Andrew Harris suspended for 2 games

[Brandon]

9 minutes ago, Geebrr said:

So you understand that Yoel Romero and Josh Barnett have actually proven their innocence through proceedings, right? 

Romero was just awarded like 27M.

So I do not agree with your comment at all

Barnett who has failed tests multiple times over the years.   He lost his UFC HW belt because of it.    

Romero ....  he may have proven his case against this one company.... otherwise if you actually honestly think that guy is not on anything then boy do I have a lot of stuff that I need to sell to you lol.  

Jones was in trouble because he was taking a bunch of **** trying to mask his cocaine use and other viagra like drugs to get it up.....   if he wasn't an elite fighter he would of been long gone and UFC wouldn't of bought his way out of trouble at all. 

[Ripper]

6 minutes ago, Booch said:

 

Thigpen btw was a totally different situation...he got caught with it full blown in his system and couldn't dispute it...so no **** he tool it like a man..had no choice...and it was a very mainstream drug that is rampant in sports..especially football...not some old school Golds Gym glory days bulking drug...like gimme a break

But the haters are gonna hate regardless....have a look on the internet as I am sure they have it in the flatlands and research the amount of Supplements that have been discovered to have banned stuff in them..not listed on the label...you'de be shocked

 

OK, just curious.  Because he only had a small amount of a banned substance its not as bad?  The league should look at it differently because its Andrew Harris and not Marcus Thigpen? I get the urge to defend a player on your team, that's what we do sometimes as fans. I don't know the steroid world and frankly don't want to either.  Its cheating and you know that.  I get it that lots of players do it.  Probably several Rider players doing it right now, how would I know.  BUT, as a community owned team and massive supporter of minor football in the province, I fully expect my team to be out front of this from day one. The first statement from Chris Jones and the Riders was the team was disappointed with Marcus and would work closely with the league, bla bla bla,  its sure as hell wasn't we know him so well and he would never do that. Every player says they don't know how it happened etc, that's how these things go every time.  As far as the 10 days later test, well IMHO they suspected something otherwise they wouldn't have randomly out of no where came back and tested him 10 days later.  Its sure looks like what ever they suspected was bang on too doesn't it?  I am a big fan of Harris, I really am, but this looks bad no matter how it happened.  I've always wondered why athletes have to be shoving pills in their mouth everyday just to play a game they are supposed to be good at to begin with. If I am a cfl coach today I am telling my players don't take a friggin thing that hasn't been cleared by the team doctor. Simple as that. Could have been a accident but it doesn't matter, piss tests don't lie.  In my job I have been involved in a more than I can count.  I have never failed one ever, I don't do drugs so it doesn't matter to me when it is. I know who will fail just by how mad they are that they are getting tested, or the classic they are picking on me defense. 

[17to85]

2 minutes ago, Ripper said:

I don't know the steroid world and frankly don't want to either.

so you are just choosing to argue with someone who professes to know that world? That is the height of ignorance.

 

Now I dunno whether or not Harris is telling the truth or not, we have all heard the "I didn't know, must be my supplements!" excuse before enough times to be immediately doubtful, however if you read Booch without any biases what he says can make sense. Again I ain't passing any judgements because I know that I don't know enough to form an opinion one way or the other. But I do know that arguing with someone who does know enough is pretty foolish. 

[Bigblue204]

11 minutes ago, Ripper said:

