Second Round Final Cuts

[M.O.A.B.]

18 minutes ago, BBlink said:

I counted 20 but then I counted 22 lol. Looks like both reserve positions will be oline men. One national, one import.

Couture and Foketi? A lot can happen before the first game.

We still need to put guys on IR too

Richards is in there for now, but we know he's going to 6-game IR.

Edited June 18, 2017 by M.O.A.B.

[wbbfan]

20 minutes ago, BBlink said:

I counted 20 but then I counted 22 lol. Looks like both reserve positions will be oline men. One national, one import.

Couture and Foketi? A lot can happen before the first game.

We still need to put guys on IR too

yeah we only need to be under the max at this point, and with the IR to shake out yet and the bye week we may not know entirely how it will be set up till the day before our first game. 

[Eternal optimist]

Slightly off-topic, but interesting note the Argos released Drew Willy as part of their final cuts. Did we ever get a steal with that trade!

[Doublezero]

Just my opinion but looking at the roster as it stands after the final cuts I am not 100% sure it is an upgrade from last year. In some positions we look to be worse. For sure Lefevour at QB is an upgrade over Willy - otherwise the QB crew is a wash. RB is a wash. But IMHO Hurl Knox and Carmichael at LB does not come close to making up for the loss of Bass Burnett and Waggonner. Lankford is not as good as McDuffie and we are going to feel that on the return game and field position. Yes, JFG is an upgrade from Kohlert but folks - we knew that last year. Nevis is an upgrade to Shologan and probably it is safe to say Tristan O and Jackson Jeffcoat are an improvement over Adrian Hubbard - what happened to him anyway? I guess we can pray that Poop will rise to the top. Not sure who is going to replace Ryan Smith at SB, if it is Lankford I don't call that an upgrade. Across the secondary it remains to be seen if Alexander and Walker can compensate for the loss of Posey CJ Roberts and Frederick. I think we are stronger on ST chase-down and contain with the addition of Rush Miles and Miller although the loss of Burnett and Waggonner there will be felt.  Can't see how management will be satisfied to sit tight with this roster. Sincerely hoping more changes/additions will be forthcoming. Not crapping on management or anything, just trying to temper my playoff hopes with a reality check. West Div is tough.

Edited June 18, 2017 by Doublezero

[HardCoreBlue]

13 hours ago, Eternal optimist said:

 

It was not too long ago that the Bombers proudly displayed one of the best middle linebackers in the league while having a "meh" defense elsewhere...

 

Henoc Muamba and 2013, methinks? That turned out swell didn't it?

I'm discussing the linebacking core as a whole, not just one piece just like I'm looking at other positions as a group.

Who else did we have at Linebackers back in 2013 other than Ian Wild? These allstars:

•  James Green LB
• 47 Pierre-Luc Labbé MLB

[AKAChip]

8 minutes ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I'm discussing the linebacking core as a whole, not just one piece just like I'm looking at other positions as a group.

Who else did we have at Linebackers back in 2013 other than Ian Wild? These allstars:

•  James Green LB
• 47 Pierre-Luc Labbé MLB

James Green played next to 0 defensive reps and PLL played sparingly. Your point?

[HardCoreBlue]

5 minutes ago, AKAChip said:

James Green played next to 0 defensive reps and PLL played sparingly. Your point?

Fair enough, how about Luc Labbe?

My point is, and this is how the whole conversation started, is I'd rather invest in a strong Linebacking core and be more flexible with my ratio/talent with another position group. You use Henoc to argue that we tried that and didn't work but you just can't pull one person from the group and say your linebacking core/group is strong.

[Eternal optimist]

17 minutes ago, HardCoreBlue said:

I'm discussing the linebacking core as a whole, not just one piece just like I'm looking at other positions as a group.

Who else did we have at Linebackers back in 2013 other than Ian Wild? These allstars:

•  James Green LB
• 47 Pierre-Luc Labbé MLB

I was just trying to make the general point that football (like many sports) is a team game, and the team wins and loses as a whole. In fact 2013 was a failure on all counts (offense and special teams as well).

[LeBird]

Last year we were the worst team at stopping the run. How is that going to change this year? Once a running back gets through the line we're looking at Loffler. We might have a good Dline but they will be against other good Olines. Henoc had up to 10 tackles a game. In the last game all of our MLB's got 4. The league might have gone for more passing but if they know they can run why not? And they did a lots last year.

