CFL - 2024 Regular Season - Discussion Thread

[Colin Unger]

I wonder if anyone has the connections here to get access to the CFL stats API. I tried and failed. It would be nice to see which stats they actually give access too. 

[Goalie]

2 hours ago, Colin Unger said:

We lost the game due to a poor decision by Zach and an annoying fumble by Demski. We already signed Whitehead and he should be in the lineup next week I would think. Garbutt looks like a keeper.

Given the reason for the loss I'm not sure exactly which players the team should be expected to sign? 

Ya. The demski fumble. You assume we score a td there when Zach has 2 all year.  I’ll go as far to say the next play after would prob have been an interception into double coverage. That’s more likely than a TD 

Edited July 20 by Goalie

[WinnipegGordo]

 

[Tracker]

Most of this if not all is already evident but for the record, here goes. The organization has delayed the replacing of players on a graduated basis until we have now reached the point where major surgery is required and that, my friends, will mean wandering in the wilderness for a long time to come. Along the same line of thought, why in hell do we bother to have good players on the sidelines if they are never rotated in? The Bombers could have saved a lot of money, time and effort by not having any backups. 

Whether its offence or defensive units, when the same player(s) keep screwing up and giving winnable games away, the caring players eventually reach the "f***-it" point and start giving less than their best and this contributes to blowouts and extended losing streaks. 

There may be something physically wrong with Collaros. Near the end of the first quarter last night after he took a bit of a tumble, I saw him doing a certain stretch motion typical of those with nagging back injuries/pain. Also: if Streveler is injured, why have we not seen the third-string QB?

If O'Shea is solely responsible for the on-field decisions, then Walters is not doing his job. If the on-the field decisions are the choices of both Walters and O'Shea, then Wade Miller is not doing his job. If we have not passed the point of no return on this season, we have to be damned close.

[wbbfan]

https://3downnation.com/2024/07/21/opinion-shea-patterson-out-duelling-zach-collaros-should-give-rider-nation-faith-in-quarterback-future/
 

more mindless vomit from 3dn. Virtually every starting qb each week has out dueled zach. 

[JuranBoldenRules]

3 hours ago, Tracker said:

Most of this if not all is already evident but for the record, here goes. The organization has delayed the replacing of players on a graduated basis until we have now reached the point where major surgery is required and that, my friends, will mean wandering in the wilderness for a long time to come. Along the same line of thought, why in hell do we bother to have good players on the sidelines if they are never rotated in? The Bombers could have saved a lot of money, time and effort by not having any backups. 

Whether its offence or defensive units, when the same player(s) keep screwing up and giving winnable games away, the caring players eventually reach the "f***-it" point and start giving less than their best and this contributes to blowouts and extended losing streaks. 

There may be something physically wrong with Collaros. Near the end of the first quarter last night after he took a bit of a tumble, I saw him doing a certain stretch motion typical of those with nagging back injuries/pain. Also: if Streveler is injured, why have we not seen the third-string QB?

If O'Shea is solely responsible for the on-field decisions, then Walters is not doing his job. If the on-the field decisions are the choices of both Walters and O'Shea, then Wade Miller is not doing his job. If we have not passed the point of no return on this season, we have to be damned close.

I disagree with the premise here.  They have been letting guys go when they priced out or got squeezed out by other guys increases, or when they retired.  But they kept a lot of the wrong guys.

Like put Bailey and Grant on the roster and drop Bighill and Alexander.

Drop Alexander two years ago for a rookie when he was already crap and put that money into Casey Sayles.

They completely did not take the issue of rush end seriously in camp.

Same with receiver.  What a pile of trash we had in there.  No one ready to play by the time the season started of the 20.

[Colin Unger]

19 hours ago, Goalie said:

Ya. The demski fumble. You assume we score a td there when Zach has 2 all year.  I’ll go as far to say the next play after would prob have been an interception into double coverage. That’s more likely than a TD 

You're right.. I'm now glad he fumbled. Wouldn't have wanted to find out. Can we give Demski the gameball for this game and a gameball for misjudging the pass against BC late in the game too. 

[Mike]

On 2024-07-20 at 12:02 PM, Colin Unger said:

We lost the game due to a poor decision by Zach and an annoying fumble by Demski. We already signed Whitehead and he should be in the lineup next week I would think. Garbutt looks like a keeper.

Given the reason for the loss I'm not sure exactly which players the team should be expected to sign? 

Do you think that’s how it works? We lost the game because we are so untalented that those individual decisions now become game-changers.

We used to be so talented and capable up and down the roster that those isolated moments become forgettable because we’re already up three scores in the same spot.

[Goalie]

Brady ball was mainly running wild in the 4th quarter killing the clock last year. But yes a fumble when we put up 9 points all on long fgs was what cost us for sure. 

