2022 CFL Season - Non Back 2 Back Champs News

[rebusrankin]

So the Riders trade for Zach and give up a 2nd rounder. They trade him to Toronto for a 4th.  Toronto gets a 3rd from us for him, plus the 1st since he reupped. How is it not pointed out more how poorly O'Day handled this?

[Noeller]

In fairness to the Riders (holy **** kill me now for saying that...) virtually everyone thought Collaros was done. At the time it didn't seem like a big deal that they cut bait with him. It's nothing short of a miracle that he's revived his career to where it is now... 

[GCn20]

38 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

I'm fairly sure they knew Collaros was leaving either way. That was the last year of his contract and to management it was probably obvious (as has been confirmed now) that Collaros wasn't that happy there. With a replacement all ready to go and the fans basically done with him, why would he re-sign? Better to trade him for something than lose him for nothing.

They got a 4th rounder for him a full month before the trade deadline. What you are saying is logical until you factor in the return they got, and the timing of the trade. If they were trying to maximize his value out the door then the trade they made seems completely irrational. You hold him to the trade deadline then dump him if no better offers come around, or you hold onto him for the season and maybe he gives you a 1A -!B option heading into the playoffs imo. It's not that the Riders traded him that perplexes me, it's the fact they traded him for essentially nothing a month before they even had to think about doing so. In a 9 team league where QBs drop like flies they were absolutely idiotic for not waiting on another team to make a better offer.

8 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

So the Riders trade for Zach and give up a 2nd rounder. They trade him to Toronto for a 4th.  Toronto gets a 3rd from us for him, plus the 1st since he reupped. How is it not pointed out more how poorly O'Day handled this?

Exactly....and he wasn't up against the trade deadline either. He had time....LOTS of time to wait out a better offer.

5 minutes ago, Noeller said:

In fairness to the Riders (holy **** kill me now for saying that...) virtually everyone thought Collaros was done. At the time it didn't seem like a big deal that they cut bait with him. It's nothing short of a miracle that he's revived his career to where it is now... 

The fact that KW gave up a 3rd rounder, and a 1st for him tells me that O'Day just simply dropped the ball on his ZC evaluation of his worth.  Sure everybody though Zac was done....except Walters (arguably the best GM in the league). I know hindsight is 20/20 but Walters traded for him only a month later and paid a much steeper price.  2 years later we KNOW how epically awful the decision was by O'Day to trade ZC at all....but even back then at the time of Zac's trade from Regina many thought that this trade made no sense. No upside to it whatsoever. A low round draft pick for a guy that could still be valuable at the QB position down the stretch.

Edited August 10, 2022 by GCn20

[Fatty Liver]

6 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

They got a 4th rounder for him a full month before the trade deadline. What you are saying is logical until you factor in the return they got, and the timing of the trade. If they were trying to maximize his value out the door then the trade they made seems completely irrational. You hold him to the trade deadline then dump him if no better offers come around, or you hold onto him for the season and maybe he gives you a 1A -!B option heading into the playoffs imo. It's not that the Riders traded him that perplexes me, it's the fact they traded him for essentially nothing a month before they even had to think about doing so. In a 9 team league where QBs drop like flies they were absolutely idiotic for not waiting on another team to make a better offer.

Exactly....and he wasn't up against the trade deadline either. He had time....LOTS of time to wait out a better offer.

The fact that KW gave up a 3rd rounder, and a 1st for him tells me that O'Day just simply dropped the ball on his ZC evaluation of his worth.  Sure everybody though Zac was done....except Walters (arguably the best GM in the league).

I thought I read somewhere that the Argo draft pick they received turned out to be Schaffer-Baker.

[Bigblue204]

5 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

They got a 4th rounder for him a full month before the trade deadline. What you are saying is logical until you factor in the return they got, and the timing of the trade. If they were trying to maximize his value out the door then the trade they made seems completely irrational. You hold him to the trade deadline then dump him if no better offers come around, or you hold onto him for the season and maybe he gives you a 1A -!B option heading into the playoffs imo. It's not that the Riders traded him that perplexes me, it's the fact they traded him for essentially nothing a month before they even had to think about doing so. In a 9 team league where QBs drop like flies they were absolutely idiotic for not waiting on another team to make a better offer.

