Which Vets do we cut next season

[JuranBoldenRules]

On 2023-11-23 at 10:42 AM, ddanger said:

Thanks for that...and wow we had Brady at a pretty sweet deal this year! He's looking at what, doubling his salary? I'm thinking AT LEAST a 50k increase.

Yeah but if you turn Augustine into a rookie with either passport there's your savings.

[Booch]

2 hours ago, Fatty Liver said:

NFL PR money is not steady income, most PR players get cut a few times, jump to different teams and repeat the process, they rarely get promoted to a game day roster for even a few games.  Brady has the option of having a spectacular CFL career or a footnote NFL career.

yeah you have to be on the actual PR all yr to make the bigger bucks to get you more than a high paying CFL contract...and that rarely happens....more like never happens for a CFL defector to sit on a PR for all 16 games....the meat grinder there chews and spits em out at a crazy rate....Only guys who sit there all yr, and maybe get a call up here and there are draft picks from 4th round and up...thats it....People get blinded by this myth that u go down there and stand around and make oodles....not happening

Look at Desjarlais...he prob lost about 100k minimum in cash last yr "hoping" to land on a PR consistantly..He got a few workouts...and looks....but while you looking and waiting you not getting paid

Look at our guy Ford....your kids cutting lawns made more than he did this yr hoping on a pipe dream...he just effectively threw a yr of earning away in what is an already short career....Should have came back and had a caveat that if someone approached his agent...we would cut him.....

1 hour ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

Yeah but if you turn Augustine into a rookie with either passport there's your savings.

and we will be doing that with him likely..Thomas...Briggs...Miller...quite possibly Kolo...Darby...with all new roster spots taken up by rookies, or guys coming off an entry who will still be cheaper

 

[JuranBoldenRules]

23 minutes ago, Booch said:

 

Look at our guy Ford....your kids cutting lawns made more than he did this yr hoping on a pipe dream...he just effectively threw a yr of earning away in what is an already short career....Should have came back and had a caveat that if someone approached his agent...we would cut him.....

 

 

This is going to be an ongoing issue with both the expansion of NFL PR's and drop of eligibility restrictions combined with CFL starting season earlier leaving fewer game cheques for guys who return.  In Ford's case the amount he could have made joining the Bombers in mid-September would be dwarfed by a couple/3 weeks on a NFL PR.  Plus the timing of the CFL offseason really hamstrings guys trying to stay in contention to make NFL teams for the next season.  Really if he came back this season that's a career long decision not a 2023 decision.

They have a lot of work to do to make navigating this more pleasant for guys to come back at the moment.

[Booch]

10 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

This is going to be an ongoing issue with both the expansion of NFL PR's and drop of eligibility restrictions combined with CFL starting season earlier leaving fewer game cheques for guys who return.  In Ford's case the amount he could have made joining the Bombers in mid-September would be dwarfed by a couple/3 weeks on a NFL PR.  Plus the timing of the CFL offseason really hamstrings guys trying to stay in contention to make NFL teams for the next season.  Really if he came back this season that's a career long decision not a 2023 decision.

They have a lot of work to do to make navigating this more pleasant for guys to come back at the moment.

WELL...HE sat on a PR during the season for a grand total of 0 weeks....so his net gain was zip! And from looks of it he was up in Canada anyway doing nothing....so why he didn't venture back here is a bit baffling

[JuranBoldenRules]

4 minutes ago, Booch said:

WELL...HE sat on a PR during the season for a grand total of 0 weeks....so his net gain was zip! And from looks of it he was up in Canada anyway doing nothing....so why he didn't venture back here is a bit baffling

Likely didn't want to risk any potential NFL interest for a handful of CFL game cheques on rookie deal.

[GCn20]

On 2023-11-24 at 2:06 PM, JuranBoldenRules said:

Likely didn't want to risk any potential NFL interest for a handful of CFL game cheques on rookie deal.

For sure. That rookie NAT contract is a joke. His max is like 75K? a full season. He might as well take the whole season once he committed to go South.

[Doublezero]

Regardless of where Dru Brown signs next season (I hope it's the CFL and Winnipeg) how much will he be paid?
There's much speculation there will be multiple bids for his very obvious talent.
Based on this list of top 15 CFL QBs in 2023, where do folks see Brown, a first-year starter, in 2024?

https://3downnation.com/2023/04/17/the-cfls-15-highest-paid-quarterbacks-for-2023-season/

As there might be a bidding war, I see him falling somewhere between Vernon Adams Jr ($350,000) and Taylor Cornelius ($432,000).
It's an interesting list, BC got fair value out of VAJ, I'd say, and Cornelius, among others, way overpaid obviously.
If it were not for the fact that Cornelius is guaranteed 50% of his salary in 2024 - I could see Elks going hard after Brown and just cutting Cornelius altogether.

