US Politics

[johnzo]

Congressional Republicans have rolled out an ACA replacement proposal that eliminates the requirement that health insurance companies cover people for pre-existing conditions. (which is very popular). 

It also stipulates that you can't use your own health savings account* money to pay for an abortion.

*An HSA is a tax-free savings account that one uses to pay for health care expenses.  Don't know if there's a similar thing in Canada.

Edited February 15, 2017 by johnzo

[The Unknown Poster]

People fearing treatment and persecution in the US fleeing to Canada and sneaking in.  Where have we heard this before.  Its a new underground railroad.

[The Unknown Poster]

27 minutes ago, johnzo said:

Congressional Republicans have rolled out an ACA replacement proposal that eliminates the requirement that health insurance companies cover people for pre-existing conditions. (which is very popular). 

It also stipulates that you can't use your own health savings account* money to pay for an abortion.

*An HSA is a tax-free savings account that one uses to pay for health care expenses.  Don't know if there's a similar thing in Canada.

I think certain businesses use HSA's.  My friend worked for a bank here and their Health Coverage includes an HSA rather then individual limited on certain things.  Employees got X amount in the HSA kitty to use on whatever they wanted.

Abortion is a tough issue.  Im very pro-life as an adoptee.  Education and availability of contraception should be prioritized to reduce unwanted pregnancies in the first place.

The argument between men and women is interesting.  I dont recall the details but I believe it was a US congressman who put forth the idea that a pregnant woman should have to receive consent from the father of the unborn child to get an abortion.  I realize the argument against the father having any say is that it's the woman's body.  But then...can a man give up his parental responsibilities if he so chooses (and the woman has the baby)?

[johnzo]

If abortion is legal, it's insane to prevent people from using their own money to buy them.  The money in an HSA is contributed by the HSA's owner.

33 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

 Abortion is a tough issue.  Im very pro-life as an adoptee.  Education and availability of contraception should be prioritized to reduce unwanted pregnancies in the first place.

The argument between men and women is interesting.  I dont recall the details but I believe it was a US congressman who put forth the idea that a pregnant woman should have to receive consent from the father of the unborn child to get an abortion.  I realize the argument against the father having any say is that it's the woman's body.  But then...can a man give up his parental responsibilities if he so chooses (and the woman has the baby)?

With you 1000x on the contraception thing.  It's strange how the people who hate abortions are also against the government helping to pay for peoples' contraception. 

It was an Oklahoma state rep or senator who proposed the father permission rule.  Probably not a huge surprise that I disagree with that, I think that women's bodies are  sovereign and I don't think men should have any abortion-authorization rights.  I could get into why I believe that but that could become a super heated discussion very quickly so happy to just agree to disagree on that one and move on unless people really want to talk about it.

Good on your adoptive parents; people who work hard for kids are heroes.

[The Unknown Poster]

9 minutes ago, johnzo said:

If abortion is legal, it's insane to prevent people from using their own money to buy them.  The money in an HSA is contributed by the HSA's owner.

With you 1000x on the contraception thing.  It's strange how the people who hate abortions are also against the government helping to pay for peoples' contraception. 

It was an Oklahoma state rep or senator who proposed the father permission rule.  Probably not a huge surprise that I disagree with that, I think that women's bodies are  sovereign and I don't think men should have any abortion-authorization rights.  I could get into why I believe that but that could become a super heated discussion very quickly so happy to just agree to disagree on that one and move on unless people really want to talk about it.

Good on your adoptive parents; people who work hard for kids are heroes.

Im not too fiery about it.  I've had my share of discussions on it.  Its complicated.  To me its less about the body and more about the moral implications.  I believe most people going for an abortion would not do so if they saw the fetus which is why those crazy people that harass patients show them aborted fetuses.  But the point is the same.  I think the topic can be compromised on a lot more to narrow the availability and practice of abortion.

My point, which is not one I've thought much about and only as a random thought is, if a father has zero say.  Like zero.  Then the decision to become a parent or not rests with the mother.  If so, should the father not have the option of opting out of parenting as well?  In many cases that would be a good thing. lol

My bio mom was 15 so she did a good thing for me.  Bio dad was there too as near as I can tell but they dont release info on paternal side of things.  My family has fostered kids since before I was born, like hundreds of kids.  New borns.  Toddlers.  Teens.  Into adulthood.   Short term.  Long term.  Drug babies.  Aids babies.  We've seen it all.  Tough tough stuff.  The homerun success stories are few but very gratifying when it happens.

