2019-20 CFL Offseason

[SpeedFlex27]

1 minute ago, AKAChip said:

What job are you referring to when you say didn't get the job done? Harris beat the same teams Nichols did outside of Calgary. MBT had an even worse team than Edmonton and didn't have the luxury of facing the pathetic Toronto defence. Beyond that, no one is arguing that either of these guys are particularly good. Just don't discount how bad BC, Ottawa and Toronto were this year and when five of your seven wins are against those three teams, it doesn't tell you a hell of a lot about your own quality of play. 

That's why Claybrooks & Maas are now unemployed. Their qbs put up such big numbers. And Chamblin won 5 games with MBT & the only reason he hasn't been fired is because of the coaches cap. They all had losing records. Nichols with his "inferior play" was 7-2 & had the Bombers in first place. 

[rebusrankin]

So if the club decides that Nichols isn't the answer, who do you think they pursue? I like Arbuckle myself. Just for fun, could MBT give us enough in a tandem with Streveler?

[AKAChip]

2 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

That's why Claybrooks & Maas are now unemployed. Their qbs put up such big numbers. And Chamblin won 5 games with MBT & the only reason he hasn't been fired is because of the coaches cap. They all had losing records. Nichols with his "inferior play" was 7-2 & had the Bombers in first place. 

Reilly was the least of Claybrooks' problems. Maas is a pretty bad coach whose time was up and again, my dislike for Nichols doesn't mean I think Trevor Harris is any good. I've been consistent on the stance that he sucks for quite some time now. I don't think MBT is particularly good either but your point about him here is disingenuous. Franklin got a number of starts and the Argos were significantly better with him than they were without him. I'm not even sure what overarching point you're trying to make here. Nichols beat two playoff teams this year and the Calgary game was won exclusively by two special teams touchdowns. It's hardly fair to judge the records of any other QB that played for the Bombers this year when no one else played the worst three teams in the league. Do you honestly think that had nothing to do with Nichols' record as a starter? You still haven't addressed that. 

[Noeller]

*IF* Nichols returns from this most recent injury and is the same as he was, then he's EASILY Top 5 in the league.... 

I just ******* hate this site some days.... 

[AKAChip]

6 minutes ago, Noeller said:

*IF* Nichols returns from this most recent injury and is the same as he was, then he's EASILY Top 5 in the league.... 

I just ******* hate this site some days.... 

It would be an interesting exercise to have a number of people rank the top 10 QBs in the league in their opinion. Maybe a good offseason activity. 

And even you have to recognize that returning to form from this shoulder injury is a rather sizeable "IF"

[Brandon]

13 minutes ago, Noeller said:

*IF* Nichols returns from this most recent injury and is the same as he was, then he's EASILY Top 5 in the league.... 

I just ******* hate this site some days.... 

Reilly

BLM

Harris

Evans

Collaros

No way is he top five even at his peak.

At this point I'd put

Arbuckle

Fajardo (look at his win loss if you're going to argue)

Masoli

Adams

Ahead of him

Nichols literally is only better then MBT , Franklin, Jennings, Davis and maybe on par with Streveler.

I dare you to disagree with putting him ahead of those top five I listed.

[AKAChip]

Arbuckle is probably better than Harris but yeah... hard to disagree. 

[Noeller]

Reilly, BLM ahead.... I'll still argue Nichols at 3rd right now...

[Noeller]

 

 

[AKAChip]

4 hours ago, Noeller said:

Reilly, BLM ahead.... I'll still argue Nichols at 3rd right now...

That's just a ridiculous take. And I absolutely guarantee you if Nichols were the Riders QB and Fajardo were the Bombers QB and their numbers were identical to what they are now, you'd argue that Nichols was a bum and Fajardo was a top-5 QB in the league.