OK, just curious.  Because he only had a small amount of a banned substance its not as bad?  The league should look at it differently because its Andrew Harris and not Marcus Thigpen? I get the urge to defend a player on your team, that's what we do sometimes as fans. I don't know the steroid world and frankly don't want to either.  Its cheating and you know that.  I get it that lots of players do it.  Probably several Rider players doing it right now, how would I know.  BUT, as a community owned team and massive supporter of minor football in the province, I fully expect my team to be out front of this from day one. The first statement from Chris Jones and the Riders was the team was disappointed with Marcus and would work closely with the league, bla bla bla,  its sure as hell wasn't we know him so well and he would never do that. Every player says they don't know how it happened etc, that's how these things go every time.  As far as the 10 days later test, well IMHO they suspected something otherwise they wouldn't have randomly out of no where came back and tested him 10 days later.  Its sure looks like what ever they suspected was bang on too doesn't it?  I am a big fan of Harris, I really am, but this looks bad no matter how it happened.  I've always wondered why athletes have to be shoving pills in their mouth everyday just to play a game they are supposed to be good at to begin with. If I am a cfl coach today I am telling my players don't take a friggin thing that hasn't been cleared by the team doctor. Simple as that. Could have been a accident but it doesn't matter, piss tests don't lie.  In my job I have been involved in a more than I can count.  I have never failed one ever, I don't do drugs so it doesn't matter to me when it is. I know who will fail just by how mad they are that they are getting tested, or the classic they are picking on me defense. 

I'm not sure anyone has said anything like that. Booch was just saying how the two situations were different. One was full blown negative test. The other, trace amounts. 

They did...see Millers comments on working with the league...Literally the second paragraph in the article "The Winnipeg Blue Bombers fully support the CFL’s policy on performance enhancing drugs and have fully cooperated with the CFL in regard to this matter."

Now you're getting pissy cause the HC wants to back his guy? SHOCKING...HC BELIEVES HIS PLAYER....OMG...HOW COULD HE!?! Have you not been paying attention to Oshea these past few years? He will 100% never throw a player under the bus, regardless of the situation. It's just not what he does. GTF over it.

My thoughts too. There has to be a limit to what the body can take in regards to supplements. Sooo why teams aren't going "hey, these are what you can take, etc etc etc...and this is how much you can take, Have at'er!" I just don't get it. I mean there's always going to be the guys looking for an edge. But why teams don't try to get in front of that I haven't ever understood.

[Nolby]

I'm assuming he will appeal this or can you when it comes to something of this nature?

[Ripper]

6 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

so you are just choosing to argue with someone who professes to know that world? That is the height of ignorance.

 

Now I dunno whether or not Harris is telling the truth or not, we have all heard the "I didn't know, must be my supplements!" excuse before enough times to be immediately doubtful, however if you read Booch without any biases what he says can make sense. Again I ain't passing any judgements because I know that I don't know enough to form an opinion one way or the other. But I do know that arguing with someone who does know enough is pretty foolish. 

I said I didn't know about it and don't really care to. I guess if you are capable of getting past this elephant sized straw man you guys have going here and get back to the facts. Piss test is positive for banned substance. Booch definitely knows his football even though we argue sometimes, its mostly because he is wrong and doesn't want to admit it. If he knows this much about this, we can probably make somewhat of a safe assumption that current players probably do too, or at least a fair few of them, couldn't we?  Along that line, we can probably make a bit of a assumption that they should know better than to take anything without the team being on the up and up with it. I find it also funny that disagreeing around here equates to ignorance, stupidity. If you disagree then present you position on it and let the discussion continue on its way.

[Booch]

10 minutes ago, Ripper said:

OK, just curious.  Because he only had a small amount of a banned substance its not as bad?  The league should look at it differently because its Andrew Harris and not Marcus Thigpen? I get the urge to defend a player on your team, that's what we do sometimes as fans. I don't know the steroid world and frankly don't want to either.  Its cheating and you know that.  I get it that lots of players do it.  Probably several Rider players doing it right now, how would I know.  BUT, as a community owned team and massive supporter of minor football in the province, I fully expect my team to be out front of this from day one. The first statement from Chris Jones and the Riders was the team was disappointed with Marcus and would work closely with the league, bla bla bla,  its sure as hell wasn't we know him so well and he would never do that. Every player says they don't know how it happened etc, that's how these things go every time.  As far as the 10 days later test, well IMHO they suspected something otherwise they wouldn't have randomly out of no where came back and tested him 10 days later.  Its sure looks like what ever they suspected was bang on too doesn't it?  I am a big fan of Harris, I really am, but this looks bad no matter how it happened.  I've always wondered why athletes have to be shoving pills in their mouth everyday just to play a game they are supposed to be good at to begin with. If I am a cfl coach today I am telling my players don't take a friggin thing that hasn't been cleared by the team doctor. Simple as that. Could have been a accident but it doesn't matter, piss tests don't lie.  In my job I have been involved in a more than I can count.  I have never failed one ever, I don't do drugs so it doesn't matter to me when it is. I know who will fail just by how mad they are that they are getting tested, or the classic they are picking on me defense. 

