Is It Time To Professionalize Our Refs

[BigBlue]

"CFL - Just run into the defender and draw PI..." (Saidin)

I agree its getting worse and worse ... I wonder if some of the zebras even thoroughly know the rules .... it seems like if a receiver just falls down the D is going to get penalized

Appeal a "no interference because the ball was not catchable" with a "illegal contact on a receiver"; of course that would only work if it was away from the play

The best receivers are more and more "pushing off" the DB to gain separation or position ... when was the last time offensive pass interference was called? What is the proportion of offensive to defensive pass interference calls in this league?

Isn't it about time we started training our reffs and turning them into full time professionals? We would only need two crews - - this league doesn't schedule three games in one day. The crews could travel with evaluator/trainers. Further they could get greater proficiency through group film work sessions over the net (assuming they were being paid enough to take the time). Lots of things can be done to raise skill and proficiency but, it is not going to happen.

Why?

Because it is an owner's decision (through the board of governors) ....

Owners never paid Gordie Howe one extra nickel as a rising superstar in the 1950's and today they are not going to spend any real money in bringing up the quality of our game through our officiating .... bandages and cosmetics is all they are going to offer unless forced to do so by ..... who?

Who can force them?

It wouldn't be the fans would it? They don't have any real or organized force or power do they?

So there is no force, actually, is there?

[Taynted_Fayth]

Only thing I would change at this point, is the coaches ability to challenge for inconsequential IC away from the play.  If it's not called on the field,  then it should be left alone, the same way players get away with holding at times.

the counter to the "just run into a defender" is the league allowed the 5 yard jam when defenders can make contact.  if they still need to make contact further downfield then they deserve the penalties

[Rich]

The changes to PI favouring offensive players was pretty much league mandated when scoring was way down a couple of years ago. 

League wants high scoring, no lead is safe games, and have told their refs to officiate that way.

There is most definitely a consistency problem.  I never know what's going to be called on replay reviews anymore, and that is a problem. 

[Fraser]

Even the NFL doesn't have full time refs

[Mr Dee]

 

49 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

So there is no force, actually, is there?

? A force is a force, of course, of course, 

And no one can talk of force of course 

That is, of course, unless the force  is the famous Mr. Glen

 -Go right to the source and ask the force

He'll give you the answer that you'll endorse. 

He's always on a steady course. 

Talk to Mr. Glen ?

(with apologies to Mr Ed)

DIRECTOR, OFFICIATING  - Darren Hackwood

TECHNICAL COORDINATOR, OFFICIATING  - Jeff Harbin

COORDINATOR OF SCOUTING & DEVELOPMENT, OFFICIATING  - Dave Hutton

COORDINATOR, FOOTBALL OPERATIONS  - Eric Noivo

VIDEO ASSISTANT  - Mike Aloisio

CFL OFFICIATING SUPERVISORS, EVALUATORS & POSITION COACHES  - 

Carey Anderson Don Cousens Ken Lazaruk Rick McFadyen Bud Steen Dave YuleDarryl BaronDon Ellis

Al McColman Michel Pinsonneault Boris Velcic

[Rich]

3 minutes ago, Fraser said:

Even the NFL doesn't have full time refs

NFL is moving towards full time refs.  Will be a phased in approach so they don't have all their experienced refs with other jobs quit all at once. 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2699793-roger-goodell-dean-blandino-say-nfl-wants-to-move-to-full-time-referees

[MC]

There is no rationale for spending the millions required to mandate full time officials, and in the process lose some of the best officials we have already.  The overall officiating is good in the CFL.  The understanding of the rules by the media (especially) and the fans is terrible.  Whenever I hear a commentator analyze a DPI on whether the defender turned his head or whether there was contact at 5 yards, or whether a defender's hand contacted the QB's helmet, it makes me want to scream.  If you are paid to speak about the game, the least you should do is understand the actual rules.

If you have to slow down a play to the point of going frame to frame to determine a challenge, then the onfield decision should never be overturned.  And if the rule calls for an official to make a judgement call (ex:  uncatchable ball) then that cannot be reviewed - otherwise, it is not a judgement. 

