Argos at Bombers GDT

[Booch]

4 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Go pass on an electric fence. Your team showed its true colors. What a crock of **** you are trying to peddle. Ever stop to think maybe we were the ones dumbing things down and just doing enough to win without showing our cards. Nope..because like most Argo fans you'd rather stick your head in the sand and claim all things Argo are great. That's what happens when you a fan in a void I guess..reality isn't easy to differentiate from wishful thinking.

assume u meant pissss??...lol

Edited October 2, 2023 by Booch

[GCn20]

8 minutes ago, Booch said:

yeah...like said a lot here...good goes with luck and luck needs to be there to be consistently good....they had a buttload of good fortune that game...we had none pretty much that game other than the decision to play the 3rd stringer, tho may have back fired cause when they did bring Dukes back in...looked like night and day and it amped up the defense....

Meh..Dukes did diddly squat after 1Q. Argos didn't look like a team we can't beat, even with all their starters. We ran about as vanilla an O and D scheme as I've seen since 2016 and let the cream rise to the top.

Bluto can yap his gams but the complete and total domination of our OL over their DL should worry any Argo fan. That was like men against boys and full lineup or not they can't stop Brady.

Edited October 2, 2023 by GCn20

[bluto]

4 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

Go pass on an electric fence. Your team showed its true colors. What a crock of **** you are trying to peddle. Ever stop to think maybe we were the ones dumbing things down and just doing enough to win without showing our cards. Nope..because like most Argo fans you'd rather stick your head in the sand and claim all things Argo are great. That's what happens when you a fan in a void I guess..reality isn't easy to differentiate from wishful thinking.

Didn't read the post, obviously (and as usual). I suggested that coach Hall did in fact do that.

[GCn20]

1 minute ago, Booch said:

assume u meant pissss??...lol

Yes

Just now, bluto said:

Didn't read the post, obviously (and as usual). I suggested that coach Hall did in fact do that.

It was nothing but fantasy after the first sentence...so I just skimmed.

[bluto]

1 minute ago, GCn20 said:

Meh..Dukes did diddly squat after 1Q. Argos didn't look like a team we can't beat, even with all their starters. We ran about as vanilla an O and D scheme as I've seen since 2016 and let the cream rise to the top.

Bluto can yap his gams but the complete and total domination of our OL over their DL should worry any Argo fan. That was like men against boys.

Do you even into english much?

 

[Booch]

1 minute ago, GCn20 said:

Meh..Dukes did diddly squat after 1Q. Argos didn't look like a team we can't beat, even with all their starters. We ran about as vanilla an O and D scheme as I've seen since 2016 and let the cream rise to the top.

Bluto can yap his gams but the complete and total domination of our OL over their DL should worry any Argo fan. That was like men against boys.

I think the only thing we were caught off guard about in first quarter was his ability to take off and run...we now know that if he ever has to step into a game for real....as will any other team

[bluto]

2 minutes ago, Booch said:

I think the only thing we were caught off guard about in first quarter was his ability to take off and run...we now know that if he ever has to step into a game for real....as will any other team

Doubt that caught anyone off guard. He was known for it in college, etc.

[bearpants]

3 hours ago, bluto said:

This is sort of continuing the discussion from the Bombers' season thread, but I thought that discussion of the Argos roster this past Friday and the reasoning and strategy behind it was more germane here.

 

I know that most of us would've rather seen a competitive game instead of having the Argos treat Friday like a Preseason (and make no mistake, they did) but consider it from our side and you quickly realize why we'd do this on the road, late in the season and against a team we may see again.

The Argos 6-game has: Daniel, Amos, Muamba, Gittens, Haggerty, Carnell, Bladek and Johnson

Our 1 game list had: Oakman, Peters, McManis, Cage, Phillips and Richards

That's 9 nailed-on starters (and 2 others who although they're starting calibre, we likely won't see them). And maybe as many as a dozen that could start and we (or anyone else) would be happy to have them. And they are mostly who are starters of All Star calibre and a few are those guys who have displayed that Big-Play Gene.

And of course, the Big one: we sat The Chad and played 3 quarters of Dukes, a quarter of Scott and a final series of Dukes. Exactly like we did in the preseason against Hamilton.

And we hid our playbooks. I didn't see a single play that I hadn't already watched this year. This is very atypical for us. Dinwidde and Mace roll out new things by the week. I didn't see a single blitz get disguised and I'm fairly sure we didn't do any of our run-blitzing (part of why Olivera ran so effectively on us all night).

(as an aside: I feel better about our backup situation now. way to early to see if he has or will develop starter or even elite traits... but you guys played your defence close to your vest too... I had presumed that you would go after Dukes early and often to shake him up. Looked more like Hall was saving that for when it gets real and just daring the kid to make completions against you if he could)

 

As for the Bombers, perhaps it's a case of playing down to the perceived level of an opponent (ie: they saw that it was a heavily rotated Argo team that didn't need a win) but they did not impress. Even Olivera. You can't fault anything he did because he can only play against what gets set in front of him, and he did it very well. But there was no scheme whatsoever in place for him. This was a one-off.

 

Takeaway: we're leaving with a loss, but with a sense of confidence. Because if these two teams are fortunate enough to play each other again, the game will be very different. And on that day in November if they face the actual 2023 Argonauts, the Bombers will have to do much better than they did Friday night.

 

 

I actually agree with a lot of what you said here… but this idea that the argos didn’t “scheme for Oliveira” is total BS… you think the team just rolled over and let him run for 160+?… you’re just trying to make excuses because the run defense had no answer for the top back in the league

[17to85]

He has been making excuses for this game for weeks. 

