CFL - 2024 Regular Season - Discussion Thread

[3rdand1.5]

Simply put Rourke IS NOT worth the contract he has today..........

Time will tell if he is what we saw this year or what we saw two years ago

I also agree with Booch, Betts was virtually a non factor.....and one step further I would also consider Covington mostly a miss.....

Taking emotion out of the equation, BC got a terrible return on investment with both Rourke and Betts for this season, and it would appear it is compounded by fines and potential draft pick losses.........very poor financial choices were made out on the West coast.......

[17to85]

Paying a qb that much rarely works out in the cfl these days

[Bigblue204]

Yeah I don't see Rourke winning a GC with that contract. 

[wbbfan]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

Paying a qb that much rarely works out in the cfl these days

If you’re legit flutie 2.0, and have an awesome front office bringing in excellent rookie dbs and WRs I think you can. With out that, real hard to see it happening. 
 

[HardCoreBlue]

15 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Yeah I don't see Rourke winning a GC with that contract. 

I’m sensing a restructuring of that contract sooner than later.

Edited November 6 by HardCoreBlue

[SpeedFlex27]

Rourke was a fool (as was his agent) if they thought the Lions would actually pay out to the life of that contract. It was just to sucker him into signing. Even with a retructuring, it'll be the most expensive in the CFL. Good luck signing their key free agents or bringing in others. Just bad management decisions. Extremely bad. 

[bluto]

Not defending the Rourke contract as a good one, but...

Using Collaros and Kelly as examples, the going rate for a starting, star type QB was set at 600k. So let's agree that Rourke was going to get that and maybe a bit more since the newer contract usually sets where the bar is.

Now 750-800k would be too high of a jump over the current standard for most of us to want our team to spend as it may remove one or even two experienced frontline players from re-signing. I know how this feels since we had to watch the likes of Adarius Pickett, Jamal Peters, DeWayne Hendrix, Boris Bede and Javon Leake leave when we had to pay Chad and make some difficult decisions over which players get to come back and which ones don't. 

But it's always that way when you pay your main man. 

But the SMS raises by 100k in each of the next 3 seasons (till 2028). So for most CFL General managers, that's kinda like being allowed to keep 2 more guys every season... presuming that when an entry level contract ends, if the team really wants the player to come back, his second deal gets him about a 50k bump (star players are different). But for BC... they gave their SMS increase money to Rourke.

Having Vernon Adams Jr makes it a bit weird... since you may be able to trade him and gain some assets, but unless a team is very thirsty for him they'll just wait for him to get cut from the Lions' roster since they almost certainly can't keep him and Rourke... BTW I don't discount that some team may want to make the deal to obtain VAj rather than risk some other team sign him. 

Sorry, longwinded and meandering so:

TL;DR - The Rourke Contract isn't great, but it isn't the disaster that some keep saying that it is... if Rourke is in fact a star level QB in this league over the contract's length

Edited November 7 by bluto

[Booch]

I just think in the makeup of the CFL salary structure....and the limited roster any contract...for anyone really that is in excess of 500..550k is just not a good move and the bang not worth the buck,

Such a fine line between allowing for nice accessory talent to compliment it, let alone have sustained roster continuity with proven vets in their prime when you start breeching 500k a yr. You see it often in the CFL where a team has to rob Peter to pay Paul and you have a deficient roster

We got lucky here with guys taking less to allow for an excessive vet laden roster....but thats not the norm, and likely won't see that again in the amount of guys, and the size of shave guys left on the table

And especially if you aren't a team that is hugely successful with draft/scouting to find top end entry level guys....you riding a slippery slope paying a QB 700k+ and then trying to lock in a couple guys to throw too that are top tier and gonna cost you likely 200k each per yr at minimum if you lucky....and thats not even factoring in 5 quality oline guys to protect that asset. And oh yeah...what about your defense???

700K+ NEXT yr and over 800k the following....if that not a lead anchor I don't know what is

[17to85]

36 minutes ago, bluto said:

Using Collaros and Kelly as examples, the going rate for a starting, star type QB was set at 600k. So let's agree that Rourke was going to get that and maybe a bit more since the newer contract usually sets where the bar is.

And the collaros contract is an anchor around the Bombers. It's negatively impacted the depth which was the whole reason they won in the first place... and also the difference is colalros got paid big after winning championships and not after having one good season.

[Bigblue204]

2 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

And the collaros contract is an anchor around the Bombers. It's negatively impacted the depth which was the whole reason they won in the first place... and also the difference is colalros got paid big after winning championships and not after having one half of a good season.

FTFY

[bluto]

36 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

And the collaros contract is an anchor around the Bombers. It's negatively impacted the depth which was the whole reason they won in the first place... and also the difference is colalros got paid big after winning championships and not after having one good season.

I'd thought so at the time they signed it. Not because he wasn't justifying it with his play and importance to your team, but the age profile and the possibility of him getting broken was a bit too risky for me. I get what you mean about sacrificing depth for a QB contract, but that's 1) what a SMS Cap makes you do anyway, 2) a personnel department's job to churn the roster to find the next guy at each position and most importantly, 3) it's an old maxim in the CFL but this is a QB driven league and no team goes anywhere without a frontline starter under centre. 

