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Not everything is as black and white as you paint it. Nobody is talking about coaching Max Hall into a world beater, but rather coaching him to the point he is as good as possible, given the conditions physically and mentally, that he has to work with. Also coaching him up to take full advantage of the schemes, and help that he receives, or doesn't, from his offensive teammates. Sure scouting is important...I would certainly hope that they don't bring in players who just "suck".

http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/12/20/calgary-stampeders-hire-veteran-defensive-co-ordinator-rich-stubler http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/Johnson+resident+defensive+guru+Rich+Stubler+will+finally+work+with+John+Hufnagel+Stamps/9308537/story.html

Well the head coach of ASU makes 2.3 million, so its probably a fair guess to say Randolph makes more there as the DC than he could here.Doesn't mean he would never want to come here..for some people money is not everything! Yep that's true. Right. So a DC for a college team making high 6 figures a year (plus his kids getting a free college education) is going to head north for 150K? Money isn't everything but its the biggest thing. Obviously it is for you...perhaps not for someone else

Marshall's Defensive Coordinators Stats for discussion https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwwreIy1lMULU0FsdkplcUo1OTA/edit?usp=sharing average 25.55 pts against per game career

No way do I want Marshall

Well the head coach of ASU makes 2.3 million, so its probably a fair guess to say Randolph makes more there as the DC than he could here. Doesn't mean he would never want to come here..for some people money is not everything!

Yep...you never fail to be the Debbie Downer!

Paul Randolph http://www.thesundevils.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=30300&ATCLID=207923335

When Marshall goes somewhere, he usually seems to be able to fix a broken defense temporarily. But...not too hard for opposing offences to figure out what schemes he is running, so if a team makes the playoffs...his defensive schemes usually suffer. He is the last D coordinator I would want back. The only salvation might be that O'Shea has his own ideas of how he wants the D run and Marshall would have to comply.

All the best to you and your families everyone!

Interesting article... Gary Etcheverry: The 'Mad Scientist' or 'Brilliant Mind' Gary Etcheverry's departure was a pretty clear portrayal of his time with the team: head scratching and polarizing. The defensive assistant has reportedly taken a job in the energy sector that is a lot more financially lucrative than his coaching career, especially now that he was relegated to an 'effort coach' with the Saskatchewan Roughriders, as described by the new Head Coach Greg Marshall. Etcheverry hated that moniker! When I spoke to 'Etch' after he accepted his reduced roll within the coaching staff, he discussed that 'effort coach' moniker head on with a question, 'is that all (I'm) going to do?" He thought of himself more as a consultant within the coaching staff, someone to give a 'different' point of view and perspective on how the defence could be successful. And that's where you see the problem with the new set up that saw a defensive coordinator taking a reduced roll to 'effort coach' or 'consultant'. The defence of the Saskatchewan Roughriders is now Richie Hall's and Greg Marshall's, not Etcheverry's. Though Hall clearly took in some Etcheverry style schemes in 2008 when Etch helped out the coaching staff when Ron Estay left the team for health reasons, the current coaching staff's philosophies are similar to those of Hall and Marshall. They believe in bigger defensive front sevens, who shut down the run, and make offenses put the ball in the air. Etcheverry said run it all you want, the only way you win consistently in the CFL is throwing the football. You start to feel why the energy business, more money and maybe more time with family was an easy thing to jump at for Etcheverry, being somewhat of an outcast in the new regime. But the departure is a loss for the Saskatchewan Roughriders and some believe it was unfair that Etcheverry, who ran a pretty solid/athletic defence the last two years, received a demotion under new Head Coach Greg Marshall. While Etcheverry didn't want to be labeled an 'effort coach', that is the ideal roll for the veteran coach. 'Effort is our Edge' was the motto for the Riders defence under Etch. He was constantly barking day after day after day in practice and in game to 'get to the ball', 'be onside', take the correct angles and it showed on the field. The Roughriders defence under Gary Etcheverry may have given up some rushing yards but it did win and help put the team in two Grey Cups, where the defence gave the team the chance to win both games. Etcheverry's defensive philosophy put players like Tad Kornegay in position to show off their athleticism. Kornegay was a 180 lbs linebacker! He wasn't there to stop the run, but be able to track down the running back or the fifth or sixth receiver in the passing game. Kornegay was in my opinion the defensive MVP the last two seasons and the veteran appreciated the opportunity to make plays. Kornegay tweeted about the departure of Etcheverry by saying, "to all rider fans Coach Etch was the man who gave me the opportunity to showcase my talent to the fullest...special man that will be missed." Though Kornegay doesn't represent the entire defence, Etcheverry did have his detractors, but it should signal that there were fans of Coach Etcheverry in the locker room. Etcheverry tried different things that were met with criticism by not only his own players but with the sports media, which Etcheverry didn't ignore and wouldn't hesitate to snap back at commentators like Glen Suitor when pushed on his 'unconventional' defences. While many in Rider Nation will be watching Greg Marshall very closely after taking over for Ken Miller, Richie Hall should be just as much under the microscope to see if his defence is one that wins. Back in February Etcheverry, almost prophetically, mentioned that it will be interesting to look back after 2011 and see which teams, who hired new defensive coordinators, struggled or failed when he was on the market and his phone remained silent. And he's right, it will be interesting.

