2021 (??) CFL Season

[Bigblue204]

15 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

No you obviously don't. You know what? I don't care about your spin and I waited as long as you to see the Bombers win a GC again. Last time they won the GC, I was in the stands and on the field afterwards. I don't care how Hamilton acted in your mind or that we shut them up. I do care that we won and that it was a great performance. 

He was a good starter. He ran up a bunch of passing records and had one of the best arms I've ever seen. He's in the hall of fame for a reason but, we never won a GC with him. We traded for Clements who took Brock's team to the promised land by beating Brock and the Ticats. The big game losses are the difference between good and great IMO. I'll take Clements over Brock every game day.

 

To be fair, I looked up the stats:

Evans, Signed 2017, Started 3 games in 2018, took over in week 7 2019, lost the GC.

Harris, Signed with Jacksonville, Arizona, Hartford, Buffalo, Orlando in 2011 and Toronto in 2012, Played in 2 games in 2012, played in 1 game in 2013, Started 1 game in 2014, Started the 2015 season due to Ricky Ray's injury, replaced by Ray for the end of the season and the playoffs, 2016 became Ottawa's starting QB.

BLM, signed in 2012, first start and break out year in 2013. He played in 5 games and got 3 starts. He's the best example of a young QB becoming a good starter in his 2nd pro season and he got it because both Drew Tate and Kevin Glenn were injured, not because he was the #2 guy.

McGuire, Signed with the Bomber in 2019, got 6 plays in one game after the Bombers lost both Nichols and Streveler. Bomber fans expect him to be the next BLM.

 

Quote one example of someone saying anything remotely close to this.

[TBURGESS]

1 hour ago, Bigblue204 said:

Quote one example of someone saying anything remotely close to this.

BLM is the 1 and only example that anyone's given of a QB with McGuire's experience level having a break out year. Everyone who thinks that we'll be fine with McGuire at QB if Collaros goes down is saying it. Everyone who expecting the best case scenario is saying it too. Even comparing McGuire to Streveler, who wasn't ready IMO to take us to the GC last year with considerably more experience than McGuire is hoping for the best despite our history.

[TrueBlue4ever]

10 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

BLM is the 1 and only example that anyone's given of a QB with McGuire's experience level having a break out year. Everyone who thinks that we'll be fine with McGuire at QB if Collaros goes down is saying it. Everyone who expecting the best case scenario is saying it too. Even comparing McGuire to Streveler, who wasn't ready IMO to take us to the GC last year with considerably more experience than McGuire is hoping for the best despite our history.

That’s not anything remotely resembling a quote. That’s Donald Trump-speak declaring as proof that  “people out there are saying......”

But let’s inject another opinion into this. Here’s Ed Tait’s write-up on McGuire and the situation he comes into. And also some QB comparables who AREN’T Bo Levi who came in the positive early reviews. 
 

https://www.bluebombers.com/2020/05/23/column-story-sean-mcguire/

[Bigblue204]

1 hour ago, TBURGESS said:

BLM is the 1 and only example that anyone's given of a QB with McGuire's experience level having a break out year. Everyone who thinks that we'll be fine with McGuire at QB if Collaros goes down is saying it. Everyone who expecting the best case scenario is saying it too. Even comparing McGuire to Streveler, who wasn't ready IMO to take us to the GC last year with considerably more experience than McGuire is hoping for the best despite our history.

So you can't find any posters saying McGuire is the next BLM?

[SpeedFlex27]

1 hour ago, TBURGESS said:

BLM is the 1 and only example that anyone's given of a QB with McGuire's experience level having a break out year. Everyone who thinks that we'll be fine with McGuire at QB if Collaros goes down is saying it. Everyone who expecting the best case scenario is saying it too. Even comparing McGuire to Streveler, who wasn't ready IMO to take us to the GC last year with considerably more experience than McGuire is hoping for the best despite our history.

