What Changes do the Bombers Need this Off-season to Improve the Team?

[Booch]

for sure, but we also don't know if he didn't lobby for someone else or a change to the bogus claim that his role is to fill a gap and occupy a lineman...watch some game film and that's not what he is doing...and even so...part of a defender job is to make a tackle while engaged and break off /disengage from the blocker...that he couldn't and didn't do. 

If this was the real intended scheme and role then it would have been better served to have Corney or Westerman fill this role, but I am siding on the reality that it was the team defending Hurl publically and not throwing him under the bus...plain and simple.  

[17to85]

So I know that Hall is the whipping boy, but it's interesting to me that so many people are pegging it on being not aggressive enough... I saw a too aggressive game plan vs. Edmonton to be honest. They blitzed and they blitzed a ton and Reilly just made plays down field. Likely woulda done better actually playing that passive game. Also I am pretty sure I saw Bowman catch 2 touchdowns because the rookie side of our backfield made the wrong call and left him uncovered. Is that on the coordinator or rookie mistakes? Maybe we need to stop and ask ourselves why we are always playing a bunch of rookies in the secondary and how many busts that causes... 

 

Once again people aren't being critical of the offense but come on, if Lapo stuck with Harris there was a chance to get a lead in that game, but no we come out throwing and have 2 completions and still punt the ball, then we pound Harris down their throats and stop using him in the redzone and kick a field goal rather than giving ourselves a shot at the touchdown. It's **** like that holds this team back more than anything. Lapo outsmarts himself and does the defensive coordinators job for him by stopping what's working before the D actually stops it. 

[blue_gold_84]

21 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Once again people aren't being critical of the offense but come on, if Lapo stuck with Harris there was a chance to get a lead in that game, but no we come out throwing and have 2 completions and still punt the ball, then we pound Harris down their throats and stop using him in the redzone and kick a field goal rather than giving ourselves a shot at the touchdown. It's **** like that holds this team back more than anything. Lapo outsmarts himself and does the defensive coordinators job for him by stopping what's working before the D actually stops it. 

The offense generated nearly 500 yards of total offense on Sunday, and you want to blame the OC...? That was the team's best offensive performance in weeks. How was it "held back"?

The Eskimos, OTOH, had five straight possessions after the half and all five resulted in points scored. The defense, namely the man in charge of it, is what ultimately let the team down again in a second consecutive post-season.

Seriously, though this ongoing narrative of yours where LaPolice is constantly enemy #1 in your books - even when there is a mountain of evidence to the contrary - is bordering on weird.

[Fatty Liver]

30 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So I know that Hall is the whipping boy, but it's interesting to me that so many people are pegging it on being not aggressive enough... I saw a too aggressive game plan vs. Edmonton to be honest. They blitzed and they blitzed a ton and Reilly just made plays down field. Likely woulda done better actually playing that passive game. Also I am pretty sure I saw Bowman catch 2 touchdowns because the rookie side of our backfield made the wrong call and left him uncovered. Is that on the coordinator or rookie mistakes? Maybe we need to stop and ask ourselves why we are always playing a bunch of rookies in the secondary and how many busts that causes... 

 

Once again people aren't being critical of the offense but come on, if Lapo stuck with Harris there was a chance to get a lead in that game, but no we come out throwing and have 2 completions and still punt the ball, then we pound Harris down their throats and stop using him in the redzone and kick a field goal rather than giving ourselves a shot at the touchdown. It's **** like that holds this team back more than anything. Lapo outsmarts himself and does the defensive coordinators job for him by stopping what's working before the D actually stops it. 

Get with the program, this mob has gathered to collect the head of Richie Hall.  One head at a time, please.

[Noeller]

I saw a Tweet from Jason Vega after the game, clearly not happy with the narrative of "Fire Richie Hall!!"  ....he seemed to indicate that the issue is with players, and not co-ordinators. Where he lost me was when he said it was the same thing with Etcheverry....suggested that Etch didn't deserve to be fired. That seemed odd to me, but still......Vega would know......

