US Politics

[Mark F]

edit

Edited August 8, 2018 by Mark F

[Mark F]

double post

Edited August 8, 2018 by Mark F

[The Unknown Poster]

Trump claims he did nothing wrong but wont answer questions about the things he clearly did wrong.  They obviously think Mueller has him for Obstruction.

Id guess Mueller would give in because even if the interview is constrained to asking Trump about his favourite foods, he's likely to lie about something and then he's toast.  And if its really important, subpoena him and make Trump have to argue that he shouldnt be allowed to be suboenaed (making him look guilty) and when he loses, make him take the 5th.

Edited August 8, 2018 by The Unknown Poster

[do or die]

 

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/400909-giuliani-to-send-mueller-counteroffer-on-interview-with-trump-later

So, according to Rudy, topics that are out of bounds, would include questions about:

Collusion
Obstruction
Trump's remarks about former national security adviser Michael Flynn and fired FBI Director Comey

As if any special prosecutor...... would allow people to be questioned - to set the agenda and scope, of those questions, in any investigation.   Right, sure, uh huh.....

This "negotiation" is a complete puff of smoke.  It is only to convince people that Trump and the WH are "trying to co-operate".    Now Trump supporters in the main, might just be gullible enough to buy it - if not anyone else

 
 

 

[do or die]

Omarosa Manigault-Newman is coming out with her new book, about her time in the Trump White House - Unhinged.  

It will be soon described by Trump supporters as a pack of lies...

Except.....

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/400965-report-former-white-house-staffer-secretly-recorded-trump

 

 

[Mark F]

51 minutes ago, do or die said:

Except...

"Oops! Washington DC is a “one party consent” recording law jurisdiction! This could be good!"

(comment)

[kelownabomberfan]

19 hours ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

By razor thin margin. It should not have been even close.  The regressive won Ohio by double digits in 2016. That is concerning for the regressive. November is going to be huge for the Democrats.

We will see.  I remain unconvinced.

[kelownabomberfan]

9 hours ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

what kind of type of vote reform are they pushing through?

I believe that this website explains it:

https://biv.com/article/2018/06/what-bcs-three-proposed-systems-proportional-representation-could-mean-voters

Everyone can see right through this though.  The NDP/Greens think by changing the system they will get more seats.  No one here but a small minority wants that, especially after how terrible they have been at governing here so far since they usurped power.  The NDP have been accused of trying to make the process extremely confusing too, in order to try and get a better result for themselves.  This entire process of reviewing our voting system has been a giant waste of taxpayer money, but that's what the NDP does best.  

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

1 hour ago, kelownabomberfan said:

I believe that this website explains it:

https://biv.com/article/2018/06/what-bcs-three-proposed-systems-proportional-representation-could-mean-voters

Everyone can see right through this though.  The NDP/Greens think by changing the system they will get more seats.  No one here but a small minority wants that, especially after how terrible they have been at governing here so far since they usurped power.  The NDP have been accused of trying to make the process extremely confusing too, in order to try and get a better result for themselves.  This entire process of reviewing our voting system has been a giant waste of taxpayer money, but that's what the NDP does best.  

So then, what is it about proportional representation that you don't like?

How is it not more democratic than first past the post?

Edited August 9, 2018 by wanna-b-fanboy

[kelownabomberfan]

12 hours ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

So then, what is it about proportional representation that you don't like?

How is it not more democratic than first past the post?

When I look at what a mess European countries are that have prop rep, including Italy, I really lose all interest in that form of voting.  It took Germany what, eight months to form a government?  First past the post isn't perfect, that's for sure, and we are seeing one of the downsides of it here in BC right now with the unholy alliance of NDP and Greens doing a terrible job.  For me though the disaster we have now is also a great example of why we DON'T want to go to a system that allows more insane zealots to have seats in our government.  Usually, first past the post keeps the nutbars on both sides of the spectrum out.  As I said, look at Italy, you have Nazis and Communists running the country right now.  It's insane.