He's been fired after a short time almost everywhere he has gone. His coaching records both defensively and as head coach are not good. After graduating from USC in 1978, he began coaching at the University of San Diego where he was the offensive line and defensive line coach. His next job was as the defensive coordinator and defensive line coach at the University of Redlands. In 1981 he was an offensive and defensive assistant at San Francisco State University. His offensive coordinator at SFSU was Mike Holmgren. In 1982, Etcheverry began a seven-year tenure as defensive coordinator at Occidental College. He coached with the Tigers from 1982 to 1987, leaving in 1988 to serve as a special assistant with the Los Angeles Rams. He returned to Occidental for one more season before accepting the head coaching position at Macalester College. He was fired after a 0–10 season in 1993. In his four seasons with the Fighting Scots, he had a 2–37 overall record. In 1994 he moved to the German Football League where he was the defensive coordinator of the Hamburg Blue Devils before becoming head coach of the Stuttgart Scorpions in 1996. In 1997 he returned to North America, this time as the defensive line coach of the Toronto Argonauts. In 1999 he was promoted to defensive coordinator by head coach Jim Barker. He left the team before the 2000 season after head coach John Huard chewed out the defense during a press conference, despite it being among the best in the league, leading in 12 of 25 statistical categories and coach Huard never seeing the team play a game. After leaving the Argos, he was Danny Barrett's defensive coordinator with the Saskatchewan Roughriders and in 2001 was the defensive coordinator of the BC Lions. In 2002 he was hired by team President Pinball Clemons to serve as the Toronto Argonauts head coach. He was fired after a 4–8 start and replaced by Pinball Clemons. In 2004 he replaced Kit Lathrop as defensive coordinator of the Ottawa Renegades. After one season in Ottawa, he was hired as special teams coordinator and assistant defensive coordinator for the UBC Thunderbirds. In 2006 he was an assistant with the South Surrey Big Kahuna Rams as well as a guest coach at the Winnipeg Blue Bombers training camp. On April 7, 2008, Etcheverry joined the Saskatchewan Roughriders as their defensive assistant coach. On January 26, 2009, he was named defensive coordinator for the Saskatchewan Roughriders. Etcheverry was hired as the head coach for the Ottawa Gee-Gees on May 23, 2012, following the resignation of Jean-Phillipe Asselin.[1] In the closing days of September, after five of eight games of the season, Etcheverry was fired as the Head Coach of the Gee-Gees with an 0-5 record.[2]

We've seen it in a few other stops though. I suspect that MB is an ace at interviewing and that's why he keeps getting hired even if the results aren't always there. Not that he's bad he's just so painfully average. That is totally assuming that he is not capable of changing and growing, and that he can't do much better with better personnel. Hmmm...there is that Assume word again.