well just so you know...a trace amount...even a small amount..especially of an oral steroid does noting for you...absolutely noting...thats why orals you take daily..and it's subsequent toxicity on the liver and kidneys...as opposed to an oil based suspension...slower release..longer lasting...so cheating yeah if he was doing the required dose...which would NOT have shown up as small..trace..minute...whateverthafack you wanna call it. An amount that showed small amounts would just cause you negative issues...random means random...we had random tests done 4 consecutive days at one point..multiple players at each one tested and retested...that doesn't mean diddly really..and the 10 day later tests were not just him ....Just so you know in regards to your "assumed guilty" stance. Yeah I will defend him based on the timeline..the drug...the test result..many things...this has happened before in pro sports and was proven...

You don't know a lot about it...but I do...too much actually but thats a different story all together..The Bombers are also working with the league...obviously stand by their player and believe in him...obviosly people in the know, are familiar with his character and see him daily and have a good handle on it...Oshea did say players have to be better at what they consume..so not like they are sloughing it off...Don't even bring in Chris Jones and his cheating ways into this discussion..good god

[TBURGESS]

What a **** show. Will definitely cost Harris the next 2 games. Will likely cost him MOP, because the CFL isn't going to put a guy who got caught up for their biggest award.

Where did the 'contamination' come from anyway? Did Harris change what he was taking between his last passed test and his failed test? Did he open a new container that was tainted? Cross contamination from something that contained the banned substance? What would that even be? I'm pretty sure I don't have anything on my shelves that contains the banned substance (I can't even remember it's name).

MOS stands by all his players. There's no reason to believe that he'd throw Harris under the bus even if he wanted to. The team stays together, especially in the press. There's no reason to believe that they wouldn't stand behind a teammate who got caught. Management knows that Harris is at least half our offence. No reason to believe they'd say anything against their meal ticket.

The story is a 32 year old RB who is not only defying father time, but is actually getting better, getting caught taking a banned substance. I wouldn't wonder if he did it for 1 second if he wasn't a Bomber. Put me on Mike's side of the ledger.

[Booch]

16 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

so you are just choosing to argue with someone who professes to know that world? That is the height of ignorance.

 

Now I dunno whether or not Harris is telling the truth or not, we have all heard the "I didn't know, must be my supplements!" excuse before enough times to be immediately doubtful, however if you read Booch without any biases what he says can make sense. Again I ain't passing any judgements because I know that I don't know enough to form an opinion one way or the other. But I do know that arguing with someone who does know enough is pretty foolish. 

no rider fan will read what i say without bias...go over there and take a ganders at it for yourself haha...and i like it that way...

[Ripper]

3 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Now you're getting pissy cause the HC wants to back his guy? SHOCKING...HC BELIEVES HIS PLAYER....OMG...HOW COULD HE!?! Have you not been paying attention to Oshea these past few years? He will 100% never throw a player under the bus, regardless of the situation. It's just not what he does. GTF over it.

Pissy??   LOL, not even close.  I am glad its not us this time, we have had our share of **** shows and will again.

My thoughts too. There has to be a limit to what the body can take in regards to supplements. Sooo why teams aren't going "hey, these are what you can take, etc etc etc...and this is how much you can take, Have at'er!" I just don't get it. I mean there's always going to be the guys looking for an edge. But why teams don't try to get in front of that I haven't ever understood.

