2021 (??) CFL Season

[kelownabomberfan]

59 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

Just for fun who was the best oc in that time and were they in the top tier league wide? Have we been sad to see any oc go idk maybe worman. 

I think in that time we've had some of the best dcs but maybe the worst ocs In the whole league. Pretty crazy for the cfl. 

Marcel Bellfool?  LOL...

[TrueBlue4ever]

4 hours ago, wbbfan said:

Just for fun who was the best oc in that time and were they in the top tier league wide? Have we been sad to see any oc go idk maybe worman. 

I think in that time we've had some of the best dcs but maybe the worst ocs In the whole league. Pretty crazy for the cfl. 

1991 could not find

1992-96 Mike Kelly (54-36, .600, 5 playoff appearances, 2 Grey Cup appearances, 3 seasons over .500)

1997-98 Joe Paopao (7-29, .194, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500)

1999 Bill Stewart (6-12, .333, 0 playoffs)

2000 could not find  

2001 Rick Worman (14-4, .778, 1 Grey Cup appearance)

2002-03 Paul LaPolice (23-13, .639, 2 playoff appearances, 2 seasons over .500)

2004 Ron Lancaster Jr. (7-11, .389, 0 playoffs)

2005-06 Mike Gibson 14-22, .389, 1 playoff appearance, 0 seasons over .500)

2007-08 Kit Cartwright (18-17-1, .519, 2 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 season over .500)

2009 Mike Kelly named a bunch of “special assistants” but had no OC (Andy Cox was running back coach and “offensive quality control” until he got sick and was replaced by Manny Matsakis, Richard Vinklarek was o-line coach and “running game co-ordinator” 7-11, .389, no playoffs)

2010-11 Jamie Barresi (14-22, .389, 1 playoff appearance, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 season over .500

2012-13 Gary Crowton (7-18, .280, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500) 

2013-15 Marcel Bellefeuille (14-33, .298, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500)

2016-19 Paul LaPolice (44-28, .611, 4 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 Grey Cup win, 4 seasons over .500)

Kelly’s totals: 6 seasons, 61-47, .565, 5 playoff appearances, 2 Grey Cup appearances, 3 seasons over .500

LaPolice’s totals: 6 seasons, 67-41, .620, 6 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 Grey Cup win, 6 seasons over .500)

Edited October 27, 2021 by TrueBlue4ever

[bb1]

6 minutes ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

1991 could not find

1992-96 Mike Kelly

1997-98 Joe Paopao

1999 Bill Stewart

2000 could not find  

2001 Rick Worman

2002-03 Paul LaPolice 

2004 Ron Lancaster Jr. 

2005-06 Mike Gibson

2006 Mike Working (passing game co-ordinator, QB coach)

2007-08 Kit Cartwright

2009 Mike Kelly named a bunch of “special assistants” but had no OC (Andy Cox was running back coach and “offensive quality control” until he got sick and was replaced by Manny Matsakis, Richard Vinklarek was o-line coach and “running game co-ordinator”

2010-11 Jamie Barresi

2012-13 Gary Crowton

2013-15 Marcel Bellefeuille

2016-19 Paul LaPolice

How in the hell did we ever win any games??? 😅😅

[Pete Catan's Ghost]

Gary Crowton - The greatest coach that never was. (Tons of accolades as an OC but knew **** about the Canadian game)

[SpeedFlex27]

11 hours ago, Albertabomberguy said:

https://3downnation.com/2021/10/26/toronto-argos-trade-quarterback-nick-arbuckle-to-edmonton-elks/

A third round pick? That, makes no sense if you're an Argos fan. I know a few longterm Argo fans on social media that aren't happy.

[Tracker]

12 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

A third round pick? That, makes no sense if you're an Argos fan. I know a few long term Argo fans on social media that aren't happy.

A third round pick=functionally nothing. If there is a clause upgrading the pick depending on performance, then, not so bad.

[Doublezero]

23 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

A third round pick? That, makes no sense if you're an Argos fan. I know a few longterm Argo fans on social media that aren't happy.

You don't even have to be an Argo fan to see who got hosed on this deal. Not sure what's up with Arbuckle though. Both Ottawa and Toronto have moved him. Can't be that he's making too much - $9k per game left on his salary for this season.

