Covid-19

[Wideleft]

16 minutes ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

Studies appear to be coming out that are also confirming this approach for younger (under 50) healthy people. I have my first 3 and honestly am torn on whether to get another at this point.

I don't understand being "torn".  What is the main reason you wouldn't?

[Super Duper Negatron]

4 minutes ago, Wideleft said:

I don't understand being "torn".  What is the main reason you wouldn't?

Basically what the article says. After 3 doses and at least one confirmed case, the benefits look to be minimal and would appear be just getting a shot for the sake of it. For my kids especially, where the risk of myocarditis is real. 

[Super Duper Negatron]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2023/02/02/well/live/covid-bivalent-booster-omicron.amp.html

For example, this doesn't scream "get another dose right now!" to me.

[Wideleft]

10 minutes ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2023/02/02/well/live/covid-bivalent-booster-omicron.amp.html

For example, this doesn't scream "get another dose right now!" to me.

It really seems to depend on what you take from the article.  For instance - take these back to back paragraphs:

A C.D.C. study looking at whether the bivalent booster protects against infection in people aged 18 to 49 was also encouraging. Compared with people who received between two and four doses of the original vaccine, people who got the bivalent booster were roughly 50 percent less likely to have a symptomatic infection from either BA.5 or XBB/XBB.1.5.

However, as with the original vaccine, the bivalent booster slightly increases the risk of myocarditis, inflammation of the heart muscle, in people aged 18 to 35. As a result, some experts are hesitant to recommend more booster doses to this group.

And yet, here's the most recent article on Myocarditis/vaccinations I could find:

What’s really going on with myocarditis and COVID vaccines

You're still more likely to be struck by lightning than to get the rare heart condition after the COVID jab.

BY JOCELYN SOLIS-MOREIRA | PUBLISHED JAN 23, 2023 2:00 PM

 

 

In the two years since the COVID vaccines became available to the public, they have become a popular target for misinformation. Anti-vaccine activists have made some wild claims—the vaccines alter DNA, cause infertility, and implant magnetic devices for the government to track your every move—with no credible scientific evidence. But they have managed to accomplish one goal: More Americans than ever are hesitant about getting a vaccine.

So whenever a person has a rare side effect from the COVID vaccines, news spreads rapidly. For example, Florida’s surgeon general recommended boys between 18 to 39 should not get the mRNA shots, citing a questionable state analysis that claimed the risk of cardiac death jumped up by 84 percent after immunization. More recently, people were quick to blame Buffalo Bills player Damar Hamlin’s sudden cardiac arrest in early January on the NFL’s mandatory COVID vaccine requirement. Cardiologists, however, were just as quick to debunk the notion with more realistic medical explanations.

Infectious disease experts have been investigating the risk of myocarditis since the beginning of the pandemic. Thousands of studies have been published on COVID, and some have found a connection between myocarditis with both the virus and the vaccines. Here are the answers we have so far.

What is myocarditis?

Myocarditis is a disease that causes inflammation in a middle layer of the heart muscle called the myocardium. The inflammation affects muscle cell function and the heart’s electrical system, causing irregular heart beats and interfering with pumping blood to and from the body. The inflammation results from your body’s immune response overreacting to an infection it’s currently fighting. Viruses are the common cause of most myocarditis infections and are responsible for 1.5 million cases every year.

A majority of myocarditis cases are mild and self-resolving, says Keren Hasbani, a pediatric cardiologist at Pediatrix Pediatric and Congenital Cardiology Associates of Texas. Most go away in less than two weeks without complications or need to go to the hospital. 

......

Is there a relationship between myocarditis and COVID?

COVID infections can cause severe and life-threatening cases of myocarditis, but the overlap is still slim. Forty out of every 1 million people are estimated to develop myocarditis 28 days after testing positive. The chances of inflammation increases among people with severe COVID illness that requires hospitalization and people with preexisting health conditions such as high blood pressure and obesity.

A 2021 study from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) found the risk of myocarditis is 16 times higher among unvaccinated people with COVID than unvaccinated people who have never had the disease. It also found that men and adults 50 years and older are more vulnerable to the condition. Among unvaccinated children under 16, myocarditis risk was 37 times higher in those with COVID infection than their healthy peers. 

Can COVID vaccines cause myocarditis?

