World Politics

[JCon]

3 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

Jokes aside. Literally what is being fought for is an expansion of personal rights.  Or at the very least a return to the normal rights that people used to have in this country. Wacko's exist.  No doubt about that but absolutely everything would be painted by wacko's if all positions were defined by the character of the dumbest person who supports them. There are of coarse wacko's who actually believe that the vaccines were killing people in large numbers. But there's a large segment of the population that actually have some level of empathy for those who were not privalaged with the same level of intellect as you or I and feel that people should not be punished for making a medical choice beyond the punishment of the natural consequences they will face for making that decision. 

No one is joking. We're just living this "freedumb" nightmare. It's not at all about personal rights. It's about their own, selfish position. They want personal freedom at the expense of everyone else's freedom. They're fine to trade. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

8 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

Jokes aside. Literally what is being fought for is an expansion of personal rights.  Or at the very least a return to the normal rights that people used to have in this country. Wacko's exist.  No doubt about that but absolutely everything would be painted by wacko's if all positions were defined by the character of the dumbest person who supports them. There are of coarse wacko's who actually believe that the vaccines were killing people in large numbers. But there's a large segment of the population that actually have some level of empathy for those who were not privalaged with the same level of intellect as you or I and feel that people should not be punished for making a medical choice beyond the punishment of the natural consequences they will face for making that decision. 

What freedoms and rights have you had taken away?

[Colin Unger]

I've never stated that this was about me. I was first in line to get vaccinated which almost instantly restored some of the things that I need in order to be healthy. 

I know things will be conflated so i'll expand my statement. What people want is to get rights in writing for things that we all took for granted as rights but it turned out to be that we didn't have any of these rights. Im not convinced i agree with all of it but I'm just staying that there's no appetite whatsoever for a  right wing dictatorship (facist) in Canada. It's quite the opposite. The left wouldn't want it because its right wing. And the right doesn't want it because they're more focused on freedom from government. It's actually quite laughable to suggest there's an increased appetite for facism in this country. 

 

[JCon]

8 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

I've never stated that this was about me. I was first in line to get vaccinated which almost instantly restored some of the things that I need in order to be healthy. 

I know things will be conflated so i'll expand my statement. What people want is to get rights in writing for things that we all took for granted as rights but it turned out to be that we didn't have any of these rights. Im not convinced i agree with all of it but I'm just staying that there's no appetite whatsoever for a  right wing dictatorship (facist) in Canada. It's quite the opposite. The left wouldn't want it because its right wing. And the right doesn't want it because they're more focused on freedom from government. It's actually quite laughable to suggest there's an increased appetite for facism in this country. 

 

The whole convoy's stated goal was to remove the PM and instill their own gov't. 

That is fascism. I'm sorry if you don't like the word. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

10 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

I've never stated that this was about me. I was first in line to get vaccinated which almost instantly restored some of the things that I need in order to be healthy. 

I know things will be conflated so i'll expand my statement. What people want is to get rights in writing for things that we all took for granted as rights but it turned out to be that we didn't have any of these rights. Im not convinced i agree with all of it but I'm just staying that there's no appetite whatsoever for a  right wing dictatorship (facist) in Canada. It's quite the opposite. The left wouldn't want it because its right wing. And the right doesn't want it because they're more focused on freedom from government. It's actually quite laughable to suggest there's an increased appetite for facism in this country. 

 

Ok, so not you personally but clearly you have in mind rights we (collectively) thought we had but didn’t. What rights are those?

[Colin Unger]

I wasn't talking about the convoy. I think i made it clear that I was talking about the larger group of canadians who are fighting for the things i said they were fighting for. For example the federal party which has the highest numbers in the polls supports what im talking about. 

 

[JCon]

Just now, Colin Unger said:

I wasn't talking about the convoy. I think i made it clear that I was talking about the larger group of canadians who are fighting for the things i said they were fighting for. For example the federal party which has the highest numbers in the polls supports what im talking about. 

 

Ah, yes, led by the leader who supports the terrorists and promised to do undemocratic things as PM. Not fascisms, nope. 

[Colin Unger]

Just now, TrueBlue4ever said:

Ok, so not you personally but clearly you have in mind rights we (collectively) thought we had but didn’t. What rights are those?

I thought i could take for granted that the government wouldn't disallow me from exercising at the gym (especially during winter), going for massage therapy, chiropractic and yoga. I guess i misinterpreted my free ability to do basic things as rights that i didn't know i didn't have.

[JCon]

Just now, Colin Unger said:

I thought i could take for granted that the government wouldn't disallow me from exercising at the gym (especially during winter), going for massage therapy, chiropractic and yoga. I guess i misinterpreted my free ability to do basic things as rights that i didn't know i didn't have.

You thought you had the freedom to impose your medical choices on others? Interesting. 

[Colin Unger]

Just now, JCon said:

Ah, yes, led by the leader who supports the terrorists and promised to do undemocratic things as PM. Not fascisms, nope. 

Define undemocratic things?  Keep in mind I know very little about him other than that he seems to be standing up for struggling Canadians and claims to want to fight for more rights for all.

1 minute ago, JCon said:

You thought you had the freedom to impose your medical choices on others? Interesting. 

And what exactly are you going on about.  Like i fully understand if for business reasons such services don't exist. If no ciropractors want to work they should certainly not be forced to. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

Just now, Colin Unger said:

I thought i could take for granted that the government wouldn't disallow me from exercising at the gym (especially during winter), going for massage therapy, chiropractic and yoga. I guess i misinterpreted my free ability to do basic things as rights that i didn't know i didn't have.