Edited October 27, 2021 by Doublezero

[WinnipegGordo]

5 minutes ago, Tracker said:

A third round pick=functionally nothing. If there is a clause upgrading the pick depending on performance, then, not so bad.

Maybe this is part 2 of the Ricky Ray trade.

The pick becomes a second if the Elks re-sign Arbuckle. The Argos also get the neg rights to QB Chad Kelly.

[TrueBlue4ever]

2 hours ago, bb1 said:

How in the hell did we ever win any games??? 😅😅

As OC’s go, 1991 mystery coach, Kelly, Worman, Cartwright and LaPo were the only ones with a  +.500 record. ‘91 guy, Worman, Cartwright, and LaPo only ones who never missed the playoffs. ‘91 guy, Worman and LaPo only ones who were over .500 every year. LPo only one with Grey Cup ring. Kelly and LaPo the only ones who were around more than 2 years to amass those totals.

6 years, 6 seasons better than .500, 6 trips to the playoffs, 1 Grey Cup win. Explain to me again how he didn’t win much? Or it was all on factors other than him, right? None of the credit, all of the blame. 

 

Edited October 27, 2021 by TrueBlue4ever

[JuranBoldenRules]

Don't really understand the Arbuckle trade for the Argos.  Only way it makes sense to me is to save cap space but given the signing bonus don't even see much there.  To me they've given up on this season even though they are contenders.  MBT isn't taking them anywhere and they are also one hit away from Pipkin.

[SpeedFlex27]

1 minute ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

Don't really understand the Arbuckle trade for the Argos.  Only way it makes sense to me is to save cap space but given the signing bonus don't even see much there.  To me they've given up on this season even though they are contenders.  MBT isn't taking them anywhere and they are also one hit away from Pipkin.

One angry Argo fan in social media was wondering what MBT we'd see now? Dr Jekyll & Mr Hyde?? This is a prime example why players like Arbuckle should never assume that coaches they previously played for will have their backs on another team. He probably feels that Dinwiddie stabbed him in the back.

[17to85]

I love how we are now pretending that it wasn't the lapolice offense when he was the head coach here... in 02 he stepped into a good team,  remember that in 01 khari was MOP MOP the team won 14 games. Under lapo they won less each consecutive year. 

And when he was head coach he had one stretch of winning, when swaggerville was doing it all. 

Then the third time he was here he jumped in to a team already on the rise. The long term work walters and oshea put in was starting to pay off. 

 

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

Not sure why people fall all over themselves to defend the guy. He has never developed a qb or taken them to new heights, in fact just the opposite, he tends to make them worse the longer they play for him... 

 

Give me Buck Pierce any day of the week.

[SpeedFlex27]

3 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I love how we are now pretending that it wasn't the lapolice offense when he was the head coach here... in 02 he stepped into a good team,  remember that in 01 khari was MOP MOP the team won 14 games. Under lapo they won less each consecutive year. 

And when he was head coach he had one stretch of winning, when swaggerville was doing it all. 

Then the third time he was here he jumped in to a team already on the rise. The long term work walters and oshea put in was starting to pay off. 

 

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

Not sure why people fall all over themselves to defend the guy. He has never developed a qb or taken them to new heights, in fact just the opposite, he tends to make them worse the longer they play for him... 

 

Give me Buck Pierce any day of the week.

Yes. GREAT post!!

[Brandon]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

I love how we are now pretending that it wasn't the lapolice offense when he was the head coach here... in 02 he stepped into a good team,  remember that in 01 khari was MOP MOP the team won 14 games. Under lapo they won less each consecutive year. 

And when he was head coach he had one stretch of winning, when swaggerville was doing it all. 

Then the third time he was here he jumped in to a team already on the rise. The long term work walters and oshea put in was starting to pay off. 

 

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

Not sure why people fall all over themselves to defend the guy. He has never developed a qb or taken them to new heights, in fact just the opposite, he tends to make them worse the longer they play for him... 

 

Give me Buck Pierce any day of the week.

Buck Pierce is doing a better job IMO at play calls then LaPo.

That being said he's coaching a team full of all stars while LaPolice is  coaching a team of left overs.  Not an apples to apples comparison.  

Had Buck Pierce left Winnipeg to run the Ottawa offense with that talent... he more then likely would of also been fired by the end of the year.  Not even the greatest of coaches could win with Matt Nichols and that group of cast offs.  

