Leaderboard

Well, this is just a terrible post. He's infallible now? No critical analysis allowed?

I know what happens to teams in this league who don't prioritize their Canadian talent, they end up in the toilet for years at a time. MOS definitely goes overboard in that regard but if that's his biggest flaw then I will gladly accept it. Yes it almost certainly cost us in the big game but would we have been in the big game 4 years in a row without the culture MOS has built here? Without a rock solid base of Canadians? Without being the number one destination for veteran free agents? I doubt it. Believe me, the players see how O'Shea treats his veterans and that's a selling point for Winnipeg. That being said.... The point of talking about sports is often to give your opinion on what your favourite team could be doing better. Nothing wrong with that. The roster could always be one percent better, the team could always win one more game. As far as firing O'Shea for his flaws? That's a tougher sell for me - he's got a lifetime membership as Blue Bomber coach as far as I'm concerned. We're lucky to have him. Flaws and all.

Moses, Garbutt and Thomas comma Tre

The great irony is the people who get slammed for talking about MOS' faults have all said there's no coach they'd rather have... people just don't like hearing about a legend like that's issues, but roster management has been a thing with oshea since day 1.

There’s a massive difference between saying it’s his fault and saying he didn’t put us in the best position to succeed. So many people here want to deal in absolutes, but the reality is it’s a mix of everything. Our roster didn’t show up and make it count, but I’ll hold strong and say we didn’t put our guys in the best position to succeed either.

Yeah. Personally I’d cut one and bring in one or two new kr guys. They did catch the ball. And only one made a bad mental mistake. I wouldn’t be surprised if we do a small to medium round of cuts this week. We usually do this to prioritize getting reps for guys who are at the forefront of positional battles and to bring in new guys. such a great group of young talented earth movers inside. If neuf isn’t good to go I would’ve started 3 imp ol before that game. Right now Wallace would be more than fine to start. If he keeps it up teams are gonna be kicking them self for passing on him. Yeah Dobson looks a bit more trim and just looked comfortable. Which let him play with that aggression he brought in college. The stadium is gonna be the original pancake house with the next generation of ol we have.

Tre Thomas, Ayers, Garbutt, and Rivers especially impressed me yesterday. Small sample size but they balled when the lights were on.

Overall I was impressed with the new guys in the front 7 playing in the first quarter. They looked good again the Rider starters, played fast and aggressive.

I have always said there's a happy medium... Osh isn't as bad as some say and he's also not infallible. I love playing as many Canadians as possible but I also like winning and believe there's merit to allowing Americans to stay with a team for a length of time and be considered National for roster purposes. There's a happy medium somewhere.

The key Canadian positions. Seems we'll have a solid crew of brawlers again this year. Can't be overstated.

Fixed it for ya … 😁

Riders played that one to win. Bombers played to get a look at some guys.

Kody Kase just looks like a CFL slot receiver. On the sight test, he did not get many balls. Stevler looks like he has improved with increased NFL coaching. His release looks a lot quicker.

#2 I think was the best returner to my eye (think that was it, hard to tell based on rider bullshit broadcasting) Linebackers #55 and 00 stood out to me a d I noticed garbut a lot but really I think every DE made some plays. Really impressed compared to last seasons preseason where no-one really stood out. Offense what can you say, Barriere looked like an over his head rookie. Might be worth some time on a pr but he wasn't ready, Wilson was more ready but collaros and streveler will carry the load just fine. Ol too hard for me to say but they seemed fine early and more confusion happens later with more subs, go figure. Receivers hard to tell given the qbing was so awful but not augustine Mitchell had some good grabs and my christ is clercius a big target. Man oh man I like already.

I’ll be the first to admit I’ve said multiple times that if he doesn’t want to use the resources he has available to him, maybe the team needs to explore coaching options. I’ve explained it this way several times but I’ll say it again - if there was another coach on another team just blatantly ignoring use of an advantage that could be deployed on our roster (the naturalized Canadian), we’d all be here laughing at how ridiculous it is. “Why wouldn’t you?” is the common question, there’s literally no downside to it. But because it’s MOS, people give him a pass for it. If he’s that stubborn, where else is he allowing that stubbornness to affect decision making? Nowhere? Okay great. Except we know that’s not the case either. THAT is why if the results start disappearing, I’m not sure if I’d be in a hurry to let him try and put the pieces back together. Also, the way you’re phrasing things is purposely staged to imply that there’s no validity behind the criticisms. That’s also interesting to me. It’s not as if the criticism is “hey, Brady is the best player in the entire league but he’s Canadian … couldn’t we do better with an American?” and we’re just inherently biased. The criticism is pretty warranted if we’re saying “hey, we play way more Canadians than we’re really required to … are Shayne Gauthier and Jake Thomas really the best we can do for significant meaningful reps?” These are low draft capital players on the backend of their careers as run-of-the-mill foot soldiers who have never even bordered on the level of impactful. Our scouting department is great. They can’t produce better than that? It’s a pretty valid question. If you need more evidence, look at the speed those guys we had in yesterday played with. Jamal Woods was probably the worst American interior lineman I saw take a snap for us yesterday and he still played faster than I’ve seen Jake Thomas play in years. Is it all technique? Understanding of the game that makes Jake efficient? Okay great. You’re the coach. Coach the athlete up to be as smart as Jake. He wasn’t that smart when he got here. You defend MOS from these criticisms because of his success. His success turning these guys into players is even more evidence that he should (in theory) be able to turn the far more athletic, far more naturally talented guys into even more so that he can have even more success. We go on and on and on about team culture and how important it is, but at what point do we start wondering if it’s become too much about culture? We haven’t won a Grey Cup in our last two tries, our culture folded when it mattered the most so maybe it’s time for talent to play a part too.