Edited December 2, 2019 by AKAChip

[JuranBoldenRules]

57 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

I don't know about your qb rankings but it needs to be updated. I'll be the first to admit that Nichols didn't put up a lot of passing yards in the 8 or 9 games he played but this was a run first team & at times very predictable on what we would do on first down. Defenses knew Harris off tackle was coming on first downs so they keyed on it. And we didn't go vertical when we passed like other teams. We had more of a horizontal, ball control passing attack which meant more short yardage throws all over the field. We were not a quick strike team under Nichols. Still, he was something like 7-2 when he got hurt. Nichols was a very good game manager & didn't turn the ball over which gave us a field position advantage most games. Field position wins games & we did. Some qbs put up a lot more yardage than Nichols but didn't win like Harris in Edmonton, MBT in Toronto & Reilly in BC. They couldn't get the job done. 

As I've said going on two years now, the best thing I can say about Nichols 2017-18-19 performance is that he's limited turnovers.  Nichols has very visibly declined physically over the past couple seasons, he's very unlikely to improve at this point.  Without Harris having all-time great seasons, all time great D and ST play in terms of turning the ball over, field position and keeping TD's off the board, we don't win many games with Nichols level of play and average D/ST.  We should expect better at QB.  But we can also try to run it back with great D and ST plus Harris carrying us, but as we know from 16-17-18 it's hard to win the games we need to win to get to the Cup, against that level of competition, with a very limited intermediate (10-20 yard) passing game.  An OC that can scheme a screen game and consistently use misdirection and play action to his advantage would make any of our QB's better overall.

My preference is Streveler 1A/veteran 1B for next season.  Nichols could very well be the 1B.  The offense for Nichols is basic and already there, we need an OC who can scheme the RPO stuff to suit Streveler and give it a go.

[rebusrankin]

BLM

Reilly

Harris

Evans

Masoli

Adams Jr

Arbuckle

Fajardo

Collaros

Nichols

[SpeedFlex27]

5 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

As I've said going on two years now, the best thing I can say about Nichols 2017-18-19 performance is that he's limited turnovers.  Nichols has very visibly declined physically over the past couple seasons, he's very unlikely to improve at this point.  Without Harris having all-time great seasons, all time great D and ST play in terms of turning the ball over, field position and keeping TD's off the board, we don't win many games with Nichols level of play and average D/ST.  We should expect better at QB.  But we can also try to run it back with great D and ST plus Harris carrying us, but as we know from 16-17-18 it's hard to win the games we need to win to get to the Cup, against that level of competition, with a very limited intermediate (10-20 yard) passing game.  An OC that can scheme a screen game and consistently use misdirection and play action to his advantage would make any of our QB's better overall.

My preference is Streveler 1A/veteran 1B for next season.  Nichols could very well be the 1B.  The offense for Nichols is basic and already there, we need an OC who can scheme the RPO stuff to suit Streveler and give it a go.

Streveler has a role on this team & he's very good at it coming off the bench with limited plays. Ask him to be the day to day number 1 & he hasn't shown he can do that.  He's not close to leading this team as a starter. So, this 1A Streveler & 1B veteran  business doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[The Ghost of Mike Kelly]

18 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

BLM

Reilly

Harris

Evans

Masoli

Adams Jr

Arbuckle

Fajardo

Collaros

Nichols

For Reilly to be that high surely you must be basing it off his pedigree over the last few seasons, in which I’d certainly rank Nichols above the likes of Adams, Fajardo, possibly Collaros and even Dane Evans—who looked terrified and whiny in the Big game, lost all composure. 
 

[JuranBoldenRules]

Watch Buono hire himself as Als GM.

[Stickem]

37 minutes ago, Noeller said:

 

 

Geez Machoka sure resembles that actor Ned Beatty in the movie 'Deliverance' ...I think he'll have to do some deliverin' if Buono gives him the green light...Seems like eons since his days with the Esks.

[Mr Dee]

Vets:
BLM

Reilly

Harris, Collaros, Nichols - worth what they’re worth in their respective offences. 

Harris has all the numbers, but can he win?

Collaros has shown he can do it, at least over the short term.