[Doublezero]

On 2021-06-19 at 12:57 AM, SpeedFlex27 said:

Dane Evans says hello.

Hoping McGuire can learn well under Collaros and succeed. Snagged one of McGuire's game-worn jerseys from the Grey Cup year just in case. (It was very clean, BTW)

 

 

[SpeedFlex27]

5 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

Of course the best possible outcome is rarely the probable outcome. In other news the sky is blue. Why worry that our backup QB has little to no CFL experience? Because we are likely going to need him to win games for us this year. It's very telling that you look at the probable outcome and call it negative. It means you know I'm right, but you don't want to admit it.

Speedy... Tell you what. I'll give you that Brock was a great QB who never found a way to win the big game so we can stop arguing about things that happened 40 years ago and don't have any meaning anymore. Better? How 'bout we talk about the rookie kicker being given the job, the DB situation, the backup QB and the loss of PLAP. At least that's relevant.

You're the one who can't stop talking about our lack of developing qbs going back 50 years. You're pushing the discussion agenda here  & not anyone else. It got old fast but yet here you are still talking about it 18 months after our Grey Cup win.  The other positions? All doom & gloom. As I said, it gets old fast. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

13 minutes ago, Doublezero said:

Hoping McGuire can learn well under Collaros and succeed. Snagged one of McGuire's game-worn jerseys from the Grey Cup year just in case. (It was very clean, BTW)

 

 

McGuire was actually directly involved in more scoring plays than either Collaros or Streveler. Zach is responsible for 6 points with his handoff to Harris, Strev for 6 for his pass to Harris, and McGuire for 21 as the holder for Medlock on the field goals and converts. 

[Doublezero]

51 minutes ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

McGuire was actually directly involved in more scoring plays than either Collaros or Streveler. Zach is responsible for 6 points with his handoff to Harris, Strev for 6 for his pass to Harris, and McGuire for 21 as the holder for Medlock on the field goals and converts. 

Indeed this is true. And I loved the lights-out hits McGuire delivered in 2019 on more than one defender on FG kick protection. It'll be interesting to see how the QBs develop as a group under a new Co-ordinator and how buck's offence differs from Lapo. You have to think it will still feature Harris but who knows? Buck has had lots of time to think about it.

[rebusrankin]

Building on Tait's article but isn't it possible that McGuire has the level of success we saw from the relatively untested Evans, Fajardo, Arbuckle in 2019? Going back further Ricky Ray, Khari Jones, Printers all had success despite limited reps before coming starters. As Kevin Garnett said, "Anything is possible."

[17to85]

7 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

Of course the best possible outcome is rarely the probable outcome. In other news the sky is blue. Why worry that our backup QB has little to no CFL experience? Because we are likely going to need him to win games for us this year. It's very telling that you look at the probable outcome and call it negative. It means you know I'm right, but you don't want to admit it.

Speedy... Tell you what. I'll give you that Brock was a great QB who never found a way to win the big game so we can stop arguing about things that happened 40 years ago and don't have any meaning anymore. Better? How 'bout we talk about the rookie kicker being given the job, the DB situation, the backup QB and the loss of PLAP. At least that's relevant.

If he doesn't work out we parachute in someone. Like we did with collaros in 2019. You worry too much. Kyle walters is anything but inactive.

[TBURGESS]

3 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

You're the one who can't stop talking about our lack of developing qbs going back 50 years. You're pushing the discussion agenda here  & not anyone else. It got old fast but yet here you are still talking about it 18 months after our Grey Cup win.  The other positions? All doom & gloom. As I said, it gets old fast. 

Just ignore me then. I'm wired to look at the most likely outcomes. You're wired to look at the best possible outcomes and to think that any other outcome is negative gloom and doom. It's not, but I'll never convince you so I'll just leave it here. I can't stop the internet cuz you're feelings are getting hurt and I'm not about to change the way I think. Your choices are to ignore it or whine about it. I'm guessing the whining will continue as it has for the last decade or so.