[Tracker]

13 hours ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

I disagree with the premise here.  They have been letting guys go when they priced out or got squeezed out by other guys increases, or when they retired.  But they kept a lot of the wrong guys.

Like put Bailey and Grant on the roster and drop Bighill and Alexander.

Drop Alexander two years ago for a rookie when he was already crap and put that money into Casey Sayles.

They completely did not take the issue of rush end seriously in camp.

Same with receiver.  What a pile of trash we had in there.  No one ready to play by the time the season started of the 20.

O'shea and possibly Walters hung onto obviously fading players like Kolankowski, Bighill, and a couple others long after they ought to have been gone and now the team is suffering for it. Instead of a continuous, slow replacement of these, we are now faced with wholesale change and it will be a  struggle to remain competitive while the new players settle in after being sorted out. The biggest help the Bomber playoff hopes have is that the Elks TiCats, RedBlacks,  and Stamps are sucking mightily.

[Goalie]

Kolo bighill sure but collaros is the main one on O tho. You developed your first Qb in ages and let him walk over a 35 36 yr old. It’s on all of them. 

Edited July 21 by Goalie

[Colin Unger]

1 hour ago, Mike said:

Do you think that’s how it works? We lost the game because we are so untalented that those individual decisions now become game-changers.

We used to be so talented and capable up and down the roster that those isolated moments become forgettable because we’re already up three scores in the same spot.

It's all a matter of perspective. I'm accepting the actual talent level of the team currently and then looking at the key mistakes that occured at key times.  We aren't talented enough to recover from key turnovers. And since you aren't going to suddenly become significantly more talented you gotta control the things you can control... like turnovers. 

1 hour ago, Goalie said:

Brady ball was mainly running wild in the 4th quarter killing the clock last year. But yes a fumble when we put up 9 points all on long fgs was what cost us for sure. 

It would appear you're ignoring the fact that I also blamed Zach for his poor interception. You want to frame it like i'm defending Zach when clearly i singled him and Demski out for their horrible mistakes.

The main reason we scored so few points was that when we actually made the plays to go deep into the Riders end of the field we committed turnovers. 

[Tracker]

2 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

It's all a matter of perspective. I'm accepting the actual talent level of the team currently and then looking at the key mistakes that occured at key times.  We aren't talented enough to recover from key turnovers. And since you aren't going to suddenly become significantly more talented you gotta control the things you can control... like turnovers. 

If the good players who are trying continue to see players who ought not to be on the field being trotted out game after game, frustration will rise leading to undisciplined play and subsequent penalties. I think the team is very close to that.

[Colin Unger]

1 minute ago, Tracker said:

If the good players who are trying continue to see players who ought not to be on the field being trotted out game after game, frustration will rise leading to undisciplined play and subsequent penalties. I think the team is very close to that.

I don't see that happening. Personally, I think its mostly just an echo chamber here of people who think this team would be saved by reshuffling the pencils they already have. Sure, this team can cobble together a season while it rebuilds especially as players like Lawler get added to the lineup.  But at best we're looking at a first round exit. We had a window to win championships with this nucleus and that's clearly closed.  The most important thing for this season is to continue to unearth new talent like Wilson, Woods, Adams, Garbutt, Bonds, Wheatfall ect.  We're going to need that and a good year in free agency in the offseason to stand a chance next year. They're going to have to find a way to build a team around zach that he can be successful with because with his guaranteed money he's certainly not going anywhere until after next season. 

[Super Duper Negatron]

10 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

I don't see that happening. Personally, I think its mostly just an echo chamber here of people who think this team would be saved by reshuffling the pencils they already have. Sure, this team can cobble together a season while it rebuilds especially as players like Lawler get added to the lineup.  But at best we're looking at a first round exit. We had a window to win championships with this nucleus and that's clearly closed.  The most important thing for this season is to continue to unearth new talent like Wilson, Woods, Adams, Garbutt, Bonds, Wheatfall ect.  We're going to need that and a good year in free agency in the offseason to stand a chance next year. They're going to have to find a way to build a team around zach that he can be successful with because with his guaranteed money he's certainly not going anywhere until after next season. 

Ok. Build for next year, got it. Is that what it looks like we are doing to you?

[Booch]

17 minutes ago, Tracker said:

If the good players who are trying continue to see players who ought not to be on the field being trotted out game after game, frustration will rise leading to undisciplined play and subsequent penalties. I think the team is very close to that.

