GDT - Banjo Bowl - Riders @ the Champs

[GCn20]

7 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

That used to be standard fare from head coaches when asked about their opponents. Better to build them up than say something that'll result in press clippings being taped up in the opponent's locker room. Very few head coaches back in the day said anything to rile up the other players. I remember coaches like Bud Grant, Joe Zaleski, Jim Spavial, Bud Riley & Ray Jauch always extolling the virtues of the other team. If you took what they said seriously then you'd say we have no chance. Building up a team is just Old School Football. Things started to change 20 or 30 years ago when coaches & GM's like Don Matthews, Roy Shivers & Leo "The Lip" Cahill came along. They loved a microphone as they always had something to say. 

Building up the other team is one thing, but saying your team had no chance of beating them is another entirely, especially after the fact. I like it when a coach is honest and compliments the opposition but I have never heard one say that his team couldn't have beat the other team. I coached and was coached for a long time in football and if you went into a game thinking you can't win I can guarantee you weren't going to do so. Never did I hear a coach suggest that the other team is too good.

[Booch]

7 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Building up the other team is one thing, but saying your team had no chance of beating them is another entirely, especially after the fact. I like it when a coach is honest and compliments the opposition but I have never heard one say that his team couldn't have beat the other team. I coached and was coached for a long time in football and if you went into a game thinking you can't win I can guarantee you weren't going to do so. Never did I hear a coach suggest that the other team is too good.

Yeah...that was an odd thing to comment about...and as a player to hear my own coach say that would be eyebrow raising...and a bit of a rub the wrong way...saying a team was better than us a particular day is standard fare and usual ..how he paackaged it tho was kind of wtf if you are a player on that squad

[bearpants]

16 hours ago, 17to85 said:

You know who else used to have nothing but praise for the opponents who kicked his teams ass? Jim Daley. I am sure Tim Burke probably had a bunch of those too. It's the hallmark of a coach in over his head.

That's not necessarily true... Bill Belichick always pumps the other team's tires... but @GCn20 explains the difference perfectly above...

[Stickem]

Dickenson playing a little reverse psychology ....sometimes that works.....sometimes it can blow up in your face....I like coaches who are straight up but denigrating your own squad would be bottom of my list ...It might give some players an inferiority/ insecurity complex

Edited September 16, 2021 by Stickem

[GCn20]

2 hours ago, Booch said:

Yeah...that was an odd thing to comment about...and as a player to hear my own coach say that would be eyebrow raising...and a bit of a rub the wrong way...saying a team was better than us a particular day is standard fare and usual ..how he paackaged it tho was kind of wtf if you are a player on that squad

Especially to the media...I can't imagine his players appreciated that too much. Football players are a proud and confident bunch and your coach telling anyone, but particularly the media, that another team outclasses you is not a good thing in any dressing room.

[Pete Catan's Ghost]

On 2021-09-12 at 4:52 PM, M.O.A.B. said:

Lots of outcry on RF re Harris staying in the game. Lol.

Awaiting the outcome of the league's decision today. 

No way a reputable league* would suspend him a full game since the other players (who threw actual punches) missed only a partial game. 

Maybe they will pull him after the 3rd quarter on Saturday to make things right. Ha.

[wbbfan]

8 minutes ago, Pete Catan's Ghost said:

Awaiting the outcome of the league's decision today. 

No way a reputable league* would suspend him a full game since the other players (who threw actual punches) missed only a partial game. 

Maybe they will pull him after the 3rd quarter on Saturday to make things right. Ha.

Its very unlikely we see any suspensions. Though the guys throwing punches should be imo. I love how the riders started that crap, continued it, and some how its harris' fault. 

[JCon]

Just now, wbbfan said:

Its very unlikely we see any suspensions. Though the guys throwing punches should be imo. I love how the riders started that crap, continued it, and some how its harris' fault. 

Riders should be proud someone put up a fight. 

[Pete Catan's Ghost]

Marino out for 6 games. That's a long time for post-brawl, hurt feelings.

[TBURGESS]

I think Harris should have been thrown out of the game, but I don't think he deserves a full game suspension.

[JCon]

Just now, TBURGESS said:

I think Harris should have been thrown out of the game, but I don't think he deserves a full game suspension.

Why should he have been thrown out? 

[GCn20]

2 hours ago, Pete Catan's Ghost said:

Marino out for 6 games. That's a long time for post-brawl, hurt feelings.

There should be a suspension coming Winnipeg's way for his hurt feelers. 

6 minutes ago, JCon said:

Why should he have been thrown out? 

I agree he should have been tossed. Not based on his actions, but because we wouldn't have to listen to Rider fans cry like babies about it now. 

2 hours ago, JCon said:

Riders should be proud someone put up a fight. 

...but did they? 

[TBURGESS]

1 minute ago, JCon said:

Why should he have been thrown out? 

It's already been discussed to death and I don't want to revisit it yet again.

The readers digest version:

You don't need to punch a player to get DQ'd.

Although some folks say that DQ's are black and white rules, the actual penalty says:

Article 2 — Rough Play

A player shall be penalized and subject to disqualification for any act of rough play against an opponent, including but not limited to:

1. striking an opponent with the fist, hand, knee, elbow or helmet in an excessively rough manner,
2. kicking an opponent or,
3. any other act of excessive roughness considered by the Referee to warrant disqualification.

Premeditated.

Not simply grabbing the face mask during the play. Harris spun a player around by the face mask, pulled it off his head during a fight well after the play was way over.