Had LaPolice stayed in Winnipeg he would have much more success then what he currently is experiencing (remind me the win/loss record of LaPo coaching Collaros and which games they won in 2019).  

TLDR -  Buck Pierce is much better,  LaPo dug his own grave by hitching his wagon to D level players in Ottawa,   we can all agree that Nichols sucks and shouldn't of even been playing in 2019 or 2021,  thank god we have moved on and have a real QB and are not running some weird offense.  

[rebusrankin]

Do Lawler, Bailey and Demski all make the jumps that they have made tg=his year under Lapo? I say No.

[TrueBlue4ever]

3 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Yes. GREAT post!!

No it’s not. It’s filled with unsubstantiated speculation, misleading information, and flat out inaccuracies. At least it’s an attempt to create an argument using “facts” rather than the ridiculous “he’s arrogant, as proven by his arrogance” comment, but when the facts you use to bolster your credibility are factually incorrect, it kind of shoots holes in your overall argument. And if you need to make stuff up in an attempt to rip someone, then that deserves defending, in my mind. 

[SpeedFlex27]

58 minutes ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

No it’s not. It’s filled with unsubstantiated speculation, misleading information, and flat out inaccuracies. At least it’s an attempt to create an argument using “facts” rather than the ridiculous “he’s arrogant, as proven by his arrogance” comment, but when the facts you use to bolster your credibility are factually incorrect, it kind of shoots holes in your overall argument. And if you need to make stuff up in an attempt to rip someone, then that deserves defending, in my mind. 

Edited October 27, 2021 by SpeedFlex27

[TrueBlue4ever]

8 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Clever. 

[blue_gold_84]

Me watching this thread unravel, just glad Pierce's tenure as OC is going so well and the team is 10-1 with first place locked up.

 

[M.O.A.B.]

11 hours ago, rebusrankin said:

Do Lawler, Bailey and Demski all make the jumps that they have made tg=his year under Lapo? I say No.

Agree. 

If you watched one of Bailey's interview when he was asked regarding Buck's offense, you kinda sense that he is more happy with this.
I guess maybe because Buck's offense feature more downfield strikes compared to Lapo's. 

[wbbfan]

16 hours ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

1991 could not find

1992-96 Mike Kelly (54-36, .600, 5 playoff appearances, 2 Grey Cup appearances, 3 seasons over .500)

1997-98 Joe Paopao (7-29, .194, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500)

1999 Bill Stewart (6-12, .333, 0 playoffs)

2000 could not find  

2001 Rick Worman (14-4, .778, 1 Grey Cup appearance)

2002-03 Paul LaPolice (23-13, .639, 2 playoff appearances, 2 seasons over .500)

2004 Ron Lancaster Jr. (7-11, .389, 0 playoffs)

2005-06 Mike Gibson 14-22, .389, 1 playoff appearance, 0 seasons over .500)

2007-08 Kit Cartwright (18-17-1, .519, 2 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 season over .500)

2009 Mike Kelly named a bunch of “special assistants” but had no OC (Andy Cox was running back coach and “offensive quality control” until he got sick and was replaced by Manny Matsakis, Richard Vinklarek was o-line coach and “running game co-ordinator” 7-11, .389, no playoffs)

2010-11 Jamie Barresi (14-22, .389, 1 playoff appearance, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 season over .500

2012-13 Gary Crowton (7-18, .280, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500) 

2013-15 Marcel Bellefeuille (14-33, .298, 0 playoffs, 0 seasons over .500)

2016-19 Paul LaPolice (44-28, .611, 4 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 Grey Cup win, 4 seasons over .500)

Kelly’s totals: 6 seasons, 61-47, .565, 5 playoff appearances, 2 Grey Cup appearances, 3 seasons over .500

LaPolice’s totals: 6 seasons, 67-41, .620, 6 playoff appearances, 1 Grey Cup appearance, 1 Grey Cup win, 6 seasons over .500)

2000 for sure and I think 91 too was oc by committee. Seriously. Pretty awful move. I believe worman was involved in the play book in 2000 too. Not sure though. 

16 hours ago, bb1 said:

How in the hell did we ever win any games??? 😅😅

Right. Most of those years we didn't have a qb coach either. Just craziness. 