Yes, but the chances are extremely rare. One August 2022 study in England calculated the rate of hospitalizations and deaths related to myocarditis in more than 42 million people 13 and older. The subjects consisted of two different groups: individuals fully vaccinated with either the AstraZeneca, Moderna, or Pfizer-BioNTech vaccines, and unvaccinated individuals who tested positive for COVID. The researchers found a 0.007-percent chance—that’s 2,681 out of 43 million vaccinated adultsof being hospitalized or dying from vaccine-related myocarditis. Only 0.001 percent occurred within 28 days of receiving a COVID vaccine or booster. A separate study from October 2022 estimated that the myocarditis risk is seven times greater in unvaccinated versus vaccinated individuals. 

So far only the mRNA vaccines have been associated with myocarditis. The risk appears to be higher in people with a second dose of the Moderna shot than the Pfizer-BioNTech one, says Jayne Morgan, a cardiologist and clinical director of the COVID task force at Piedmont Hospital in Atlanta. The large-scale study done in England last year showed more overlap of myocarditis cases with a second Moderna dose. Meanwhile, another 2022 study measured a two- to threefold higher chance of developing myocarditis after a second Moderna vaccine, with the association being the strongest among men and people between 18 to 39. Still, Morgan warns that the rate is small compared to that of unvaccinated populations with COVID.

Though incidence is low, research points to young men under 40 having the highest risk of developing myocarditis, says Morgan. A September 2022 study in Israel reported 28 mild cases of myocarditis after a the Pfizer-BioNTech booster shot—out of nearly four million adults. The results showed that men between the ages of 16 to 19 had the highest risk of myocarditis (a 1 in 15,000 chance), followed by men between the ages of 20 to 24. All individuals made a full recovery after spending an average of 3.5 days in the hospital.

There is no official explanation for why young men have a greater risk of myocarditis. Some COVID researchers have hypothesized that the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein that the mRNA vaccines were designed from might trigger an overly active immune response that causes inflammation in the heart. That doesn’t mean the vaccine causes the infection, warns Hasbani: Instead, the immune system is responding to the vaccine in a way that also happens to react with heart cells in the myocardium. The effect is nearly always temporary.

https://www.popsci.com/health/myocarditis-covid-vaccine-heart/

 

 

[Mark H.]

1 hour ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

Studies appear to be coming out that are also confirming this approach for younger (under 50) healthy people. I have my first 3 and honestly am torn on whether to get another at this point.

Talk to your family doctor.  

I also have the first 3 shots. I took a flu shot this fall, but not another covid jab. 

[Wideleft]

14 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

Talk to your family doctor.  

I also have the first 3 shots. I took a flu shot this fall, but not another covid jab. 

My former family doctor (Jazz Atwal) and my current doctor would have completely different takes on this.

Just saying.

[Mark H.]

7 minutes ago, Wideleft said:

My former family doctor (Jazz Atwal) and my current doctor would have completely different takes on this.

Just saying.

Yes. Just like the article has a variety of takes. 

[Super Duper Negatron]

45 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

Talk to your family doctor.  

I also have the first 3 shots. I took a flu shot this fall, but not another covid jab. 

Exact same boat as you. Vax twinsies!

[Noeller]

I got 4 regular ones (every time I've been eligible, I've jumped on the day I was able) but haven't had the chance to get the 5th (bi-valent) yet. Got sick just as I was eligible for it. Hoping in the next couple weeks to be able to go get it. AFAIC, the risk of COVID far outweighs the risk of myocarditis. Get that protection in me as soon as possible, thanks...

[Wideleft]

9 minutes ago, Noeller said:

I got 4 regular ones (every time I've been eligible, I've jumped on the day I was able) but haven't had the chance to get the 5th (bi-valent) yet. Got sick just as I was eligible for it. Hoping in the next couple weeks to be able to go get it. AFAIC, the risk of COVID far outweighs the risk of myocarditis. Get that protection in me as soon as possible, thanks...

5 jabs here.  No issues.  Teen-aged kids both have the bivalent - no issues.  Also no COVID.

[Mark H.]

I had Covid back in 2021 (double jabbed at the time) - it was quite manageable

I got hit like a truck by the flu before Christmas. Turned into a bad case of bronchitis, lost 90% of my voice

 

[Wideleft]

5 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

I had Covid back in 2021 (double jabbed at the time) - it was quite manageable

I got hit like a truck by the flu before Christmas. Turned into a bad case of bronchitis, lost 90% of my voice

 

Did you get the flu shot?  I get mine every year.

