Canadian Politics

[17to85]

5 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Generalizing like that, yes.  But if people don't think there aren't racists & white supremacists in the Liberals & NDP then they are naïve.  I vote Conservative & always have since I turned 18. I'm no racist or white supremacist. I personally don't know any Conservative who is. I resent being lumped in with any idiot social conservative as I'm not one myself. If it was up to me I'd throw every wingnut out who used religion to espouse views of hatred. And Faith Goldie is human trash that should be taken out with the garbage. 

YOU JUST VOTED FOR THEM! You can't claim to be against them when you are on here talking up the UCP. They embrace those assholes and anyone who voted for them endorsed it. So STFU with the moral high ground. You vote for parties that support those people you are an enabler and as bad as they are.

[17to85]

3 hours ago, FrostyWinnipeg said:

RIP Environment

 

RIP middle class, but hey if you're rich you just hit the jackpot.

[Zontar]

6 hours ago, Mark H. said:

Tory majority in Alberta - Canada has gone blue.

NS, Ont, MB, SK, AB

 

Take a bow, Justin, Gerald.

[rebusrankin]

4 hours ago, 17to85 said:

RIP middle class, but hey if you're rich you just hit the jackpot.

Have the Liberals or NDP really helped the middle class either?

[AtlanticRiderFan]

12 hours ago, Mark H. said:

Tory majority in Alberta - Canada has gone blue.

NS, Ont, MB, SK, AB

 

And New Brunswick has a PC minority, propped up by the People's Alliance, a populist right-wing party.

Edited April 17, 2019 by AtlanticRiderFan

[kelownabomberfan]

[pigseye]

9 hours ago, 17to85 said:

RIP middle class, but hey if you're rich you just hit the jackpot.

The Cons always give the middle class the biggest tax breaks, it's the NDP and the Liberals who tax the crap out of us. 

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

6 minutes ago, pigseye said:

The Cons always give the middle class the biggest tax breaks, it's the NDP and the Liberals who tax the crap out of us. 

I don't think taxes and tax breaks are the be all end all of a government's ability or lack thereof to help the constituents.

[pigseye]

9 minutes ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

I don't think taxes and tax breaks are the be all end all of a government's ability or lack thereof to help the constituents.

Well I do, the government already inhales 50% of middle class income in the form of taxes and I am personally fed up with it. Especially when those tax dollars aren't even used in this country to prop our social safety net. 

[Wideleft]

21 minutes ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

I don't think taxes and tax breaks are the be all end all of a government's ability or lack thereof to help the constituents.

And Kansas and Oklahoma are proof of that.  The grand experiment of low taxation failed miserably.  

"Since Kansas enacted tax and spending cuts in 2012 and 2013, Brownback and his allies have argued that this fiscal potion would generate an explosion of economic growth. It didn’t. Overall growth and job creationin Kansas underperformed both the national economy and neighboring states. From January, 2014 (after both tax cuts passed) to April, 2017, Kansas gained only 28,000 net new non-farm jobs. By contrast, Nebraska, an economically similar state with a much smaller labor force, saw a net increase of 35,000 jobs."

"The tax cuts did produce one explosion, however. The state’s budget deficit was expected to hit $280 million this year, despite major spending reductions. Kansas falls well below national averages in a wide range of public services from K-12 education to housing to police and fire protection, according to an analysis by the Urban Institute’s State and Local Finance Initiative."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2017/06/07/the-great-kansas-tax-cut-experiment-crashes-and-burns/#7e46e2385508

[pigseye]

Then it's a good thing we aren't Kansas. 

[17to85]

13 minutes ago, pigseye said:

Well I do, the government already inhales 50% of middle class income in the form of taxes and I am personally fed up with it. Especially when those tax dollars aren't even used in this country to prop our social safety net. 

And that is why you support them, but you are wrong to think like that. The  biggest thing eroding the middle class is giving rich and corporations tax breaks. All it does is download the burden onto the middle class.

[nate007]

4 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

And that is why you support them, but you are wrong to think like that. The  biggest thing eroding the middle class is giving rich and corporations tax breaks. All it does is download the burden onto the middle class.

So are high income taxes for the middle class a problem or not?

[pigseye]

Just now, 17to85 said:

And that is why you support them, but you are wrong to think like that. The  biggest thing eroding the middle class is giving rich and corporations tax breaks. All it does is download the burden onto the middle class.

Well I've been middle class for the past 35 years and have lived under all 3 forms of the major parties and can tell you unequivocally that I have more disposable income under a Cons government than the other two. It's you who are actually confused so let me explain. The liberals give the rich and the corporations the same tax cuts that the Cons do and they are the ones who off load it onto the middle class because they won't cut spending. The NDP just tax and tax and tax and don't care who or what you are and still can't balance a budget because they want to give anyone who applies a government union job.