Totally agree

 

[do or die]

The Winnipeg management, coaches and its players can certainly provide moral support to Andrew.   We want to and can take his statement at face value. 
But the league does a policy on performance enhancing drugs and it applies to everyone.   Something does seem odd about the substance itself and the season testing sequence on Harris.  Proving that the test was somehow compromised, at this stage is going to be problematic, and without some Perry Mason moment.....Harris will just have to do the time.

[M.O.A.B.]

By Andrew appealing it tells me he didn't took any steroids intentionally and really thought it is a mistake. Because it sounds stupid appealing the result if you knew you intentionally put it on your system. 

[Booch]

4 minutes ago, Ripper said:

I said I didn't know about it and don't really care to. I guess if you are capable of getting past this elephant sized straw man you guys have going here and get back to the facts. Piss test is positive for banned substance. Booch definitely knows his football even though we argue sometimes, its mostly because he is wrong and doesn't want to admit it. If he knows this much about this, we can probably make somewhat of a safe assumption that current players probably do too, or at least a fair few of them, couldn't we?  Along that line, we can probably make a bit of a assumption that they should know better than to take anything without the team being on the up and up with it. I find it also funny that disagreeing around here equates to ignorance, stupidity. If you disagree then present you position on it and let the discussion continue on its way.

you kind of made the obvious statement in that do you really think Harris is that dumb?...like really?...and also...what football player with any IQ starts a cycle mid season..or even in season.??...when juicing your wind is basically non existent not to mention sky high blood pressure...you don't play pro ball on the sauce...you do it off season...much akin to Thiggy getting caught in off season

I am mostly wrong on Turdfans....according to..turdfans..lol

And doesnt disagreeing there equate to same thiing...and a banning because the thin skin can't take facts and truth???

[Bigblue204]

6 minutes ago, M.O.A.B. said:

By Andrew appealing it tells me he didn't took any steroids intentionally and really thought it is a mistake. Because it sounds stupid appealing the result if you knew you intentionally put it on your system. 

the counter to that is, if you want to look innocent then you will appeal for the reasons you stated above. If he doesn't appeal, people will assume he's guilty. If he does appeal, people will assume he's appealing so he doesn't appear guilty to try and save face.

That's the unfortunate thing for harris moving forward now. This will be a cloudy spot in his otherwise sunny career regardless of the truth.

Edited August 26, 2019 by Bigblue204

[Bomber_fanaddict]

The problem with only taking what the team Dr. says is ok to take is there will be times they dont even know what is in the supplement they are giving their athletes. 

 

[Bigblue204]

2 minutes ago, Bomber_fanaddict said:

The problem with only taking what the team Dr. says is ok to take is there will be times they dont even know what is in the supplement they are giving their athletes. 

 

Well that would be the whole point...the team (or league? or CFLPA? etc) would be responsible for making sure they are what they say they are.

[bustamente]

I don't believe any athlete that says he didn't take anything illegal or didn't know what he was putting into his body, and I don't believe Harris either, cheated got caught do your time and come back hungry. It also doesn't change my opinion of him either, he is a great running back and the Bombers need him.

[17to85]

15 minutes ago, Ripper said:

I said I didn't know about it and don't really care to. I guess if you are capable of getting past this elephant sized straw man you guys have going here and get back to the facts. Piss test is positive for banned substance. Booch definitely knows his football even though we argue sometimes, its mostly because he is wrong and doesn't want to admit it. If he knows this much about this, we can probably make somewhat of a safe assumption that current players probably do too, or at least a fair few of them, couldn't we?  Along that line, we can probably make a bit of a assumption that they should know better than to take anything without the team being on the up and up with it. I find it also funny that disagreeing around here equates to ignorance, stupidity. If you disagree then present you position on it and let the discussion continue on its way.

You are taking the guilty because he is suspended stance, all I'm saying is there is a possibility that the guy wasn't juicing based on the things that Booch outlines. I ain't making a judgement because how the crap should I know? All I know is the guy is suspended cause he got illegal **** in his body somehow. Supplements with steroids in em isn't an unheard of thing, I actually think it's pretty common. There's a lot of things that could point to Harris telling the truth... or he's full of it and trying to save face, but to come out and blatantly say "I don't know about these things but you're wrong" is just ignorant and only a Rider fan could take such a position. 