Edited August 9, 2018 by kelownabomberfan

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

2 hours ago, kelownabomberfan said:

 Usually, first past the post keeps the nutbars on both sides of the spectrum out.  As I said, look at Italy, you have Nazis and Communists running the country right now.  It's insane.

See that's the problem- people want democracy for all, until it doesn't suit their view (not you- just people in general, myself included). I mean we are all about the democratic process and fairness when it comes to voter rights, but once you introduce the fringe element of either side.... people get squeamish. If we live in a democratic society- then let us be in a democratic society for all, even the fringe people. Just hope that the mass of level headed people out number the fringe. 

 

As for Italy and so forth- if that is the way their country is leaning then that is the way it is leaning. The people of Italy have spoken. 

[kelownabomberfan]

52 minutes ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

See that's the problem- people want democracy for all, until it doesn't suit their view (not you- just people in general, myself included). I mean we are all about the democratic process and fairness when it comes to voter rights, but once you introduce the fringe element of either side.... people get squeamish. If we live in a democratic society- then let us be in a democratic society for all, even the fringe people. Just hope that the mass of level headed people out number the fringe. 

 

As for Italy and so forth- if that is the way their country is leaning then that is the way it is leaning. The people of Italy have spoken. 

I think everyone should have the right to vote (if they are a citizen anyway) and so I don't care if they want to vote for the fringe lunatic on the ticket.  I just don't want that fringe lunatic being my MLA/MP and being rewarded for their bad ideas with a six figure salary.  I don't want Nazis or Communists being a part of my government.  Their ideas are horrible and wrong.  In first past the post, these nuts are weeded out.  Fine by me.  But I don't say that people shouldn't have the right to vote for them.

As for Italy I'd say the exact opposite - a small minority has spoken and because of their flawed voting process that small minority has now created a giant mess.  I prefer our system - it's so much better and creates so much stability. 

[kelownabomberfan]

It’s not what they’re doing. It’s how they’re doing it that will occupy the judge’s attention.

 

And there’s probably enough leeway in the Constitution, the charter of rights and the relevant legislation that the NDP-Green power play will at least get to a vote in November.

So some of the valid complaints about how fixed this fall’s referendum is, how self-serving it is and how skewed the process has been to date are just background noise in a courtroom. Nonetheless, two-thirds of the petition against the referendum is an everything-but-the-kitchen-sink encyclopedia about the inequities in the referendum.

The strictly legal arguments, by contrast, amount to a modest 10 pages. They’re based on the premise that changing the voting system is a constitutional change, so the provincial constitution would have to be changed under a section of the 1867 Constitution Act.

Another point is that the referendum results bind governments because they are presumed to represent a clear statement by the electorate. But this two-stage ballot doesn’t offer a clear choice, they argue. The first question offers a choice only between the status quo and a general undefined concept (“proportional representation”).

And the second preferential ballot on three choices of PR systems has a lot of details missing that are left to the government’s future discretion.

An additional wrinkle: Some voters on the second question will have voted against changing on the first choice. So they’ll be ranking the systems on the basis of which they dislike the least. The argument is that can’t be counted as a vote in favour, and would invalidate the results.

Also listed as a legal point are the restrictions on advertising spending during the campaign, something the plaintiffs think violates their free-speech rights.

The overall argument is that that upcoming referendum, with its no-minimum-turnout threshold, uncertain questions and arbitrary government design, doesn’t measure up to democratic standards.

The case is brought by the Independent Contractors and Businesses Association, which is becoming the omnibus challenger of all NDP moves (the Trans Mountain Pipeline stall, community benefits agreements, etc.).

Association president Chris Gardner is joined by a low-profile union leader as a plaintiff. Ken Baerg is the director of the Canada West Construction Union, an unaffiliated organization with members in B.C. and Alberta.

Their game plan is to get the referendum postponed until the legal flaws are corrected.

They say they support a referendum on voting systems, but one that’s done in a more fair and transparent manner. In the meantime, they’re active on the No side.

