Osh is a Legend

[J5V]

1 hour ago, Noeller said:

The only question is whether Osh wants to get back on this sinking ship. I know I'd run away. But if the organization is smart they beg The Trinity to come back and try to fix this with better coordinators... 

A few days ago you said there is no way O'Shea would ever leave. What caused you to change your mind?

The Trinity IS the organization. They certainly haven't needed anyone's permission to fix things and we're going on 6 years.

Miller has a job, he can't do Walters' job for him. Walters has a job, he can't do O'Shea's job for him. O'Shea has a job, he can't do Lapo's and Hall's jobs for them. To win a championship each of these people have to be working at a championship level. It's hard to believe that that's happening. It all starts with Wade Miller and I haven't seen him anywhere near a Grey Cup since he took over. 

[Mark H.]

15 minutes ago, Floyd said:

Its really time to move on from the Mack excuse... team is rebuilt.

I would never say fire Walters and Miller until they've had another coach under their reign - Bauer's problem was that he didn't like Ritchie, it got personal and he couldn't let it go... now I think we have the opposite problem - we like Osh as a person too much and can't look at it rationally

I only went back that far to show that O’shea’s .500 record is not solely on him. 

[Deiter Fan]

22 minutes ago, Floyd said:

Yet its year four of Lapo and five of Hall...  how can this not fall on Osh/Walters?

I actually think it does fall on them. I was just offering my thoughts on what is likely to happen. O'shea will be probably be given a pass because of the loss of Nichols and that pass will likely solidify if he sacrifices one or both of his co-ordinators. 

You have to be at least a bit of a hard-ass if you want to be the boss and make uncomfortable decisions that will hurt/disappoint people. While he may have been a hard-ass as a player he doesn't strike me as one as a coach.

[Deiter Fan]

34 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Anyone watching the Lions/Argos game? It's 54-0 Lions. 

Good thing I wasn't saving the pvr'd game for tomorrow.

[Floyd]

Just now, Mark H. said:

I only went back that far to show that O’shea’s .500 record is not solely on him. 

Going back a bit further...  I remember how Ritchie took Reinbold's disaster and turned them into a team after one season

 

[J5V]

1 hour ago, Mark H. said:

When it comes to Blue Bomber history, he who cannot draw on the last 11 years is living from hand to mouth.  Look at where this team was at after 2008 & 2009 - the cupboard was bare.  Other than a 2011 GC berth, we had absolutely pathetic seasons after that.  

O’Shea brought success and competence to this team.  To include the first two seasons just to make the point that he is .500, given the mess he inherited, is misleading. 

Other changes need to be made, but the coach who turned this team and organization into something respectable needs to stay.  

Meanwhile, we can keep lamenting our 9 - 6 team.  In other news, the Grey Champion lost to the predicted tire fire. 

This is a good "perspective" post. We haven't lost anything yet. We are playoff bound and anything can and does happen in the CFL.

[Floyd]

3 minutes ago, Deiter Fan said:

I actually think it does fall on them. I was just offering my thoughts on what is likely to happen. O'shea will be probably be given a pass because of the loss of Nichols and that pass will likely solidify if he sacrifices one or both of his co-ordinators. 

You have to be at least a bit of a hard-ass if you want to be the boss and make uncomfortable decisions that will hurt/disappoint people. While he may have been a hard-ass as a player he doesn't strike me as one as a coach.

I'd give Osh another set of coordinators - but I think if we slide 0-3 for the rest of the season, there is no choice other than to clean house

Khari is a 'nice' coach and he's doing okay... but he's super into the game as well...  and has Bobby Gordon and Marquay MacDaniel there to assist - these are guy who know how to win

[J5V]

1 hour ago, rebusrankin said:

What kind of offensive and defensive system would the Labrador Retriever be running?

A tenacious one and one where he'd defend his turf to the death.

[J5V]

1 hour ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

I think you're overly optimistic. Would you sign MOS to a 3 year deal with the risk he may never win a championship in nearly a decade & have only 1 playoff win go show for? That's a huge risk. The only reason Walters does that is because they are friends & he is looking after his good buddy,  After 9 years if there are no results then everyone will get fired. How do you sell another 3 years to the Bomber base? That will be a tough one.

You just do it. Sign everyone. Who's going to stop you?

[Deiter Fan]

7 minutes ago, Floyd said:

I'd give Osh another set of coordinators - but I think if we slide 0-3 for the rest of the season, there is no choice other than to clean house

Khari is a 'nice' coach and he's doing okay... but he's super into the game as well...  and has Bobby Gordon and Marquay MacDaniel there to assist - these are guy who know how to win

Oh come on...Montreal is a total anomaly. Freak of nature. The exception that proves the rule. Everyone knows that you can't possibly be successful in a short period of time with a new coach. You have to give them 5 years minimum

[Deiter Fan]

7 minutes ago, J5V said:

1 hour ago, rebusrankin said:

What kind of offensive and defensive system would the Labrador Retriever be running?

A tenacious one and one where he'd defend his turf to the death.