13 hours ago, 17to85 said:

I love how we are now pretending that it wasn't the lapolice offense when he was the head coach here... in 02 he stepped into a good team,  remember that in 01 khari was MOP MOP the team won 14 games. Under lapo they won less each consecutive year. 

And when he was head coach he had one stretch of winning, when swaggerville was doing it all. 

Then the third time he was here he jumped in to a team already on the rise. The long term work walters and oshea put in was starting to pay off. 

 

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

Not sure why people fall all over themselves to defend the guy. He has never developed a qb or taken them to new heights, in fact just the opposite, he tends to make them worse the longer they play for him... 

 

Give me Buck Pierce any day of the week.

In plops first year here they kept the worman playbook its pretty well known. Khari was familiar with it and plop tweaked it. Namely with more screen opportunities to the backs. And I have to say as a member of the not plop fan base calling plays from some one else's playbook is crazy hard and un natural. 

12 hours ago, Brandon said:

Buck Pierce is doing a better job IMO at play calls then LaPo.

That being said he's coaching a team full of all stars while LaPolice is  coaching a team of left overs.  Not an apples to apples comparison.  

Had Buck Pierce left Winnipeg to run the Ottawa offense with that talent... he more then likely would of also been fired by the end of the year.  Not even the greatest of coaches could win with Matt Nichols and that group of cast offs.  

Had LaPolice stayed in Winnipeg he would have much more success then what he currently is experiencing (remind me the win/loss record of LaPo coaching Collaros and which games they won in 2019).  

TLDR -  Buck Pierce is much better,  LaPo dug his own grave by hitching his wagon to D level players in Ottawa,   we can all agree that Nichols sucks and shouldn't of even been playing in 2019 or 2021,  thank god we have moved on and have a real QB and are not running some weird offense.  

Buck has shown tremendous ability to predict and adapt to defensive tendencies. He's shown some flashes of great creativity too. I'm very optimistic for how good an oc he can become. Right now we don't miss any oc from the past 30 years. 

14 hours ago, Pete Catan's Ghost said:

Gary Crowton - The greatest coach that never was. (Tons of accolades as an OC but knew **** about the Canadian game)

Yeah. I mean that offense didn't have many pieces and he was under a control freak but the adjustment to the cfl game is hard especially for established ocs. I think you have to bring them in slow not just drop them into the mix right away. 

[HardCoreBlue]

13 hours ago, 17to85 said:

I love how we are now pretending that it wasn't the lapolice offense when he was the head coach here... in 02 he stepped into a good team,  remember that in 01 khari was MOP MOP the team won 14 games. Under lapo they won less each consecutive year. 

And when he was head coach he had one stretch of winning, when swaggerville was doing it all. 

Then the third time he was here he jumped in to a team already on the rise. The long term work walters and oshea put in was starting to pay off. 

 

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

Not sure why people fall all over themselves to defend the guy. He has never developed a qb or taken them to new heights, in fact just the opposite, he tends to make them worse the longer they play for him... 

 

Give me Buck Pierce any day of the week.

I look forward to having him back on TSN breaking down plays.

[bearpants]

15 hours ago, 17to85 said:

Can anyone honestly say that they think this team would be as good if we still had lapo here? Would collaros be having the season he is? Would Lawler? Or Bailey?

 

I think the team would probably still be as good, record wise... that D isn't changing no matter who the OC is... But I agree that Collaros, Lawler and Bailer likely would not be playing as well... 

[17to85]

19 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I think the team would probably still be as good, record wise... that D isn't changing no matter who the OC is... But I agree that Collaros, Lawler and Bailer likely would not be playing as well... 

Ok the D would be good yes, but we would be back to the lapo relying on field goals offense and considering our kicking situation....

[GCn20]

15 hours ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

Don't really understand the Arbuckle trade for the Argos.  Only way it makes sense to me is to save cap space but given the signing bonus don't even see much there.  To me they've given up on this season even though they are contenders.  MBT isn't taking them anywhere and they are also one hit away from Pipkin.

My guess is it was to settle a division in the locker room. Poorly speculation though.

23 hours ago, Eternal optimist said:

I wish all the best to the man who's unit was at the root cause of the infamous "too many men" penalty that cost the 'Riders the 2009 Grey Cup. (He was their Special Teams coordinator at that time)

Kavis Reed was the ST coordinator for the RIders in '09