[blue_gold_84]

6 minutes ago, Noeller said:

I saw a Tweet from Jason Vega after the game, clearly not happy with the narrative of "Fire Richie Hall!!"  ....he seemed to indicate that the issue is with players, and not co-ordinators. Where he lost me was when he said it was the same thing with Etcheverry....suggested that Etch didn't deserve to be fired. That seemed odd to me, but still......Vega would know......

Hall was an upgrade over Etcheverry. Now it's time to find an upgrade over Hall.

The only issue with the players I can see is they're not buying what Hall is selling. But is anyone...? Besides Vega, that is.

[Jacquie]

54 minutes ago, Booch said:

for sure, but we also don't know if he didn't lobby for someone else or a change to the bogus claim that his role is to fill a gap and occupy a lineman...watch some game film and that's not what he is doing...and even so...part of a defender job is to make a tackle while engaged and break off /disengage from the blocker...that he couldn't and didn't do. 

If this was the real intended scheme and role then it would have been better served to have Corney or Westerman fill this role, but I am siding on the reality that it was the team defending Hurl publically and not throwing him under the bus...plain and simple.  

Medlock basically confirming that mentality:

 

[Noeller]

I'm curious about our current position coaches, and if we've got someone in house that might be the next DC.....

[do or die]

Re:  Hurl  

I don't completely blame him, for the situation........he is strictly a backup.....who is miscast as a starter.    Hurl can play inside or out, reasonable smart and gives max effort.   
But he just cannot MAKE PLAYS from the MLB slot......I watch this guy always getting screened or washed out of the point of attack.   Also not quick enough to be really utilized as a blitzer either.      This position must be upgraded - period.  

As, well......I think that this whole idea, that the defensive scheme is to have the MLB, just eat up some blocks - so that someone else, might make the play is a total crock.

[do or die]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

So I know that Hall is the whipping boy, but it's interesting to me that so many people are pegging it on being not aggressive enough... I saw a too aggressive game plan vs. Edmonton to be honest. They blitzed and they blitzed a ton and Reilly just made plays down field. Likely woulda done better actually playing that passive game. Also I am pretty sure I saw Bowman catch 2 touchdowns because the rookie side of our backfield made the wrong call and left him uncovered. Is that on the coordinator or rookie mistakes? Maybe we need to stop and ask ourselves why we are always playing a bunch of rookies in the secondary and how many busts that causes... 

 

Once again people aren't being critical of the offense but come on, if Lapo stuck with Harris there was a chance to get a lead in that game, but no we come out throwing and have 2 completions and still punt the ball, then we pound Harris down their throats and stop using him in the redzone and kick a field goal rather than giving ourselves a shot at the touchdown. It's **** like that holds this team back more than anything. Lapo outsmarts himself and does the defensive coordinators job for him by stopping what's working before the D actually stops it. 

Might also want to ask why the rooks in the secondary.....don't see to progress, as the season wears on and why the tackling techniques continue to be so bad.    

And yes, Lapo gets too cute, by half at times....particularly in the redzone.   

 

[Booch]

6 minutes ago, do or die said:

Re:  Hurl  

I don't completely blame him, for the situation........he is strictly a backup.....who is miscast as a starter.    Hurl can play inside or out, reasonable smart and gives max effort.   
But he just cannot MAKE PLAYS from the MLB slot......I watch this guy always getting screened or washed out of the point of attack.   Also not quick enough to be really utilized as a blitzer either.      This position must be upgraded - period.  

As, well......I think that this whole idea, that the defensive scheme is to have the MLB, just eat up some blocks - so that someone else, might make the play is a total crock.

I have  played in many different schemes and systems, both sides of the border and as a Linebacker...never...EVER have I been in a system that had a linebacker in that role, or a scheme that took a second level guy out of the play making role...never happens and if this was some new funky defensive style to try and bring something new and fresh well then it can be now shelved as a bust/failure...whatever.