[bluto]

3 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I actually agree with a lot of what you said here… but this idea that the argos didn’t “scheme for Oliveira” is total BS… you think the team just rolled over and let him run for 160+?… you’re just trying to make excuses because the run defense had no answer for the top back in the league

Not at all. They were trying, and Brinkman looked properly worn out in the 4th. But if you can look back at the game and see any run blitzes or the schemes we usually have, then your eyes are better than mine.

[Booch]

5 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I actually agree with a lot of what you said here… but this idea that the argos didn’t “scheme for Oliveira” is total BS… you think the team just rolled over and let him run for 160+?… you’re just trying to make excuses because the run defense had no answer for the top back in the league

Yeah I call B.S on the letting him run free...thats also a prime way to get your defenders injured s well....save for just stepping right out of the way

[17to85]

The thing that Oliveira did well in that game was be patient and read where the blocks were. Like he has come such a long way from just running right into the pile to being able to take that moment and find the hole.

[bearpants]

8 minutes ago, bluto said:

Not at all. They were trying, and Brinkman looked properly worn out in the 4th. But if you can look back at the game and see any run blitzes or the schemes we usually have, then your eyes are better than mine.

I don't know specifically what they were scheming... but if the defensive game plan wasn't heavily revolved round "let's stop Oliveira"... then I don't know what your D coaches were doing all week 

[Booch]

no team wants to give up close to 200 on the ground...ever...heck even 100 is not stomached well....so to say the guys on the field were willing to just let us run is laughable

[bluto]

13 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I don't know specifically what they were scheming... but if the defensive game plan wasn't heavily revolved round "let's stop Oliveira"... then I don't know what your D coaches were doing all week 

It basically looked like they played it "straight up".

[HardCoreBlue]

6 minutes ago, bearpants said:

I don't know specifically what they were scheming... but if the defensive game plan wasn't heavily revolved round "let's stop Oliveira"... then I don't know what your D coaches were doing all week 

Apparently this game to the Argo's, 14 games in, was to be treated exactly like a preseason game. Resting some starters, evaluating/reps for their depth, playing all their qb's except #1 and showing nothing but vanilla.

And look how we faired says Argo fan. 

 Gawd I hope this bites them in the a$$. 

[17to85]

So if it was basically as much a preseason game as all that what it essentially tells us is that the argos knew the game was a loss from the get go and gave up before even taking the field. Some "champions" so fragile they can't even handle the thought of a challenge.

[Booch]

54 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

So if it was basically as much a preseason game as all that what it essentially tells us is that the argos knew the game was a loss from the get go and gave up before even taking the field. Some "champions" so fragile they can't even handle the thought of a challenge.

my thoughts as well...

[bluto]

Ya say this but...

 

You've now put yourself in the spot where a "fragile" team may possibly go back to back on you. You really shouldn't let your mouth write that cheque.

[17to85]

16 minutes ago, bluto said:

Ya say this but...

 

You've now put yourself in the spot where a "fragile" team may possibly go back to back on you. You really shouldn't let your mouth write that cheque.

Bring it. Because the Bombers will.  Argos want to pretend they can turn it on and off at will go nuts, we've seen that strategy fail countless times in the past. 

Argos rolled over and showed their belly to Winnipeg. That says it all.

[GCn20]

19 hours ago, Booch said:

Yeah I call B.S on the letting him run free...thats also a prime way to get your defenders injured s well....save for just stepping right out of the way

I call BS on that as well. No coach with a lick of sense would ever put his players in harms way like that. An idiotic notion really.

37 minutes ago, bluto said:

Ya say this but...

 

You've now put yourself in the spot where a "fragile" team may possibly go back to back on you. You really shouldn't let your mouth write that cheque.

You guys are acting like you are all that and a bag of chips, at the end of the day you will be hoping that a rookie QB can handle the difference between regular season and playoff football. Good luck with that. Dinwiddie is effectively taking old mo out of the equation as well. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by GCn20

[bluto]

15 minutes ago, GCn20 said:

I call BS on that as well. No coach with a lick of sense would ever put his players in harms way like that. An idiotic notion really.

Which is likely why nobody suggested it.

Edited October 3, 2023 by bluto
being nice.

[Purple_Reign]

19 hours ago, bluto said:

It basically looked like they played it "straight up".

I don’t care who you put on that Argos Dline should we meet again. Brady is going to run them over once again. NO TEAM plays to not stop the run that’s insane!! 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Purple_Reign

[bluto]

3 minutes ago, Purple_Reign said:

I don’t care who you put on that Argos Dline should we meet again. Brady is going to run them over once again. NO TEAM plays to not stop the run that’s insane!! 

I agree. That's likely why the Argos didn't play "to not stop the run".

I feel like the difference between "not scheming to stop a specific threat" and "totally abdicating defensive responsibility" ought to be an easy distinction for most people to get? (and an obvious one for anyone who watched on Friday)

Edited October 3, 2023 by bluto

[wbbfan]

22 hours ago, Booch said:

I think the only thing we were caught off guard about in first quarter was his ability to take off and run...we now know that if he ever has to step into a game for real....as will any other team

With our lack of a nose, our run fits are stretched thin. Lber in A gap, db with ot reaps inability and possibly getting blocked by a wr. 
 Any team that runs option modestly well easily steals one gap back, a good zone or read can do it too. 
 It’s really hard to defend a qb option in the cfl  and gap cancel, with out a 2 gap guy it’s basically gambling and hoping for the best. 
 Even back in 21 before stove came back the lone weakness was getting gashed by big run plays when the offence stole back gaps.