Week 7 - E(l)ks @ Blue Bombers - GDT

[Jesse]

16 minutes ago, Bubba Zanetti said:

Mcrae is pretty much that guy already. They did insert him for a couple runs last night when the running game was stalled. Its imperative that our run game is a success. It opens up so much more for Buck and Zach.

Our first successful run was to Demski, might need to keep him involved for a couple runs a game too.

[Mike]

My favorite secondary is Houston/Nichols/Parker/Holm/Rose with Alexander at SAM

[Booch]

12 minutes ago, Bubba Zanetti said:

Mcrae is plenty shifty and fast. The guy averaged like 9 yards a carry in college. Youre not going to be bringing in a newbie at this stage of the season when Mcrae is around.

plus...he never fumbled ever in his collegiate career...dont recal any in pros yet either to this point...so he is dependable

[Nolby]

10 hours ago, Noeller said:

Congrats Osh.... Puzzling roster decisions aside, I'm still so glad we have you....

 

 

On his way to his own statue

[Booch]

1 minute ago, Mike said:

My favorite secondary is Houston/Nichols/Parker/Holm/Rose with Alexander at SAM

BA at Sam is something I'd like to see us do...and would make better use of his skills being involved more...Never thought of Parker at safety but thats an interesting idea...he's be a picking machine I bet and a sure tackler 

I'd go as far to like to see Cole at safety...or given a shot....dude can cover ground and lay the lumber too

[Mike]

Just now, Booch said:

BA at Sam is something I'd like to see us do...and would make better use of his skills being involved more...Never thought of Parker at safety but thats an interesting idea...he's be a picking machine I bet and a sure tackler 

We keep everything in front of us by design, I’d rather see us use more of a center fielder there. Personally.

[Booch]

1 minute ago, Mike said:

We keep everything in front of us by design, I’d rather see us use more of a center fielder there. Personally.

and the fact we havnt been using him much in the true safety sense recently anyway would make sense too

[Geebrr]

3 minutes ago, Nolby said:

On his way to his own statue

He should have one waiting. He is a Bomber legend already. 

7 minutes ago, Mike said:

My favorite secondary is Houston/Nichols/Parker/Holm/Rose with Alexander at SAM

Interesting idea. 

[Mike]

I know Parker is small, but safeties are trending smaller now. He’s only giving up an inch and five pounds to a guy like Metchie who plays bigger than he is, just like Parker. Sure tackling, center fielder abilities … it’s not like teams fear Alexander when they come across the middle anyways, when’s the last time you saw him lay out a guy that way?

[bigg jay]

2 minutes ago, Geebrr said:

He should have one waiting. He is a Bomber legend already. 

Can't wait for the reaction to his statue having him in shorts and a hoodie. 😂

[Geebrr]

Just now, bigg jay said:

Can't wait for the reaction to his statue having him in shorts and a hoodie. 😂

I hope it is playoff Osh with full beard too. 

[MOBomberFan]

51 minutes ago, Booch said:

Targets and completion percent...and completions for first downs is cut and dry...Piss break and snacking or not....even if u went for a dump...

Then I will gladly look this information up and report back. If we are going to have an ongoing narrative around here I'd like it to be backed by facts, not feelings

Where do you get your completion % vs/catches allowed by specific DBs stats from? CFL.ca is unfortunately very limited right now, cfldb only has data from previous seasons

Here's a little of what I scraped together so far:

 

Holm -         7 games played, 29 targets (4.1/game), 7 PKDs 0 INTs

Houston -    6 games played, 19 targets (3.1/game), 4 PKDs, 5 INTs

Clements -   6 games played, 20 targets (3.3/game), 0 PKDs, 0 INTs

Alexander -  7 games played, 21 targets (3.0/game), 0 PKDs, 1 INTs

ADS         -  5 games played, 23 targets (4.6/game), 3 PKDs, 0 INTs

 

Holm certainly gets a share of targets but it's hardly lopsided. It appears ABS is quickly becoming the new target of choice for the opposing offense. Actual completion rates vs these DBs would be much more telling.