Edited November 7 by bluto

[bluto]

20 minutes ago, Booch said:

I just think in the makeup of the CFL salary structure....and the limited roster any contract...for anyone really that is in excess of 500..550k is just not a good move and the bang not worth the buck,

Such a fine line between allowing for nice accessory talent to compliment it, let alone have sustained roster continuity with proven vets in their prime when you start breeching 500k a yr. You see it often in the CFL where a team has to rob Peter to pay Paul and you have a deficient roster

We got lucky here with guys taking less to allow for an excessive vet laden roster....but thats not the norm, and likely won't see that again in the amount of guys, and the size of shave guys left on the table

And especially if you aren't a team that is hugely successful with draft/scouting to find top end entry level guys....you riding a slippery slope paying a QB 700k+ and then trying to lock in a couple guys to throw too that are top tier and gonna cost you likely 200k each per yr at minimum if you lucky....and thats not even factoring in 5 quality oline guys to protect that asset. And oh yeah...what about your defense???

700K+ NEXT yr and over 800k the following....if that not a lead anchor I don't know what is

Not disputing anything you say, Booch. You are arguing what ought. Here is what is:

You can have a Jake Maier for 300k. (after all figures added in)

You can have Dru Brown for 355k (rises to 400k next season and then he'll get a Big Boy contract afterward if he continues as a frontline starter)

You can have a Trevor Harris for 361k (he was on 500k and took a pay cut).

You can have Bo Levi for 361k (he made all of his bonuses and looks the bargain of the league after the pay-cut he took)

You can have a Cody Fajardo for 450k (after easily makeable bonuses).

You can have Vernon Adams Jr for 500k.

You can have a Zach or The Chad for 600k.

Welcome to the desert of the real, Neo.

[17to85]

1 hour ago, bluto said:

, 3) it's an old maxim in the CFL but this is a QB driven league and no team goes anywhere without a frontline starter under centre

Except Montreal. 

1 hour ago, bluto said:

Not disputing anything you say, Booch. You are arguing what ought. Here is what is:

You can have a Jake Maier for 300k. (after all figures added in)

You can have Dru Brown for 355k (rises to 400k next season and then he'll get a Big Boy contract afterward if he continues as a frontline starter)

You can have a Trevor Harris for 361k (he was on 500k and took a pay cut).

You can have Bo Levi for 361k (he made all of his bonuses and looks the bargain of the league after the pay-cut he took)

You can have a Cody Fajardo for 450k (after easily makeable bonuses).

You can have Vernon Adams Jr for 500k.

You can have a Zach or The Chad for 600k.

Welcome to the desert of the real, Neo.

200k difference is one more top of the line starter... or a bunch of depth pieces... it's significant 

[Brandon]

2 hours ago, bluto said:

Not disputing anything you say, Booch. You are arguing what ought. Here is what is:

You can have a Jake Maier for 300k. (after all figures added in)

You can have Dru Brown for 355k (rises to 400k next season and then he'll get a Big Boy contract afterward if he continues as a frontline starter)

You can have a Trevor Harris for 361k (he was on 500k and took a pay cut).

You can have Bo Levi for 361k (he made all of his bonuses and looks the bargain of the league after the pay-cut he took)

You can have a Cody Fajardo for 450k (after easily makeable bonuses).

You can have Vernon Adams Jr for 500k.

You can have a Zach or The Chad for 600k.

Welcome to the desert of the real, Neo.

Math isn't a strong point around these boards.   Every year people around here think that if one team signs one guy for a high contract that they have zero ability to fill out the rest of the roster.  

 

[bigg jay]

I love Willie but I'm not sure how he got selected as a league all-star this year other than name recognition.

[bluto]

1 hour ago, 17to85 said:

Except Montreal. 

200k difference is one more top of the line starter... or a bunch of depth pieces... it's significant 

It's actually 4.

Presuming that the difference between a player's first contract (when they try to make the team and stick) and his second (where he is established and gets a raise) is about 50k.

So BC has decided to forgo 2 of those players to have Nathan Rourke. It isn't a disaster if he plays like an MOP calibre starting QB.

[17to85]

Ever see a one man team win anything?

[HardCoreBlue]

2 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Ever see a one man team win anything?

Golf?

[blue85gold]

8 minutes ago, bluto said:

It's actually 4.

Presuming that the difference between a player's first contract (when they try to make the team and stick) and his second (where he is established and gets a raise) is about 50k.

So BC has decided to forgo 2 of those players to have Nathan Rourke. It isn't a disaster if he plays like an MOP calibre starting QB.

Huge if right now though!

[bluto]

9 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Ever see a one man team win anything?

False equivalency.

I'm talking about a team that takes two established players and lets them go in favor of two guys on their first contracts and a (hopefully) star quarterback.

Ask any fan of a team with poor play at QB if they'd make that trade.

[rebusrankin]

Marcus Sayles should not be all CFL. Heck having 2 out of the 5 secondary pieces from a team that was one of the worst against the pass is a joke.

[Fatty Liver]

1 hour ago, bigg jay said:

 

Where's Jake?

[HardCoreBlue]

3 minutes ago, Fatty Liver said:

Where's Jake?

Last time I saw him, his hands were on his hips looking quite tired after another straight forward bull rush dance with an OLineman.

Love you JT! Please don't hurt me.

[bearpants]

2 hours ago, bigg jay said:

I love Willie but I'm not sure how he got selected as a league all-star this year other than name recognition.

Was there really no good defensive ends in the league this year??

1 hour ago, rebusrankin said:

Marcus Sayles should not be all CFL. Heck having 2 out of the 5 secondary pieces from a team that was one of the worst against the pass is a joke.

When you spend all season hyping up a guy (Milligan)... you kind of have to put him on the all-star team... at least that's how the CFL media thinks...

Sayles, Micah, and Willie clearly prove name recognition is more important that actual playing ability... I would take Nichols over every one of the CFL "all-stars" in the secondary

[Jpan85]

The league leader in sacks had 8 this year.