[Noeller]

I'm a moron for not getting my flu shot this year. Mid Jan I got hit with a cough... Then head cold... Then cough that has been hanging around. Mostly kicked it now (knock on wood) but man just a heavy, phlegmy chest thing that I couldn't shake. The worst. 

[Tracker]

4 hours ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

Studies appear to be coming out that are also confirming this approach for younger (under 50) healthy people. I have my first 3 and honestly am torn on whether to get another at this point.

You may wish to consider the potential risk in vaccination vs the potential harm if you do not. We get influenza shots every fall, so we do have precedent.

[BaconNBigBlue]

People have had 5 shots already?  Jebus, here in BC we've only gotten 3 shots and only get a booster if you're immunocompromised. 

[Mark H.]

1 hour ago, Wideleft said:

Did you get the flu shot?  I get mine every year.

I got the flu shot afterward, to be honest

I got it the previous 2 years, and simply neglected to get jabbed in 2022

2 hours ago, Noeller said:

I'm a moron for not getting my flu shot this year. Mid Jan I got hit with a cough... Then head cold... Then cough that has been hanging around. Mostly kicked it now (knock on wood) but man just a heavy, phlegmy chest thing that I couldn't shake. The worst. 

Did you see a Doctor? I needed meds to get rid of mine. 

[Noeller]

13 minutes ago, Mark H. said:

I got the flu shot afterward, to be honest

I got it the previous 2 years, and simply neglected to get jabbed in 2022

Did you see a Doctor? I needed meds to get rid of mine. 

nah, I've had it before and it was always viral, so they just tell me "wait it out"......maybe I could have cut down the time a bit, but figured they wouldn't do anything (again) so I just waited it out. Seems to be mostly gone now, thankfully...

[bustamente]

To my knowledge I have not gotten Covid, and am booked for my 3rd booster in the middle of the month, do I have to probably not but at this point I don't want to tempt faith

[Mark H.]

11 minutes ago, Noeller said:

nah, I've had it before and it was always viral, so they just tell me "wait it out"......maybe I could have cut down the time a bit, but figured they wouldn't do anything (again) so I just waited it out. Seems to be mostly gone now, thankfully...

As long as you don't develop a secondary infection, that approach will work - might even strengthen your immunity.

[WildPath]

I wonder if some of the guidance to not recommend the shots is because the vaccines aren't keeping up to the evolution of the virus. I believe we are recommended to get flu shots every year because they have a good indication what strain will be going around, but with Covid, the virus seems to still be evolving too fast. I remember reading medical opinions that eventually that should slow down or even mostly stop and I haven't heard of any new variants with the mass infection in China, so maybe there is something to that.

I'll keep getting them because I am immunocompromised, but I don't really see much of a risk to getting them without any health conditions, just that they may not have big gains for immunity and reducing the chance of severe sickness and death if you've been infected already. It seems like for those out there that haven't had an infection in the past year/half year or so the recommendation is to still keep getting the shots, especially since the boosters have been updated and are quite a bit more effective since the original rounds.

[SpeedFlex27]

13 hours ago, Noeller said:

I got 4 regular ones (every time I've been eligible, I've jumped on the day I was able) but haven't had the chance to get the 5th (bi-valent) yet. Got sick just as I was eligible for it. Hoping in the next couple weeks to be able to go get it. AFAIC, the risk of COVID far outweighs the risk of myocarditis. Get that protection in me as soon as possible, thanks...

I've had 5 shots myself with the bivalent in early December. Plus the flu shot. I figured I'd get another one in June. Being 67 & with high BP that I keep current. I've never had Covid (touch wood).

[the watcher]

Interesting research

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/09/crazy-interesting-findings-by-australian-researchers-may-reveal-key-to-covid-immunity

[Wideleft]

53 minutes ago, the watcher said:

Interesting research

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/09/crazy-interesting-findings-by-australian-researchers-may-reveal-key-to-covid-immunity

Looks like there is a little more work to do on this and the researchers are making a highly educated guess on natural immunity.  I continue to be amazed at the potential of Crispr.

[Tracker]

9 hours ago, Wideleft said:

Looks like there is a little more work to do on this and the researchers are making a highly educated guess on natural immunity.  I continue to be amazed at the potential of Crispr.

Crispr has its problems. On a semi-related note, a seer named Edgar Cayce stated way back a hundred years ago that Atlanteans "grew" semi-humanoids some 80,000 years ago for dangerous labour.

[Tracker]