CFL - 2023 Regular Season - Discussion Thread

[Bigblue204]

2 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

The whole argument is hypothetical on both sides.

Stats don't tell the whole story. For example a 5 yard offensive play is a nothing burger stats wise, but it may be a TD or continue a drive at a major point in the game or extend a drive or help to drain the clock. Maybe it's a QB threading the needle. Maybe it's a receiver making a spectacular catch. Maybe it's a tipped ball at the LOS that still gets caught. 

All things being equal, a great defensive game will be over shadowed by bad QB play. For example: The Dinwiddie GC. 

no one has said it was bad qb play. It was an ok performance by Collaros, that was 100% over shadowed by outstanding Defence. The defence gives up 1 TD, Bombers O puts up 20 points and you're claiming the O was more influential in the win lol. Keep being you Tburg

[17to85]

You ever seen a championship team with a bad defense? 

[Booch]

1 minute ago, 17to85 said:

You ever seen a championship team with a bad defense? 

nope...but seen several with average to almost below average offenses tho

[GCn20]

22 hours ago, Booch said:

well when you break it down....by numbers you are mistaken...Its more  depth thing right now, and rotation issue...due to said depth, and if not fixed...will prob wear the Dline down

currently we rank 1st sacks...we have played 1 more game than BC but the other teams are well behind us...we give up the lowest 1st down yardage in league....1st in comp. % against and 2nd in pass yards per game...a lot which can be linked to the dline play, as QB's are obviously not getting the time to make reads, or stand in there and deliver the ball....we also are 2nd in QB efficiency against as well...another thing which is a direct link to the dline play. and are middle of the road in rush yards against.

So our starting Dline guys....save for a flip flop of Lawson from Thomas, and when Haba was in are doing their job and upgrade in talent is a mis-informed comment......Its the total lack of depth behind them on the game day roster, and zero of it on the PR which is the issue, and pretty much playing with fire until we address it

 

I agree. The quality of our starters is excellent. We do have to make sure they don't get worn out and that we can survive injuries if they come. That's the issue. Our starting DL is as good as anyones and better than most.

[Booch]

3 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

I agree. The quality of our starters is excellent. We do have to make sure they don't get worn out and that we can survive injuries if they come. That's the issue. Our starting DL is as good as anyones and better than most.

when its The Jeffs..Walker and Lawson with Haba subbing....I'd rank them right up there.....but we have diddly behind them right now

[rebusrankin]

BLM to start for Hamilton tomorrow.

[Bigblue204]

26 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

BLM to start for Hamilton tomorrow.

the guy is absolutely done and fleecing the ticats

[MOBomberFan]

redblacks reloading as they heat up

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

13 minutes ago, MOBomberFan said:

redblacks reloading as they heat up

Thank goodness, I want someone in the east challenging Argos for first- i am done with the east always having a cake walk.

[bluto]

22 minutes ago, Wanna-B-Fanboy said:

Thank goodness, I want someone in the east challenging Argos for first- i am done with the east always having a cake walk.

It may not end up as a cakewalk, but I've seen the other teams in the East enough. They aren't on the Argonauts' level. It's down to injuries and luck now.

[TBURGESS]

3 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

no one has said it was bad qb play. It was an ok performance by Collaros, that was 100% over shadowed by outstanding Defence. The defence gives up 1 TD, Bombers O puts up 20 points and you're claiming the O was more influential in the win lol. Keep being you Tburg

Bull stuff. The CFL is a QB driven league and Collaros is the best QB in the league. Without Collaros the Bomber O doesn't put up 20 points and the defense is on the field a lot longer & we don't win any games. 

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

21 minutes ago, bluto said:

It may not end up as a cakewalk, but I've seen the other teams in the East enough. They aren't on the Argonauts' level. It's down to injuries and luck now.

Yup. There is a clear separation of teams in the east. 

The ALLCAPS are intriguing- time will tell if Crum is legit.

[Fatty Liver]

30 minutes ago, bluto said:

It may not end up as a cakewalk, but I've seen the other teams in the East enough. They aren't on the Argonauts' level. It's down to injuries and luck now.

