CFL/XFL Exploring Alignment

[JCon]

15 hours ago, 17to85 said:

[Bigblue204]

16 hours ago, Brandon said:

What has he done or what headlines or initiatives outside of trying to expand to Moncton has he done in regards with Canadian investors.  I guess the bumbling of the Alouettes and screwing that up as well would be a 2nd failed thing he's attempted.  

And how has he done compared to guys before,  the only headlines he's made is trying to extend to Mexico, Europe and now the States with zero success.   He's been by far the biggest failure in the last 30 years of all the different CFL commissioners.  It's unfortunate that during the largest crisis that the CFL was stuck with the worst leader they have had.  

As I said before... it's sad that a rinky dink league with teams like the Goldeyes can get their **** in order while Ambrosie is praying and hoping that they can sell the league to Americans for a quick buck.    His arrogance and lazyness completely torpedoed any chance of help from the feds and now he's in desperation mode.   

Every business I've been apart of 100% make media releases on deals that don't go through. They really like the idea of the public knowing that they're in financial hell and still can't get outside investors. Optically it's amazing for every aspect of the business!

[TBURGESS]

8 hours ago, Brandon said:

The Feds EASILY can give the money. 

Can and will are two completely different things.

[GCn20]

Just because the XFL has a billion dollar hedge fund behind it doesn't mean they have unlimited capital. I guarantee that they have a dollar figure amount they are willing to lose and it isn't anywhere close to what some people here think it is. The XFL has no franchises per se, and will have a very limited rope on losses before their backers pull out. Just like XFL 1.0, AAF, XFL 2.0. the USFL and all the other defunct leagues littered amongst the football landscape. It's a business and anyone thinking the XFL is going to give us the 60 million dollars to operate based on some good will is dreaming in technicolor. They are talking to us because they NEED us, they NEED our viability and history as a league to differentiate themselves from every other failure league that came before. SMH, at those that think the XFL will save us. Good lord....it's the other way around and we will charge them a hefty fee for doing so and we hold all the leverage.

Edited March 18, 2021 by GCn20

[Bigblue204]

I know the NFL does this with Amazon Prime streaming their Thursday night games live....would be interesting if the CFL could swing deal like that with another platform. I know TSN would likely have issues...but if it's not on cable tv I wonder if there is a way to get it done. I'm assuming TSN likely has broadcasting rights...but I wonder if that also includes streaming.

[Noeller]

 

Edited March 18, 2021 by Noeller

[SpeedFlex27]

Our TV deal with TSN didn't cover the cost of running a team only a percentage like 60%. That's why the CFL is in this mess. You don't compete. You don't get paid. The old saying goes. Or You can't win it if you're not in it.

The CFL would rather have their product on a cable sports channel in Canada to a limited audience where not everyone subscribes than on a major Canadian network available to everyone. The loss of potential audience means loss of potential ad revenues which means a smaller TV deal, That is one part of the the broken business model the CFL  lives by. 

Maybe it wouldn't matter if all the games were televised on a major network or not. Maybe the money TSN pays is all that is available to the CFL. But until they actually do it, we'll never know. 

Another old saying. You never know until you try. 

Edited March 18, 2021 by SpeedFlex27

[JCon]

4 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Our TV deal with TSN didn't cover the cost of running a team only a percentage like 60%. That's why the CFL is in this mess. You don't compete. You don't get paid. The old saying goes. Or You can't win it if you're not in it.

The CFL would rather have their product on a cable sports channel in Canada to a limited audience where not everyone subscribes than on a major Canadian network available to everyone. The loss of potential audience means loss of potential ad revenues which means a smaller TV deal, That is one part of the the broken business model the CFL  lives by. 

Maybe it wouldn't matter if all the games were televised on a major network or not. Maybe the money TSN pays is all that is available to the CFL. But until they actually do it, we'll never know. 

Another old saying. You never know until you try. 

I get your point but most hockey is shown on SportsNet or TSN, with some CBC coverage. I don't think TSN having the rights is that big of deal but it would be nice if they showed one game a week, plus playoffs, on CTV. 

[SpeedFlex27]

27 minutes ago, JCon said:

I get your point but most hockey is shown on SportsNet or TSN, with some CBC coverage. I don't think TSN having the rights is that big of deal but it would be nice if they showed one game a week, plus playoffs, on CTV. 