 

[HardCoreBlue]

Just now, Eternal optimist said:

I was just trying to make the general point that football (like many sports) is a team game, and the team wins and loses as a whole. In fact 2013 was a failure on all counts (offense and special teams as well).

Completely agree with you and that's what we tell our players on the teams I coach. Absolutely it can't be pinned on one person especially in football. Greatest team sport ever. My role on the team as well is ensuring no player gets thrown under the bus by other players (and coaches!).  

I'm just breaking it down where tough decisions are being made when it comes to assessing our talent and where we need to be stronger outside the earshot of players.

Happy Fathers day if it applies

[Mark F]

1 hour ago, Doublezero said:

I guess we can pray that Poop will rise to the top.

First rule of plumbing is applicable.

"S**T flows downhill"

Therefore.....looking for a good season from him.

[Doublezero]

2 minutes ago, Mark F said:

First rule of plumbing is applicable.

"S**T flows downhill"

Therefore.....looking for a good season from him.

Ya, that's what we need. Opposing RBs blocked by a wall of Poop and major s**tstorm in the backfield.

[Mark F]

I think Jim Otto was number 00.

[Doublezero]

8 minutes ago, Mark F said:

I think Jim Otto was number 00.

Indeed so. As was Harold Nash for Wpg:

 

[BBFan]

In looking at the Bombers roster other than the Thin Import LB issue it seems we are razor thin with our National numbers

We currently have 22 listed on the Roster however at least 2 of those Coates and Richards are INJ and Miles didn't play in either Exhibition Game so I would assume he is INJ as well however I haven't officially see that. It could be the Bombers expect Coates and Miles to be available within the next 2 weeks and all reports are Richards will miss many games. So If the one of those 2 Coates or Miles can't play in the first game or another NAT get injured between now and the first game they will have to dip into the practice roster however there isn't much they can do to add a NAT that would contribute.

I checked other teams and most had 25 or more NATS listed on their current roster so I am concerned that the Bombers might run into problem with their NAT Depth and they probably should have keep Warden and Butcher and possibly a few others ?

Edited June 18, 2017 by BBFan

[Taynted_Fayth]

2 hours ago, Doublezero said:

Just my opinion but looking at the roster as it stands after the final cuts I am not 100% sure it is an upgrade from last year. In some positions we look to be worse. For sure Lefevour at QB is an upgrade over Willy - otherwise the QB crew is a wash. RB is a wash. But IMHO Hurl Knox and Carmichael at LB does not come close to making up for the loss of Bass Burnett and Waggonner. Lankford is not as good as McDuffie and we are going to feel that on the return game and field position. Yes, JFG is an upgrade from Kohlert but folks - we knew that last year. Nevis is an upgrade to Shologan and probably it is safe to say Tristan O and Jackson Jeffcoat are an improvement over Adrian Hubbard - what happened to him anyway? I guess we can pray that Poop will rise to the top. Not sure who is going to replace Ryan Smith at SB, if it is Lankford I don't call that an upgrade. Across the secondary it remains to be seen if Alexander and Walker can compensate for the loss of Posey CJ Roberts and Frederick. I think we are stronger on ST chase-down and contain with the addition of Rush Miles and Miller although the loss of Burnett and Waggonner there will be felt.  Can't see how management will be satisfied to sit tight with this roster. Sincerely hoping more changes/additions will be forthcoming. Not crapping on management or anything, just trying to temper my playoff hopes with a reality check. West Div is tough.

 not seeing the comparison here.  Maybe Hurl vs Bass but Wild and Leggett are the incumbents, Knox and Carmichael are back ups at this point (unless moe is out longer then expected).  Burnett saw limited action last year and was a back up as well, and waggonner never saw any reps on D 

[Doublezero]

1 minute ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

 not seeing the comparison here.  Maybe Hurl vs Bass but Wild and Leggett are the incumbents, Knox and Carmichael are back ups at this point (unless moe is out longer then expected).  Burnett saw limited action last year and was a back up as well, and waggonner never saw any reps on D 

Just saying the overall LB talent is weaker.

[Taynted_Fayth]

1 minute ago, Doublezero said:

Just saying the overall LB talent is weaker.

I think our starting 3 of Wild, Hurl, Leggett will be about the same, maybe slightly less talented then Wild, Bass, Leggett, but Bass wasn't exactly lighting it up at MLB either.  With Waggonner never getting any reps on D,  i think the depth comparison would be Knox vs Burnett.