He'd obviously run a grrrrrrrreat one

[Floyd]

22 minutes ago, J5V said:

A tenacious one and one where he'd defend his turf to the death.

Would be a helluva return game

[pigseye]

HC is ultimately to blame for everything from Lapo & Hall to the players not getting it done. No excuses for O'Shea, he's had time to turn over the roster and hire co-ordinators. 

[SpeedFlex27]

1 hour ago, J5V said:

You just do it. Sign everyone. Who's going to stop you?

To me, you don't do it. If after 6 years O'Shea loses in the playoffs how can you bring him back? For another 3 years? You know he won't sign for a lesser term. That is playing with fire with the fanbase. 

[Goldkobra]

I don't think we need to clean house just yet. It sucks that we can't seem to get over the hump, but this is as successful and consistent this organization has been in decades.  I don't expect them to through that away. That being said,  changes need to happen.  It seems to me like we are too easy to gameplan against.  Too predictable and locked into certain tendencies in game situations.  Particularly on offence.

[Mike]

5 hours ago, Floyd said:

I'd give Osh another set of coordinators - but I think if we slide 0-3 for the rest of the season, there is no choice other than to clean house

Khari is a 'nice' coach and he's doing okay... but he's super into the game as well...  and has Bobby Gordon and Marquay MacDaniel there to assist - these are guy who know how to win

I mean ... do Robert Gordon and Marquay McDaniel “know how to win” more than our coaching staff? They have one Grey Cup between them, which is less than Jordan Younger for example. 

Not arguing your main point but just stating that it’s not as cut and dry as pointing to the winning attitude of who he has surrounded himself with. There are plenty of winners here too.

[Mark H.]

7 hours ago, Floyd said:

Going back a bit further...  I remember how Ritchie took Reinbold's disaster and turned them into a team after one season

True.  And Walters / O’Shea could have taken the quick approach and loaded up with Vets. Hell, maybe (maybe!) they could have signed Henry Burris and already won a cup. But then, what happened in 2004 - 2005?  In 2019, we have a team that is 100 times better, with a solid foundation to build on. 

[JuranBoldenRules]

2 hours ago, Mark H. said:

True.  And Walters / O’Shea could have taken the quick approach and loaded up with Vets. Hell, maybe (maybe!) they could have signed Henry Burris and already won a cup. But then, what happened in 2004 - 2005?  In 2019, we have a team that is 100 times better, with a solid foundation to build on. 

The differences between the Bombers and a contender are in the QB room, including the guy designing the offense.

[Mark H.]

12 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

The differences between the Bombers and a contender are in the QB room, including the guy designing the offense.

Fair comment.  Yesterday, by the end, it was clear that even the OL had given up. 

[the watcher]

6 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

The differences between the Bombers and a contender are in the QB room, including the guy designing the offense.

Trying to turn Streveler into a pocket passer is the equivalent of trying trying to turn me , a 61 year old balding old man who wasn't great looking to start with into a gigilo.  As much as I might want it to happen....It ain't. Osh's  part in this should have been to slap Lapo's bald head the second he brought it up. If Lapo had gone into this game and made intellegent use of a QB who has limited but very special abilities THAT would have been genius. But the buck stops at the head coach. In the end his blind loyalty may cost him his job.

[Doublezero]

Compared with other CFL clubs, Bombers have had poor coaching at the QB position.  Most of the competitive teams have former QBs or Offensive experts at the helm.  But we've got Walters and MOS who are ST experts and who arguably don't have the same nuanced understanding of the QB position as, say, Khari or Dickenson in Calgary. Lapo and Buck aren't up to the task unfortunately.

[Mark F]

We don't really know about Buck.

He has to do what he's told to do.

After his stint in BC under Wally, who thought Khari was any good? Turns out he was being held back.

Edited October 6, 2019 by Mark F

[Carlos Harper]

2 hours ago, Mark H. said:

True.  And Walters / O’Shea could have taken the quick approach and loaded up with Vets. Hell, maybe (maybe!) they could have signed Henry Burris and already won a cup. But then, what happened in 2004 - 2005?  In 2019, we have a team that is 100 times better, with a solid foundation to build on. 

Respectfully disagree. Bombers have signed plenty of vets and have relied heavily on free agency to build the team.  

The solid foundation you speak of is not there imo. Team is littered with entry level contracts and first year starters. No prospects outside the CFL to speak of.

It's a tribute to Stanley Bryant that he has been able to stay healthy at 35. The long snapper is 38 and still has a spot on the roster for another year. 

Good luck to them the rest of the way but even if they win the cup I would still be doubtful that long term success with this group is guaranteed.

[Doublezero]

8 minutes ago, Mark F said:

We don't really know about Buck.

He has to do what he's told to do.

After his stint in BC under Wally, who thought Khari was any good? Turns out he was being held back.

One of the criticisms of Streveler is that he hasn't been able to pick up defensive formations and get through his reads. Not sure I agree with this but even if true - who's responsible for that? Arbuckle in Calgary and Adams in Montreal have good QB experience coaching them. Hamilton has Tommy Condell.

[pigseye]

Buck, Dinwiddie would be the obvious choices next year, no?