[Bomber_fanaddict]

4 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Well that would be the whole point...the team (or league? or CFLPA? etc) would be responsible for making sure they are what they say they are.

Which would be great. But the cost to have a third party test and retest all of the supplements they take would fold the league. 

[pigseye]

1 hour ago, BomberfanMKS said:

Here is the thing - O'Shea is parroting this line about trace amounts 10 days after a clean test means it was unintentional.

Does anything we've seen from O'Shea as our head coach over the last couple years give you the impression he would protect someone he thought was intentionally cheating?

 

IMO - If O'Shea thought Harris was purposefully taking banned substances the BEST the club could get him to say to protect Harris would be "I won't comment".  He wouldn't be talking about having Harris at practices surrounded by his teammates, because (IMO) he'd be advocating for cutting the guy.

The trace amount thing is a red herring, D-bol may not be a base steriod anymore but everyone uses it in their stacks, in small amounts.

O'Shea is a former player and for all we know, may have been a user himself, in any case I would expect him to back whatever story Harris is feeding him.

[pigseye]

1 hour ago, Noeller said:

Apparently not since the 80s, and you couldn't even find it today unless you went to a back alley in New York City............says Booch.....

Well booch can get it on amazon anytime he wants, it's still one of the most popular out there especially in stacks in small amounts. 

[Ripper]

17 minutes ago, Booch said:

you kind of made the obvious statement in that do you really think Harris is that dumb?...like really?...and also...what football player with any IQ starts a cycle mid season..or even in season.??...when juicing your wind is basically non existent not to mention sky high blood pressure...you don't play pro ball on the sauce...you do it off season...much akin to Thiggy getting caught in off season

I am mostly wrong on Turdfans....according to..turdfans..lol

And doesnt disagreeing there equate to same thiing...and a banning because the thin skin can't take facts and truth???

Thigpen tested positive in November after our playoff game against Toronto so likely he was on it all year and was rolling the dice around piss tests on not getting caught.   And when did I say Harris was dumb?  If starting a cycle mid season is dumb, wouldn't it be more likely he has been on it the whole time?  I have nothing else to add to the discussion other than the opinion I have stated so I will bow out and read comments and let others carry the discussion on from here.  Safe travels to anyone coming out to Regina

Edited August 26, 2019 by Ripper

[Bigblue204]

5 minutes ago, Bomber_fanaddict said:

Which would be great. But the cost to have a third party test and retest all of the supplements they take would fold the league. 

You wouldn't leave the choice up to the players, is what I'm saying. The team/league etc would say here's a list you can take, they would supply the teams...and that would be that. You wouldn't leave it up to the players to ask the team to test whatever supplement is trendy that week.

Obviously there's a cost to all of this. But there's also a cost to having a potential MOP get busted due to contamination (assuming that's what happened).

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

18 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

Where did the 'contamination' come from anyway? Did Harris change what he was taking between his last passed test and his failed test? Did he open a new container that was tainted? Cross contamination from something that contained the banned substance? What would that even be? I'm pretty sure I don't have anything on my shelves that contains the banned substance (I can't even remember it's name).

It's called metandienone, and if you have supplements in your home, there is a tonne of stuff in there that is not listed in the ingredient list. Contamination is also an issue too. Supplements are not regulated... at all. 

[TBURGESS]

10 minutes ago, wanna-b-fanboy said:

It's called metandienone, and if you have supplements in your home, there is a tonne of stuff in there that is not listed in the ingredient list. Contamination is also an issue too. Supplements are not regulated... at all. 

I understand that it's an unregulated industry. Are you suggesting that the company Harris buys from changed their product and that's why Harris got caught? If that's the case every player who is using that supplement is going to get caught if they're tested.

Edited August 26, 2019 by TBURGESS