5 hours ago, TrueBlue4ever said:

That’s not anything remotely resembling a quote. That’s Donald Trump-speak declaring as proof that  “people out there are saying......”

But let’s inject another opinion into this. Here’s Ed Tait’s write-up on McGuire and the situation he comes into. And also some QB comparables who AREN’T Bo Levi who came in the positive early reviews. 
 

https://www.bluebombers.com/2020/05/23/column-story-sean-mcguire/

You realize that Tait writes uber positive articles for the Bombers, right? I read the article. McGuire seems like a nice kid. It's worth noting that Fajardo had 3 years of experience before he got the call. Arbuckle isn't Ottawa's starting QB, Nichols is. Arbuckle will be fighting it out with MBT for the Argos starting QB spot. I'd rather have Arbuckle than McGuire because I've seen more of him and he's done pretty well.

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

If he doesn't work out we parachute in someone. Like we did with collaros in 2019. You worry too much. Kyle walters is anything but inactive.

Like who? (Munching on popcorn)

If there's a vet QB out there worth bringing in, then bring him in to TC and let him compete against McGuire. That way he has the offence down and he will be ready to go sooner if we have to bring him back later. Heck, we could put him on the IR just to keep him around.

You don't worry enough.

[blue_gold_84]

20 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

You don't worry enough.

Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do but doesn't accomplish a damned thing.

You must have one hell of a worn out rocking chair.

[17to85]

1 hour ago, TBURGESS said:

Like who? (Munching on popcorn)

If there's a vet QB out there worth bringing in, then bring him in to TC and let him compete against McGuire. That way he has the offence down and he will be ready to go sooner if we have to bring him back later. Heck, we could put him on the IR just to keep him around.

You don't worry enough.

Like whoever shakes out. I mean at this point before 2019 no one thought collaros would be available. There's always some option if things don't work out. Maybe McGuire is capable. Maybe streveler comes back, maybe some other team has a change at qb and someone is available. He'll Maybe collaros lasts the whole year. He does have a strong OL... you worry too much. 

[SpeedFlex27]

Reaction to every TBurg post about the Bombers here...

 

 

 

Edited June 21, 2021 by SpeedFlex27

[TBURGESS]

7 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Reaction to every TBurg post about the Bombers here...

 

 

 

That's not the flex you think it is. Lots of folks around here think that their opinion and conjecture is worth more than facts so they try to 'shout' me down.

12 hours ago, 17to85 said:

Like whoever shakes out. I mean at this point before 2019 no one thought collaros would be available. There's always some option if things don't work out. Maybe McGuire is capable. Maybe streveler comes back, maybe some other team has a change at qb and someone is available. He'll Maybe collaros lasts the whole year. He does have a strong OL... you worry too much. 

Do I have this right? You're idea is to wait until we need a QB right away before we look for one? Take whoever is available at that moment? You don't think it's a good idea to bring one to camp to compete? Where's the downside to competition? Where's the downside to knowing our offence? If we keep him on the IR, he can be in all the meetings. and be ready to play the day we need him. If Streveler comes back, great, cut the other vet QB.

You're a fly by the seat of your pants, non-planner guy. I'm a plan for the worst and hope for the best guy. If it turns out that Collaros lasts the whole season, then we've burned some non-sms cash. If it turns out we need another QB, then having one around from day one is huge. Think of it as insurance if you like.

[M.O.A.B.]

There's no available free-agent vet QB at the moment. 

Or maybe TBurg is rooting for Jonathon Jennings? 😁

 

Edited June 21, 2021 by M.O.A.B.

[Bigblue204]

45 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

That's not the flex you think it is. Lots of folks around here think that their opinion and conjecture is worth more than facts so they try to 'shout' me down.