[kelownabomberfan]

2 hours ago, Rich said:

This isn't a commentary on whether or not all these people should be let into the country, but it is sad that this many people have it so bad in their home country they risk this voyage to get out. 

 

I get fleeing from Syria and Libya, but why are all of these people suddenly fleeing Africa as well?  What changed?

[kelownabomberfan]

1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

People fearing treatment and persecution in the US fleeing to Canada and sneaking in.  Where have we heard this before.  Its a new underground railroad.

What are you talking about? 

[bigg jay]

10 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

I get fleeing from Syria and Libya, but why are all of these people suddenly fleeing Africa as well?  What changed?

Nothing has changed as far as refugees coming from Africa.  The refugees in Emerson are mostly from Somalia where there's been a civil war going on since 1991.  Minneapolis has a large Somali community so refugees tend to go there for support.  Since Trump is trying to ban Somalian refugees, a lot of them are trying to get to Canada rather than wait to see what the US justice decides to do.

[do or die]

On 2016-11-21 at 8:16 AM, The Unknown Poster said:

THis is a great take on it.  Certainly, you have to question the intelligence of those who voted for Trump.  But there are legitimate reasons some did.  But like Stewart I agree there disqualifiers.   I think that's the pain some people feel here.  You see it everywhere really (here certainly) where people blindly support a party no matter what.

But I doubt Trump wants the job for 8 years. 

During the election I was traveling through the Dakotas, Minnesota, and Illinois.    Talked to a bunch of folks about it, got some varying reasons on why  people were supporting Donald Trump.   Some of them seemed fascinated with his celebrity status,   Some considered him a "straight shooter"  and more importantly "not a politician"

But, the key concept I took away, was that a lot of people were angry - real, real  angry.... and mistrustful of not just the Democrats, but of the entire current economic, political and judicial systems.....and were looking for an outlet to vent that anger and "make ourselves heard"

In short, the general feeling among Trump supporters was....that the "deck was stacked" and "no one was really listening to us" and that it was time to "send a message to Washington"     

Trump really cashed in on this.....running as the ultimate outsider (even attacking mainstream Republicans) , telling people what they wanted to hear, utilizing very simple and strident messages, or sound bites....and a very simplistic problem/solution mantra....while actively encouraging folks to get as "mad as hell" and then channeling that anger into an over the top aggressive posture....which also helped Trump play pretty fast and loose with the truth, and having it accepted in quite a number of instances...

"Make America great again"

"Build a wall, and make Mexico pay for it"

"Tear up NAFTA, etc, give Americans a better deal"

"Lock her up"

"Drain the swamp"

Trouble is, without the what and the how.....these statements are in themselves, are really pretty meaningless.    During the election, Trump articulated no plans or policies to accomplish any of this - depending on his supporters to take it on strictly face value. (they did)

So in the end, this real estate baron, CEO, 1 per-center, business mogul....had now somehow become the acknowledged voice of the legit concerns and enabler....of  blue collar America.

Ironic. 

Without going further into what has happened in the first month, in the Trump White House.....as I am out of breath, at present...

 

[Mark F]

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Edited February 15, 2017 by Mark F

[Mark F]

45 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

I get fleeing from Syria and Libya, but why are all of these people suddenly fleeing Africa as well?

Libya is in Africa.

Edited February 15, 2017 by Mark F

[kelownabomberfan]

16 minutes ago, Mark F said:

Libya is in Africa.

Yeah I know. I meant parts of Africa that aren't considered failed states. I get that a lot of Africa is not pleasant but it's been that way for a long time. Why suddenly are thousands of Africans appearing on the US border and trying to sneak into the US? Why now?

[johnzo]

17 hours ago, kelownabomberfan said:

Thanks Johnzo.  Hope you get some time off soon too.  Still a long way to football season! o

Truth.  I gotta get back to Winnipeg for the Fringe Festival and a Bomber game this summer, I took my wife a couple years ago and she really loved the scene there (except for the mosquitos and the Bombers stinking up the joint against Edmonton) so it's an easy sell for a vacation/visit home.

Anyway, regarding failed states, there's all kinds of shitty refugee situations in Africa.  http://www.unhcr.org/en-us/africa.html has the details. Civil wars, religious wars, anti-lgbt laws, etc. 

