Renaming Sports Teams

[Bigblue204]

26 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

 What the govt did was wrong. I just said we are all assigned numbers. THAT IS IT.  And this discusssion isn't about these schools or kidnappings. It's about renaming the Eskimos. So, let's just discuss the topic at hand. 

I'll talk about what I want where I want thanks. This was part of that discussion, the tweet I shared was an example of why some people don't like the name Eskimos. Someone else compared it to SIN and you said that was a great point. I disagreed and said why.

[SpeedFlex27]

1 hour ago, Bigblue204 said:

I'll talk about what I want where I want thanks. This was part of that discussion, the tweet I shared was an example of why some people don't like the name Eskimos. Someone else compared it to SIN and you said that was a great point. I disagreed and said why.

I said great point in the sense the government gives us all numbers. Please don't read into what I said as anything more than that. That was the Catholic Church & the federal government that had a hand in that which was awful. Kids being taken from their parents. Families split up. Lots of needless suffering. 

As far as the team name goes... Some don't like the word Eskimo & not all among Inuit themselves. Some say it's okay. Yet, you seem to dismiss those that aren't offended as not relevant Why is that? There is no clear consensus in the Inuit community. 

Edited July 10, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[TBURGESS]

1 hour ago, Bigblue204 said:

That's not even how we elect our leaders. Do you think Calgary should ask 50% of canadians where their new football stadium is built? Or what the design should look like? I'm guessing you want 50% of america to vote on the new NHL team name in Seattle? 

Your bad at guessing. We're not talking about where a football stadium is being built or a name for a new team. We're talking about a sports team changing their name after 70 years or so. 

I'm talking about the barest of majorities, 50%+ of those who take the time and effort to actually vote. Maybe you've heard of democracy? It's the system we're supposed to be using. It's not called minority rules ya know.

[SpeedFlex27]

You know, maybe I'm just clued out when it comes to the discussion here about changing the name Eskimos. I was never told or taught that Eskimo was a bad word. It was a designation given to people who live in the arctic. Not just in Canada but the US , Northern Europe & Russia.

As I see it, it was a name given to people who lived in one of the harshest climates in the world & thrived as a people. Able to live off the land with their own unique culture & language. I always thought Eskimo meant a proud people & heritage. I don't know anyone who considered the word Eskimo as derogatory. Edmonton named their team for the Eskimos as a compliment & acknowledgement of their proud way of life & that is how & everyone else including me has looked at it.  It's not a derogatory name like Redskins which should be changed. There are no teams called the Pale Faces.

The word Eskimo is supposed to be a proud team name. If the Inuit community overwhelmingly wants a name change, okay then do it & make the change. If they think Eskimo is a derogatory name then who am I to say it isn't? But if all this is is just the work of a few activists in their community being picked up by the Cancel Culture while the majority of Inuit are silent then no, it shouldn't be changed.

I say, put it to a vote. If the Inuit community votes for change then change it. That should put an end to this once & for all. 

[Eternal optimist]

53 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

I'm talking about the barest of majorities, 50%+ of those who take the time and effort to actually vote. Maybe you've heard of democracy? It's the system we're supposed to be using. It's not called minority rules ya know.

Oh, but it is! Several times in the Canadian Federal Elections, including 2019, was the political party in power determined not by majority rules (i.e. popular vote), but by voter distribution. Regardless, my point still stands - expecting an entire nation to have 50% support of anything that is not a no-brainer is downright impossible. Nothing would get done. Not only that, there are plenty of issues that, despite public opposition, were for the greater good, long-term.

I doubt the Red River Floodway would ever have been built if a 50%+ approval from public was required. Another bad decision made by the public that did get 50%+ approval was the Brexit referendum, which is still reeking havoc for Britain economically.

[SpeedFlex27]

This isn't rocket science. It's about a name change. Not about building a floodway. Take a vote. It's one question, yes or no. Let the people decide & respect the decision on both sides of the argument.

