2019-20 CFL Offseason

[JCon]

2 minutes ago, Stickem said:

So when do the feds. give us an answer?,,,I hope they don't sit on it too long and keep the league guessing....I've found in politics the longer things are drawn out that there's some sort of glitch and more conferencing is needed...Of course they could come out with a flat out 'no' BUT they could also offer some suggestions of their own, that might include some of our well heeled owners like Braley and get some input from him....We're hanging on the ropes guys...maybe we get saved by the bell and Trudeau comes through...Here's hopin'

So here's just a few problems based on my years in gov't reviewing all sorts of funding proposals. I've seen stadium/arena proposals. I've seen plans to create 5 meter x 5 meter gardening plots. I've seen almost everything in size and scale under $500 million. I've also seen a lot of people coming forward who don't even know what they need. They can't articulate it. 

But...

1 - You need to come with a real plan. Sure, you can get through the door, gets someone's ear about your plight but, if you don't have a plan, waiting for gov't to develop one can be problematic. 

2 - If you're relying on gov't to have a plan, you better have a lot of time and not be approaching them during a crisis. Like now. The gov't analysts are working OT already trying to come up with plans and formulas to tackle the bigger problems facing our economy right now. This is not a small ask. Someone needs to analyse all the data and determine what the economic impact would truly be if the CFL folded. Also, what are implications for bailing out the CFL? Who's next on the list? How much are you going to hand out and how do you pick winners and losers. 

3 - If gov't is going to bail them out, they need a policy in place to rationalize it, which goes back to the previous issue. 

It sounds like the CFL has identified that there is a problem and have found some ways to contribute back through offer advertising but they haven't come with a plan. That's what I'm reading. 

[Noeller]

Feds said today that they need a proper business plan from the league and PA before they can move forward on this. Read a quote from one MP who said "we can work with them, if they present a proper business plan...and the sooner the better". So I get the impression that things are relatively positive, but the league needs to get it's **** together in a real hurry.

[DR. CFL]

The challenges of formulating a plan:

1 )You don’t have an agreement with the PA on the basis of a reduction of the number of games. 2) Logistically planning requires a known fixed start up date as all arrangements work backwards from that...you don’t know a date. 3) you don’t know if provincially, regionally or in all the cities what the rules will be and if you will be able to hold games. 4) Will players entering the Country be required to self isolate for 14 days? Where and at who’s expense. 5) What will the requirements for testing of players, coaches and staff be ? Costs associated with that and justification to others who are unable to be tested. 6) what happens when a player, coach or staff member tests positive? Normal requirements are that that individual and anyone who has been in close proximity are required to self isolate for 14 days. 7) what is the projected lost revenue on the basis of a reduction in games, associated reduction in TV revenue, reduced revenue from social distancing in venues, reduced concession revenues.  what are the projected increases in costs associated with all extra precautions that will need to be put in place?

  Those are just some starters that government will want factored in.  It is understandable that they want a detailed business plan. 

[Mr Dee]

I think they have a basis for a plan going forward but their hands are still tied to each area/province and it’s restrictions, if they can get a firm idea as to when they can start a schedule, then they can move forward from there. It won’t be until past August so they do have a little time to factor in extra costs and the other factors the kindly Dr. ^^ has mentioned. (What he’s doing here and not on the front lines I don’t know😉)

Some of these areas can be covered by studying the plans the NBA Raptors must have put forward, so there’s that. And the NHL must also have some useful info.

This won’t be easy, but is it worth all the effort?

You're damned right It is.

[M.Silverback]

4 hours ago, Booch said:

Maybe it is time in this age for a more fluid working relationship...one where each CFL team would be an affilaite with a group of NFL ones and could utilize players that would essentially be buried on an NFL practice sent there to develop...sure lots of logistics and details would have to be hashed out...who pays what...limits for number of players..etc..etc..but would benefit both leagues and is something that could be worked out into a beneficial working relationship between leagues...and would also possibly allow CFL teams to have greater talent play here...sure in some instances may be a short duration...half a year...a whole year..who knows.

I'd be in favor of some type of arrangement like this. I heard Randy Ambrosie on the Waggle podcast (episode 201), and he talked about a relationship with NFL and advice from Roger Goddell. My take was that the CFL would do it, but, the NFL is reluctant. From their perspective it's really just an additional expense. They already pluck the best players off CFL rosters every year. And I think a lot of NFL teams would rather have their best prospects close by on the practice roster, working with the position coaches and roster players. 

Doesn't mean it could never happen. I just think that the CFL might have to bring more to the table. Not sure what that would be. Might be time to float the idea/beg the NFL again. 

[SpeedFlex27]

9 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

Change takes time. And has already started via CFL 2.0 and trying to get the world to watch which will bring more TV contracts which means less reliance on ticket sales.