I'll surely come fill this out further if anyone can point me in the right direction as to where to find catches allowed by/% compl. vs specific DBs

[Geebrr]

1 minute ago, Mike said:

I know Parker is small, but safeties are trending smaller now. He’s only giving up an inch and five pounds to a guy like Metchie who plays bigger than he is, just like Parker. Sure tackling, center fielder abilities … it’s not like teams fear Alexander when they come across the middle anyways, when’s the last time you saw him lay out a guy that way?

He cracked some guy on Hamilton in the opener and got flagged. 

I said it earlier this week - he is not playing at the level he has set for himself. I am not willing to write him off as having lost a step yet - but him not being the force he has been in past is an issue. 

[Booch]

3 minutes ago, Mike said:

I know Parker is small, but safeties are trending smaller now. He’s only giving up an inch and five pounds to a guy like Metchie who plays bigger than he is, just like Parker. Sure tackling, center fielder abilities … it’s not like teams fear Alexander when they come across the middle anyways, when’s the last time you saw him lay out a guy that way?

rules now dont allow it hardly anyway and almost looks like he consciously not trying to f=do it to hurt team with a penalthy...so stick him closer to the L.O.S and make plays

1 minute ago, MOBomberFan said:

Then I will gladly look this information up and report back. If we are going to have an ongoing narrative around here I'd like it to be backed by facts, not feelings

Where do you get your completion % vs/catches allowed by specific DBs stats from? CFL.ca is unfortunately very limited right now, cfldb only has data from previous seasons

Here's a little of what I scraped together so far:

 

Holm -         7 games played, 29 targets (4.1/game), 7 PKDs 0 INTs

Houston -    6 games played, 19 targets (3.1/game), 4 PKDs, 5 INTs

Clements -   6 games played, 20 targets (3.3/game), 0 PKDs, 0 INTs

Alexander -  7 games played, 21 targets (3.0/game), 0 PKDs, 1 INTs

ADS         -  5 games played, 23 targets (4.6/game), 3 PKDs, 0 INTs

 

Holm certainly gets a share of targets but it's hardly lopsided. It appears ABS is quickly becoming the new target of choice for the opposing offense. Actual completion rates vs these DBs would be much more telling.

I'll surely come fill this out further if anyone can point me in the right direction as to where to find catches allowed by/% compl. vs specific DBs

which is normal...any team will attack the new rookie....or should until they show they can make play

You can go look at tackles...if they have a high total...they have a high completion percentage against......excluding a safeties numbers as they are skewed a bit and not a good barometer....you want your safety to be involved and makibg tackles....depending on the scheme or what you have him doing means he's coming up and making plays based on his eyes

[MOBomberFan]

4 minutes ago, Booch said:

You can go look at tackles...if they have a high total...they have a high completion percentage against......excluding a safeties numbers as they are skewed a bit and not a good barometer....you want your safety to be involved and makibg tackles....depending on the scheme or what you have him doing means he's coming up and making plays based on his eyes

Roger that, when I have time I'll take another look

[Booch]

1 minute ago, MOBomberFan said:

Roger that, when I have time I'll take another look

dont get me wrong...I dont hate Holm....he has some usefulness and possible more upside??....that not sure...but we have better in house, and if Parker didnt get hurt doubt we even having this convo

[Booch]

11 minutes ago, MOBomberFan said:

Roger that, when I have time I'll take another look

Holm..29 tackles

ADS..23 tackles

BA...21 tackles

Darby..20 tackles 

Houston...19 tackle

Nichols..17 tackles

Lawrence..6 tackles (3 games)

that being said...some tackles can be possible attributed to run support, and being involved on a play where a guy was getting yac from a play not a direct result of them...but the correlation between targets and tackles carries merit

Edited July 21, 2023 by Booch

[Jesse]

20 minutes ago, MOBomberFan said:

Then I will gladly look this information up and report back. If we are going to have an ongoing narrative around here I'd like it to be backed by facts, not feelings

Where do you get your completion % vs/catches allowed by specific DBs stats from? CFL.ca is unfortunately very limited right now, cfldb only has data from previous seasons

Here's a little of what I scraped together so far:

 

Holm -         7 games played, 29 targets (4.1/game), 7 PKDs 0 INTs

Houston -    6 games played, 19 targets (3.1/game), 4 PKDs, 5 INTs

Clements -   6 games played, 20 targets (3.3/game), 0 PKDs, 0 INTs

Alexander -  7 games played, 21 targets (3.0/game), 0 PKDs, 1 INTs

ADS         -  5 games played, 23 targets (4.6/game), 3 PKDs, 0 INTs

 

Holm certainly gets a share of targets but it's hardly lopsided. It appears ABS is quickly becoming the new target of choice for the opposing offense. Actual completion rates vs these DBs would be much more telling.