Edited July 11, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[tacklewasher]

14 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

Your bad at guessing. We're not talking about where a football stadium is being built or a name for a new team. We're talking about a sports team changing their name after 70 years or so. 

I'm talking about the barest of majorities, 50%+ of those who take the time and effort to actually vote. Maybe you've heard of democracy? It's the system we're supposed to be using. It's not called minority rules ya know.

3 wolves and a sheep deciding on lunch.

 

SMH

[TBURGESS]

According to this thread...

1. If you're against a forced name change for the Eskimos you're nothing more than a stupid racist.

2. You don't want to have a vote on it because even 50% of people who bother to vote is too high a bar.

Assuming that means you're worried that more than half don't agree, you're saying more than half are nothing more than stupid racists. Sounds legit.

FTR: Voting has nothing to do with right and wrong. It has to do with political will.

[Floyd]

Well after reading this thread, I am 100% for changing the name...  this debate is ridiculous 

maybe not every single inuk takes offence at ‘Eskimo’ but if some do then change it... it’s just a brand

on the one hand 70 years of history is used as an argument for the name while historical mistakes connected with the word are dismissed 

[Stickem]

I've got an idea for a changed name....Maybe not original and I've seen it before...even used it a few times myself... 'The Schmoes' and I'm sure the schmoes won't mind....All of this political correctness really burns my arse sometimes...about as much as a 3 and half foot flame...The CFL has bigger problems than just name changes for cripes sake....like actually playing the game........After saying that....que the Redblacks for the next one on the 'nothing else to do' list..... 

Edited July 11, 2020 by Stickem

[Eternal optimist]

21 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

This isn't rocket science. It's about a name change. Not about building a floodway. Take a vote. It's one question, yes or no. Let the people decide & respect the decision on both sides of the argument.

The floodway was an example to support your side of the argument...?

[Fred C Dobbs]

If you want to get an insight into an Inuit discussion of this issue I strongly recommend reading this article in the local Iqaluit (Nunavut) newspaper:

https://nunatsiaq.com/stories/article/edmonton-football-club-responds-to-new-calls-for-a-name-change/

It's not so much the article itself but rather the comments on it that I found really interesting. Just a random example:

Posted by Northern Inuit on 6 July, 2020

just because you have a twitter account doesn’t make you the be all and end all voice of eskimo’s and inuit alike.

talk to us, many of your fellow inuit love the name Edmonton Eskimo’s.

I’m not a fan of the CFL, but I’m proud and happy that Edmonton chose their name.

now wash your hands and stop worrying about the small things.

Edited July 12, 2020 by Fred C Dobbs

[SpeedFlex27]

6 hours ago, Eternal optimist said:

The floodway was an example to support your side of the argument...?

Oops, sorry.... Misunderstood. 

[SpeedFlex27]

14 hours ago, Floyd said:

Well after reading this thread, I am 100% for changing the name...  this debate is ridiculous 

maybe not every single inuk takes offence at ‘Eskimo’ but if some do then change it... it’s just a brand

on the one hand 70 years of history is used as an argument for the name while historical mistakes connected with the word are dismissed 

Why does your opinion or that of others who disagree carry more weight on this subject? Just wondering. We have no idea how many in the Inuit community want a change. Have a referendum. Put it to a vote. See what the results are. 

[Eternal optimist]

8 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Why does your opinion or that of others who disagree carry more weight on this subject? Just wondering. We have no idea how many in the Inuit community want a change. Have a referendum. Put it to a vote. See what the results are. 

The other problem too is Indigenous communities historically have lower voter turnout, likely due to lack of trust in government agencies, so a referendum would likely have skewed results unfortunately.