If you do not like a rule, then that is discussion for the offseason (ex: contacting a receiver away from the play).  Officials have to officiate the games according to the rules.  And the rules shouldn't change during the season.

The officials are human and will make mistakes and errors in judgement, but so does everyone else playing and coaching the game. 

If you think the CFL officials are so bad, try watching every other major professional sport. 

[BigBlue]

35 minutes ago, MC said:

There is no rationale for spending the millions required to mandate full time officials

Would it really cost "millions" to have two crews of referees working full time?

[JuranBoldenRules]

18 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Would it really cost "millions" to have two crews of referees working full time?

You would need way more than 2 crews.  If you think they are bad now you think they'll be better fatigued?

Plus full timers would need salaries in the high 5 figures, maybe even low 6.  Most of them right now are police officers, lawyers, teachers, insurance brokers etc.  They aren't giving up their actual careers for $50,000 a year.

[BigBlue]

23 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

43 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Would it really cost "millions" to have two crews of referees working full time?

You would need way more than 2 crews

Really .... each crew works 2 games per week:

Thursday & Saturday or Friday & Another

plus 3 days of travel

= 5 day week of five half days of doing what you love (even if you are living out of a hotel eating reasonable restaurant food) and being otherwise at your leisure .... not for a married guy but I can think of a ton of single athletes who would love it for a ten year run from June to November.... (the worst problem would be hung over reffs at the game but they would get over that soon enough) ... off season they could train at their sport or do a different job for those 6 months of the year

Edited July 17, 2017 by BigBlue

[Eternal optimist]

45 minutes ago, BigBlue said:

Really .... each crew works 2 games per week:

Thursday & Saturday or Friday & Another

plus 3 days of travel

= 5 day week of five half days of doing what you love (even if you are living out of a hotel eating reasonable restaurant food) and being otherwise at your leisure .... not for a married guy but I can think of a ton of single athletes who would love it for a ten year run from June to November.... (the worst problem would be hung over reffs at the game but they would get over that soon enough) ... off season they could train at their sport or do a different job for those 6 months of the year

I understand your frustration, but I think referees deserve a bit more respect than you're giving them. I think the biggest problem as it stands is the challenge system with the PI/IC calls. Maybe it is just me, but most of the bad calls / non-calls I've seen this year have come from the command center - an area totally out of control of the referees on the field.

[Dragon37]

I totally agree with MC. I would go further and say that the "problem" isn't the skill of the officials on the field it is the millions of judges off the field who have better angles and the ability to slow a play down that is the problem. There have been all sorts of changes for the wrong reasons and it is now catching up with us. Rules need only be changed if they are no longer functioning properly. Now the rule changes have slanted the deck heavily in favor of the offense and dramatically forced the defense to up their skill level. Offensively you can get away with anything now.

[Tracker]

I suspect that the reffing is a bout the same as it always has been, but now there are so many replay angles that any mistake the officials make is magnified and replayed over and over. That said, I do not know what the answer is, but it appears that the C'Mon center has made a few horrible decisions.

[17to85]

22 minutes ago, tracker said:

I suspect that the reffing is a bout the same as it always has been, but now there are so many replay angles that any mistake the officials make is magnified and replayed over and over. That said, I do not know what the answer is, but it appears that the C'Mon center has made a few horrible decisions.

I have said it before and I'll say it again, the problem with the refs now is that they use replay as a crutch to avoid doing their jobs. They err on the side of calling touchdowns because it gets reviewed anyway, they don't take risks on close calls knowing that things are likely to be challenged so they don't have to stick their necks out. The replay system has hurt the quality of reffing in the league and the attitude of the people in charge of reffing has made it even worse still. 

[SPuDS]

we really, REALLLLLY need to get the c'mon centre rectified and like, yesterday.  its inexcusable that our replay... the only officiating part that should NEVER get things wrong... is failing so badly.  It is so beyond logic that they are blowing calls this often and this brutally.. I mean, its not even up for debate as to how they make their calls.. its been wtf pretty much universally across the board in regards to some of their gaffes.