I like how you hve touched on this, as I have said before even tho they talk about how tight they are...the culture..etc....outwordly.....inwardly i gets to a point where a core group of players will get very disenchanted, and like you said almost start to become more for me...than we...when they see certain players get preferential treatment, and play ahead of guys who rightfully should be taking majority of reps...or are coach's fav's...I've seen it/played within it first hand where it is the ultimate way to divide a room...and I see it happening here last yr already....and It's also a coach killer...self inflicted mind you...but their demise

Yeah Osh has won some games....we got to 4 Cups...tho lost 2 right at the feet of him...and will say again as others have also come to see now that we won a lot despite what Osh was doing...because we had elite guys in their prime that glossed over a lot of the real dumb decisions...we don't have that now...plus the lack of forward thinking and planning has us extremely bare in a lot of positions for any succession plan, and a few of our contracts we are stuck with barring a trade or out right release is gonna hamper us even being able to make say 2..3 bigger moves in free-agency next yr to fix that...seeing as our HC has no inclination whatsoever to allow any yhoung guys take over and show that they are it....

It's a what have you done for me lately and 2+ yrs now has been a HC who is oblivious to the situation, and almost doing things to the detriment of the squad soley on his personal biases....so to say there now way we would move on from him...especially if he shows no plan to change his ways, is a fail by Walter's and Miller....There are a lot of coaches out there who we could hire and we would be just fine....Osh isnt the be all end all of HC's....sometimes things just run their course

3 minutes ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

Ok. Build for next year, got it. Is that what it looks like we are doing to you?

no...we are setting ourselves ujp for epic collapse next yr clinging onto 2019-2021

[17to85]

Things are not so dismal for this team... they just need to actually be willing to be a meritocracy.

[Colin Unger]

6 minutes ago, Super Duper Negatron said:

Ok. Build for next year, got it. Is that what it looks like we are doing to you?

No i think they're focus is primarily still on winning.  But when you combine some aging players we kept and a bunch that we didn't keep then all the injuries in my view/hope its turning out to be a rebuilding year while we still make the playoffs. My hope is that as we get more players back they start to actually look for replacements for some weaker starters.  Would like to obviously see Wallace and Tui get more playing time at some point and taking a look at some more linebackers. Either guys we have here or signing NFL cuts who can make an impact next season. 

[Booch]

4 minutes ago, Colin Unger said:

No i think they're focus is primarily still on winning.  But when you combine some aging players we kept and a bunch that we didn't keep then all the injuries in my view/hope its turning out to be a rebuilding year while we still make the playoffs. My hope is that as we get more players back they start to actually look for replacements for some weaker starters.  Would like to obviously see Wallace and Tui get more playing time at some point and taking a look at some more linebackers. Either guys we have here or signing NFL cuts who can make an impact next season. 

well if they focused on winning this yr...as well as next....playing a number of guys as legit front liners the way we are won't get it done...and just puts us further behind the curve for 2025

[Tracker]

There is a truism that it is far better to be trusted than liked and pro athletes who are for the most part dependent on each other to win are acutely aware when teammates are not holding up their end of things. They are equally dependent on their coaches. Ultimately, they may grieve when a friend is cut but they have to believe it was for the team's best interest. If some players are unduly favoured, that must lead to dissent and resentments..

Edited July 21 by Tracker

[Colin Unger]

6 minutes ago, Booch said:

well if they focused on winning this yr...as well as next....playing a number of guys as legit front liners the way we are won't get it done...and just puts us further behind the curve for 2025

Players like Bighill, Nuefeld, Thomas and Kolo had better not be back next season.   Part of the problem is that there were so many aging players plus a horrible recruitment class last season that they kind of needed to choose some to replace and some to keep. In some cases they made the right and wrong choices.  Jefferson and Bryant are clearly by far the best of the aging players and I wouldn't be surprised if they could help us next season.

[Fatty Liver]

Good time as any for Walters to flip Collaros back to Pinball in exchange for Arbuckle, freeing up plenty of capital to work with and convincing Pinball he's made a great trade which gives him the option to dump Kelly.  Second part don't bother sending Arbuckle a plane ticket,  when he inquires send the following response.  

FIOFO.

Kyle

[Colin Unger]

Nobody is going to take on his salary that's guaranteed for next season right now. And if injuries occur i see teams trading for MBT or Masoli sooner then taking on guaranteed money next season.   Its crappy but we have to fix the offensive line and stick with him through next season. 

[wbbfan]

If Fajardo is going to be out for 6ish I could see them biting. Especially if they have a bad deal for us to eat. Maybe ott though they shouldn’t. 
 Edm, is a wild card. They could easily begin to play for assets rather than wins this year. But I’m sure they’d require a lot to eat that deal. 
 

We have to keep in mind that strevy signed a deal with significant play time incentives. If he hits those and we eat Zachs deal we could be in more cap trouble. 
 It’s critical that we start making moves to save money and cut old dead weight before too long. We need those cap bucks pronto. 

[Colin Unger]

The somewhat sad part is that it would be tremendously unlikely that even if he didn’t have guaranteed money and we were being offered a 1st round pick and an elite middle linebacker on an entry level deal I doubt that the team would have any interest in trading him even in this offseason.