[Bomber_fanaddict]

On 2020-07-10 at 6:39 PM, SpeedFlex27 said:

You know, maybe I'm just clued out when it comes to the discussion here about changing the name Eskimos. I was never told or taught that Eskimo was a bad word. It was a designation given to people who live in the arctic. Not just in Canada but the US , Northern Europe & Russia.

As I see it, it was a name given to people who lived in one of the harshest climates in the world & thrived as a people. Able to live off the land with their own unique culture & language. I always thought Eskimo meant a proud people & heritage. I don't know anyone who considered the word Eskimo as derogatory. Edmonton named their team for the Eskimos as a compliment & acknowledgement of their proud way of life & that is how & everyone else including me has looked at it.  It's not a derogatory name like Redskins which should be changed. There are no teams called the Pale Faces.

The word Eskimo is supposed to be a proud team name. If the Inuit community overwhelmingly wants a name change, okay then do it & make the change. If they think Eskimo is a derogatory name then who am I to say it isn't? But if all this is is just the work of a few activists in their community being picked up by the Cancel Culture while the majority of Inuit are silent then no, it shouldn't be changed.

I say, put it to a vote. If the Inuit community votes for change then change it. That should put an end to this once & for all. 

Exactly this. I've never once thought of it as derogatory or as a slur of any kind. It's a lot different then say the "N" word where you were taught it was a racial word and not to use it. I'm also not opposed to change. But change it if the Inuit want it changed and not as a political stunt or because someone who is non inuit and has nothing to do with the name is whining about it. 

 

 

[Floyd]

12 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Why does your opinion or that of others who disagree carry more weight on this subject? Just wondering. We have no idea how many in the Inuit community want a change. Have a referendum. Put it to a vote. See what the results are. 

So you actually think holding a referendum about a CFL team name in Nunavut and the western arctic is a good way to spend time and money?

the Inuit have elected leadership - at worst ask them and get an endorsement or change it - but more comments I read on this thread - like generalizing about voter turnout and what ‘Eskimo’ really means - the more I’d say it just should be changed...

like what is the actual argument against changing eskimos to say ‘elks’ other than ‘its always been like this’...  and in that argument, I’d say there’s an element of systemic racism - if you think about it

 

[SpeedFlex27]

39 minutes ago, Floyd said:

So you actually think holding a referendum about a CFL team name in Nunavut and the western arctic is a good way to spend time and money?

the Inuit have elected leadership - at worst ask them and get an endorsement or change it - but more comments I read on this thread - like generalizing about voter turnout and what ‘Eskimo’ really means - the more I’d say it just should be changed...

like what is the actual argument against changing eskimos to say ‘elks’ other than ‘its always been like this’...  and in that argument, I’d say there’s an element of systemic racism - if you think abo

Yes, I believe it would be money well spent if people feel that strongly. about the issue. My argument is we don't know how many people from their community want it changed. If the results show the Inuit want change then the Esks can go ahead & no one will say otherwise. I maintain that 10% of the voices are making 90% of the noise. And of that 10% a good percentage aren't members of the Inuit  community. With a referendum, we'd know for sure. C'mon Floyd, this would be democracy in action. A win for everyone.  If the result was for a name change then I'd support it. 

Edited July 12, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[RaimeyTime]

On 2020-07-10 at 1:52 PM, TBURGESS said:

 Black Lives Matter? Bar Life Matters? Bo Levi Mitchell? Which BLM is it?

Bureau of Land Management!

[Floyd]

1 hour ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Yes, I believe it would be money well spent if people feel that strongly. about the issue. My argument is we don't know how many people from their community want it changed. If the results show the Inuit want change then the Esks can go ahead & no one will say otherwise. I maintain that 10% of the voices are making 90% of the noise. And of that 10% a good percentage aren't members of the Inuit  community. With a referendum, we'd know for sure. C'mon Floyd, this would be democracy in action. A win for everyone.  If the result was for a name change then I'd support it. 

