Mike

Agreed, except that the drop off in talent when 'you just slot another NI in somewhere else and play an American at MLB' can pretty steep. Not so much when you go from NI OG to NI OG, if you've been drafting and developing NI OGs. I don't necessarily agree. The drop off is usually going to be steep in any situation. If you're capable enough to start as a Canadian in this league, you rarely sit on the bench.

Dude that's a JPEG

Fight to keep him, yes. But again, if he doesn't want to be here well we need to move on. We have to focus on the future. Would I like him to be in our future, yes. If Muamba's agent holds the Bombers up for ranson or as leverage to get more money off another team then let him go. We can easily replace a Canadian MLB with an American without missing a beat. On the OL, losing a Canadian like Labatte hurts a lot more than if we lost Muamba as the OL is considered a Canadian position & MLB an American one. You build your Canadian talent from the OL out... See, this is a theory that will soon get debunked. There is some great Canadian talent out there in every position. It doesn't matter if it's o-line, receiver, linebacker. You build your Canadian talent by finding quality Canadians at any position. Saying the MLB position is an American position is like saying the RB is an Amercian position. It's an old-fashioned way of thinking in my mind. Now If you had said the word "primarily" I could have accepted that. Well yes and no. It's great to have a young NI starter like Muamba at a position typically taken by an import. The problem arises when he gets hurt, or needs to be spelled. There is a SIGNIFICANT dropoff between him and his backup. You have no depth at that position, and the opposition takes great advantage of that. It's much easier to replace a NI OG with another in the hopper - the dropoff in talent is not nearly as bad. Ideally, we should be drafting Offensive linemen, receivers and special teams/safeties/DTs. With some luck you find a couple decent NI OT and start 4 NI on the Oline. Add 2 receivers and you have only one spot to fill. It's not 'old fashioned' it's smart. Except when you do it properly, what you have is flexibility in your ratio so if Henoc gets hurt, you don't necessarily need a backup NI MLB, you just slot another NI in somewhere else and play an American at MLB. For example, if Andrew Harris gets hurt in BC, they don't replace him with a NI RB, they simply adjust their ratio and dress another NI somewhere else. Same with Cornish in Calgary, Matt Walter is the game day backup but I doubt he'd be the weekly starter if Cornish got hurt. Same thing applies with Ted Laurent in Edmonton. Andre Durie in Toronto. etc etc

Good lord.

Based on Burke's attitude to date, I'm pretty sure that's a typo. 99.9% confident he actually said "don't worry about the win"

Typical Sun headline...hardly an exodus!....not so sure it is about the chaotic atmosphere...more like MONEY! The lack of winning and negative atmosphere plays as large a roll in attracting and retaining players as money does .. what incentive does a top tier free agent have to stay in (or come to) Winnipeg when there's little chance of making the playoffs (and making the extra coin associated with a post season birth)? If two contracts are being considered, both offering similar money, what would entice someone to join an organization that's constantly under the microscope and in a state of continual change? There are too many other factors that don't necessarily make these decisions that simple...one example...chance of making the team and being a starter...but in the end it still boils down to money for these guys. If a guy is sitting at home and not working and gets a chance to be on a team in turmoil or not and get a pay cheque...what do you think he would pick? So we can sign the guys sitting on the couch with nothing better to do. But can we sign the guys with other options?

Or more accurately, how stupid Tim Burke is. The depth on this team isn't good, but there are 4 or 5 different ways to work the lineup better than putting in three import OL. What is his plan here? It can't be talent evaluation or MSW would be in to see what we have there and Pencer would continue to get a shot. But we can't actually be trying to win, right? And if we were trying to win, wouldn't we want to play a guy like Ian Wild, who has been a significant bright spot on the team? Sure doesn't seem worth starting an ineffective Will Ford at his expense. The funniest part about this is that the run game will still suck. That's what drives me nuts the most. If we're evaluating, he's doing it wrong. If we're trying to win, he's doing it wrong. The only way he's right is if we're just throwing darts at a dartboard to fill roster spots because hey, nobody can be wrong that way.

Didn't Mike bring it up? There was an ounce of truth to it but I don't think it was ever as close as the guy on Riderfans made it sound and I don't think the other players in the deal (Chiles, as an example) were accurate.