I'm not sure that being told that you're not going to Regina is a bad thing.

100% thought the DL especially looked good against the run.

Thank you. This is an argument I can accept. I have never said O’Shea is infallible, so making that assumption about my post is inaccurate and unfair. But I have found more than a bit of the criticism of him to lack perspective and be so inflammatory as to border on the absurd. His roster has been called garbage, putrid, a joke, and other over the top things. And it has been even stated that O’Shea should be shown the door by the club if he can’t smarten up and be better. And when you suggest that he has given away our competitive advantage, a quick check of the team’s results shows just how competitive we have in fact been, as to underlie the lack of perspective on the big picture, that he and the players have put themselves in position to win 4 straight Grey Cups because of the strength of the roster some claim is so flawed. Just as you say he did not set the team up in the best way to succeed, I could say that some players did not perform like they should have in spite of the coaching, critical mental and physical errors cost us as much as if not more than coaching or roster strategy did, and just plain luck played a big hand in determining the outcome. Neither of us is 100% right or wrong with our assessment. Where the “bad roster” argument gets out of hand for me is where it is suggested it is all part of an O’Shea agenda to deliberately undermine the team (and his own job) with a weaker roster (which is only based on opinions by certain posters who claim without hard evidence that player X who we haven’t seen play is clearly better than player B who has been on the roster) in an effort to get on a soapbox and proclaim, what exactly? And that he needs to be called out and explain himself to justify his decisions, and the media are cowards with no balls for not doing so. Well forgive me for saying I don’t think he really needs to say too much to defend himself on this issue, since his job is to win games and field the most competitive team he can, whether someone likes the way in which he does it or not. And by that measure alone he is about as unassailable as any coach we have ever had here, on par with Grant and maybe ahead of Murphy in terms of winning and success. I would love a good measured debate on it, but just like some deal in absolutes, some deal on hyperbole and unrealistic expectations. People say we are good but not good enough, I would say that we are much better than merely “good”, that those people think that anything short of absolute perfection is mediocre, and wrongly feel he deserves to be called to the carpet for not achieving an essentially impossible standard. Just the way I see it.

In that case you can’t give him much credit for winning though. The team was flat in the last two gcs and guys played who shouldn’t have. He’s not top of the list but he’s on it.

I agree. I appreciate people who know more about a subject than I do, but I've learned to never put anyone on a pedestal, we're all human at the end of the day. We have to put up with each others' faults, limitations and rough edges - they aren't going away - people are who they are. The one thing that I have a problem with - is when people pretend to be something they aren't - or claim to have knowledge or understanding that they don't really have.

1 garbutt and rivers. Both played really well garbutt vs the riders starters. 2 Moses and petrishen. Moses made a bunch of good plays especially on the goal line. Both flew around making plays. Ayers Thomas and gemmel all had flashes too. 3 Dobson and Wallace. Dobson looked really good at guard and centre. Wallace looked way further a long then I expected. HH strevy on the pa option sweep trucking riders. honorable mentions, Wilson for the bounce back, schmekel played an excellent game, fox and Lawson were great inside together, ford looked good on the corner, smith was the best of the returners. crunch of the game hallett with the perfectly timed smash on kick cover with out a no yards. block of the game. Wallace Dobson and kola cruising down field mashing for strevy scape goats, Barry-eh, cruickshank, lofton , kalra with the sack on barryeh.

I held back.

