Lawless says there is trade market for Willy

[Goalie]

We'd need a veteran back up qb coming back to us for sure. Montreal makes sense with Glenn, can "finish" his career where had his most success. 

 

[holoman]

19 minutes ago, Mike said:

I don't want Burris in any situation, to be honest.

If there was a situation out there that could land us assets for Willy while we still retained a quality backup QB in some way or another, I'd consider supporting the idea of trading Drew.

Is that situation out there? I don't see it.

The ONLY situation that I can see presenting itself is a scenario where we basically do a three way trade with Toronto/Montreal

Toronto gives up: assets, gets: Drew Willy

Winnipeg gives up: Drew Willy, gets: half the assets from Toronto, Kevin Glenn, cap relief to bolster their roster elsewhere

Montreal gives up: Kevin Glenn, gets: half the assets from Toronto, cap relief, an opening to boost Vernon Adams/Rakeem Cato up the depth chart and invest in the future

I feel vindicated.   I was thinking to myself this morning that if we were to trade Willy, the only QB that we would likely get in return is either Glenn or Cato.  How we get that plus other assets was hard to figure out. Possibly a 3 way deal makes sense. 

[Goalie]

How about..

 

To Toronto : Drew Willy

To Winnipeg: Glenn plus BC's first from Montreal

To Montreal: I have no friggin clue lol 

[holoman]

Just now, Goalie said:

How about..

 

To Toronto : Drew Willy

To Winnipeg: Glenn plus BC's first from Montreal

To Montreal: I have no friggin clue lol 

What does B.C. get out of this? lol

[Mike]

Yeah, Montreal doesn't have BC's first.

BC has Montreal's first.

[rebusrankin]

I am curious which teams are interested in Willy and am curious what is on the table. Count me in the I'd do the deal if we get a guy like Glenn coming back.

[wbbfan]

anthony coombs would be a nice pick up. Could play some wr and rb to back up harris. Take lochards spot. I also like cody fajardo as a prospect. 

[rebusrankin]

Coombs is a FA after the season is he not?

[wbbfan]

Just now, rebusrankin said:

Coombs is a FA after the season is he not?

No clue. Dont know if we'd have an advantage with that or not either. 

If they are interested id flip one of neufeld/keeping as well. Ideally get back a package of guys/picks. 

[Noeller]

Only QBs I'd want in return would be Glenn or Lulay, realistically.....not sure either of these happen. As long as Montreal is in a hunt, they're not going to deal Glenn, and they're very much in the playoff picture over there.

[HardCoreBlue]

1 minute ago, Noeller said:

Only QBs I'd want in return would be Glenn or Lulay, realistically.....not sure either of these happen. As long as Montreal is in a hunt, they're not going to deal Glenn, and they're very much in the playoff picture over there.

When I look at BC, Willy might be a good fit there with Jennings. Two different style QB's that could give defenses different looks. I'm still flabbergasted that Lulay remains 'content' standing on the sidelines.

[White Out]

1 hour ago, Mike said:

I can't help but chuckle that some folks can't imagine the idea of Drew Willy being an effective starter ever again even knowing that the best QB mind in the CFL seems to think he can.

You chuckle at the idea that a near 30 year who's never been a proven winner -anywhere- will suddenly be an effective starter in his older age.... is a silly idea to some?

Cool story, bro.

Edited August 29, 2016 by White Out

[Mike]

4 minutes ago, White Out said:

You chuckle at the idea that a near 30 year who's never been a proven winner -anywhere- will suddenly be an effective starter in his older age.... is a silly idea to some?

Cool story, bro.

Yes. I do.

Mostly because the argument that is brought forth by the majority of the people who hold that opinion, including yourself, is largely based on emotions.

[White Out]

Just now, Mike said:

Yes. I do.

Mostly because the argument that is brought forth by the majority of the people who hold that opinion, including yourself, is largely based on emotions.

It's not an emotional opinion. I was against Willy coming here, but after his hot start my opinion was turned and I thought, 'sweet, a great qb'. Since that 5-1 start Willy has shown me he's not a good starting Qb. He lacks the on field intelligence to quickly make reads and get rid of the ball in a timely fashion. 

Drew Willy's starting record as a CFL qb is all the evidence needed to form a reasonable opinion that he's not starter material. 

[sweep the leg]

3 hours ago, Noeller said:

Have a peek at Scott Milanovich's QB history. If SM wants a guy as his QB, that's saying something........

Ok, so I took a peek. He's been successful with Ray & Calvillo, both of whom had great success before they ever met Milanovich. All his history tells us is that he doesn't make previously great qbs worse.

Edited August 29, 2016 by sweep the leg

[Mike]

2 minutes ago, White Out said:

It's not an emotional opinion. I was against Willy coming here, but after his hot start my opinion was turned and I thought, 'sweet, a great qb'. Since that 5-1 start Willy has shown me he's not a good starting Qb. He lacks the on field intelligence to quickly make reads and get rid of the ball in a timely fashion. 

Drew Willy's starting record as a CFL qb is all the evidence needed to form a reasonable opinion that he's not starter material. 

And I simply don't agree with you. Nor does Mike O'Shea. Or Scott Milanovich, apparently.

So there you go.

[mbrg]

11 minutes ago, White Out said:

You chuckle at the idea that a near 30 year who's never been a proven winner -anywhere- will suddenly be an effective starter in his older age.... is a silly idea to some?

Cool story, bro.

So....like 29 year old Nichols became this year?

 

You have the option to behave better, you know?

