US Politics

[Mark F]

So Russia today said they will shoot down American fighter jets in Syria.

 

 

[iHeart]

wow is there really any truth to this? I can't tell if this is fake news

 

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2017-06-19/sean-spicer-to-lead-communications-office-searches-for-new-press-secretary

[Mark F]

neither can I. guess we'll see.

[StevetheClub]

Not sure what the big deal is. He is currently overseeing two offices and it sounds like he and/or his superiors would like him to shift to one, which sounds like is typical.

[The Unknown Poster]

"It's Obama's fault I conspired with Russia"

 

[Atomic]

5 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

"It's Obama's fault I conspired with Russia"

 

"It's Trump's fault that the DNC's security was a joke"

[The Unknown Poster]

 

[johnzo]

Senate Republican health care plan is out. It makes deep cuts to Medicaid.

Nearly half of newborn deliveries in the USA are funded by Medicaid.

What the **** does "pro-life" even mean to these people?

The Congressional plan cut almost $900B in government health spending over the next decade.  Strangely, it only reduced the deficit by $100B. Where is the other $800B going?

[Wideleft]

48 minutes ago, johnzo said:

Senate Republican health care plan is out. It makes deep cuts to Medicaid.

Nearly half of newborn deliveries in the USA are funded by Medicaid.

What the **** does "pro-life" even mean to these people?

The Congressional plan cut almost $900B in government health spending over the next decade.  Strangely, it only reduced the deficit by $100B. Where is the other $800B going?

To the richest of the rich, of course.  That new swamp is full of greenbacks and I ain't talking walleye.  https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2017-06-23/senate-gop-health-bill-tax-cuts-for-rich 

 

[Mark F]

On 2017-06-23 at 0:00 PM, johnzo said:

Strangely, it only reduced the deficit by $100B. Where is the other $800B going?

Conservative governments don't actually care much about government debt.

They talk about how terrible it is,  but are happy to increase it as much as anyone else.

And right now we get to see US government "run like a business".

 

 

 

Edited June 25, 2017 by Mark F

[do or die]

So Trump wasn't going to gut Medicare?   Right.  Only eliminate Medicaid coverage for nursing homes, the elderly, home care for the disabled, etc.

Repeal and Replace in a way, is not actually the central issue, although there is the added bonus of throwing out health coverages for 22 million Americans, so that only "deserving" people (with money) can have it....and 300 Billion or so, made available for tax cuts for big business moguls, other 1 per-centers and the appropriate lobbyists.

The real, core deal, here.... is that Republicans are just dying to kill basic, longtime health and social programs put into place by FDR, LBJ, and Obama......  so the privileged and rich can become even wealthier.  

Which is really all you need to know about these people............

 

Edited June 27, 2017 by do or die

[Mark F]

The Americans can afford two trillion to invade Iraq, but just can't afford public single payer healthcare.

what a corrupt country.

Yeah, Trump and friends are greedy stupid ignorant scum, but,

If the Democrats, who had control of house, senate, and whitehouse had just forgotten about their "donors" (pharmacy and medical "industry" ugh)

for once, and rammed through single payer, which they could have done, Using procedures which the Republicans do not hestitate to use,

they might have assured themselves years of being in power, if that's all they care about.

But they didn't even try. Obama campaigned on including a "public option" which he promptly ditched when elected.

Instead, they pass what many non rightwingers, people who study it carefully, have called a seven hundred page mess, which works sort of, but not really. there are still multi millions with no care at all.

Hillary spent one billion on her campaign. Lot of compromises needed to get that level of "donation"

There are all kinds of stories being publicized now, about Americans who delayed going to get treatment, and ended up with far worse conditions, cause they have huge copays, or nothing at all. That's under Obama's healthcare.

Puke.

Universal single payer public health care.