[White Out]

I really wish people would stop conflating score with entertainment. High scoring games with ridiculous penalties, challenges to fish for penalties, and inconsistent reffing is much worse than a low scoring game. The worst part of a CFL game, and by far, is watching and waiting when something good happens to see if a flag is on the carpet. Or the endless challenges that bog down the game. I'm shocked I still watch, and I'm sure if I didn't love the Bombers I probably would have stopped watching. 

I hope the new commish gets in their and mandates that the league is TV and fan friendly; cut way down on the flags, challenges, and endless delays. Improving the officiating is harder to do; look no further than the States and the eff ups that happen every week in the NFL. Being a ref is hard but the league has put itself behind the 8 ball already by having some very stupid rules.

[blue_gold_84]

On 7/16/2017 at 4:55 PM, Fraser said:

Even the NFL doesn't have full time refs

True. But they seem more competent and better trained.

The addition of the "eye in the sky" seems to have only muddied the waters with regard to officiating in the CFL.

[Jacquie]

The CFL/NFL official exchange program is back this year. In the Bombers/Argos game there was an official whose number isn't listed in the 2017 Rule Book or on the CFL Officials website. An NFL official perhaps? 

[WBBFanWest]

1 minute ago, Jacquie said:

The CFL/NFL official exchange program is back this year. In the Bombers/Argos game there was an official whose number isn't listed in the 2017 Rule Book or on the CFL Officials website. An NFL official perhaps? 

1

I understand it's part of the "CFL Referee for a Day" program that the league is running with the CNIB 

[Sard]

I've seen the argument many times over the years that there should be less flags, but I have to disagree with that as an absolute statement.  When I see receivers running offside on every play and no flag, that frustrates me to no end.  So overall, I would say that the refs just need to be consistent in enforcing the rules.

Rather than telling the refs to put away the flags, it's also on the players to play clean.  If they play within the rules, and the refs call the game according to the rules, then there would be no flags.  Real life and game speed don't work that way though, so there is room for human error on both sides.

 

Also, to hear how some people talk about it, you would think that there was a challenge on every play... overall there can be a maximum of 6 challenges in a game (unless the rules on the number of challenges have changed), and I'm not sure if there have been any games with more than 3 so far this year (disclaimer that I have not actually watched every single game so can't say that definitively).  They do seem to have got faster with the challenge calls in general, but as has been said many times on here the C'mon Centre needs to get the calls right and they are currently failing at that far too often so far this year.

[SpeedFlex27]

51 minutes ago, Jacquie said:

The CFL/NFL official exchange program is back this year. In the Bombers/Argos game there was an official whose number isn't listed in the 2017 Rule Book or on the CFL Officials website. An NFL official perhaps? 

Man, will they have some stories to tell when they go back to work at the NFL.

[WBBFanWest]

1 minute ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Man, will they have some stories to tell when they go back to work at the NFL.

NFL Ref 1 - So how was reffing in the Great White North?

NFL Ref 2 - Saskatchewan sucks, but other than that not much different from here.  

NFL Ref 1 - You mean to say that they screw up calls, just like we do?

NFL Ref 2 - Yep, just like us.  You know what else is the same?

NFL Ref 1 - Let me guess, they have fans that think they have a hot clue what we do and how we should do it and that all our bosses should be fired?

NFL Ref 2 - I see you've been to Calgary.

[Brandon]

I just don't understand why they don't have an official in the booth who can call the very easy penalties (offside, no yards, etc...) when they have the perfect view to see it?  

[WBBFanWest]

Just now, Brandon said:

I just don't understand why they don't have an official in the booth who can call the very easy penalties (offside, no yards, etc...) when they have the perfect view to see it?  

Maybe because there is no spot in any booth that gives you "a perfect view" of the entire field and each player on it?

[SpeedFlex27]

1 hour ago, WBBFanWest said:

NFL Ref 1 - So how was reffing in the Great White North?

NFL Ref 2 - Saskatchewan sucks, but other than that not much different from here.  

NFL Ref 1 - You mean to say that they screw up calls, just like we do?

NFL Ref 2 - Yep, just like us.  You know what else is the same?

NFL Ref 1 - Let me guess, they have fans that think they have a hot clue what we do and how we should do it and that all our bosses should be fired?

NFL Ref 2 - I see you've been to Calgary.