How many D-line starters are they down this week?  Any other significant injuries right now?

[GCn20]

45 minutes ago, bluto said:

It may not end up as a cakewalk, but I've seen the other teams in the East enough. They aren't on the Argonauts' level. It's down to injuries and luck now.

Argos are definitely the class of the East. Are they the best team in the CFL? Hard to say. Other than the Lions, they haven't really played anyone good. Was a good victory against the Leos though despite Adams completely handing them the game.

33 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

Bull stuff. The CFL is a QB driven league and Collaros is the best QB in the league. Without Collaros the Bomber O doesn't put up 20 points and the defense is on the field a lot longer & we don't win any games. 

Might as well hand us the Grey Cup now then.

[bluto]

12 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

How many D-line starters are they down this week?  Any other significant injuries right now?

The big issue we have at DL is that I'm sure how the ratio management is going to allow everyone to get enough games. Oak is practicing full now but Brinkman's play has been so good.

Henoc still hasn't played. Jordan Williams is practicing full.

By and large, we're still healthy. But, like Winnipeg, we're a QB injury away from beingin a crisis.

[Booch]

5 minutes ago, bluto said:

The big issue we have at DL is that I'm sure how the ratio management is going to allow everyone to get enough games. Oak is practicing full now but Brinkman's play has been so good.

Henoc still hasn't played. Jordan Williams is practicing full.

By and large, we're still healthy. But, like Winnipeg, we're a QB injury away from beingin a crisis.

we can prob sustain a QB injury a bit better as Brown has some experience...and lots with his teamates....who even are the ARGO BACKUPS??....

[Bigblue204]

42 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

Bull stuff. The CFL is a QB driven league and Collaros is the best QB in the league. Without Collaros the Bomber O doesn't put up 20 points and the defense is on the field a lot longer & we don't win any games. 

Feel free to keep making a fool of yourself. I'm enjoying it.

Collaros IS the best qb in the league. He wasn't in those playoff games. Again....look at what actually happened. Not how you feel.

Edited July 27, 2023 by Bigblue204

[rebusrankin]

9 minutes ago, bluto said:

The big issue we have at DL is that I'm sure how the ratio management is going to allow everyone to get enough games. Oak is practicing full now but Brinkman's play has been so good.

Henoc still hasn't played. Jordan Williams is practicing full.

By and large, we're still healthy. But, like Winnipeg, we're a QB injury away from beingin a crisis.

Your front 7 depth and talent makes me envious. So many good players.

[bb1]

3 hours ago, 17to85 said:

You ever seen a championship team with a bad defense? 

Off the top of my head no football team,but definitely in Hockey it was the 80s Oilers....average defense at best.

Edited July 27, 2023 by bb1

[Fatty Liver]

4 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Feel free to keep making a fool of yourself. I'm enjoying it.

Collaros IS the best qb in the league. He wasn't in those playoff games. Again....look at what actually happened. Not how you feel.

IMO Kelly is challenging Collaros as the best QB in the league this season, he has an advantage in that he can also use his legs to gain yards when needed, something Zach is no longer encouraged to do, for good reason.

[bluto]

12 minutes ago, Booch said:

we can prob sustain a QB injury a bit better as Brown has some experience...and lots with his teamates....who even are the ARGO BACKUPS??....

Yeah. Exactly.

I made an allusion in the pre season while the Argos were assembling their team. They were making some excellent moves and I couldn't even think that not having MBT come back (or another ready-made QB) was even an option. We had won the championship, built what might arguably be the strongest roster of players (other than at QB) and then put a player who has had less than 100 CFL snaps run it?? It would be like if Red Bull, after winning last year with a dominant car, decided to change out Verstappen for a driver who'd only ever completed one race before. Unthinkable. But here we are and I am happily eating humble pie on this subject.

 

Who is our QB2? Cameron Dukes. How young is he? I dunno, but he still has spots on his face. What do I know about his play? Well... he comes in for short yardage, but because he looks like he weighs a little less than Paul Reubens does, he has no push so he only gets the job done half the time. Why else does Kelly have so many rushing TDs. (and now that Chad is our obvious QB1, it does my head in that he has to keep coming in at short yardage if Dukes can't make it).