Again, it comes down to using a sports cable channel that has limited viewers or a network broadcaster. CBC used to be a CFL partner & probably would be the best to be associated with again as CTV has the NFL. However, doesn't this show just how limited the revenue streams for the CFL in Canada truly are?

Edited March 18, 2021 by SpeedFlex27

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, Noeller said:

 

The XFL v2.0 got 0 dollars for its tv deal with ESPN and FOX.  IDK how any one thinks they are gonna help get us significantly more TV dollars from the US networks than what we get already from TSN.

https://blog.jipel.law.nyu.edu/2020/04/the-xfl-tv-rights-deal-are-the-terms-favorable/#:~:text=On May 6th%2C 2019,right to air their games.

[SpeedFlex27]

3 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

The XFL v2.0 got 0 dollars for its tv deal with ESPN and FOX.  IDK how any one thinks they are gonna help get us significantly more TV dollars from the US networks than what we get already from TSN.

https://blog.jipel.law.nyu.edu/2020/04/the-xfl-tv-rights-deal-are-the-terms-favorable/#:~:text=On May 6th%2C 2019,right to air their games.

Different owners & different people negotiating. Media savvy people as Redbird has shown itself to be. The XFL 2.0 was Vince's baby & he stroked his ego getting it off the ground twice while spending a ton of his & WWE's money. I have a feeling a different kind of tv deal would be negotiated where the league did get paid. Just don't know how much they'd get. 

[Brandon]

I'm sure the CFL could get some money (not a lot) from a streaming service down south.   But I'd imagine it would not be anything significant or saving the league type of money.   

[wbbfan]

Just now, SpeedFlex27 said:

Different owners & different people negotiating. Media savvy people as Redbird has shown itself to be. The XFL 2.0 was Vince's baby & he stroked his ego getting it off the ground twice while spending a ton of his & WWE's money. I have a feeling a different kind of tv deal would be negotiated where the league did get paid. Just don't know how much they'd get. 

Does redbird have connections at networks better then the bigmac? Idk but I dont feel like they would. I also really dont see them being willing to lose the kind of money he did in the xfl. They are not the type of company to lose money, and the XFL will not be in a position to make money for a very long time. 

Remember the NHL struggling soo hard to get tv deals in the states? Free broadcast rights to ESPN, and didnt they get dropped from that and have their games in the US on like outdoor network for a while in the us? I dont follow hockey and im not sure i have it right. But the US cares more about hockey than about canadian/3down football. 

[SpeedFlex27]

15 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

Does redbird have connections at networks better then the bigmac? Idk but I dont feel like they would. I also really dont see them being willing to lose the kind of money he did in the xfl. They are not the type of company to lose money, and the XFL will not be in a position to make money for a very long time. 

Remember the NHL struggling soo hard to get tv deals in the states? Free broadcast rights to ESPN, and didnt they get dropped from that and have their games in the US on like outdoor network for a while in the us? I dont follow hockey and im not sure i have it right. But the US cares more about hockey than about canadian/3down football. 

But it won't be 3 down Canadian football.

[Brandon]

30 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

Does redbird have connections at networks better then the bigmac? Idk but I dont feel like they would. I also really dont see them being willing to lose the kind of money he did in the xfl. They are not the type of company to lose money, and the XFL will not be in a position to make money for a very long time. 

Remember the NHL struggling soo hard to get tv deals in the states? Free broadcast rights to ESPN, and didnt they get dropped from that and have their games in the US on like outdoor network for a while in the us? I dont follow hockey and im not sure i have it right. But the US cares more about hockey than about canadian/3down football. 

Do I need to post a link for how many BILLIONS of dollars the WWE is getting on their latest deal with NBC?   I'm pretty sure himself & the company are very savy when it comes to tv deals.  Possibly the best. 

[wbbfan]

Just now, Brandon said:

Do I need to post a link for how many BILLIONS of dollars the WWE is getting on their latest deal with NBC?   I'm pretty sure himself & the company are very savy when it comes to tv deals.  Possibly the best. 

This is what I had assumed. That vince co would have much better network connections than redbird.  But he took a HUGE gamble on the xfl 2.0 tv deal and it wasnt on track to pan out imo. And his track record on risks out side of the wwe is not good. 

8 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

But it won't be 3 down Canadian football.

The cfl would not survive changing to 4 down football. Itd be like being lost a drift at sea and trading your hull for a mast. You go from listing aimlessly to sunk. 

[TrueBlue4ever]

4 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Our TV deal with TSN didn't cover the cost of running a team only a percentage like 60%. That's why the CFL is in this mess. You don't compete. You don't get paid. The old saying goes. Or You can't win it if you're not in it.