Nichols - fits in with LaPo’s offence, is that good enough? 

I think these ^^. guys as veterans are still ahead of the new breed because the new guys may be exciting, but they’re not consistent enough yet. 

Newbies :

Fajardo, Evans, Masoli, Adams Jr, Arbuckle, - unproven to me, but trending upwards. They really depend on their coordinators to unleash their talents. Lots of factors.

We’re going to run with Streveler, so all’s we need is a vet who can succeed with our new OC. Nichols can do at least that much.

And we have our own wildcard in McGuire, he’s a keeper.

[Bigblue204]

Jesus christ, all this bellyaching.  Goalie has mentioned it but most seem to have forgotten. The Offense didnt win **** all. That playoff drive had basically nothing to do with the QB. You want to go through numbers. Go take a look see at the amount of points given up by Willie and company. That was and will forever be the deciding factor in the playoffs. Collaros, Nichols, Streveler....hell I could've been taking the snaps and they would have still won.

I'm also disappointed in people who are comparing regular season games to playoff games. They're different beasts all together and comparing them is useless.

[J5V]

9 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

We were lucky that Nichols got hurt. He wouldn't have got us past Calgary, let alone have won the cup.

You say this with such conviction. How do you know ?

[Brandon]

27 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Jesus christ, all this bellyaching.  Goalie has mentioned it but most seem to have forgotten. The Offense didnt win **** all. That playoff drive had basically nothing to do with the QB. You want to go through numbers. Go take a look see at the amount of points given up by Willie and company. That was and will forever be the deciding factor in the playoffs. Collaros, Nichols, Streveler....hell I could've been taking the snaps and they would have still won.

I'm also disappointed in people who are comparing regular season games to playoff games. They're different beasts all together and comparing them is useless.

I disagree,  Collaros extended drives and made big throws that Nichols would of not made.    Clearly the D was the main reason we won,  but I wouldn't ignore the contributions from the O.  

[Bigblue204]

1 hour ago, Brandon said:

 Clearly the D was the main reason we won

Fixed it for you

[Goalie]

1 hour ago, Brandon said:

I disagree,  Collaros extended drives and made big throws that Nichols would of not made.    Clearly the D was the main reason we won,  but I wouldn't ignore the contributions from the O.  

The O put up similar numbers to what the O was doing when Nichols was starter. This idea our O was consistent or good is just such a myth. We won with a below average O. 

[blueingreenland]

My off-season QB wish list for the Bombers would be:

1. Arbuckle & Streveler

2. Collaros & Streveler (I only put Collaros at #2 because Arbuckle doesn't have the injury history, is younger, and may come cheaper than Collaros, allowing us $ to re-sign Streveler, however I would be very happy if they re-signed Collaros).

3. Masoli & Streveler

4. Nichols & Streveler 

5. Streveler & McGuire (Yes, I know we already have McGuire under contract, but with Streveler being #1, he would act as a close #2).

[Blue and Gold87]

35 minutes ago, Goalie said:

The O put up similar numbers to what the O was doing when Nichols was starter. This idea our O was consistent or good is just such a myth. We won with a below average O. 

Again, you can't simply look at the final totals and get a complete picture of HOW those yards were earned. No one is saying our offense was some juggernaut, but Collaros just had the intangibles and made timely throws that gave our offense another level to deal with and that was the big difference from what we were used to with Nichols in my opinion. Escapability, making something out of nothing, throwing it up to a covered WR to let him make a play and not just settle for a check down, knowing when to run and ability to actually do it ect...

These things add up and make a huge difference between winning and losing. Collaros just took the O  to another level and that was good enough to help us win the GC. 

 

 

 

 

[17to85]

Everyone has even lost the entire point here. It's not really whether or not Collaros is better than Nichols, he may very well be, but at this point in their careers (pending how Nichols comes back from injuries) they're not so far apart. 

The entire point here is that it is complete and utter horseshit that people are so willing to downplay everything that Matt Nichols has done for this team.