[JCon]

I would say, a 2-year deal $300k & $400k. Includes a $125k & $125k signing/roster  bonus. 

He has some leverage. 

[SpeedFlex27]

Brown would be a second tier starter so you have to look at what a guy like Taylor Cornelius made. Or if Jake Dloegala stays with the Riders. Some of the young guys like Dustin Crum & Taylor Powell (who I think will be a future star in the CFL) are probably still on rookie deals. It'll be interesting come 2025. 

[TBURGESS]

I'd say $160Kish all in. He's started 2 games on a dominant team. He's in Arbuckle territory, not Maier. 

[Stickem]

15 hours ago, Doublezero said:

Regardless of where Dru Brown signs next season (I hope it's the CFL and Winnipeg) how much will he be paid?
There's much speculation there will be multiple bids for his very obvious talent.
Based on this list of top 15 CFL QBs in 2023, where do folks see Brown, a first-year starter, in 2024?

https://3downnation.com/2023/04/17/the-cfls-15-highest-paid-quarterbacks-for-2023-season/


If it were not for the fact that Cornelius is guaranteed 50% of his salary in 2024 - I could see Elks going hard after Brown and just cutting Cornelius altogether.

AND just be a backup to Ford....Brown may as well stay here ??

[JuranBoldenRules]

3 year 300k hard money (at least 100k year 1 at signing) per year plus bonuses that push it to 400-450 based on performance and roster is the floor.  Could get some guaranteed money to seal it with 3-4 bidders.  So $1 million-$1.5 million over 3 years ball park.

Edmonton, Calgary, Hamilton, Ottawa are for sure in running.  Calgary has least flexibility until they trade Maier which would happen if they hooked Brown.  Hamilton and Ottawa have tons of flexibility.  One of them will end up with Brown or Maier for sure.

[Fatty Liver]

1 hour ago, Stickem said:

AND just be a backup to Ford....Brown may as well stay here ??

That wouldn't last long, within 2 games Jones would pull Ford and insert Brown.

[17to85]

3 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

I'd say $160Kish all in. He's started 2 games on a dominant team. He's in Arbuckle territory, not Maier. 

You think brown only gets 160k? If that's the case no way we lose him. Sadly for you, you're wrong.

[GCn20]

5 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

You think brown only gets 160k? If that's the case no way we lose him. Sadly for you, you're wrong.

160k...lol. I think he is 250k minimum...and there will be mutliple teams willing to pay him that even as a backup. That's the starting bid and he likely goes up from there.

Edited December 1, 2023 by GCn20

[JCon]

4 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

You think brown only gets 160k? If that's the case no way we lose him. Sadly for you, you're wrong.

$160k is a joke for a starting QB. Oh, but Keyboard Lawyer Warrior knows everything. 

[Jesse]

17 minutes ago, JCon said:

$160k is a joke for a starting QB. Oh, but Keyboard Lawyer Warrior knows everything. 

Not counting Kelly, who was on his rookie deal, the lowest paid starter was Adams, who got 350k.

The higher paid back-ups (Arbuckle and Shilts) received 130ish and then play time bonuses for starts. to get them in the low 200s.

It all depends if someone is going to go all-in on him as a starter, or if Dru is willing to bet on himself as a back-up somewhere where he thinks he can beat out an established starter or go behind a starter who's at a higher risk of missing time.

[Wheeler]

Would not be surprised at all if Oliveira makes an NFL training camp roster, and if he doesn't, his ask is gonna be huge.

 

[TBURGESS]

1 minute ago, 17to85 said:

You think brown only gets 160k? If that's the case no way we lose him. Sadly for you, you're wrong.

We're not keeping him because we don't have the ability to offer him what he really wants and needs... A realistic shot at the starting job. 

$160K is double what he's making now & more than any other backup QB on the list. He hasn't started many games. His 2 best games were against 4 win Edmonton and 6 win Calgary. 

He's not a starting QB. He's a backup with a ton of up side. He's Arbuckle, not Maier. The only way he gets Cornelius money is if multiple teams see his as 'the guy'. 

Masoli & BLM are done IMO. I'd retire Harris too, but the Riders seem to like him for some reason. 

Maier and Cornhole are both majorly overpaid for their contributions to their teams, which is what usually happens when you overpay based on the hope they will eventually be worth the money.