[White Out]

8 minutes ago, Mike said:

 

3 minutes ago, Mike said:

And I simply don't agree with you. Nor does Mike O'Shea. Or Scott Milanovich, apparently.

So there you go.

If your argument rests on logical fallacies (appeals to authority) you're going to have a tougher time convincing me. First off, Milanovich may intend to trade for Willy and restructure his contract. So even there your appeal to authority is shaky at best.  Further, MOS is the current coach of this guy. Do you really expect him to come out and say something like "Willy will never be a starter again?". Get real.

Lots of professionals get paid and make huge mistakes on 'their guys'. Look at Pavelec and Chevy. By all accounts Chevy seems to be a fairly decent GM but when it comes to Pavelec his blind spot is so bad you could drive a bus past it.

Edited August 29, 2016 by White Out

[Goalie]

1 hour ago, holoman said:

What does B.C. get out of this? lol

Yeah. Right... the other way around. BC has montreals First. 

 

Well, forget that then 

[Atomic]

5 minutes ago, sweep the leg said:

Ok, so I took a peek. He's been successful with Ray & Calvillo, both of whom had great success before they ever met Milanovich. All his history tells us is that he doesn't make previously great qbs worse.

I'd argue that he helped re-invigorate Calvillo's career and it would be silly to overlook his role in the development of Zach Collaros and Trevor Harris

[White Out]

5 minutes ago, mbrg said:

So....like 29 year old Nichols became this year?

 

You have the option to behave better, you know?

1) I don't consider Nichols to be an "effective starter" just yet. His best role is still that of backup, but he's certainly a better option than Willy. If I had to make a list of QB's by skill, Nichols is probably very near the #9 slot and perhaps a bit further. Willy is 13 or 14 at best.

2) Behave better? You mean just agree? Mike decided to add a little zest to his post with his "chuckle" comment. Seems like a cool story bro is hardly an escalation from that.

[Goalie]

Just now, Atomic said:

I'd argue that he helped re-invigorate Calvillo's career and it would be silly to overlook his role in the development of Zach Collaros and Trevor Harris

Yup. Harris and Collaros are definitely 2 Guys who say Hello for sure. 

[Atomic]

Not surprised there is a market for Willy, even though everyone told me he wouldn't even get a deal as a backup QB if he was a free agent.

[Goalie]

I guess the real question is... what type of market is it? I mean, If you are going to move Willy, you'd definitely need a QB, and not some rookie coming back our way unless the Bombers feel confident Davis and Bennett can win some games if Nichols goes down... Which I'm not sure they are, Has Davis seen the field this season? more than once or twice? or at all even? I can't recall, maybe once or twice in short yardage earlier but not since. So the Bombers would need a QB coming back for sure... 

I'd agree with Mike here that the only way a Willy trade works for the Bombers is a 3 way involving another team and Montreal (or BC i guess) (Glenn/Lulay)

 

[Mike]

2 minutes ago, White Out said:

If your argument rests on logical fallacies (appeals to authority) you're going to have a tougher time convincing me. First off, Milanovich may intend to trade for Willy and restructure his contract. So even there your appeal to authority is shaky at best.  Further, MOS is the current coach of this guy. Do you really expect him to come out and say something like "Willy will never be a starter again?". Get real.

Lots of professionals get paid and make huge mistakes on 'their guys'. Look at Pavelec and Chevy. By all accounts Chevy seems to be a fairly decent GM but when it comes to Pavelec his blind spot is so bad you could drive a bus past it.

Instead of trying to poke holes in my argument, you should try strengthening yours because it's full of holes at this point in time.

Drew Willy, in the past, has shown that he is capable of playing at a high level that is good enough to win football games. Drew Willy, in the recent past, has shown that he is also capable of struggling and playing poorly to the point that it is clearly not good enough to win football games.

He's done both. So why are you so hung up on the most recent body of work? Because it's a "what have you done for me lately" business? That's fine. And that's your prerogative. But it's not a solid argument.

Here's my argument: comparing Nichols and Willy right now is an apples-to-oranges comparison, because Willy has never had the one thing that Nichols has been handed that has been so beneficial to his success - a high performing offensive line. You can blame the offensive line struggles on Willy and it's certainly true that you'd be able to argue that at times, he has not helped their situation by clinging onto the ball too long. Was it a regular enough occurrence that it's worth considering as a major factor? Not in my opinion.

Compare Nichols 2016 to Nichols 2015 instead. Look how bad Nichols looked last year with the same personnel Willy was operating with. It was a clear cut case that Willy was the superior quarterback. Now here's the thing: you have to pick a side at this point. Either Nichols 2016 is looking a whole lot better because of the sudden reshuffling of the offensive line OR Nichols 2016 improved from Nichols 2015. Here's the tricky part for you as a Willy detractor: either one of those choices really shoots some holes in your argument.

If Nichols 2016 can be better than Nichols 2015, why can't Willy 2016 be better than Willy early 2016? It obviously can happen. Situations change. Circumstances change. Players can slump. Players can regain form. It's not a "one-and-done" business. And obviously the professionals believe that. So why don't you?

If that's not the side you choose to be on and you think Nichols is so much better this year because of the personnel surrounding him, then obviously it's difficult to write Willy off because he has yet to be given a chance to work with that very same personnel. The offensive line changes were the catalyst to our season. Nichols has not lit the world on fire, but the offensive line sure as heck has. So it stands to reason that Drew Willy, shellshocked nature and all, could very easily come back in and turn his opportunity with a revamped line into something that leads to him shaking that vacant look off and regaining the form that he's shown in the past.