Tho on the flip side this is the mantra and basis for a strong aggressive 3-4 style defense, and versions of a 4-4 where you have a big dominant nose tackle do this, or in the 4 man a nose tackle type Defensisive tackle and a more athletic guy..Like Poop who can do a similar job and be effective against the run,  yet have a good 6 inch burst and can get in the backfield, or make plays along the line where the flow dictates.

We actually had personnel to run a scheme such as this, but for whatever reason used the wrong people, or schemed it from the wrong position...and it befuddled me all year

[17to85]

56 minutes ago, blue_gold_84 said:

How was it "held back"?

They scored 10 points in the first half did they not? How about they try running on the first series rather than a 2 and out? How about scoreing a touchdown instead of a field goal because your OC took away your best weapon? I mean christ they coulda taken a lead early on, how does that change things? Momentum is huge in sport and Lapo doesn't do anything until he's behind. Same **** on Sunday. We got down on the scoreboard and I said to Noeller "OK here comes good Lapo now" and look at all the meaningless yards they got at the end of the game after the team had already collapsed. 

It matters when when you gain yards and points than the total. 

[blue_gold_84]

3 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

They scored 10 points in the first half did they not? How about they try running on the first series rather than a 2 and out? How about scoreing a touchdown instead of a field goal because your OC took away your best weapon? I mean christ they coulda taken a lead early on, how does that change things? Momentum is huge in sport and Lapo doesn't do anything until he's behind. Same **** on Sunday. We got down on the scoreboard and I said to Noeller "OK here comes good Lapo now" and look at all the meaningless yards they got at the end of the game after the team had already collapsed. 

It matters when when you gain yards and points than the total. 

So did the Eskimos. What's your point?

You're clearly getting emotional, so trying to have a rational discussion about the offense would be a fool's errand. The fact you called LaPolice a loser is evidence enough you lack impartiality on the topic.

[17to85]

The fact that I don't just blindly look at the box scores and see 500 yards and think the offense was fine is all the proof I need to know that I am more objective than most here. 

Everyone is looking only at the D, but that's bullshit and always has been. You would think that if the O was doing so great they woulda got more than 10 points in the first half. They got 16 points in the 4th quarter, the teams mental collapse happened in the 3rd quarter, all those yards and points they got in the 4th were lipstick on the pig, which is a Lapo speciality. 

The guy is a loser, it's because he's too passive and constantly is his own worst enemy. Mark my words we will never win a championship with him as OC.  He couldn't do it with swaggerville what chance does he have now? 

[blue_gold_84]

46 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

The fact that I don't just blindly look at the box scores and see 500 yards and think the offense was fine is all the proof I need to know that I am more objective than most here. 

Everyone is looking only at the D, but that's bullshit and always has been. You would think that if the O was doing so great they woulda got more than 10 points in the first half. They got 16 points in the 4th quarter, the teams mental collapse happened in the 3rd quarter, all those yards and points they got in the 4th were lipstick on the pig, which is a Lapo speciality. 

The guy is a loser, it's because he's too passive and constantly is his own worst enemy. Mark my words we will never win a championship with him as OC.  He couldn't do it with swaggerville what chance does he have now? 

How else does one determine offensive production besides statistics from the game itself...?

Again, the Eskimos only scored 10 points in the first half, too. In fact, the offensive production for both teams was about the same net yardage after 30 mins. of play. Everyone is looking at the defense because - get this - it's by far the weakest link on the team. The fact you continue to call someone a loser shows you are not objective at all. And what does Swaggerville have to do with anything? For one, he was HC back then and two, the defense was that team's strong suit, not the other way around.

A polite suggestion: remove your head from your rectum, take off those turd-laden blinders, and try to look at things rationally. I'd love to know to what LaPolice did to you but I'm afraid to ask.