So for the middle class, there is only one choice that will leave you with more disposable income in your pocket. 

[17to85]

Yeah the liberals cut the rich taxes too  they are a pretty  centrist even right leaning party. Tax increases are unpopular and a hard sell but they need to happen, and not on the middle class. Parties need to tax the wealthy more that is how things were in the 50s which everyone seems to think were the glory days... yet now everyone is afraid of that so we get small incremental tax raises on the middle class. 

Conservative governments don't out more money in anyone's pockets though, and if they do it's done to cause long term harm to society as a whole. Alberta for example, since I am still pissed off at the election last night NEEDS more spending. Klein neglected the infrastructure so much it left a big deficit which subsequent governments had to spend on which depleted the heritage fund, but hey corporations kept getting big tax breaks and well6just spend into debt on needed schools and hospitals and roads. 

The sooner the **** you got mine generation dies the sooner we can fix our broken system.

[JCon]

8 minutes ago, nate007 said:

So are high income taxes for the middle class a problem or not?

"High" is subjective. But, if it's high and you're getting services that exceed those taxes, not so bad. 

[nate007]

6 minutes ago, JCon said:

"High" is subjective. But, if it's high and you're getting services that exceed those taxes, not so bad. 

I was just pointing out that he was criticizing someone for making middle-class tax cuts a priority, and then complaining that high-income and corporate tax cuts were pushing the tax burden on to the middle class. 

I don't mind paying taxes if the government is using them responsibly, but it's all the inefficiency and waste that really grinds my gears.

[pigseye]

The thing that most people don't understand is debt servicing costs. The more debt you acquire, the more of your tax dollars has to go servicing that debt, instead of it going towards our social programs, infrastructure and the like.

A province or a country can't continue to run deficits without having to raise taxes to pay the debt servicing costs. It's just a vicious circle and the only way out of it is by running balanced budgets and getting debt servicing costs under control. Once you have done that, there won't be a need to continuously raise taxes on anyone, at least not at the current rate we are going.

And let me just say, a carbon tax is about as blatant a cash grab as you will see in your lifetime. The entire climate change issue can only be solved if the USA and China get on board, everything else is just posturing. 

[17to85]

So again talking about Alberta.... Kenney is going to run huge deficits too, because he's slashing taxes. So how does that help get out of a hole? Province needs the spending but with less tax revenue how do we get out of that cycle? Best way would be to tax those who can afford it. 

I don't like carbon taxes in general, but the Alberta ndp carbon tax I view as more of a provincial sales tax, just easier to sell to the public. Something that is needed here probably as unpopular as it is.

[JCon]

Yeah, I'm getting pretty tired of gov'ts cutting taxes before balancing the budget. Cut taxes, after you've made the spending cuts. 

Conservatives here cut the PST by a point but still haven't balanced the budget. Know what would balance the budget? Not cutting a point off the PST!! 

They've just downloaded more debt to the next generation. 

[pigseye]

Alberta will only get out of their hole when they start getting a decent price for their oil again. Nothing the UPC or the NDP can do will ever change that, although the UPC might make it a little less painful to endure until that time comes, just my two cents. 

[Fatty Liver]

3 minutes ago, pigseye said:

Alberta will only get out of their hole when they start getting a decent price for their oil again. Nothing the UPC or the NDP can do will ever change that, although the UPC might make it a little less painful to endure until that time comes, just my two cents. 

Gas prices here in BC are hovering at $1.50/L and that is before they jump the price for the long-weekend, rumour has it we will see $1.70/L this summer.  We are now paying more for a liter of gas than we were when oil was selling for $100 per barrel.  This has nothing to do with a new carbon tax as we have being paying that for over a decade already.

Edited April 17, 2019 by Throw Long Bannatyne

[pigseye]

7 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Gas prices here in BC are hovering at $1.50/L and that is before they jump the price for the long-weekend, rumour has it we will see $1.70/L this summer.  We are now paying more for a liter of gas than we were when oil was selling for $100 per barrel.  This has nothing to do with a new carbon tax as we have being paying that for over a decade already.

You guys are really getting hosed buying gas from Washington at USD because your local supplies are maxed out. Build that pipeline......

[Fatty Liver]

9 minutes ago, pigseye said:

You guys are really getting hosed buying gas from Washington at USD because your local supplies are maxed out. Build that pipeline......

Sorry, I'm buying an electric car and heating with wood, I'm beyond my tipping point.

Edited April 17, 2019 by Throw Long Bannatyne

[Wideleft]

I'd much rather have a pipeline from Gimli.

Edited April 17, 2019 by Wideleft