Covid-19

[Tracker]

Few people can pivot to the discussion of federal equalization payments in the middle of a pandemic like Alberta Premier Jason Kenney can. 

Last week, when announcing his province’s donation of hundreds of thousands of pieces of personal protective equipment (PPE) to Ontario, Quebec, and B.C. in their fight against the COVID-19 pandemic, Kenney was asked if he expected anything in return.

“I obviously hope that our fellow Canadians will recognize in this contribution, the generous role that Albertans have always played across the country,” Kenney said. 

“This is one practical expression of that in a time of need, but we Albertans contribute $20 billion more to the rest of Canada than we get back in benefits every year. That helps to fund their hospital systems, their health-care systems, their schools.”

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/jason-kenney-coronavirus-alberta_ca_5e9f7e5bc5b69150246a2992?utm_hp_ref=ca-homepage

[Tracker]

12 hours ago, Mr Dee said:

But is it the really the science or those who manipulate the science?

The problem is that often results are interpretable and researchers, being human can succumb to confirmation bias wherein they are favourably disposed to interpret ambiguous data in such a way as to support their biases. And sometimes the results are so bizarre that they do not fit within a existing paradigm, like the wave/particle conundrum of light.

[The Unknown Poster]

Helpfully, my workplace said "hey since the state of emergency was extended, we're going to keep working from home".  I wasnt in the meeting so I couldnt ask the obvious follow up of 'um, are you suggesting you were planning to have us back in the office in May?'  I sure hope they arent stupid enough to bring us all back into the office in the next month or two.  I think its this weird aversion to Work from Home.  Some businesses just despise the notion of employees being happy and comfortable.

[Mark H.]

1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Helpfully, my workplace said "hey since the state of emergency was extended, we're going to keep working from home".  I wasnt in the meeting so I couldnt ask the obvious follow up of 'um, are you suggesting you were planning to have us back in the office in May?'  I sure hope they arent stupid enough to bring us all back into the office in the next month or two.  I think its this weird aversion to Work from Home.  Some businesses just despise the notion of employees being happy and comfortable.

Think about what they're doing at work while you're not there - open your eyes! 

[nate007]

54 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Helpfully, my workplace said "hey since the state of emergency was extended, we're going to keep working from home".  I wasnt in the meeting so I couldnt ask the obvious follow up of 'um, are you suggesting you were planning to have us back in the office in May?'  I sure hope they arent stupid enough to bring us all back into the office in the next month or two.  I think its this weird aversion to Work from Home.  Some businesses just despise the notion of employees being happy and comfortable.

I haven't looked at job postings at other organizations once during this whole thing. Used to do it pretty regularly. Wasn't actively looking to move on, just liked to see what was out there. Working from home is awesome, and has removed 90%+ of any desire to look elsewhere.

You want to retain employees after this, show that you've learned something from this and give them at least some flexibility to work from home. 

[The Unknown Poster]

3 minutes ago, nate007 said:

I haven't looked at job postings at other organizations once during this whole thing. Used to do it pretty regularly. Wasn't actively looking to move on, just liked to see what was out there. Working from home is awesome, and has removed 90%+ of any desire to look elsewhere.

You want to retain employees after this, show that you've learned something from this and give them at least some flexibility to work from home. 

I agree 100%.  And you'll see it, I think.  You'll see companies allow it and you'll see a lot of push back from employees when companies dont.  I know among my co-workers, some prefer being in the building, either because they feel more productive or miss the social interaction.  But for others, its amazing.  Totally changes the work-life balance.  I think companies just feel like, if they cant see you every second, you're probably up to no good.  But its really no different then managing employee productivity in an office.

I have a feeling my workplace will fight tooth and nail against it, with no real reasoning.  I hope Im wrong.  

[blue_gold_84]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ohs-cargill-inspection-high-river-covid-outbreak-death-meat-processing-1.5539263

Quote

Days after dozens of cases of COVID-19 were confirmed at a meat plant in southern Alberta, provincial health and safety investigators conducted an inspection by video call and concluded the plant was safe to remain open.

Now, just under a week after that call, one person is dead and 515 people are sick with COVID-19 due to the outbreak at the Cargill facility near High River, and the union representing the plant's workers says it's time for an independent investigation.

OSH inspection by video call...? Unreal.

[17to85]

1 minute ago, blue_gold_84 said:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ohs-cargill-inspection-high-river-covid-outbreak-death-meat-processing-1.5539263

OSH inspection by video call...? Unreal.

So with health and safety it ultimately comes down to are the workers following safety procedures and are the managers enforcing them. 

You can look at what a company puts on paper and it looks good, but if it's not implemented what do you do short of having someone fro  OHS  there all the time?

[Fatty Liver]

2 hours ago, Tracker said:

The problem is that often results are interpretable and researchers, being human can succumb to confirmation bias wherein they are favourably disposed to interpret ambiguous data in such a way as to support their biases. And sometimes the results are so bizarre that they do not fit within a existing paradigm, like the wave/particle conundrum of light.

We must listen to the same radio programs. 😁 

"A "confirmation bias" is a type of cognitive bias that involves favouring information that confirms your previously existing beliefs or biases. "

Turns out a lot of scientific research is chock-full of non-confirmable evidence that can not be accurately duplicated, it mostly shows up in how data is qualified and interpreted.  Bias is a part of the human condition, it's hard-wired right into our programming.   I like girls with big ****...can't explain, just do.

[Mark H.]

6 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So with health and safety it ultimately comes down to are the workers following safety procedures and are the managers enforcing them. 

You can look at what a company puts on paper and it looks good, but if it's not implemented what do you do short of having someone fro  OHS  there all the time?

