Trade Barker & Milanovich for O'Shea & Walters?

[Noeller]

I still firmly believe the league mandated that Ray trade because they felt the Argos needed saving, and they were hosting the game that year, so if they got Ray, won the Cup, then all of a sudden the franchise would be fine again. I really and truly believe that...conspiracy theory be damned...

[Taynted_Fayth]

8 minutes ago, Noeller said:

I still firmly believe the league mandated that Ray trade because they felt the Argos needed saving, and they were hosting the game that year, so if they got Ray, won the Cup, then all of a sudden the franchise would be fine again. I really and truly believe that...conspiracy theory be damned...

I didnt think at the time it was the league setting this up, I truly believed Tillman was going to end up in toronto to some capacity and was basically shifting over an asset he didnt want to lose when he left the eskimoes

[Dragon37]

No thanks to either. Milanovich as OC maybe but even then I am not sold. I was proven wrong by both MOS and Walters and after the promising season they had I am more than okay for both to get one more shot to improve the team. 

Edited November 23, 2016 by Dragon37
Grammar

[M.O.A.B.]

I'm open to Millanovich as OC... IF Lapo bolts for a HC gig... but I got a feeling Lapo will choose to stay in 'Peg.. here's hoping.

[SpeedFlex27]

4 hours ago, BigBlue said:

thank you

Like why not just be honest & say you want Walters & O'Shea gone instead of hiding how you feel with some fantasy trade that will never happen?  Then, on top of things you start telling us why it should happen. All you guys that want O'Shea gone should just give it up already. He's coming back.

Edited November 23, 2016 by SpeedFlex27

[Blueandgold]

8 hours ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

Arblows:

2013: 11-7    2014: 8-10  2015: 10-8   2016: 5-13

 

Bombers:

2013: 3-15  2014: 7-11  2015: 5-13  2016: 11-7 

 

I like how we trend vs TO. Elated that you are not making Cheif Executive decisions for the Bombers. 

 

I'd never make the trade, but this might be the only argument that supports it. The Argos being superior any year between 2013-2015 is a fairly damning comparison.

[Eternal optimist]

16 hours ago, BigBlue said:

In Fantasyland, this trade would be interesting. The Toronto managerial talent is better & proven. The Winnipeg duo holds out hope, promise and dreams. If I was CEO I think I would make the trade.

No way would I make this "trade" - not even in Fantasyland.

[GCn20]

I would hire Barker in a heart beat as our QB scout....but that's about it.

[17to85]

14 minutes ago, gcn11 said:

I would hire Barker in a heart beat as our QB scout....but that's about it.

the question would be though, good scouting of qbs or good coaching of qbs? Who did Barker bring into the league in his previous stops? 

[JCon]

He found one QB? Callaros? Who else am I missing?

[Blueandgold]

8 minutes ago, JCon said:

He found one QB? Callaros? Who else am I missing?

Trevor Harris.

[JCon]

Just now, Blueandgold said:

Trevor Harris.

Who started well both seasons but faded pretty bad. I'll reserve judgement for a few seasons more.

[BigBlue]

Regarding Drew Willy, who has made the biggest mistake .... Walters for signing unproven Drew to a stupid big contract so we had to get rid of him when he faltered ... or Barker for giving up a high draft pick to get Drew as a reclamation project?

[bigg jay]

11 minutes ago, Blueandgold said:

Trevor Harris.

He signed Harris but I wouldn't go as far as to say he found him.  I can't find the specifics at the moment, but I remember hearing that he had been on a few different neg lists before he finally landed on Toronto's.

 

[Jpan85]

WE also have Ted Govia on our staff who was scout with Toronto when Collaros and Harris were brought in.

[bigg jay]

18 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Regarding Drew Willy, who has made the biggest mistake .... Walters for signing unproven Drew to a stupid big contract so we had to get rid of him when he faltered ... or Barker for giving up a high draft pick to get Drew as a reclamation project?

Barker all day.  Walters, in hindsight, may have made a mistake but he not only corrected it but he added the 1st overall pick.  Barker paid a high price for a broken QB and now he's stuck with him and that contract.

[BigBlue]

25 minutes ago, bigg jay said:

Barker all day.  Walters, in hindsight, may have made a mistake but he not only corrected it but he added the 1st overall pick.  Barker paid a high price for a broken QB and now he's stuck with him and that contract.