[17to85]

Like I said elsewhere, the when is more important than the total. 

I brought up swaggerville to illustrate a point, that even with  the kind of defence we all want to see a Lapo led offense still can't get the job done. 

I am the only one here looking at the big picture, everyone else is fixated on trying to find one single thing to blame and that's the only problem on the team. I am trying to get you all to think about things but no, it's all Ritchie Halls fault. Damn the man! woulda been 20-0 and win the grey cup easily if not for him!

[JCon]

17 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Like I said elsewhere, the when is more important than the total. 

I brought up swaggerville to illustrate a point, that even with  the kind of defence we all want to see a Lapo led offense still can't get the job done. 

I am the only one here looking at the big picture, everyone else is fixated on trying to find one single thing to blame and that's the only problem on the team. I am trying to get you all to think about things but no, it's all Ritchie Halls fault. Damn the man! woulda been 20-0 and win the grey cup easily if not for him!

Hahaha.

Most Offensive Points: Bombers 2nd.

You score the second most points on offence (first overall) and I would say he was doing something right.

 

I wonder if we looked at the defence to see where we finished- oh... 7th on offensive points allowed. Maybe, that's a clue?

 

 

 

Edited November 14, 2017 by JCon

[WBBFanWest]

17 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Like I said elsewhere, the when is more important than the total. 

I brought up swaggerville to illustrate a point, that even with  the kind of defence we all want to see a Lapo led offense still can't get the job done. 

I am the only one here looking at the big picture, everyone else is fixated on trying to find one single thing to blame and that's the only problem on the team. I am trying to get you all to think about things but no, it's all Ritchie Halls fault. Damn the man! woulda been 20-0 and win the grey cup easily if not for him!

The problem with being delusional is that you really can't see the delusion.  Here's a little tip,: if everyone else is wrong and you're right, maybe it's not them. 

[Slimy Sculpin]

21 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Like I said elsewhere, the when is more important than the total. 

I brought up swaggerville to illustrate a point, that even with  the kind of defence we all want to see a Lapo led offense still can't get the job done. 

I am the only one here looking at the big picture, everyone else is fixated on trying to find one single thing to blame and that's the only problem on the team. I am trying to get you all to think about things but no, it's all Ritchie Halls fault. Damn the man! woulda been 20-0 and win the grey cup easily if not for him!

I just about sprayed my coffee all over my computer screen when I read this. Kind of think pretty highly of yourself?

[do or die]

Feel so left out......

[pigseye]

It's about winning, Lapo has done alright for us in his 3 stints here but still hasn't won us the big game, big enough picture for you folks.

[do or die]

With a D that can actually make consistent stops......that task might become somewhat easier.

[bearpants]

3 hours ago, 17to85 said:

Once again people aren't being critical of the offense but come on, if Lapo stuck with Harris there was a chance to get a lead in that game, but no we come out throwing and have 2 completions and still punt the ball, then we pound Harris down their throats and stop using him in the redzone and kick a field goal rather than giving ourselves a shot at the touchdown. It's **** like that holds this team back more than anything. Lapo outsmarts himself and does the defensive coordinators job for him by stopping what's working before the D actually stops it. 

I actually completely agree with you here... I still cannot believe how criminally underused Harris is...  the guy had 120 yards on 15 touches Sunday... so my first question is why didn't he have 25 touches?? ... And he was playing with more heart than anyone I've seen in a long time...  I say every game, give 33 the ball!... we were joking that they finally figured out how to get that first play after a short yardage with LeFevour working... he hands the ball to Harris...

[The Unknown Poster]

Was Nelson the DC here during "swaggarville"?  he was a very aggressive DC and guys were getting INT's left and right...or am I imaging that?

[sweep the leg]

1 minute ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Was Nelson the DC here during "swaggarville"?  he was a very aggressive DC and guys were getting INT's left and right...or am I imaging that?

Nelson was here with Mike Kelly. Tim Burke was our DC for swaggerville.