You did misinterpret. Those are privileges, not rights. And in the Charter, Rights are subject to reasonable limitations for the greater public good. And if you had a clear medical issue that was not elective, your right to medical treatment would not have been denied. 

[Colin Unger]

I have many clear medical issues. That's why these things not being available to anyone but government workers was so horrific for my life.

Yeah I acknowledge that i misinterpreted and that im not fighting for rights that exist but rather for new rights to be created. 

Surely you guys would be on board with limiting government power considering you think we are on the verge of being run by fascist dictators. We could act now and courts could limit their power once they are in.

[17to85]

You have no idea what you are talking about. On one hand you say you don't know much about pollievre and then on the other you say he is standing up for the little guy. You are a fascists dream. You believe whatever crap you are fed. No one had their rights taken away. That's just something selfish dumb people say to justify their selfish dumb behaviors. 

 

[JCon]

4 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

Surely you guys would be on board with limiting government power considering you think we are on the verge of being run by fascist dictators. We could act now and courts could limit their power once they are in.

PP loves you. Adores you. Ignorant, by your own admission, and just going along with PP because he says things you like. 

[Colin Unger]

2 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

You have no idea what you are talking about. On one hand you say you don't know much about pollievre and then on the other you say he is standing up for the little guy. You are a fascists dream. You believe whatever crap you are fed. No one had their rights taken away. That's just something selfish dumb people say to justify their selfish dumb behaviors. 

 

Again you're really jumping to conclusions. It was no accident that I used the word "seems to be".  I don't trust him at all. 

[17to85]

Now you are using weasel words. It's all classic behaviors. You dearly want your opinions but God help you if you need to think about why you hold those opinions. 

 

[JCon]

Just now, Colin Unger said:

Again you're really jumping to conclusions. It was no accident that I used the word "seems to be".  I don't trust him at all. 

I urge you to read what he says. I urge you to look at what he has done. Who he stands with. And, who supports him. 

 

[Colin Unger]

1 minute ago, JCon said:

PP loves you. Adores you. Ignorant, by your own admission, and just going along with PP because he says things you like. 

I haven't once said that I'm going along with him and there's zero chance I'll vote for him due to Ted Falk being my local rep. But even without that it would be unlikely that I would vote for him but not impossible. I'm merely point out to you that there is a large swath of Canadians that like the idea of more rights.  A group that goes way beyond the whacky protestors. 

[JCon]

1 minute ago, Colin Unger said:

I haven't once said that I'm going along with him and there's zero chance I'll vote for him due to Ted Falk being my local rep. But even without that it would be unlikely that I would vote for him but not impossible. I'm merely point out to you that there is a large swath of Canadians that like the idea of more rights.  A group that goes way beyond the whacky protestors. 

Which, I understand. But, what "rights" do you (or they) think that they are missing? What's not covered in the Charter? 

[Colin Unger]

Just now, JCon said:

Which, I understand. But, what "rights" do you (or they) think that they are missing? What's not covered in the Charter? 

Off the top of my head Freedom of speech is pretty important especially if you guys are right about PP and he gains power.  It would also be important to have a list of rights that a time of emergency doesn't negate. Because by definition facists are militant and a facist could be elected and then create a way and then invoke a time of emergency to gain further dangerous powers. 

[17to85]

3 minutes ago, JCon said:

Which, I understand. But, what "rights" do you (or they) think that they are missing? What's not covered in the Charter? 

That's the one thing they never say. Canada has always had the ability to limit a person's rights when it impacts societies right. 

These plague rats need to stop pretending to be heros and realize they are just morons.

[Colin Unger]

2 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

That's the one thing they never say. Canada has always had the ability to limit a person's rights when it impacts societies right. 

These plague rats need to stop pretending to be heros and realize they are just morons.

Have you ever disagreed with someone and not resorted to Trump style personal attacks?

[17to85]

Just now, Colin Unger said:

Have you ever disagreed with someone and not resorted to Trump style personal attacks?

I generally only argue with morons... so I guess not. 

[JCon]

17 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

Off the top of my head Freedom of speech is pretty important especially if you guys are right about PP and he gains power.  It would also be important to have a list of rights that a time of emergency doesn't negate. Because by definition facists are militant and a facist could be elected and then create a way and then invoke a time of emergency to gain further dangerous powers. 

In times of emergency, the gov't has to have the ability to limit personal freedoms and it's up to the court to decide if those measures are reasonable. The last thing you want during an emergency is for a gov't not to be able to react to protect society, like when terrorists invade the capital. 

There is public enquiry going on right now over the use of the Emergencies Act. You should pay careful attention to that and why the Feds felt it was necessary. You'll hear all different sides. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by JCon

[Colin Unger]

You guys should step outside of Canada for a while.  Wanting to have more rights is pretty much universal but in some countries they are not free to express that for fear of the government killing them. Believe me the stories that people told me after I built trust with them when i was living in Nicaragua were heart-wrenching. Having rights that some government can't take away everytime there is an emergency or an emergency they create is extremely important. 

Just now, JCon said:

In times of emergency, the gov't has to have the ability to limit personal freedoms and it's up to the court to decide if those measures are reasonable. The last thing you want during an emergency is for a gov't not to be able to react to protect society, like when terrorists invade the capital. 

There is public enquiry going on right now over the use of the Emergencies Act. You pay careful attention to that and why the Feds felt it was necessary. You'll hear all different sides. 

I agree with that needing to react to emergencies.  The problem is what happens when a facist dicator is in charge. Society at large will not realize what they are until it is too late. At first they will manipulate and make everyone believe there is a real emergency and be granted special powers. But the time there is a push back it will be too late especially with how comfortable so many people have become with the granting of special powers.