I  give huge thanks that I live in Canada, for that alone.

edit : saw this

"DR. STEFFIE WOOLHANDLER: We reviewed the world’s scientific literature on the relationship between health insurance and mortality. And there is really now a scientific consensus that being uninsured raises the death rates. It raises your death rates by between 3 and 29 percent. And the math on that is that if you take health insurance away from 22 million people, about 29,000 of them will die every year, annually, as a result. That’s what we found by reviewing the literature. There was a similar review in New England Journal of Medicine. We published our own study in the Annals of Internal Medicine, which is the official organ of the American College of Physicians, the nation’s largest medical specialty society. "

whether 3 or 29, Brutal.

and yet there are still people down there who will support Trump.

 

 

Edited June 27, 2017 by Mark F
edit

[HardCoreBlue]

2 hours ago, Mark F said:

The Americans can afford two trillion to invade Iraq, but just can't afford public single payer healthcare.

what a corrupt country.

Yeah, Trump and friends are greedy stupid ignorant scum, but,

If the Democrats, who had control of house, senate, and whitehouse had just forgotten about their "donors" (pharmacy and medical "industry" ugh)

for once, and rammed through single payer, which they could have done, Using procedures which the Republicans do not hestitate to use,

they might have assured themselves years of being in power, if that's all they care about.

But they didn't even try. Obama campaigned on including a "public option" which he promptly ditched when elected.

Instead, they pass what many non rightwingers, people who study it carefully, have called a seven hundred page mess, which works sort of, but not really. there are still multi millions with no care at all.

Hillary spent one billion on her campaign. Lot of compromises needed to get that level of "donation"

There are all kinds of stories being publicized now, about Americans who delayed going to get treatment, and ended up with far worse conditions, cause they have huge copays, or nothing at all. That's under Obama's healthcare.

Puke.

Universal single payer public health care.

I  give huge thanks that I live in Canada, for that alone.

edit : saw this

"DR. STEFFIE WOOLHANDLER: We reviewed the world’s scientific literature on the relationship between health insurance and mortality. And there is really now a scientific consensus that being uninsured raises the death rates. It raises your death rates by between 3 and 29 percent. And the math on that is that if you take health insurance away from 22 million people, about 29,000 of them will die every year, annually, as a result. That’s what we found by reviewing the literature. There was a similar review in New England Journal of Medicine. We published our own study in the Annals of Internal Medicine, which is the official organ of the American College of Physicians, the nation’s largest medical specialty society. "

whether 3 or 29, Brutal.

and yet there are still people down there who will support Trump.

 

 

Some of the same people who have been armed with the tag line FAKE NEWS when countering people like Dr. Steffie Wollhandler.   

[Atomic]

Amazingly, people will die regardless of health coverage, in 100% of the cases.

[The Unknown Poster]

The Canadian system isnt perfect.  But it sure does beat not being able to go to the Walk-in or ER whenever you feel the need.  In fact, one of the issues with our system is that people go when they dont need to. 

The US really needs a scenario where they can revamp their military focus.  Didnt they go through a period of "leaner" military, not less military just more efficient.  One less war would fund health care forever.

[Mark F]

2 hours ago, Atomic said:

Amazingly, people will die regardless of health coverage, in 100% of the cases.

 

and also.... the sky is blue. Does God exist?

 

Edited June 27, 2017 by Mark F

[Mark F]

2 hours ago, HardCoreBlue said:

Some of the same people who have been armed with the tag line FAKE NEWS when countering people like Dr. Steffie Wollhandler.   

And....longevity in usa is declining substantially, and rapidly.

 

[Atomic]

8 minutes ago, Mark F said:

And....longevity in usa is declining substantially, and rapidly.

Not necessarily a bad thing.  People's value to society sharply drops off after 65.

[Mark F]

1 hour ago, Atomic said:

Not necessarily a bad thing.  People's value to society sharply drops off after 65.

good one!

keep em coming!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2017 by Mark F

[johnzo]

One thing to remember about the Affordable Care Act is that it substantially expanded Medicaid (basically, federal gov't health insurance for poor folks, handicapped folks, people in nursing homes, etc.)   I can't find a simple nationwide expansion number, but in Washington state, 600,000 more people were enrolled in Medicare post-expansion, and in California and NY, 6 million more people were enrolled. So you have millions of people who could almost certainly not afford private health insurance (Medicaid is means-tested) now having coverage.