 

https://www.timescolonist.com/opinion/columnists/les-leyne-injunction-bid-on-vote-reform-will-be-longshot-1.23393048

[johnzo]

On 2018-08-07 at 8:45 PM, kelownabomberfan said:

Ohio stayed Republican tonight.  And yet all we hear is how much the Republicans suck.  Fair enough.  So what's the problem?  Why are they still winning?  Saying that it's because voters are stupid is a sure fire way to keep losing.  There is a bigger picture here.

The Ohio congressional victory for the GOP was like us beating the Alouettes 7-6 on a last minute safety touch.  Bombers still get the two points, but morningbigblue would be rightfully freaking out about our underperformance.

Re, the bigger picture.  it's a pat and often lazy left-wing thing to say that the Republicans are driven by racism, but man, after watching this Laura Ingraham piece I have to wonder about that. 

Her problem is that there are too many brown people in the USA, and that the USA she loves is gone because of that.

(the bit about not voting for that massive demographic change is kinda funny, as Reagan and Bush I did far more to formally legitimize immigrants than Clinton or Obama, and Bush II almost got a giant amnesty bill to sign, before it was derailed by congressional opposition)

Edited August 9, 2018 by johnzo

[Jacquie]

14 minutes ago, johnzo said:

The Ohio congressional victory for the GOP was like us beating the Alouettes 7-6 on a last minute safety touch.  Bombers still get the two points, but this place would be concerned about whether the Bombers were actuallly a winning team.

The GOP hasn’t won it yet. There were 600 ballots discovered which has narrowed the margin. As well, there are over 1,700 provisional votes and over 1,700 absentee ballots that haven’t been counted yet.

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/ohio-finds-votes-special-elections_us_5b6c0aeae4b0530743c72e77

[do or die]

Right now, less immigrants are entering the US, than in the Reagan era.   But you wouldn't know, with all the Trump/GOP hyperbole on this subject. 

"Invasion, bad hombres, hordes.....are just hot buttons for people who just have to have scapegoats for something or other.  Historically, the successive waves of Irish, Jews, Italians, Germans, and other Eastern European immigrants, helped build America into the world's superpower.  

Mind you, they were white.  As if the following Mexican, Asian, and African immigrants have contributed nothing to the prosperity of America.  You know, S-hole countries.   Irony, is that a lot of the people bellowing on this issue, were descended from immigrants, themselves.   The alt-Right and Trump have played on the anger and ignorance, surrounding immigration and created a narrative of shameless lies, to further their (and supporters) xenophobia and bigotry.

Which leads me to good ole Jeff Sessions

http://thehill.com/latino/401128-judge-threatens-to-hold-sessions-in-contempt-after-attempted-deportation-of-migrant

This administration will simply run amok, if allowed to.

 

 

[johnzo]

1 hour ago, Jacquie said:

The GOP hasn’t won it yet. There were 600 ballots discovered which has narrowed the margin. As well, there are over 1,700 provisional votes and over 1,700 absentee ballots that haven’t been counted yet.

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/ohio-finds-votes-special-elections_us_5b6c0aeae4b0530743c72e77

O'Connor would have to win the remaining votes 70-30 to pull this off, and that's assuming no provisional ballots are discarded. It could happen, but I think this election is in garbage time.

Tho of course O'Connor should do everything he's entitled to do to make sure the ballots have been cast and counted correctly.

Edited August 9, 2018 by johnzo

[kelownabomberfan]

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/politics/opinion-how-donald-trump-just-keeps-winning/ar-BBLHlEy?ocid=spartanntp

[johnzo]

1 hour ago, do or die said:

Right now, less immigrants are entering the US, than in the Reagan era.   But you wouldn't know, with all the Trump/GOP hyperbole on this subject. 

"Invasion, bad hombres, hordes.....are just hot buttons for people who just have to have scapegoats for something or other.  Historically, the successive waves of Irish, Jews, Italians, Germans, and other Eastern European immigrants, helped build America into the world's superpower.  

Mind you, they were white.

I dunno if the Irish and Italians and especially the Jews were welcomed back in the day, or even considered "white." There's lots of examples of violence and organization against them .... tens of thousands of Jewish refugees were turned away from America in the world war years.

Which makes it especially galling to see people like Bill O'Reilly -- the descendant of Irish refugees -- going on about how refugees and immigrants suck.