They actually have a thread on RF.com praising the 2…… I had to turn on CJOB mid way through the second. Just couldn’t listen to them mumble about, call out incorrect penalties, incorrect names and the shrieking every time a Rider made a play. I get that they are Rider Broadcasters but at least show a bit if non bias. That’s the biggest thing I miss about Knuckles.

agree....thing with Garbutt....he made plays yup...but watch his technique...his burst...first move....very well coached/trained edge guy....perfecr body type to compliment WJ on other side too Baffles the mind why neither were slotted in mid -season last yr....a case of Walker...all be it decent, and adequate...was here first...so as you could see in camp was the defacto starter regardless of who jumped out, as he was outplayed by others, but tenure secured his spot....DE...well we rolled with a useless draft pick and the desire to play a coache's fav at FB....imagine where both would be at..Habba too with a dozen or so games under their belt and some play-off experience....

He did start a few games in 2021 but only due to Stove getting hurt. When Stove was healthy, Sayles was the back-up.

Casey Sayles came into a starting role pretty early on, and would probably still be starting here now The best 70k the Bombers ever burned! Thank you again for being a snake, Darian

MOS has to wear those mistakes you discuss. 100%. PR usage, designated Americans, The F'ing FB usage, letting players dictate too much. The things I give him the benefit of the doubt on are some roster decisions around new players coming in. A lot is discussed about MOS's loyalty to guys, but we also have examples of rookies coming in and playing right away. When we have players that look good in limited action and they can't seem to stay on the field, everyone gets all on MOS for staying loyal to whatever vet is in the guts way, but no one asks what the player is or is not doing to get on the field. There is so much we don't see. When are they getting to practice, are the putting in the work off the field, in the meeting rooms, are they where they are supposed to be on the field on the plays we don't see? We know the formula for becoming one of the favourites. Steal snaps, be a hard worker, get in early, stay late, be a good teammate, know your role, etc, etc, etc. The one thing we can all agree on is the culture reset that has happened under the current regime. MOS is loyal to the guys who are good examples and set that culture. When a guy can't get on the field, we have to put some of the onus on the player too. Not just blame MOS for keeping a guy down.

You guys both have very polarizing takes imo. I would not want any other coach and am fully aware he has faults. So does every coach. The good outweighs the bad with MOS. What he is able to do as a coach overall is still very good work. It is annoying to see his stubborness on roster management play out year after year though. This is a problem he has had since day one, and isn't likely to change, but I hope it does.

The nationalized American rule is the one that sticks with me. Zero excuse not to use it. There’s only benefits. I have to add the caveat every single time that I love MOS, so nobody thinks I’m insulting the guy personally. The roster management has in fact been an issue since 2014. Kuale, Hurl, Carmichael, Sticking with Willy until almost being fired, Kelvin McKnight, Chris Matthews when he was crippled and couldn’t do anything. Tavarres whatever that was on the roster for 2 years and didn’t see a meaningful snap. Jake Thomas last year. That’s just off the top of my head.

there's a difference between delibirately doing something and seeing it..and stubbornly doing someting......and not seeing it....and he falls in there somewhere....Nobody said he needs to be shown the door...I have said I dont want him to be fired but he needs to chamge and evolve....Make sense too that if one side of the fence say's you cant put bulk blame on him for the losses......as he didn't play the game, then you can't put bulk of accolades on him for the wins either....it is only a fair assesment, and makes good sense. That being said, I along with @Mike and others will stand on the hill that Osh has final say on roster and game decisions and he did not put best roster out in last 2 cups to allow us to win, and made some poor decisions....but it's old news...past history and not gonna change.....but he can....and will he?...If we roll along 14-4 this year...get to the Cup and then blow it again with a less than best roster....some odd decisons...playing guys less than acceptable due to injury...it has definately become a concern and he has not learned from history

Skimmed through it. Strev can make all the wide throws. Still trucking guys, even looking much leaner than 2019. Barriere needs some work, that was pretty terrible. Terry Wilson seemed like he knew what he was doing, albeit with a lot of jobbers on the field for both teams. All of this granted Bombers didn’t really throw downfield with any QB. On D, #22 McGhee was with the 1’s, was around the ball a lot for better or worse. He had a rough play early where he let KSB pull down a duck in front of him that he should have made a play on. He got in on another breakup to hold the same drive to a FG. Oulette didn’t look like he enjoyed being tackled by #48 Gemmel, he could be a real thumper. Bombers ran a fairly aggressive D for an exhibition game. Rivers, Garbutt, LB Tre Thomas, and actually Schmeckel all stood out to me on plays. ST basically nothing. Ol’ Garcia seemed to be in fine form and the punter had a nice TD saving tackle. Godawfully boring game with atrocious commentary. We’re so, so lucky with our radio guys here.

I will give more in depth thoughts going forward but it was real nice to see the first D playing a LOT mote physical again. They will get back to grinding teams down. Riders won but that was nothing for them the be proud of. Bombers were looking for certain things and I think they saw them.... someone let barriere know there's an extra guy in the cfl.

That sums it up well imo. And I assume the default RT is and will be lofton.

So is it fair to say that Bryant is of course a no brainer, we have no real worries with some combo of Neufeld, Kolo, Dobson, Eli and Wallace but RT is still a question mark?