Medicaid isn't perfect, but it's a damn sight better than being uninsured and relying on an ER for your chemotherapy.

The individual mandate part of the law -- the part that says you either have health insurance or pay a tax penalty -- is the part that everyone is attacking, the one that creates a weird and freaky partnership between the government and the insurance business. This could definitely use reform, but there are success stories. Two of my close friends rely on the Washington state insurance exchange for coverage, and they are definitely up **** creek if that market destabilizes.

I want single-payer too, and I'm prepared to pay higher taxes for it .. but there is a baby in the Obamacare bathwater.  Just rolling back the clock to 2009 will hurt an awful lot of people.

8 hours ago, Mark F said:

Obama campaigned on including a "public option" which he promptly ditched when elected.

It's really hard to make drastic and fast change in the USA. It's not like Canada, where a single small committee in the PMO can unaccountably run the country as it sees fit.  The American government is set up to be slow and incremental.  Look at how much trouble Republicans are having with rewriting health care in the USA .. and that's with single-party control of the House, the Senate, and the presidency.  The Republicans are a largely disciplined machine and even they are breaking down on the health care question.

The New Deal was probably the most radical government plan in USA history .. and it would have fallen apart had not two Supreme Court justices decided at the last minute that federal intervention in the economy was not unconstitutional.  And Roosevelt had a landslide mandate as well as a friendly Congress. The system is deliberately set up to allow people to jam sticks into legislative spokes.

But yeah, be thankful for Canada.  I have a ton of blessings in the USA, many friends, a great wife, and a solid career in a field that capitalism finds useful, but it could be very different very quickly for me.

[FrostyWinnipeg]

 

[Mark F]

2 hours ago, johnzo said:

It's really hard to make drastic and fast change in the USA

edit.

ok.

Edited June 28, 2017 by Mark F

[HardCoreBlue]

15 hours ago, johnzo said:

One thing to remember about the Affordable Care Act is that it substantially expanded Medicaid (basically, federal gov't health insurance for poor folks, handicapped folks, people in nursing homes, etc.)   I can't find a simple nationwide expansion number, but in Washington state, 600,000 more people were enrolled in Medicare post-expansion, and in California and NY, 6 million more people were enrolled. So you have millions of people who could almost certainly not afford private health insurance (Medicaid is means-tested) now having coverage.

Medicaid isn't perfect, but it's a damn sight better than being uninsured and relying on an ER for your chemotherapy.

The individual mandate part of the law -- the part that says you either have health insurance or pay a tax penalty -- is the part that everyone is attacking, the one that creates a weird and freaky partnership between the government and the insurance business. This could definitely use reform, but there are success stories. Two of my close friends rely on the Washington state insurance exchange for coverage, and they are definitely up **** creek if that market destabilizes.

I want single-payer too, and I'm prepared to pay higher taxes for it .. but there is a baby in the Obamacare bathwater.  Just rolling back the clock to 2009 will hurt an awful lot of people.

It's really hard to make drastic and fast change in the USA. It's not like Canada, where a single small committee in the PMO can unaccountably run the country as it sees fit.  The American government is set up to be slow and incremental.  Look at how much trouble Republicans are having with rewriting health care in the USA .. and that's with single-party control of the House, the Senate, and the presidency.  The Republicans are a largely disciplined machine and even they are breaking down on the health care question.

The New Deal was probably the most radical government plan in USA history .. and it would have fallen apart had not two Supreme Court justices decided at the last minute that federal intervention in the economy was not unconstitutional.  And Roosevelt had a landslide mandate as well as a friendly Congress. The system is deliberately set up to allow people to jam sticks into legislative spokes.

But yeah, be thankful for Canada.  I have a ton of blessings in the USA, many friends, a great wife, and a solid career in a field that capitalism finds useful, but it could be very different very quickly for me.

Nice gratitude statement with a sprinkle of reality. A lot of us can relate.

[The Unknown Poster]

 

[JCon]

14 hours ago, The Unknown Poster said:

 

Interesting that a Republican President is proposing an internet tax. That will play well.