Do I have this right? You're idea is to wait until we need a QB right away before we look for one? Take whoever is available at that moment? You don't think it's a good idea to bring one to camp to compete? Where's the downside to competition? Where's the downside to knowing our offence? If we keep him on the IR, he can be in all the meetings. and be ready to play the day we need him. If Streveler comes back, great, cut the other vet QB.

You're a fly by the seat of your pants, non-planner guy. I'm a plan for the worst and hope for the best guy. If it turns out that Collaros lasts the whole season, then we've burned some non-sms cash. If it turns out we need another QB, then having one around from day one is huge. Think of it as insurance if you like.

I totally agree with this. But at the end of the day, I'm gonna trust the management that just brought this team to a championship. And...camp doesn't start today...there is still time for competition to be brought in. On top of that, let's not forget that Streveler was in the system for less time than McGuire when he got his opportunity (injury forced) AND has been the only CFL qb to start in the NFL in recent years. So while overall the teams track record on finding qbs hasn't been great, within the last year or two it's been pretty solid.

13 minutes ago, M.O.A.B. said:

There's no available free-agent vet QB at the moment. 

Or maybe TBurg is rooting for Jonathon Jennings? 😁

 

Bombers sign Jennings.....Tburg "they're just bringing in bodies for the sake of having bodies, this is a waste of signing bonus money that could have been used on a younger player that actually has some potential!"

[TBURGESS]

39 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Bombers sign Jennings.....Tburg "they're just bringing in bodies for the sake of having bodies, this is a waste of signing bonus money that could have been used on a younger player that actually has some potential!"

Seriously, I'd take Jennings as a Vet backup prospect. He looked pretty good as a throw deep first QB. He looked pretty bad when he was told to cut down on the mistakes and read the defence. You gotta let Jennings Jenning if you want to use his potential. I don't expect a good to great backup vet QB. Anyone we would hire would have baggage otherwise they'd be a starting QB.

[JimmyFartball]

Pass on Jennings because he can't pass ...

[bearpants]

On 2021-06-20 at 9:37 AM, TBURGESS said:

How 'bout we talk about the rookie kicker being given the job, the DB situation, the backup QB and the loss of PLAP. At least that's relevant.

I think you're just assuming that he is "being given the job"... we're still a month away from camp and could easily have another kicker or two by then...

[TBURGESS]

30 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I think you're just assuming that he is "being given the job"... we're still a month away from camp and could easily have another kicker or two by then...

I'm assuming based on MOS's comments. I seriously hope they bring in another kicker or two.

[17to85]

1 hour ago, TBURGESS said:

Seriously, I'd take Jennings as a Vet backup prospect. He looked pretty good as a throw deep first QB. He looked pretty bad when he was told to cut down on the mistakes and read the defence. You gotta let Jennings Jenning if you want to use his potential. I don't expect a good to great backup vet QB. Anyone we would hire would have baggage otherwise they'd be a starting QB.

So you'd rather a guy who has shown his flaws and been found lacking rather than hope a young guy can step in and play? If we had to get to Jennings we'd be hooped anyway so what's the difference? Sometimes you have to take a chance on a new guy rather than try a retread. Retreads are for when the new guy fails.

[Bigblue204]

31 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So you'd rather a guy who has shown his flaws and been found lacking rather than hope a young guy can step in and play? If we had to get to Jennings we'd be hooped anyway so what's the difference? Sometimes you have to take a chance on a new guy rather than try a retread. Retreads are for when the new guy fails.

While I do agree with you. To be fair, with Jennings you at least know what you're getting into. You have an idea of what he does well and where he struggles. And hopefully you're able to draw up a game plan that fits his skills. Saying all that I like going with the unproven/unknown guys until they show they can't take the heat.

[M.O.A.B.]

1 hour ago, bearpants said:

I think you're just assuming that he is "being given the job"... we're still a month away from camp and could easily have another kicker or two by then...

Really thought the Bombers brought in UofM kicker/punter Matt Riley last year, but his name is not on the roster anymore. 

Edited June 21, 2021 by M.O.A.B.