I'll surely come fill this out further if anyone can point me in the right direction as to where to find catches allowed by/% compl. vs specific DBs

Lol, Houston targeted 19 times and on half of those, the ball is picked off or knocked down.

I don’t remember who was complaining about him, but get out of here with your nonsense.

[Booch]

Teams will game plan and scheme to target areas and players where they will have the best success, its not just random willy nilly fly by seat of your pants stuff....unless you are the Elks....they go into a game with specific targets and plays based on in game situation

2 minutes ago, Jesse said:

Lol, Houston targeted 19 times and on half of those, the ball is picked off or knocked down.

I don’t remember who was complaining about him, but get out of here with your nonsense.

hahah...I was actually gonna say that as well...Lawrence as well I believe had 4 or 5 knockdowns

Edited July 21, 2023 by Booch

[MOBomberFan]

I suppose where things get blurry is when a guy (real-time example, Holm in game 1) gets targeted 4 times, makes 2 PKDs, but 3 DTs... at least one of those DTs came from a play that was not a target vs that player if 2 of his 4 targets were knocked down... so it's an interesting bit of data, but still far from the total picture.

Above, if we directly correlate tackles to completions allowed, Holm has given up 100% of his targets while somehow knocking down 7 passes. Doesn't quite compute. But is is interesting nonetheless.

[Booch]

1 minute ago, MOBomberFan said:

I suppose where things get blurry is when a guy (real-time example, Holm in game 1) gets targeted 4 times, makes 2 PKDs, but 3 DTs... at least one of those DTs came from a play that was not a target vs that player if 2 of his 4 targets were knocked down... so it's an interesting bit of data, but still far from the total picture.

Above, if we directly correlate tackles to completions allowed, Holm has given up 100% of his targets while somehow knocking down 7 passes. Doesn't quite compute. But is is interesting nonetheless.

again...not to knock holm but a few of his knockdowns he was beat and was rewarded by a severe under thrown ball....or just bad pass in general

[Bigblue204]

2 hours ago, BomberBall said:

Eli had 2 holding calls?  I only recall Kola getting penalized a couple times.

Wait...isn't Eli 67?

[MOBomberFan]

Just now, Booch said:

again...not to knock holm but a few of his knockdowns he was beat and was rewarded by a severe under thrown ball....or just bad pass in general

Fair, but that's the Johnny Augustine YPC avg argument over again though. You can't take away 'the easy ones', they happened and they count. Or we need to take away every other DB's 'easy ones' too

1 minute ago, Bigblue204 said:

Wait...isn't Eli 67?

No that's Kola

[Brandon]

1 hour ago, Mike said:

Overall, I’d take Houston as easily one of the top 2-3 corners in the CFL. Seems like guys like BVD prefer a player like Abu who gets targeted 10 times a game for 6 first downs, because he limits gains to just past the first down marker as a sure tackler. 

Sorry if I prefer players not getting absolutely burned and torched one or two times per game.  I said the exact same thing last year with Rose at around the same time of the season.   I'm not sure if you were one of the people on here giving him excuse after excuse,  but eventually the thick headed folks could admit the guy was a shell of his former self and was a liability on the field.   At least Rose had the excuse of being injured,   Houston does not.    Hopefully he can develop into a solid player but at this point he's way hot and cold and laughable to suggest he's top 2 - 3 corner in the CFL.   A top 2 - 3 CB doesn't get burned by Corny,  Crum,  Fajardo....    Prime example of a guy with fancy stats that doesn't tell the whole story.       

 

[bigg jay]

3 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Wait...isn't Eli 67?

Eli is 65.