That's an impressive 9 players named as the three stars

MOS has been a great coach but he's not infallible. Walters has been a great GM but he's also not infallible. Heck both risked potentially losing their jobs if we don't win in 2019.

You the real mvp. No one can compete with that. Truth. I wonder how strevy would’ve done here in his first go around if he had current buck as his oc the whole time. For that fact, I wonder what Matt nichols and our whole offence then would’ve looked like.

Can they provide you with bacon????

most the issues here is because I dont think Osh walks on water and will call out things...every coach I have ever played for..worked with, or known had faults...were far from perfect and most died on the hill due to them eventually...it happens to them all....some people tho can't accept that and see it only as an attack or knowing better...I never once said Osh should be gone, but he does have things that could be addressed....if people take it as I think I knoiw better, or am always right thats their choice, and their right....But I will talk from experience....from still being connected to the game with current and former players/regimes...and people can take it how they want....If i get abrasive and aggressive...well it's to be expected as thats how I played nd was coached...and was brought along not to settle....stand pat...and you had to earn your keep daily...nothing is given There's way more that have a great knowledge here....I'd say the best group in the CFL...you would also be surprised who some are...and there is a group that work on the mob mentality here too...which is also fine....and I dont disparage a true hard core fan who defends their squad...unless they start talking out the bumhole...

You, Booch and JBR.... Of course each person has to do their own critical thinking... But you three know what you're talking about and it's appreciated by this doorknob, anyhow...

Asking on behalf of fans who hope that good isn’t good enough

some people dont understand professional sports is a "what have you done for me now" business....not what have u done in the past We lost the last 2 cups...cups we should have won...and any coach worth anything will tell you thats a failure at the end of the season....and a few simple tweaks..changes...or changes in philosphy and we are prepping to win our 5th straight...deny it...argue it....agree with it....fact of the matter, more than anything our coaching failed us in the last 2 playoff runs....I could care less if we are a 15-3 grey cup champ...or an 8-10 Grey Cup champ...regular season wins and accolades mean diddly if you not slapping on a ring at the end of the day

There’s a ton of really knowledgeable posters, unfortunately some don’t post much any more but like booch says we have a tremendous group on here. 100%. Mos is open about his limitations and what he does. He believes the culture over comes talent. I believe even he realizes this year we’ve past the tipping point. In the nba last year the raptors ran back a team full of vets with limited upside. They did it based on loyalty. fans and people around the league knew the raptors were past it. But Masai knew those guys since they were kids. He picked and groomed them. He thought they had chance and deserved to play it out. There isn’t a better basketball guy in the nba. Some times being too close to the situation blinds great minds. Or brings them to act against a teams best interest. We’ve been making decisions like that. With mos we have to walk the line between being competitive/developing guys and being loyal to old guys. That, is the single more relevant discussion point around the bombers. People forget that mos was on the hot seat Here with a sub .500 record. If we didn’t fluke out with collaros we have no ships, and a different hc. Mos deserves tons of credit and is the goat of bomber coaches. No one is beyond questioning though especially in sports. Zach is the bomber qb goat imo, and he has been real questionable in the play offs.

“Coach O’Shea, you turned around a club that had missed the playoffs in 5 of the previous 6 years and was an all-time worst 3-15 before your arrival. You’ve had 7 straight 10+win seasons in a row, an all-time club record, and 7 straight playoff appearances, and you’ve been coach of the year more than any other coach since you started 9 years ago. In that time your roster has featured 15 CFL award winners and 43 CFL all-stars, which is tops in the league. No team has won more in the last 7 years, and other than the Stanps, no team has won more since you started your head coaching gig. You coached the team to back-to-back Grey Cup victories. You’re the 4 time defending Western Division champions, something this league hasn’t seen in over 40 years. No other team has more playoff wins, Grey Cup appearances or Championships during your tenure. You are on track this season to become the all-time winningest coach in the club’s 93 year history. It’s obvious that you are failing at putting out the most optimum roster to smugly satisfy a personal Canada-first agenda that is failing us competitively. Explain yourself! Asking on behalf of fans who know better”

yeah....I certain people will see a noticeable difference....and nore how he looked when he left college and came up to us the first yr

Sounds like we have more than enough good Canadian boys to play the guard/center positions. Anyone watch our OT prospects?

Barriere's college coach is now the qb coach for the Stamps. He gave us Mike Reilly, VA & Bo Levi Mitchell so he could end up there.

Ehhhhhhhhhhh......... I mean you're partly there.

13800 passing yards 121 tds 19 picks 1600 rush yards 22 more tds. No one thought he’d be in the cfl this early. If you are gonna sit a guy a year and teach him, this is the guy. It all comes down to how he bounces back and learns.