Exactly....and he wasn't up against the trade deadline either. He had time....LOTS of time to wait out a better offer.

There weren't a lot of options at that time though, basically everyone was set at QB and I'm assuming (though this could be unwise considering who I'm talking about) that they shopped him around and tried to gather what type of interest there was. BC/EDM/CGY/WPG/HAM/MTL were all set with starters and backups...That leaves TO/OTT..... Riders holding him to the deadline were just as likely to get no offers as they were to get a few. They had an offer from the other division, they took the guarantee instead of the guess. 

[GCn20]

2 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

I thought I read somewhere that the Argo draft pick they received turned out to be Schaffer-Baker.

Sometimes you get lucky in the late rounds but most of the time the pick is worthless.

[17to85]

13 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

I thought I read somewhere that the Argo draft pick they received turned out to be Schaffer-Baker.

I would rather have collaros than schaffer-baker and fajardo. Just saying.

[Geebrr]

41 minutes ago, Noeller said:

In fairness to the Riders (holy **** kill me now for saying that...) virtually everyone thought Collaros was done. At the time it didn't seem like a big deal that they cut bait with him. It's nothing short of a miracle that he's revived his career to where it is now... 

Never under estimate the feeling of joy that accompanies leaving that place and what it can do for you. 

[GCn20]

37 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I would rather have collaros than schaffer-baker and fajardo. Just saying.

Another way to look at it in hindsight is that the Riders could have held out for the Bombers and gotten the 9th and 27th? pick and taken Rourke AND Schaffer-Baker. The fact they got value out of their 4th rounder doesn't diminish the fact they lost out on two higher picks by making a bad trade. Last time I checked, they could have selected Schaffer-Baker anyway had they held out for the better deal. The fact they got him in the 4th round is luck not good roster management. They could have gotten a 1st round assett and still selected Schaffer Baker.

23 minutes ago, Geebrr said:

Never under estimate the feeling of joy that accompanies leaving that place and what it can do for you. 

We all know that....except O'Day...he never saw it coming.

43 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

I would rather have collaros than schaffer-baker and fajardo. Just saying.

But would you rather have Collaros than Schaffer Baker AND Rourke? Because that is what could have transpired had the Riders not rushed to throw Zac away. Actually, I would still take Collaros but Rourke evens it out a lot more. Makes it a decision. One the Riders were too stupid to have to make.

[bb1]

12 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Another way to look at it in hindsight is that the Riders could have held out for the Bombers and gotten the 9th and 27th? pick and taken Rourke AND Schaffer-Baker. The fact they got value out of their 4th rounder doesn't diminish the fact they lost out on two higher picks by making a bad trade. Last time I checked, they could have selected Schaffer-Baker anyway had they held out for the better deal. The fact they got him in the 4th round is luck not good roster management. They could have gotten a 1st round assett and still selected Schaffer Baker.

We all know that....except O'Day...he never saw it coming.

But would you rather have Collaros than Schaffer Baker AND Rourke? Because that is what could have transpired had the Riders not rushed to throw Zac away. Actually, I would still take Collaros but Rourke evens it out a lot more. Makes it a decision. One the Riders were too stupid to have to make.

I would take Collaros over Rourke and the whole Sask team if we are including the last 2 years. Potential is one thing. Without Collaros we don't have the the last 2 cups,nobody can take that away from us.

[GCn20]

16 minutes ago, bb1 said:

I would take Collaros over Rourke and the whole Sask team if we are including the last 2 years. Potential is one thing. Without Collaros we don't have the the last 2 cups,nobody can take that away from us.

I agree completely. In hindsight, Sask throwing Zac away is probably going to go down as one of the worst moves of the past few decades by the Riders. Were there extenuating circumstances? Yes. At the end of the day an extremely smart GM decided to trade real tangible assets to get him though, so obviously he was not as disposable as Rider fan apologists made him out to be. 

[Jpan85]

I don't think Zack would have re-signed with the Riders he was not happy how they used him. 