Buck Pierce

Did he actually say that? He knows we can cut anyone we want in the offseason, right? That statement makes no sense. It makes quite a bit of sense actually, so I'm glad Walters/Mack put the team in this situation. Use the leftover $$$ on guys like Etienne, Alex Hall, etc and give them bonus dollars to count against 2013 cap. Free up as much 2014 cash as possible for a guy like Collaros or some OL

Highly doubt it but hey, who knows.

Walters is looking good because Mack was asleep at the wheel... Walters found import tackles and signed some castoffs - but all GMs (except Mack) do that... I would agree that the jury is still out - i.e. Bo Smith, Levi Brown, etc... However, I do think that Walters ends up as our full-time GM - there is such a tiny window to sign Collaros or anyone before the Ottawa draft... if he gets that done, how do you fire/demote him after that? If he doesn't get it done, is there really time to get a new GM in place before free agency? If Higgins or someone is available, they would have to be in here by mid-December at the latest. Chances are Mack would have brought in the same tackles just because it's the scouting that finds players and we have the same scouts, other than that Kelly is the only guy Walters has brought in that has made an actual impact so far. People are freaking out cause the guy said the right things and brought in a couple bodies, but Mack brought in bodies when he needed them too, just tended to be from a different source. The amount of crap that Mack gets thrown at him is too damned high and because he made such a good scape goat Walters has a pretty easy job. Never mind that the biggest mistake is still there (Burke) and the team still has no life and still regularly gets out coached and continually shows no signs of life. Except Mack didn't bring in those guys. He brought in Taormina, Boatman and Simmons... maybe as usual he was going off his 'gut' instead of listening to his scouts ...anyway, whatever. Walters found us a new tackle prospect, Mack didn't. The best player on our OL is a holdover from the Kelly days - that is sad. As for Burke, everyone was pretty excited when he came here and everyone kind of knew he was the next HC after Lapo... the biggest mistake Mack made was not Burke, it was cheaping out on Asst Coaches... ignoring the OL... not signing any substantial free agents... and... and... and... maybe there is no one 'biggest' mistake. Had to isolate this because a) he doesn't pick the assistants and we actually have/had a few of the higher paid assistants in the league. Oh wait, you think Craig Dickenson works for free, right? And I suppose Gary Crowton came up here with a D1 resume as a hobby.

He has said in some interviews that he would like to go back to being a GM and/or HC. He's also applied for a few openings in the past few years as well including here after Kelly and Bauer were gone. Interesting... Sorry TB, but this is pretty common knowledge. The CFL job is a gig until he finds something else coaching wise. If not, it's a nice cushy job to fall back on. But Higgins does want to coach again. I'm not sure why your apologizing here. I questioned your statement because I hadn't heard anything about it. I don't claim to know ALL of what goes on in the CFL, so if there is something I haven't heard, I'll ask about it. That's part of what a message board is about. Besides, if it was "common knowledge" then shouldn't I be the one apologizing?? Sorry, TB.

I don't want Willy just because he's got a ridiculous name. Drew P. Willy Droopy Willy.

Ask Saskatchewan fans how solid their OL is.

Drives me nuts that Burke gets such a free pass from guys like Kirk Penton. Penton is a quality writer, but his absolute hate on for Joe Mack drives me nuts. http://www.winnipegsun.com/2013/09/23/all-hope-is-not-lost-with-bombers Seriously? Give me a break. Such a double standard lol