Well I hate to break it to you but Canada barely knows what the CFL is... ha

if the Eskimos have a letter from the IRC (Inuvialuit leadership) and NTI (Nunavut tunngavik) saying that the name is not offensive, it’s a non issue...  if not, then just change the name - every move a private business makes does not have to appease all canadians - but right now the name Eskimos is not helping the brand

if Edmonton came out and said we are being proactive in support of indigenous peoples and changing the name - look at how much free advertising and goodwill the CFL would get... at a time when we are asking Canada for money

[SpeedFlex27]

1 minute ago, Floyd said:

Well I hate to break it to you but Canada barely knows what the CFL is... ha

if the Eskimos have a letter from the IRC (Inuvialuit leadership) and NTI (Nunavut tunngavik) saying that the name is not offensive, it’s a non issue...  if not, then just change the name - every move a private business makes does not have to appease all canadians - but right now the name Eskimos is not helping the brand

if Edmonton came out and said we are being proactive in support of indigenous peoples and changing the name - look at how much free advertising and goodwill the CFL would get... at a time when we are asking Canada for money

Well, the leadership from what I understand has been silent. I could be wrong there but I don't recall any senior community leaders say they want the name changed. Have you?Therefore,  I believe it's only a minority that does. If it was such a pressing issue then there would have been a message sent & there would be no doubt. The call to have a name change looks more like bullying to me. That isn't a good enough reason to force a name change, I don't think. I don't have an issue with a name change if it can be shown that the majority of the Inuit community want that. 

[Floyd]

13 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Well, the leadership from what I understand has been silent. I could be wrong there but I don't recall any senior community leaders say they want the name changed. Have you?Therefore,  I believe it's only a minority that does. If it was such a pressing issue then there would have been a message sent & there would be no doubt. The call to have a name change looks more like bullying to me. That isn't a good enough reason to force a name change, I don't think. I don't have an issue with a name change if it can be shown that the majority of the Inuit community want that. 

I've been in the north for almost 25 years now...  Jordin Tootoo, Tanya Tagaq and Mumillaq Qaqqaq's voices have A LOT of weight up here.

I too know a lot of people that don't care about the word Eskimo... but its DOES have systemic racism connotations.

Eskimos just lost Boston Pizza as a sponsor... once again, the CFL is behind an issue instead of ahead of it.

On a basic economic level, any diehard fan or casual fan would not 'stop liking' CFL football if they were 'forced' to cheer for the Edmonton Elks...  but the name Eskimos has been hurting the CFL brand and now the bottom line.

Minority voices or not... the Eskimos brand now prevents the Feds from giving the CFL any sort of bailout...  what point are we trying to prove?

[Noeller]

Again, why do we name teams after ethnicities? I don't understand how that even became a thing. 

[SpeedFlex27]

1 hour ago, Noeller said:

Again, why do we name teams after ethnicities? I don't understand how that even became a thing. 

Because it was meant as a compliment. Not a racial slur. The name Eskimo was never meant to be a bad thing. My point is why should a minority get to change things? Or white folks who have never even  visited the North? Why should they have a say? They have no right to be dictating anything to the Inuit community. Just like Belair Direct or Pizza Hut. The last time I looked, white folks in a lot warmer climates ran those companies. I can say with confidence that no senior company executives from either  companies have spent ay time in Canada's far north. Yet here they are lecturing.  Another example of white entitlement thinking they know better than the Inuit community? How many offices does Belair Direct have in Nunavut or Inuvik? Or Boston Pizza  restaurants? Let the Inuit community figure it out for themselves & then go from there.

Again, I'm not against the Eskimos renaming their team. I just want to see proof that an overwhelming amount of Inuit find the name offensive, first. 

Edited July 13, 2020 by SpeedFlex27

[Mr Dee]

Re: nicknames for teams.
Usually, one bases decisions like this, on feelings, even without conscious reasoning.
It’s intuitive. 
In this case it just happens to be Inuitive.
See?
You’re welcome