One thing is certain - it's about time meat packing plants stopped flying under the radar.  They used to pay higher wages and provide better working conditions - thus they had long term employees.  Now, they have 80% - 100% employee turnover every year.  And none of their 'savings' have been reflected in the price of meat. 

[itchy]

7 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So with health and safety it ultimately comes down to are the workers following safety procedures and are the managers enforcing them. 

You can look at what a company puts on paper and it looks good, but if it's not implemented what do you do short of having someone fro  OHS  there all the time?

One word- enforcement

Employers know they can cut corners, with little to no repercussions from OSH who also have the responsibility to enforce. H&S authorities have effectively been neutered when it comes to violations, and then you see these cases occur. If there is consistent enforcement, and fines for those who violate the rules, corporations will be motivated to follow the rules and regulations that are there.

I also don't buy blame being put on employees for the most part. Sure you're gonna have some idiots in any workplace that you're going to have to deal with. For the most part it is the culture of acceptance of ignoring H&S concerns in the name of productivity, a lack of training and awareness, and general apathy that leads to hazards such as this. In the legislation, the wording is also, " the employer shall ensure...". If you look at construction, if you don't follow the rules, you get kicked of the worksite. How many other employers are that diligent?

 

[blue_gold_84]

7 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So with health and safety it ultimately comes down to are the workers following safety procedures and are the managers enforcing them. 

You can look at what a company puts on paper and it looks good, but if it's not implemented what do you do short of having someone fro  OHS  there all the time?

Adhering to proper workplace health and safety procedures is the responsibility of the employee, the employer, and the OHS committee (which is usually a combination of both parties forming said committee). It's standard practice to conduct site inspections on a regular basis to address and resolve issues in the workplace. This pandemic is one such instance where an inspection is necessary. Keep in mind it can vary from business to business but the general mandate remains the same.

The bottom line, however, is conducting a workplace inspection by video call is asinine, lazy, irresponsible, and basically useless. Whoever made this decision has put a lot of people needlessly at risk, of one which has died.

[Wideleft]

24 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

One thing is certain - it's about time meat packing plants stopped flying under the radar.  They used to pay higher wages and provide better working conditions - thus they had long term employees.  Now, they have 80% - 100% employee turnover every year.  And none of their 'savings' have been reflected in the price of meat. 

And they need to be smaller and much more numerous for the sake of resiliency in the food supply.

[itchy]

Just now, blue_gold_84 said:

Adhering to proper workplace health and safety procedures is the responsibility of the employee, the employer, and the OHS committee (which is usually a combination of both parties forming said committee). It's standard practice to conduct site inspections on a regular basis to address and resolve issues in the workplace. This pandemic is one such instance where an inspection is necessary. Keep in mind it can vary from business to business but the general mandate remains the same.

The bottom line, however, is conducting a workplace inspection by video call is asinine, lazy, irresponsible, and basically useless. Whoever made this decision has put a lot of people needlessly at risk, of one which has died.

Federally, the concept of virtual inspections was introduced with Bill C-4 in 2013

[blue_gold_84]

7 minutes ago, itchy said:

Federally, the concept of virtual inspections was introduced with Bill C-4 in 2013

Oh, I know. It's a pile of regressive dogshit. 

[17to85]

I work for a health and safety consulting firm, I am aware of how things work. And i can tell you right now it always always always comes down to are the supervisors and management enforcing things. Workers by and large are ignorant, they need the supervisors and management to enforce thing. Cause you can't have someone from ohs on location all the time.

So yeah the blame ultimately lies with management. When I go to a site I know if it will be good or bad simply based on which company it is.

[FrostyWinnipeg]

https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/south-dakota-plans-race-with-700-spectators-despite-governor-telling-fans-not-to-go/

[FrostyWinnipeg]

Missouri sues China alleging it "lied to the world" about the danger posed by the coronavirus when it first emerged in late 2019. Chinese officials have dismissed the lawsuit as "absurd." 

https://nbcnews.to/2VtGQXb

 

Edited April 22, 2020 by FrostyWinnipeg

[Mr Dee]

Ain’t it the truth...

[FrostyWinnipeg]

https://decaturish.com/2020/04/gov-kemp-tells-fox-news-gyms-may-be-safer-than-grocery-stores-la-fitness-plans-to-reopen

[Fatty Liver]

Outbreak in BC at a poultry plant, probably the similar circumstances to the High River meat factory.

 

The latest numbers released on Tuesday followed news of a new community outbreak at Vancouver's United Poultry Company chicken processing plant, where 28 workers have tested positive for COVID-19.

[FrostyWinnipeg]

Manitoba reports 2 new probable cases of #COVID19, bringing the total to 257.
- 97 active cases
- 7 in hospital (3 in ICU)
- 154 recovered
- 6 deaths
- 21,601 total tests conducted at Cadham Provincial Lab, 440 yesterday

Manitoba RCMP have charged three people from The Pas for not social distancing and refusing to comply while having a house party. Between April 14-20, Mounties received 101 #COVID19 related calls - mostly for reports of 10+ people gathering.

Edited April 22, 2020 by FrostyWinnipeg

[17to85]

2 hours ago, FrostyWinnipeg said:

Missouri sues China alleging it "lied to the world" about the danger posed by the coronavirus when it first emerged in late 2019. Chinese officials have dismissed the lawsuit as "absurd." 

https://nbcnews.to/2VtGQXb

 

Well if that's the standard then everyone can sue the USA. Just no self awareness amongst Republicans is there?

[The Unknown Poster]

 

[FrostyWinnipeg]

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/494150-2-cats-become-first-known-companion-animals-in-us-to-test