As for why a sudden surge, I think it's a case of the surge just getting noticed.  African immigration to the USA radically increased in the 2000s, per http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/14/african-immigrant-population-in-u-s-steadily-climbs/

[johnzo]

2 hours ago, do or die said:

During the election I was traveling through the Dakotas, Minnesota, and Illinois.    Talked to a bunch of folks about it, got some varying reasons on why  people were supporting Donald Trump.   Some of them seemed fascinated with his celebrity status,   Some considered him a "straight shooter"  and more importantly "not a politician"

But, the key concept I took away, was that a lot of people were angry - real, real  angry.... and mistrustful of not just the Democrats, but of the entire current economic, political and judicial systems.....and were looking for an outlet to vent that anger and "make ourselves heard"

Yeah, this sucks.  An angry population is easy to motivate in bad directions, and people on the left have absolutely no clue how to respond to that anger. And when I say forces, I mean both legitimate economic forces and less legit agitators like Fox News / talk radio / twitter trolls / etc.

I think this accounts for the huge frustration among the Bernie folks in the USA ... conditions seemed ripe for a genuine socialist populist to emerge with bipartisan nationwide support and completely shake up the American political etch-a-sketch.  Instead the Dems went in for Clinton.

There's definitely some truth to the stereotype of a coastal elite that lives a completely different life than their inland cousins. Here in Seattle I'm surrounded by people who very deliberately moved away from the small inland towns they hated, and they are really really not the best ambassadors for urbanite left-wing ideas.

[The Unknown Poster]

I think a lot of Trump voters assumed he wasnt going to win. So they figured it didnt matter. 

[The Unknown Poster]

I don't think I'd want to go to war with the intelligence community. 

 

[do or die]

.....or the Judiciary

......or the media

....or the mainstream members of your own party.....

[The Unknown Poster]

6 minutes ago, do or die said:

.....or the Judiciary

......or the media

....or the mainstream members of your own party.....

My feeling has always been that Trump is legitimately an arrogant SOB and not doing all this with some exit strategy in mind. He seems very impulsive and emotional.  But I wonder if the thought has occurred to him that if his leaving office is inevitable (either through risk of impeachment, removal or his own boredom) that he is trying to create a "they forced me out" scenario.

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

And just to ratchet up tensions between the WH and IC...

 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/16/politics/stephen-feinberg-white-house-intelligence-agencies/index.html?adkey=bn

 

Quote

White House considering outsider to review intelligence agencies

By Jim Sciutto, Chief National Security Correspondent

 

Updated 10:37 AM ET, Thu February 16, 2017

(CNN)The White House is considering tapping Stephen Feinberg, founder of a New York investment firm and a longtime friend to President Donald Trump, to conduct a review of US intelligence agencies, according to US officials with knowledge of the plans.

There are still many issues to work out, especially because the Director of National Intelligence -- by statute -- has oversight over the agencies and is the President's prime contact on all intelligence issues, one of the sources said.

An administration official confirmed the move is under consideration.

Feinberg, a billionaire who leads the private equity firm Cerberus Capital Management, was a top economic adviser to Trump during the 2016 campaign and has been one of the President's friends for decades.

The New York Times first reported the plans and said Feinberg has informed his company's shareholders he is in discussions to join the administration.

Trump has nominated former Indiana Sen. Dan Coats, a Republican, to be DNI but he has not been confirmed yet.

Full story here

 

 

Doesn't he know that the USA is at war with other countries?

Edited February 16, 2017 by wanna-b-fanboy

[Mark F]

15 hours ago, johnzo said:

Instead the Dems went in for Clinton.

Neither party really minds being out of power... they take turns.... doing little for the citizens..... not much difference between them.  Style, not substance. Democrats  preferred to be out of power, and have Trump, than go with Sanders.

Someday, hopefully, people everywhere, (not just the USA) will realize the nature of this game. Divide and rule.

We have it here as well.

Trump finally right about something wannabe... NYT is failing, financially anyway.

Edited February 16, 2017 by Mark F

[The Unknown Poster]

Didnt JFK try to go to war with the intelligence community.  Not sure that ended well.  Different scenario though.

I like Trump's boldness.  He doesnt refute anything...he's just mad its being leaked.  Its interesting because you can argue its treasonous in some ways.  But Im guess those in the intelligence community who "know" things feel they are upholding their commitment to the constitution by exposing Trump.

[The Unknown Poster]

Trump employing the same tactics we did when we liked a girl in school.  three way calling!

 

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

Unfortunately there isn't a strictly Trump thread, so I guess this bit of awesomeness goes here:

 

 

[The Unknown Poster]

Relayed to above. Im assuming this guy is now on several watch lists lol  although if JT had done this he would have secured my vote in the next election  

 

[Mark F]

What's the count of billionaires in Trumpville?