[do or die]

Well for me......I'm taking the gin I will drink.....over the gin I have drank..

[JuranBoldenRules]

3 minutes ago, Jpan85 said:

I don't think Zack would have re-signed with the Riders he was not happy how they used him. 

You're discounting the ability of Craig Dickenson to give an inspirational speech to change his mind.

[Fatty Liver]

43 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Another way to look at it in hindsight is that the Riders could have held out for the Bombers and gotten the 9th and 27th? pick and taken Rourke AND Schaffer-Baker. The fact they got value out of their 4th rounder doesn't diminish the fact they lost out on two higher picks by making a bad trade. Last time I checked, they could have selected Schaffer-Baker anyway had they held out for the better deal. The fact they got him in the 4th round is luck not good roster management. They could have gotten a 1st round assett and still selected Schaffer Baker.

We all know that....except O'Day...he never saw it coming.

But would you rather have Collaros than Schaffer Baker AND Rourke? Because that is what could have transpired had the Riders not rushed to throw Zac away. Actually, I would still take Collaros but Rourke evens it out a lot more. Makes it a decision. One the Riders were too stupid to have to make.

No doubt Rider management is dumb, but trading Collaros to their desperate rivals on the eve of the 2019 playoffs is not happening.

[Geebrr]

9 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

You're discounting the ability of Craig Dickenson to give an inspirational speech to change his mind.

And being on the team giving cheap shots rather than absorbing them 

[DTonOB]

One important thing to remember was that Zach was ready to come back from his injury when the Riders traded him. And with Fajardo flying by that point, we would have been relentless with the "Who's the QB?" "What about that throw? Does that tell you it's time to go back to Zach?" "How can you take a job from a guy because of injury?"
As many have pointed out, the return wasn't great. But I think part of it is that the Riders wanted needed it done quickly.

[Geebrr]

1 minute ago, DTonOB said:

One important thing to remember was that Zach was ready to come back from his injury when the Riders traded him. And with Fajardo flying by that point, we would have been relentless with the "Who's the QB?" "What about that throw? Does that tell you it's time to go back to Zach?" "How can you take a job from a guy because of injury?"
As many have pointed out, the return wasn't great. But I think part of it is that the Riders wanted needed it done quickly.

Gotta drop that “we” when talking about the Gappers, DT. It is “they”. Always “they”. Even past tense😉

[JuranBoldenRules]

Just now, Geebrr said:

Gotta drop that “we” when talking about the Gappers, DT. It is “they”. Always “they”. Even past tense😉

WE being the media I believe.

[Geebrr]

1 minute ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

WE being the media I believe.

Gapper media 😉

[JCon]

CoFaj was doing well and Collaros was eating cap space. The trade made sense if they thought Jesus Sprinkles was the one going forward. 

 

Plus, they've always been next level in Riderville identifying and retaining talent. 

Just ask Willie, Nic, and Zach. They know. 

[17to85]

23 minutes ago, DTonOB said:

And with Fajardo flying b

Hardly. 

[Noeller]

Yeah the biggest mistake was ever thinking CoFaj was ever going to be a true starting QB in the CFL. Career 3rd stringer playing dress up as a starter going on 3 years now...

[GCn20]

28 minutes ago, DTonOB said:

One important thing to remember was that Zach was ready to come back from his injury when the Riders traded him. And with Fajardo flying by that point, we would have been relentless with the "Who's the QB?" "What about that throw? Does that tell you it's time to go back to Zach?" "How can you take a job from a guy because of injury?"
As many have pointed out, the return wasn't great. But I think part of it is that the Riders wanted needed it done 

A QB contoversy is not a bad problem to have. It's only a problem if one of your QBs is psychologically fragile and can't handle the....errr...ok i see where you were going with this...

Edited August 10, 2022 by GCn20

[Jesse]

54 minutes ago, Jpan85 said:

I don't think Zack would have re-signed with the Riders he was not happy how they used him. 

And Zach with the Riders wasn’t - and would never be - the Zach we’ve gotten with the Bombers.

I don’t really consider it a miss by them at all - but no doubt one of the biggest gains this organization has even made.