Edited August 9, 2018 by johnzo

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

22 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/politics/opinion-how-donald-trump-just-keeps-winning/ar-BBLHlEy?ocid=spartanntp

TFT.

 

A few interesting tidbits here:

Quote

"As long as I campaign and/or support Senate and House candidates (within reason), they will win!"

That's not exactly the right conclusion, based on Trump's results. More accurately, the first line of that tweet would read: "As long as I campaign and/or support Senate and House candidates (within reason), they will win primaries."

 

Quote

"we will have a giant Red Wave!"

Heheh - someone needs to tell trump that the "red wave" is a euphemism for menstruation. 

 

And this conclusion here is very telling about how reality slants left.

Quote

This is the Trump paradox for Republicans. Break with him and risk being on the wrong side of a primary loss. Stick with him and run the risk of being dragged down by his unpopularity with everyone outside of the Republican base.

 

Edited August 9, 2018 by wanna-b-fanboy

[do or die]

51 minutes ago, johnzo said:

I dunno if the Irish and Italians and especially the Jews were welcomed back in the day, or even considered "white." There's lots of examples of violence and organization against them .... tens of thousands of Jewish refugees were turned away from America in the world war years.

Which makes it especially galling to see people like Bill O'Reilly -- the descendant of Irish refugees -- going on about how refugees and immigrants suck.

No they did not get welcomed with open arms.....I was focusing on their contributions.....compared to hypocrites like O'Reilly.....or, uh that Drumpf fella.

[Mark F]

Hard to grasp the casual viciousness of Trump and his staff. 

 

Quote

A federal appeals court ruled Thursday that the Environmental Protection Agency violated the law by allowing the sale of chlorpyrifos, a pesticide that has been shown to harm the brains of babies. The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals also ordered the agency to stop the sale of the chemical in 60 days. Farmworkers and environmentalists sued last year when then-EPA Administrator Scott Pruitt halted an attempt to ban the use of chlorpyrifos on food. “The panel held that there was no justification for the EPA’s decision in its 2017 order to maintain a tolerance for chlorpyrifos in the face of scientific evidence that its residue on food causes neurodevelopmental damage to children,” wrote Judge Jed S. Rakoff in the majority opinion. Dow Chemical Co. created chlorpyrifos in the 1960s and sells 5 million pounds of it in the U.S. each year. It is chemically similar to a Nazi chemical warfare agent, according to NBC News. Pruitt said last year that studies on whether chlorpyrifos is harmful are inconclusive.

And who is it that wants to sell this toxin? Ban abortions, then cause brain damage to the baby.

These people are vile filth.

 

Edited August 9, 2018 by Mark F

[johnzo]

Anyway, this Ingraham stuff is pretty ******* scary.

I am a legal immigrant to the USA.  I don't feel personally targeted by the current administration because I'm the whitest goddamn person on the planet (I'm mostly English + Danish) and my record is squeaky-clean here ... but every time I see a headline about targeting legal immigrants I get a little nervous. I need to get my ass naturalized soon, because this is my home, and I need to feel secure in it, and also being able to vote will be good.

Just in case anyone is curious -- I don't resent "illegal" immigrants because I got to emigrate to the USA by choice, I was at the end of a bad relationship and needed a change, and hey, why not Seattle? But I could have moved anywhere in Canada, or a lot of other countries, and I would've been fine. I didn't come to the USA under duress, because my home country is a bomb-paved hellscape, or because there's no other way I can support my family, or because my government is killing people of my religion. A lot of those folks have faced enormous hardship that I simply can't imagine, and once they're here, they are paying taxes and working hard  -- much, much harder than I do, with my super cushy office rocket programming job.  And so I'm not going to condemn those folks on the basis of them being on the wrong side of a border as a survival strategy.

Edited August 10, 2018 by johnzo

[kelownabomberfan]

This is puzzling...

 

[The Unknown Poster]

16 minutes ago, kelownabomberfan said:

This is puzzling...

 

Not really, Rasmussen is a well known conservative-bias polling group.   Plus there is always the chance of voter stupidity lol