Maier started most of 2022 throwing for 2389 yards. Cornelius started most of 2022 and threw for 2768 yards. Brown started 2 games and threw for 983 yards. 

Looking at next year's QB's.

Bombers - Collaros

Lions - Adams

Argos - Kelly

Als - Fajardo

Stamps - Maier

Elks - Ford

Riders - Harris

Ticats - ??? - I'd guess BLM/Powell but I'd cut BLM to bring in Brown.

Redblacks - ??? - Best choice for Brown

[Jesse]

6 minutes ago, Wheeler said:

Would not be surprised at all if Oliveira makes an NFL training camp roster, and if he doesn't, his ask is gonna be huge.

 

I'm a huge Brady fan, but that would surprise me a lot.

His ask will also be limited by the position he plays. There's a ceiling for RBs.

2 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

We're not keeping him because we don't have the ability to offer him what he really wants and needs... A realistic shot at the starting job. 

$160K is double what he's making now & more than any other backup QB on the list. He hasn't started many games. His 2 best games were against 4 win Edmonton and 6 win Calgary. 

He's not a starting QB. He's a backup with a ton of up side. He's Arbuckle, not Maier. The only way he gets Cornelius money is if multiple teams see his as 'the guy'. 

Masoli & BLM are done IMO. I'd retire Harris too, but the Riders seem to like him for some reason. 

Maier and Cornhole are both majorly overpaid for their contributions to their teams, which is what usually happens when you overpay based on the hope they will eventually be worth the money.

Maier started most of 2022 throwing for 2389 yards. Cornelius started most of 2022 and threw for 2768 yards. Brown started 2 games and threw for 983 yards. 

Looking at next year's QB's.

Bombers - Collaros

Lions - Adams

Argos - Kelly

Als - Fajardo

Stamps - Maier

Elks - Ford

Riders - Harris

Ticats - ??? - I'd guess BLM/Powell but I'd cut BLM to bring in Brown.

Redblacks - ??? - Best choice for Brown

If he's brought in as a starter, proven or not, the starting salary starts with a 3. Of course, that's not a sure thing at this point. 

[Wheeler]

5 minutes ago, Jesse said:

I'm a huge Brady fan, but that would surprise me a lot.

His ask will also be limited by the position he plays. There's a ceiling for RBs.

There is no ceiling for a dominant Canadian RB in his mid twenties.

[Jesse]

2 minutes ago, Wheeler said:

There is no ceiling for a dominant Canadian RB in his mid twenties.

Highest contract ever given out was by us, to Andrew Harris, at 170k.

Brady could top that, but he's not blowing the pay scale out of the water. RBs are too replaceable. 

[Wheeler]

3 minutes ago, Jesse said:

Highest contract ever given out was by us, to Andrew Harris, at 170k.

Brady could top that, but he's not blowing the pay scale out of the water. RBs are too replaceable. 

Oliveira is a game changer, IMO the most dominant RB this league has seen since Mike Pringle.  Every team in the league will be interested, which will do nothing but drive up the price.  If you honestly think that a guy like Kenny Lawler will be making 6 figures more than Oliveira, well then I guess there is no use discussing this.    That said, isn't Lawler supposed to be getting even more coin this upcoming season?  

[JCon]

24 minutes ago, Wheeler said:

Would not be surprised at all if Oliveira makes an NFL training camp roster, and if he doesn't, his ask is gonna be huge.

 

Oliveira is not making a camp because there will be at least 10, non-drafted NCAA players to fill those roles. Never mind those that get drafted. 

1 minute ago, Wheeler said:

Oliveira is a game changer, IMO the most dominant RB this league has seen since Mike Pringle.  Every team in the league will be interested, which will do nothing but drive up the price.  If you honestly think that a guy like Kenny Lawler will be making 6 figures more than Oliveira, well then I guess there is no use discussing this.    That said, isn't Lawler supposed to be getting even more coin this upcoming season?  

BO will not make more than Lawyer. You have no idea what you're talking about. 

Ballsy? 

[Jesse]

2 minutes ago, Wheeler said:

Oliveira is a game changer, IMO the most dominant RB this league has seen since Mike Pringle.  Every team in the league will be interested, which will do nothing but drive up the price.  If you honestly think that a guy like Kenny Lawler will be making 6 figures more than Oliveira, well then I guess there is no use discussing this.    That said, isn't Lawler supposed to be getting even more coin this upcoming season?  

The top receivers have topped 300k for the past 2-3 seasons.

Top RBs, including Hall of Fame calibre Canadian Andrew Harris, has not hit 175k. I agree that Brady will set the market, but he's going to set the market as a RB, which is simply at a different scale than other positions.