Carmichael is listed as DB on both the Bombers and CFL sites, unless he acts as an emergency SAM (He's 5'10" 189lbs so not that big).

As for Burnett, I thought he played alright at times last year, but I seem to remember him having at least 1 really bad game... can't remember which game though. I think his contribution on teams was what kept him around more than his LB play imo.

[Doublezero]

14 minutes ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

I think our starting 3 of Wild, Hurl, Leggett will be about the same, maybe slightly less talented then Wild, Bass, Leggett, but Bass wasn't exactly lighting it up at MLB either.  With Waggonner never getting any reps on D,  i think the depth comparison would be Knox vs Burnett.

Carmichael is listed as DB on both the Bombers and CFL sites, unless he acts as an emergency SAM (He's 5'10" 189lbs so not that big).

As for Burnett, I thought he played alright at times last year, but I seem to remember him having at least 1 really bad game... can't remember which game though. I think his contribution on teams was what kept him around more than his LB play imo.

I see what you're saying but maintain the overall LB talent level was better last year - which is surprising since you have MOS and Walters and I daresay Wade Miller as the braintrust. I would expect to see 3-4 formation sometimes. We saw that vs Edm last Thurs. Carmichael took considerable reps at SAM during TC if I am not mistaken. I remember seeing Waggonner take a few (albeit very few) turns at LB last season. He will be missed mainly on ST. There is going to be a lot of interchangeability on this defence between DL and LB positions viz ratio. So they are probably stronger on the D line this year (hoping Westerman can be as effective as he was in 2015) but not so much at LB. Hopefully Wild and Leggett can stay healthy.

Edited June 18, 2017 by Doublezero

[SpeedFlex27]

Justin Herdman was released by the Argos. Should the Bombers sign him?

[Taynted_Fayth]

6 minutes ago, Doublezero said:

I see what you're saying but maintain the overall LB talent level was better last year - which is surprising since you have MOS and Walters and I daresay Wade Miller as the braintrust. I would expect to see 3-4 formation sometimes. We saw that vs Edm last Thurs. Carmichael took considerable reps at SAM during TC if I am not mistaken. I remember seeing Waggonner take a few (albeit very few) turns at LB last season. He will be missed mainly on ST. There is going to be a lot of interchangeability on this defence between DL and LB positions viz ratio. So they are probably stronger on the D line this year (hoping Westerman can be as effective as he was in 2015) but not so much at LB. Hopefully Wild and Leggett can stay healthy.

I think carmichael was only getting those reps because Leggett got hurt, and may have played well enough to find himself as go to guy if the same happens down the road.  

With regards to MOS, Walters and Miller - I don't think Miller scouts, not in his job description and he was a FB and ST demon so maybe not the best eye for LBs. I'm not really sure who or what Walters primary scouting forte or focus is, but I get the feeling with his Guelph connections he primarily focuses on NI's especially in the OUA, the imports are likely the focus of our other scouts on the payroll.

Then there's MOS. I hear a lot of people saying for a HOF MLB he should have an uncanny eye for MLB talent. This might be true, but the way he played (HOF level) maybe out of the reach of those who are brought before him to evaluate. He generally seems more focused on character and work ethic more than sheer talent.  This may have an effect and main reason why a guy like Kuale and Hurl lasted or are lasting as long as they have

[Taynted_Fayth]

6 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Justin Herdman was released by the Argos. Should the Bombers sign him?

I'd do it. He was likely expendable due to them picking up Woods

[SpeedFlex27]

4 minutes ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

I'd do it. He was likely expendable due to them picking up Woods

Local kid with lots of potential & a chip on his shoulder. Yes, I'd do it as well.

[Fatty Liver]

38 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Justin Herdman was released by the Argos. Should the Bombers sign him?

He's been moved to their PR, so I would guess they probably won't touch him.

Edited June 18, 2017 by Throw Long Bannatyne

[SpeedFlex27]

2 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

He's been moved to their PR, so I would guess they probably won't touch him.

I don't know why we don't. This so called "Gentleman's Agreement" not to take players from other teams off the PR is frustrating. If it's frowned upon so much as dirty pool if it happens then why doesn't the CFL change the rules to say PR players are protected? Some of the rules in the CFL are head scratchers & make little sense.