You don't think they take a combo of Willy and Glenn? At most Ottawa will draft 1 QB. They need/want to stock up NI's in the draft, and drafting a QB gives that team the opportunity to protect more NI's. Collaros, Willy, Glenn are all free agents anyways. And of those three, if you were the GM...which one would you set your sites on talent wise only?. except in Glenn's case I guess age would have to be a factor Glenn's not a winner. A guy who threw 12 passes before this season takes over the 4th quarter of a close game while he fades away. Personally I'd have zero interest in Glenn as a starter if I were Ottawa, or any CFL team if I'm setting the goal at winning a Grey Cup. I'd target BLM heavily, offer Calgary the 1st overall pick in the draft and a high pick in 2015 too. Willy hasn't played enough, and while I like that Collaros has that mentality where he's able to put it all together in the 4th quarter, I have some doubts that he's working in a great environment for a young QB with Milanovich on a very good football team that would be hard to replicate elsewhere. I'm not sure Collaros could step onto a bad team and make them a good team. I think BLM is much more likely to be that guy, he's got the best arm (all things considered, strength accuracy placement) of all the QB's in the league IMO and he doesn't lack poise. McPherson had a nearly perfect QB rating as a starter with Milanovich BTW. That's when he was the next big thing. While I don't discount the potential of what you're saying about Collaros being true to an extent, let's not try and compare him to McPherson. McPherson has 240 pass attempts in his CFL career and Collaros already has 210 this season alone. He's put up more scoring drives, less turnovers and more yardage than McPherson ever did and honestly, Collaros has the *it* factor I like to see in a QB. I want a guy who can take over in the fourth quarter and make you confident that no matter what, he's going to give you a chance. Can he complete nearly 70% of his passes without Milanovich? Probably not. But he can take what he's learned and put a new team in a good position to thrive with him as their starter. As much as I prefer Mitchell, I know he's not available so I'm all in on Collaros. Winnipeg needs him.

I honestly can't believe we'd criticize Walters for inquiring about another "unavailable" QB. I'd phone Hufnagel every day if I was Walters. "You ready to trade Mitchell yet? No? Okay, call me when you are."

I still feel like Ottawa takes him in the expansion draft and tries to lock him up before free agency. Winnipeg might have to pay to get that opportunity.

To be fair, our red zone offense is almost entirely based on running whereas most teams have a lot more pass plays in those pages of their play book. Still brutal though.

I'm officially on the Collaros bandwagon. He's for real.

You JUST called Muamba "exceptional by NI standards" on the other site. Make up your damn mind.

Burke's attitude is the type of attitude that instills a losing culture in a locker room. He shows no faith in any of his players, he's a horrible motivator and he is no good at maximizing the talent (no matter its shortcomings) he has at his disposal. I mean really, who can possibly have respect for a head coach who throws his entire roster under the bus by saying "I'm doing the best with what I've got?" How can I respect a guy who doesn't even have the stones to go for a win on his HOME FIELD with 30 seconds and a timeout remaining? Burke may not think much of the roster he has to work with and that's his perogative, but a good coach or even a sensible one would find a way to get the most they could out of that talent by motivating them and sticking by his guys even if they didn't necessarily deserve it. Burke, OTOH, seems content to mail it in and not even try. We were tied with the ball in our possession last night, our team is 2-9 and while I'm not expecting it to spark some kind of miraculous season turnaround, Burke had a golden opportunity to show his offensive guys that he has trust in them. No one would have blamed him for trying and failing, it's not the end of the world. But instead of taking his guys aside and telling them that he felt they could give it a shot, he basically mailed it in, showed them he doesn't trust them enough to do a damn thing and said "**** it." How do you think our players feel? Tim Burke literally could not trust them for 30 seconds because apparently he thought the most likely result was a turnover. What the hell is that? If that's the attitude he's going to coach with, we may as well forfeit. It's absolutely embarrassing. FWIW, I heard a few stories from the Legacy Dinner the other night. Couple conversations with some of our stronger defensive players and apparently it was a good chance to get their honest thoughts instead of the "proper" media replies. I bet you can guess what they think of Tim Burke and his coaching staff. I'll give you a hint. It's the same thing I think of them.

They are not mutually exclusive. Trace what Burke does and at the end of your drawing you will have a conclusion that Burke shares the blame...heavily. Just go back to what I asked, is he or isn't he responsible for the personnel who are starting? We have seen more personnel turnover in the last month under our Interim GM than Mack made in his 3 years. So I ask again, who is responsible the personnel on the field and why aren't they making plays when the opportunity hits them right in the hands. You want to talk personnel, then lay the page out. This thread is on Burke and if you have decided he shares no blame..then say so. All I will say then is, put any other coach in the league in Burke's shoes and how do you think he would fair. If you answer that question honestly then you will see that the HC position is meaningless for this current mess. I disagree.

You can (and I will) easily point to Burke being unable to get ANYTHING out of his players.