 

EDIT: Dukes bio says he is 24 years old, 205 pounds (riiiiight) and won the NA1A Championship as a QB.

Edited July 27, 2023 by bluto

[Booch]

6 minutes ago, bluto said:

Yeah. Exactly.

I made an allusion in the pre season while the Argos were assembling their team. They were making some excellent moves and I couldn't even think that not having MBT come back (or another ready-made QB) was even an option. We had won the championship, built what might arguably be the strongest roster of players (other than at QB) and then put a player who has had less than 100 CFL snaps run it?? It would be like if Red Bull, after winning last year with a dominant car, decided to change out Verstappen for a driver who'd only ever completed one race before. Unthinkable. But here we are and I am happily eating humble pie on this subject.

 

Who is our QB2? Cameron Dukes. How young is he? I dunno, but he still has spots on his face. What do I know about his play? Well... he comes in for short yardage, but because he looks like he weighs a little less than Paul Reubens does, he has no push so he only gets the job done half the time. Why else does Kelly have so many rushing TDs. (and now that Chad is our obvious QB1, it does my head in that he has to keep coming in at short yardage if Dukes can't make it).

 

EDIT: Dukes bio says he is 24 years old, 205 pounds (riiiiight) and won the NA1A Championship as a QB.

yeah....lean depth there....hopefully he stays upright but the way he plays...I see him getting dinged up....then........gonna be trouble on offense.

Kelly needs to learn touch tho as well...he howitzers everything and doesn't need to, and will be interesting now in the 2nd 3rd of season if he gets figured out somewhat.....only time in recent memory I didnt see it happen during that first yr is whn Ricky Ray came in...and just kept getting it done....I dont think Kelly has between the ears what Ray had...so as season goes...I expect him to make forced errors....and have certain things taken away from him by defense's to see if he can figure it out

[bluto]

1 minute ago, Booch said:

yeah....lean depth there....hopefully he stays upright but the way he plays...I see him getting dinged up....then........gonna be trouble on offense.

Kelly needs to learn touch tho as well...he howitzers everything and doesn't need to, and will be interesting now in the 2nd 3rd of season if he gets figured out somewhat.....only time in recent memory I didnt see it happen during that first yr is whn Ricky Ray came in...and just kept getting it done....I dont think Kelly has between the ears what Ray had...so as season goes...I expect him to make forced errors....and have certain things taken away from him by defense's to see if he can figure it out

Who does? But seriously, Ray didn't have the top running game and defence working for him, so Kelly may just keep rocking (provided he stays healthy).

If I have a beef with him (and at this stage anyone who does is being very petty considering what he's been like) it is that he never checks down. Watch him. If his first read is a no-go you can actually see him spot his check down and then he will keep looking. It isn't part of his makeup to take the easy 5-6 yard pass. It lead to a truly brutal pick in week 6 against Montreal where he threw across his body. And then against Hamilton he did the exact same thing but it wasn't picked.

[rebusrankin]

6 minutes ago, bluto said:

Who does? But seriously, Ray didn't have the top running game and defence working for him, so Kelly may just keep rocking (provided he stays healthy).

If I have a beef with him (and at this stage anyone who does is being very petty considering what he's been like) it is that he never checks down. Watch him. If his first read is a no-go you can actually see him spot his check down and then he will keep looking. It isn't part of his makeup to take the easy 5-6 yard pass. It lead to a truly brutal pick in week 6 against Montreal where he threw across his body. And then against Hamilton he did the exact same thing but it wasn't picked.

Sad thing is both of his rbs are excellent pass catchers and would do real damage on those plays.

[bluto]

1 minute ago, rebusrankin said:

Sad thing is both of his rbs are excellent pass catchers and would do real damage on those plays.

We know that Harris can burn a defence with a catch. We don't yet know if AJ is that sort, but he was in T.O. in the off season specifically to learn route running, so I'd love to see it. Particularly since Dinwiddie has some forms where we go with a split (until they move) or I've seen either or both at tight.