The CFL would rather have their product on a cable sports channel in Canada to a limited audience where not everyone subscribes than on a major Canadian network available to everyone. The loss of potential audience means loss of potential ad revenues which means a smaller TV deal, That is one part of the the broken business model the CFL  lives by. 

Maybe it wouldn't matter if all the games were televised on a major network or not. Maybe the money TSN pays is all that is available to the CFL. But until they actually do it, we'll never know. 

Another old saying. You never know until you try. 

The TV rights come nowhere close to covering 60% of team costs. For the 2019 Bombers, it covered 11.8%. 
And I don’t know if it the CFL preferring to be on cable. Bell media owns TSN and CTV, so they could broadcast on network, but TSN needs an anchor tenant to fill broadcast space. CBC is publicly owned, so who can the league get into a rights bidding war with? You are left with Global, CITY TV, or Sportsnet - another cable outlet. As you said, revenue streams in Canada are limited. I recall that when TSN bought the rights they were buying a dead product TV-wise. It took creating Friday Night Football to build interest in the league. 

[Noeller]

This is a worthwhile 9 minutes, but even after having watched this, I still don't know what the right answer is. Enjoy Canadian-based teams playing American football because it's better than nothing, or let the league die an honourable death because everything meaningful would be dead in a merger anyhow.... 

 

[SpeedFlex27]

13 hours ago, Noeller said:

This is a worthwhile 9 minutes, but even after having watched this, I still don't know what the right answer is. Enjoy Canadian-based teams playing American football because it's better than nothing, or let the league die an honourable death because everything meaningful would be dead in a merger anyhow.... 

 

Didn't know Tim Micalief was so passionate about the CFL. Which is good to see. And to work at Sportsnet, sounds like he has had to defend himself quite a bit from all the NFL Proud Boys over there. I don't think his former partner Sid Sexeiro thought much of the CFL.

It just reiterates my thought that the team means more than the league to me. I want my football team in Winnipeg. I want the Bombers to stick around. Not fold & go away forever. I also think a new league with 4 downs will be an easier sell to fans across Canada if their teams still exist. Bring in a new league with different names like the Winnipeg Zippidy Doo Da's or the Saskatchewan Prairie Oysters with zero history & it'll fail. 

Edited March 19, 2021 by SpeedFlex27

[JCon]

3 minutes ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Didn't know Tim Micalief was so passionate about the CFL. Which is good to see. And to work at Sportsnet, sounds like he has had to defend himself quite a bit from all the NFL Proud Boys over there. I don't think his former partner Sid Sexeiro thought much of the CFL.

It just reiterates my thought that the team means more than the league to me. I want my football team in Winnipeg. I want the Bombers to stick around. Not fold & go away forever. I also think a new league with 4 downs will be an easier sell to fans across Canada if their teams still exist. Bring in a new league with different names like the Winnipeg Zippidy Doo Da's or the Saskatchewan Prairie Oysters with zero history & it'll fail. 

He spent a lot of time covering Ontario university football. You don't see him much attached to the CFL because The Score and, subsequently, SportsNet are unware that there is a Canadian Football League, so they never cover it in his shows. 

[SpeedFlex27]

4 minutes ago, JCon said:

He spent a lot of time covering Ontario university football. You don't see him much attached to the CFL because The Score and, subsequently, SportsNet are unware that there is a Canadian Football League, so they never cover it in his shows. 

I never watched Tim & Sid because quite frankly, Sexeiro was a prick. 

[bryan35]

Personally if the CFL goes to 4 downs I'll stop watching. I much prefer the 3 down game. If that stops I'll resort to watching the NFL.

[17to85]

I will fight anyone that claims the CFL rules are inferior. And quite frankly I can't see myself caring anywhere close to as much about a 4 down CFL.

[Mr Dee]

If the XFL wants to be truly unique, they should adopt our rules..all of them..with adaptions for field sizes.
Could they handle it?
The only caveat is that only the CFL teams play for the Grey Cup.
They can play for their own.

Other than that, let’s wrap up the CFL, and give it a proper send away, not part of another failed US attempt at being professional.

Then we simply set up a lower level Canadian game..

[Noeller]

15 minutes ago, Mr Dee said:

Then we simply set up a lower level Canadian game..

Was kinda thinking about this.... if things go sour, here's hoping another league...much smaller......starts at the grass roots.