Your take on this is surprisingly ignorant 

How is saying the business model is broken  ignorant when teams collectively lose $10-20 million every year with row upon row & section upon section of empty seats in nearly every stadium? It's true.  If it was any other business would you say that? I'd say not. You'd call them bad owners. 

Not many of us here were AAF or XFL fans. Whe we'd watch a game the first thing we'd notice were the empty seats & we'd snicker to ourselves thinking that particular league would fail as we viewed  both as a threat to the CFL. Well, we see a half empty stadium in Edmonton, in BC & a completely empty one in Toronto yet we don't snicker. We say to ourselves that's just the CFL does business & ignore it.

Why do so many Canadians who are only NFL fans say hurtful things & mock our league? Whether we like to admit it or not, their perception of the CFL is absolute & total failure because of all the empty seats. That the CFL isn't worth watching or investing in as a fan. I've followed the Bombers & the CFL as a fan for 55 years. It would kill me to see the league fold. I pray they find a way to survive & then if they do to finally try & fix things right. 

The CFL needs to live within its means. If that means rolling back the salary cap millions of dollars to save it, then fine.  Or adjusting ticket prices downward then fine,. Just do it.  I hope the league survives & gets a chance to reset. 

Edited May 8, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[SpeedFlex27]

10 hours ago, WBBFanWest said:

You sure seem to know a lot about how to run the CFL despite never having done it.  Tell you what, why don't you talk to Ambrosie directly and spare us your constant ranting.  He seems like a smart guy and I'll bet he'd be thrilled to get your advice.

Well, you seem to know as well. So, you talk to Randy for me. You're much smarter, according to you. 

[SpeedFlex27]

9 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

The ppv would need be to ridiculously expensive to work Unfortunately. 

Not enough people would buy.

[SpeedFlex27]

7 hours ago, Noeller said:

So, I love the discussion on this, but here's a couple thoughts from someone in broadcasting re:advertising/advertisers...

-Shopping for anything and everything is down right now. If people aren't spending money at a business (Wendy's, Rona, Save On Foods, etc...) that business can't afford to advertise. That's sort of the world we're living in right now. All media corps are BEGGING for advertising right now...they've all seen a major drop off. So, asking the clients to pay more because "more eyes on the product" isn't going to fly, because they just can't afford to right now. 

I'm not saying anything is absolute, but the whole world of advertising has changed in the last two months, so I'm not sure what would actually work...

Great points, Noeller.

[Mr Dee]

8 hours ago, Noeller said:

I'm not saying anything is absolute, but the whole world of advertising has changed in the last two months, so I'm not sure what would actually work...

I hear you, but I have to think that money is accounted for by the advertisers.
Could be gone, but who knows?
People (well most anyways) are aware of the draw that CFL football will bring on football-starved fans. 
It’s an interesting topic that I’m sure will be discussed further.

A hail Mary? 

Get Khari and Milt on it.

And now to watch the Bomber game.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Mr Dee

[WBBFanWest]

50 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Well, you seem to know as well. So, you talk to Randy for me. You're much smarter, according to you. 

No, I just don't blather on ad nauseam about how terrible he is every time Ambroise's name gets mentioned.  Ya, we get it, Randy's no Sydney Halter 

[JuranBoldenRules]

Ambrosie is way too fluffy.  Needs to be very direct.  No one has time for bullshit right now least of all governments with everyone coming cap in hand right now.

I also would like to know, and no one seems to be asking, what other kinds of deals has the CFL looked at in terms of TSN/Bell, other industries that are really reliant on the CFL to make their revenue...New Era, other suppliers.

[DR. CFL]

The irony of this situation is fans are fans....by definition they are subjective in their reasoning....that’s what makes sports franchises successful...often when they win or lose.  Those people having to formulate a business plan are objective minded people. Often they list two columns...one is the pros/ positive attributes ( reason the business will succeed) and cons / negative attributes ( the reason a business will fail).

The government has legitimately asked for a business plan to outline the details that demonstrate a step by step process outlining how this will work. No different than what a bank requires before investing in a business or project.

We know what the sentimental subjective fan wants. We know what the objective business investor wants. The jury is now out.

[Dr Zaius]

Canada needs the CFL. Besides the NHL, we have no other professional sports identity. No, curling doesn't count. 

There should be no doubt the government bails out the league. Imo, of course.

Edited May 9, 2020 by Dr Zaius

[DR. CFL]

15 minutes ago, Dr Zaius said:

Canada needs the CFL. Besides the NHL, we have no other professional sports identity. No, curling doesn't count. 

There should be no doubt the government bails out the league. Imo, of course.

The government has set up that committee for exactly that reason....the CFL  won’t be the only sports entity looking for money. 