Everyone who saw the play would categorize it as rough play against an opponent. Most, non-bomber fans would call it excessive. Therefore Article 2, point 3 should/could have been exercised.

Maybe the Ref didn't see it, so couldn't DQ Harris, but the command center could see it and chose to ignore it.

If the penalty is about safety like they say it is, then it's a dangerous play. More dangerous than punching a player with a helmet on.

Folks bring up Adams vs Bighill ignore the fact that Adams took a 1 game suspension for the play or justify it by saying that Adams hit Bighill with the helmet. I don't think that's any worse than throwing a guy to the ground by his face mask.

FTR:

Yes, I think the players who were thrown out should have been.

No, I don't think throwing Harris would have made any difference to the outcome of the game, nor do I think is was the worst face mask ever.

 

[JCon]

8 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

It's already been discussed to death and I don't want to revisit it yet again.

It hasn't but whatever. 

 

They haven't been throwing out players recently for pulling a helmet off but now they should. Right....

 

[TBURGESS]

12 minutes ago, JCon said:

It hasn't but whatever.

They haven't been throwing out players recently for pulling a helmet off but now they should. Right....

Pulling a helmet off by the face mask after the play is over, isn't just pulling the helmet off and attacking a player by his face mask after the play is over isn't just an average in the heat of the moment face masking.

I remember a player pulling a helmet off by the face mask and bowling the helmet down the field a few years back and he was ejected. Got a 1 game suspension too, but that was eventually overturned when the players association stepped in.

Asking a Bomber or a Riders fan about the Harris penalty is pretty much useless as you're not going to get an unbiased opinion. The CFL panel thought it should be a penalty. They're unbiased, mostly ex players and coaches who know what they are looking at.

[Jpan85]

The Vernon Adams incident of last year set precedent.

[JCon]

4 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

Pulling a helmet off by the face mask after the play is over, isn't just pulling the helmet off and attacking a player by his face mask after the play is over isn't just an average in the heat of the moment face masking.

I remember a player pulling a helmet off by the face mask and bowling the helmet down the field a few years back and he was ejected. Got a 1 game suspension too, but that was eventually overturned when the players association stepped in.

Asking a Bomber or a Riders fan about the Harris penalty is pretty much useless as you're not going to get an unbiased opinion. The CFL panel thought it should be a penalty. They're unbiased, mostly ex players and coaches who know what they are looking at.

They have not been ejecting players for pulling off the helmet for ages. 

Where was this when any other helmet got pulled off?

I think it's dangerous and should be an ejection but it's so on-brand for you to come out against a Bomber now, rather than any other player. 

[Bigblue204]

7 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

Pulling a helmet off by the face mask after the play is over, isn't just pulling the helmet off and attacking a player by his face mask after the play is over isn't just an average in the heat of the moment face masking.

I remember a player pulling a helmet off by the face mask and bowling the helmet down the field a few years back and he was ejected. Got a 1 game suspension too, but that was eventually overturned when the players association stepped in.

Asking a Bomber or a Riders fan about the Harris penalty is pretty much useless as you're not going to get an unbiased opinion. The CFL panel thought it should be a penalty. They're unbiased, mostly ex players and coaches who know what they are looking at.

That's because throwing an opponents helmet is something you get ejected for.

 It was a penalty. The panel was not in agreement about whether he should have been booted though.

3 minutes ago, JCon said:

Where was this when any other helmet got pulled off?

I believe it was in Edmonton....I want to say BC vs EDM but I could be wrong.

[Jpan85]

Joel Figueroa?

[wbbfan]

52 minutes ago, JCon said:

They have not been ejecting players for pulling off the helmet for ages. 

Where was this when any other helmet got pulled off?

I think it's dangerous and should be an ejection but it's so on-brand for you to come out against a Bomber now, rather than any other player. 

You cant. Guys helmets are held on by little more than hopes and prayers these days. Aka nothing. Atleast 1 pops off on virtually every single play. Half the face masks in the league could be turned into ejections if the person being grabbed is smart about it. 

IF any thing, we should see a crack down on shoving after the play. Thats an epidemic in todays game, and thats what leads to the worse stuff. No more skip the first and call the retaliation. 1 shove 1 instant 15 yard penalty. That crap will end fast. And soo will the majority of the post play shenanigan's. 

[camper_2]

4 hours ago, JCon said:

Riders should be proud someone put up a fight. 

With the whining coming from the likes of Suitor, McCormack & other Rider followers, Micah deserved something as well, but, again as I read the "Rider Ambassadors" are never at fault...  

[WinnipegGordo]

3 minutes ago, camper_2 said:

With the whining coming from the likes of Suitor, McCormack & other Rider followers, Micah deserved something as well, but, again as I read the "Rider Ambassadors" are never at fault...  

Sorry if this posted already:

 

[rebusrankin]

So Harris is at fault and not the Riders who took the cheap shots at Demski and other Bombers? Riders acted like bullies after the play and then act shocked when stood up too.

[Bigblue204]

Harris gets his fine. Edem too (to go along with a broken wrist...) Micah walks away clean....WHERE'S THE OUTRAGE!?!?!?!?!!

[Rod Black]

2 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Harris gets his fine. Edem too (to go along with a broken wrist...) Micah walks away clean....WHERE'S THE OUTRAGE!?!?!?!?!!

I’m OUTRAGED - mad as hell and NOT gonna take it anymore. DAMMIT!