Covid-19

[Noeller]

Sweden's decision is and was deplorable. To say that the economy is more important than ANY lives, no matter how old they might be, is inexcusable. 

[JCon]

And, what you never address is the long-term health implications of contracting the Rona. We don't know what they are yet but there is research that shows scarring on the lungs and heart.

 

I mean, I smoked for several years and didn't die, so obviously smoking is safe.  

 

Edited October 1, 2020 by JCon

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

5 minutes ago, JCon said:

I mean, I smoked for several years and didn't die, so obviously smoking is safe.  

 

God damn it! I knew I shouldn't have quit! 

Cya'll later, gotta score me a pack of smokes.

Edited October 1, 2020 by wanna-b-fanboy

[Mr Dee]

What’s the fascination with Sweden anyways?

[FrostyWinnipeg]

2 minutes ago, Mr Dee said:

What’s the fascination with Sweden anyways?

Women and or hockey players.

 

[Floyd]

1 hour ago, Mr Dee said:

What’s the fascination with Sweden anyways?

They took a long term approach that looked at the overall health of their society... it’s not some ridiculous economy over lives as is portrayed

They actually made the same mistakes as us in terms of long term care homes - and accidentally elevated their death rate - but regardless it is very interesting to watch their curve remaining flat and their death rate at or near zero - herd immunity has become a dirty word but Sweden may have achieved it

will find out this October for sure 

1 hour ago, Noeller said:

Sweden's decision is and was deplorable. To say that the economy is more important than ANY lives, no matter how old they might be, is inexcusable. 

But skyrocketing overdose rates are fine - because those are different lives... got it

[Mr Dee]

9 minutes ago, Floyd said:

They took a long term approach that looked at the overall health of their society... it’s not some ridiculous economy over lives as is portrayed

They actually made the same mistakes as us in terms of long term care homes - and accidentally elevated their death rate - but regardless it is very interesting to watch their curve remaining flat and their death rate at or near zero - herd immunity has become a dirty word but Sweden may have achieved it

I’d like to see your sources..

Sweden is a completely different society than ours. They voluntarily had a few lockdowns because the people there seem to be more aware of why they should. They’d did have restrictions as to size of group meetings and they did have a higher mortality rate than their neighbours. 
Were they right in their path? Who’s to say? The economic impact is still debatable but that’s the same in many countries. 
Quote: “Despite the more relaxed approach, only 7.3% of people in Stockholm had developed the antibodies needed to fight the disease by late April -- well below the 70-90% needed for herd immunity.” - New Scientist

Sweden is not the shining example many want it to be, but I herd they have good meatballs. 🙂

Canada - total deaths...9316    total cases - 160,265 = 0.0581

Sweden - total deaths...5893   total cases -  93,615  = 0.0629
 

[Floyd]

18 minutes ago, Mr Dee said:

I’d like to see your sources..

Sweden is a completely different society than ours. They voluntarily had a few lockdowns because the people there seem to be more aware of why they should. They’d did have restrictions as to size of group meetings and they did have a higher mortality rate than their neighbours. 
Were they right in their path? Who’s to say? The economic impact is still debatable but that’s the same in many countries. 
Quote: “Despite the more relaxed approach, only 7.3% of people in Stockholm had developed the antibodies needed to fight the disease by late April -- well below the 70-90% needed for herd immunity.” - New Scientist

Sweden is not the shining example many want it to be, but I herd they have good meatballs. 🙂

Canada - total deaths...9316    total cases - 160,265 = 0.0581

Sweden - total deaths...5893   total cases -  93,615  = 0.0629
 

Excellent demonstration of my point about dogmatic thinking and using outdated information

I am talking about the second wave and moving forward - as in the death rate during the lockdown months versus Sweden’s approach

and you do know that we consider T cells as a measure of immunity more than antibodies

anyway would love to chat - but I know your schtick so why bother

my original reference was to Italy being used as a success story while Sweden is still villainized yet has a lower per capita mortality and case rate - you just demonstrated my point

[Mr Dee]

So, no sources then...

[Noeller]

Due to the high number of crazy people here, Alberta's CMO, Deena Hinshaw, has (multiple times) explained why "The Sweden Approach" and "Herd Immunity" are idiotic ideas that are a bad idea for Canada. Every time she tells idiots that they're ideas are idiotic, I'm here for it....but also feel so sorry for her having to do it in the first place. 

[17to85]

There are not enough people in Sweden contracted the disease to garner herd immunity. Look for other explanations as to why the rates dropped please and thank you. Unless you can show that the percentage is actually high enough to confer herd immunity.

[JCon]

Sweden didn't take a long term approach,they took a gamble. And, it's been a failure with more unnecessary deaths. 

 

Herd immunity works with a vaccine. Not without. 

[Mark H.]

6 minutes ago, JCon said:

Sweden didn't take a long term approach,they took a gamble. And, it's been a failure with more unnecessary deaths. 

Herd immunity works with a vaccine. Not without. 

If herd immunity really worked - then epidemics would have been less devastating during the pre - vaccine era.  Look at the Black Death, for example, people died from it for over two centuries. 