[17to85]

1 hour ago, Dr Zaius said:

No, curling doesn't count.

get out

[Noeller]

As an aside, I'm really curious what the rules on curling will be in the fall... 

[SpeedFlex27]

3 hours ago, WBBFanWest said:

No, I just don't blather on ad nauseam about how terrible he is every time Ambroise's name gets mentioned.  Ya, we get it, Randy's no Sydney Halter 

Ah, so what? Put me on ignore if you don't like it. And this goes back to the mid 80's & how many Commissioners has that been? 

Edited May 9, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[Eternal optimist]

8 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Ah, so what? Put me on ignore if you don't like it. And this goes back to the mid 80's & how many Commissioners has that been? 

Ooh, ooh! I love making lists!

Jake Gaudaur (1968-1984)
Douglas Mitchell (1984 - 1988)
Bill Baker / Roy McMurty (1989)
J. Donald Crump (1990 - 1991)
Larry Smith (1992 - 1997)
John Tory (1997 - 2000)
Michael Lysko (2000 - 2002)
David Braley (interim) (2002)
Tom Wright (2002 - 2007)
Mark Cohon (2007 - 2015)
Jim Lawson (interim) (2015)
Jeffrey Orridge (2015 - 2017)
Jim Lawson (interim) (2017)
Randy Amrbosie (2017 - present)

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Football_League#League_commissioners

Haven't vetted the source because surprised if anyone cares about this lol.

[Mr Dee]

Donald Crump? 
Yeesh! 
That’s too close..

That was the start of our drought.

Coincidence? 😳

Edited May 9, 2020 by Mr Dee

[JuranBoldenRules]

10 hours ago, Dr Zaius said:

Canada needs the CFL. Besides the NHL, we have no other professional sports identity. No, curling doesn't count. 

There should be no doubt the government bails out the league. Imo, of course.

There is no doubt IMO either.  There are at least three provincial governments relying on a CFL team operating to serve public debt on a stadium, arguably four but I don’t know as much about the BC Place arrangement.

I’m not entirely sure why the ask is to the Feds.  I would like to hear more about other partnership ideas and levels of government more directly involved.

Whatever happens a CFL will emerge out of this.  All these venues will need tenants.  It just might be slightly reformed.

[Eternal optimist]

1 hour ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

There is no doubt IMO either.  There are at least three provincial governments relying on a CFL team operating to serve public debt on a stadium, arguably four but I don’t know as much about the BC Place arrangement.

I’m not entirely sure why the ask is to the Feds.  I would like to hear more about other partnership ideas and levels of government more directly involved.

Whatever happens a CFL will emerge out of this.  All these venues will need tenants.  It just might be slightly reformed.

Personally, I think it's because the Feds have the ability to just "make" money like wizards... as for Ambrosie's pie-in-the-sky figure of $150,000,000, I think that was a negotiation tactic... Probably doesn't expect that full amount to come through, but it's easier to bargain down than up.

Just my 2 cents.

[WBBFanWest]

1 hour ago, Eternal optimist said:

Ooh, ooh! I love making lists!

Jake Gaudaur (1968-1984)
Douglas Mitchell (1984 - 1988)
Bill Baker / Roy McMurty (1989)
J. Donald Crump (1990 - 1991)
Larry Smith (1992 - 1997)
John Tory (1997 - 2000)
Michael Lysko (2000 - 2002)
David Braley (interim) (2002)
Tom Wright (2002 - 2007)
Mark Cohon (2007 - 2015)
Jim Lawson (interim) (2015)
Jeffrey Orridge (2015 - 2017)
Jim Lawson (interim) (2017)
Randy Amrbosie (2017 - present)

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Football_League#League_commissioners

Haven't vetted the source because surprised if anyone cares about this lol.

I look at this list and it breaks my heart.  How could so many commisionners fail to appreciate the fact that there were people with no knowledge and all the answers just waiting to jump in and so them all how wrong they were in their wrongness .  Imagine if they had!

[17to85]

10 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Ah, so what? Put me on ignore if you don't like it. And this goes back to the mid 80's & how many Commissioners has that been? 

Awe you know what no one is angry about it, we just all laugh because it's like clockwork. You show up disparaging the commissioner when anything happens. For what it's worth i don't think he's all that fantastic either. 

[DR. CFL]

14 minutes ago, WBBFanWest said:

I look at this list and it breaks my heart.  How could so many commisionners fail to appreciate the fact that there were people with no knowledge and all the answers just waiting to jump in and so them all how wrong they were in their wrongness .  Imagine if they had!

The plight of that extensive lists of Commissioners was the fact that they were operating at the mercy of a number of controlling private owners. Not a position of power and likely a source of great frustration.