Do you think Barker made the deal out of desperation to save his job? Or is a real rehab possible... we gave up a first for Khari Jones and that worked out .... maybe Drew is irredeemable ... as to Ricky Ray, Burris has turned out to be better than Collaros in the past two or three seasons .... probably because of injuries but who can forecast that ... a healthy Burris in Hamilton might have meant a cup visit or two for Hamilton ... Ray has been amongst the elite in the league: could Barker know he would turn into glass?

Edited November 23, 2016 by BigBlue

[bearpants]

1 hour ago, BigBlue said:

Regarding Drew Willy, who has made the biggest mistake .... Walters for signing unproven Drew to a stupid big contract so we had to get rid of him when he faltered ... or Barker for giving up a high draft pick to get Drew as a reclamation project?

When you word it like that... definitely Barker... Barker knew what he was getting, a mediocre to average (at best) and potentially broken down QB...  and he took on the huge contract and gave up a ton to get him...

Walters signed him on potential... sometime that works out, sometimes it's a mistake... 

[bearpants]

37 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Do you think Barker made the deal out of desperation to save his job? Or is a real rehab possible... we gave up a first for Khari Jones and that worked out .... maybe Drew is irredeemable ... as to Ricky Ray, Burris has turned out to be better than Collaros in the past two or three seasons .... probably because of injuries but who can forecast that ... a healthy Burris in Hamilton might have meant a cup visit or two for Hamilton ... Ray has been amongst the elite in the league: could Barker know he would turn into glass?

You're missing the point here... when he originally traded for Ray, it was a great deal... he got one of the best QBs in the league for a bag of balls... but over the past couple years Ray has shown injury concerns and yet Barker chose to stick with Ray rather than hand the keys over to Collaros or Harris...

[bigg jay]

56 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Do you think Barker made the deal out of desperation to save his job? Or is a real rehab possible... we gave up a first for Khari Jones and that worked out .... maybe Drew is irredeemable ... as to Ricky Ray, Burris has turned out to be better than Collaros in the past two or three seasons .... probably because of injuries but who can forecast that ... a healthy Burris in Hamilton might have meant a cup visit or two for Hamilton ... Ray has been amongst the elite in the league: could Barker know he would turn into glass?

Not a good comparison.  Injury-free back-up looking for a chance to start versus a former starter with injury/performance issues trying to resurrect his career.

How would Barker know that a 37 year old QB would be more susceptible to injury?  Common sense might tell him that or the fact he missed 36 games over 5 seasons would be another indicator that he should probably be planning for the future.  He let 2 guys walk in a 3 year span where Ray was already having health issues.  The fact that he got absolutely nothing for either guy and then completely over-pays for Willy just makes it all so much worse.

[JCon]

21 minutes ago, bigg jay said:

Not a good comparison.  Injury-free back-up looking for a chance to start versus a former starter with injury/performance issues trying to resurrect his career.

How would Barker know that a 37 year old QB would be more susceptible to injury?  Common sense might tell him that or the fact he missed 36 games over 5 seasons would be another indicator that he should probably be planning for the future.  He let 2 guys walk in a 3 year span where Ray was already having health issues.  The fact that he got absolutely nothing for either guy and then completely over-pays for Willy just makes it all so much worse.

Ray was healthy QB before going to the Argos.

[bigg jay]

3 minutes ago, JCon said:

Ray was healthy QB before going to the Argos.

Yes, but the part you bolded was in reference to Drew Willy not Ray.

[JCon]

1 minute ago, bigg jay said:

Yes, but the part you bolded was in reference to Drew Willy not Ray.

Gotcha. Misread that part.

[17to85]

The problem isn't that Ray turned to glass, the problem is that the Argos OL took a down turn and they haven't fixed it. Bomber fans of all people should know that a crappy OL is a recipe for QBs getting hurt. 

[do or die]

2 hours ago, bearpants said:

When you word it like that... definitely Barker... Barker knew what he was getting, a mediocre to average (at best) and potentially broken down QB...  and he took on the huge contract and gave up a ton to get him...

Walters signed him on potential... sometime that works out, sometimes it's a mistake... 

Mistakes will be make.....the deal is correcting them.