[SpeedFlex27]

29 minutes ago, JCon said:

Sweden didn't take a long term approach,they took a gamble. And, it's been a failure with more unnecessary deaths. 

 

Herd immunity works with a vaccine. Not without. 

The Swedes are convinced that they have this virus licked. Pretty cocky to be sure. 

[Floyd]

5 hours ago, Mr Dee said:

So, no sources then...

I posted the nytimes article already - that’s how this conversation began - we can easily find current articles discussing Sweden’s approach on cnn, bbc and there’s even a monk debate about it - but again I don’t expect you to read anything with substance

[SpeedFlex27]

2 hours ago, JCon said:

Sweden didn't take a long term approach,they took a gamble. And, it's been a failure with more unnecessary deaths. 

 

Herd immunity works with a vaccine. Not without. 

Today I heard that Sweden is going to allow visitors into senior care homes unmasked starting in a few days. When I heard that on the car radio coming home from work this evening, I just gasped. These poor seniors are trapped in these care centres & heartless health officials allow that? Why not just pass around a handgun & play Russian Roulette with these poor seniors? One bullet in the chamber. 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[Wideleft]

 

@Stonekettle

Hey, remember when Republicans told us how Grandpa should be willing to take one for the team because Wall Street?

NormalHey, remember when Republicans told us how Grandpa should be willing to take one for the team because Wall Street?

 

9:23 AM · Oct 2, 2020·TweetDeck

 

 

[Bigblue204]

20 hours ago, Noeller said:

Sweden's decision is and was deplorable. To say that the economy is more important than ANY lives, no matter how old they might be, is inexcusable. 

I used to think along these lines as well. However there is very, very clear evidence that shutting down economies also leads to unnecessary death. I'm in no way saying Swedens plan would work here or was better then shutting down, BUT to say it's the economy over lives, is false. You're gonna lose people either way.

[JCon]

1 minute ago, Bigblue204 said:

I used to think along these lines as well. However there is very, very clear evidence that shutting down economies also leads to unnecessary death. I'm in no way saying Swedens plan would work here or was better then shutting down, BUT to say it's the economy over lives, is false. You're gonna lose people either way.

True, which is why we've adapted as we've learned more about the virus. We've been promoting safely reopening and trying to reduce the risk.

 

Not really with schools, of course, we're just throwing them into the classroom and hoping. And, apparently, our gov't is willing to shutdown some things but not bars. 

But, we still don't know enough about the long-term health effects. That, to me, could really hurt the economy. 

[Bigblue204]

Just now, JCon said:

True, which is why we've adapted as we've learned more about the virus. We've been promoting safely reopening and trying to reduce the risk.

 

Not really with schools, of course, we're just throwing them into the classroom and hoping. And, apparently, our gov't is willing to shutdown some things but not bars. 

I can't even talk about bars and restaurants without becoming enraged lol. Health officials are all saying "Most of the spread in WPG is via bars and restaurants" yet we continue to operate as is...AND I can't have my family over for dinner (not that I actually want to, but the point is still there) because it's too dangerous. The way it's being handled is truly showing how horrible our "leadership" is. 

[JCon]

Just now, Bigblue204 said:

I can't even talk about bars and restaurants without becoming enraged lol. Health officials are all saying "Most of the spread in WPG is via bars and restaurants" yet we continue to operate as is...AND I can't have my family over for dinner (not that I actually want to, but the point is still there) because it's too dangerous. The way it's being handled is truly showing how horrible our "leadership" is. 

I cancelled my Xmas dinner already. 

"But, shouldn't we wait to see how things are?"

"No, I don't want to risk having your parents over at all. Ever. What if they get sick?" 

 

This situation may last several years in my house. Can never be too safe!!

[iHeart]

Edited October 2, 2020 by iHeart

[JCon]

I have been extremely fortunate that my family and friends have not been directly affected by the virus, from a health point of view. Many have experienced financial implications but, so far, health has not been impacted. 

There have now been two incidents this week that have potentially exposed my grandmother, in a long-term seniors residence, and at my children at school. 

I hope everyone is staying safe and healthy. Wear your masks, please. 

[17to85]

So let's talk about seniors care facilities.... they're locked down tighter than a drum... yet they still have maintenance contractors going in regularly... like why? Put that **** off if it isn't critical. I had to go into a place recently for some work that really wasn't critical and yes they have a questionnaire to fill out every day but really, nothing stops people from lying on them. Just seems entirely too risky given the risk factors for the residents.

[JCon]

In my grandmother's care home, it was a cook that did not have direct contact with the residents. However, they would have had contact with other staff who, in turn, would have contact with my grandmother.

Months ago, the Province prevented staff at care homes from working at multiple locations. They did not stop people from working at both hospitals and care homes, though, and this was a source of an outbreak at a Brandon care home. 

Riviera, the corporation that runs my grandmother's home, likes to have staff working shorter hours at multiple locations because it helps keep their benefit costs down. Separate employment contracts. Many of these people are new immigrants that provide all sorts of services in the residence.