If Burke said he didn't want him playing...you think MB would go against that? This was not the first time Burke had said a player would no longer be playing or performing in a certain position due to a mistake. Burke was pissed at Goltz because he was pouting.

He kept putting him in there because Burke refused to let Goltz play.

As has been pointed out, MB was OC in Montreal in 2007 - the year AC left the team to be with his wife while she was battling cancer and the year they had Charlie Carpenter as oline coach and the Als oline gave up the most sacks by far (65). A.C. played in over two thirds of the game that year (13). That OL had among other perenial all-star and potential hall of famer Scott Flory. A.C., Cahoon, Watkins, Edwards, Flory is a pretty good base of talent to work with. So you base his worth as an OC only based on being 7th in scoring, but choose to ignore the other facts. That's weak!

After leaving Saskatchewan, Bellefeuille joined the Montreal Alouettes in 2006 as their running backs and wide receivers coach.[2] In 2007 he was promoted to Offensive Coordinator and running backs coach. In his 1st season in Montreal, he helped Robert Edwards lead the CFL in touchdowns with 17.[2] Bellefeuille also helped the Alouettes be the only team with two 1,000 yard receivers in Kerry Watkins and Ben Cahoon.[2]

Here are the actual facts

Amen to that!

You mean guys like Foster? Gonna go ahead and disagree with you there. What other moves were there? The Neufeld trade? Well why don't we wait to see the guy play before we judge that one? There is really very little to go on for the guy at this point, it will be determined when they play some games next year. And what other moves would you have made with the season still in progress? Not the point, point is that there hasn't been enough for us to judge yet so we gotta hold off until there's enough to actually judge. Ahhh...no premature judging....but but..I really want to judge now....I might be wrong and that would be the worst thing ever! you still didn't answer the question...

You mean guys like Foster? Gonna go ahead and disagree with you there. What other moves were there? The Neufeld trade? Well why don't we wait to see the guy play before we judge that one? There is really very little to go on for the guy at this point, it will be determined when they play some games next year. And what other moves would you have made with the season still in progress?

BS. Granted he brought in a couple of semi decent receivers, but the rest so far haven't shown me diddly so far, including a dud QB, a gimped NI OLman...and was he responsible for our crappy kicker or was that Mack. I can't remember. I don't know why you guys are harping on Robyn and IC Khari. They're just stating that we won't know what kind of GM he'll be until August, and that's the truth. You guys were the same ones that said there was nothing wrong with Mack and that all the Mack hate wasn't justified earlier this year, and the same ones who said "oh you can't say Burke is bad when he took over in the middle of the year like he did blah blah" back in 2012. As if any of you know what this guy is going to be like any more then we do. We all like him so far and what he's saying, and hope he's good. But no one knows if he's going to **** it up or make us into a winning team just yet. Geez, stop crucifying people here and acting like they said "this guy was utter **** and OMGZORZ HE'S THE AWFUL!!!111!ONE!!!!" Oh chill out! This was a good positive thread for a change until the glass half empty folks showed up. Of course no one really knows, many of us just like what we see so far....period! Oh chill out! This was a good positive thread for a change until the glass half empty folks showed up. Of course no one really knows, many of us just like what we see so far....period!

Jordan Brescacin http://www.windsoressexsports.com/2013/07/15/ex-lancer-brescacin-takes-talents-to-finland/ Armitage http://boxscorenews.com/western-mustangs-shane-bergman-and-eric-armitage-selected-in-the-cfl-draft-p56146-68.htm

Yes...you've missing all the moves that have gone on behind the scenes. You've missed the scouting department upgrade...etc. etc. etc. It is obvious you have no idea what a GM does on a daily basis.

Very impressed with Kyle...nice for the fans to see the thinking and planning that is going on behind the scenes. He is very forthcoming as much as he can be, which is a good thing. Until I watched the video didn't even know there was going to be a neg list draft today.