Bombers at Riders LDC Early chat

[BaconNBigBlue]

Better be pitch outs, roll outs and Chris Streveler mixed in the keep the defense guessing as to what's coming.  Don't fully rely on long bombs.  Kill them with short to intermediate passes and mix in runs and the Riders will be crying into their beers by the evening.

 

[Arnold_Palmer]

Just now, BaconNBigBlue said:

Better be pitch outs, roll outs and Chris Streveler mixed in the keep the defense guessing as to what's coming.  Don't fully rely on long bombs.  Kill them with short to intermediate passes and mix in runs and the Riders will be crying into their beers by the evening.

 

We’ve been asking for Buck to use Streveler properly all season. If it hasn’t happened yet I don’t think it’s ever going to happen. 

[17to85]

10 minutes ago, Atomic said:

Zach actually had a pretty good start to 2023 and statistically it was one of the top 3 seasons of his career.

The bold is the key there... he fell off hard after that ugly BC game, it was only Brady that saved him from being exposed.

Moving on would have been bold sure, but to me it was a no trainer for the long term good of the team.

[Bigblue204]

28 minutes ago, Atomic said:

I don't disagree with the overall point but I'm not sure the Aaron Rodgers comparison is totally apt. Rodgers was coming off arguably the worst season of his career and his relationship with GB management had been strained, at best, for a year or more.

Zach actually had a pretty good start to 2023 and statistically it was one of the top 3 seasons of his career. And the Bombers management have a great relationship with Collaros. He just fell off hard in the final third of the season which has continued into this year.

But you're right - many people wanted to move on to Dru Brown from Collaros. That is not hindsight. It would have been an incredibly bold move to get rid of Collaros. But ultimately probably the right move.

I believe Rodgers was also at the end of his Contract...I could be wrong about that though. Getting rid of Collaros wasnt going to be as simple as we would like to believe. Cut him and we're on the hook for 2 yrs of $$. Or try to find a trade partner who could take on that contract, which likely means they get taken over coals as they wouldn't have much leverage in any deal. Maybe Ottawa takes him on if the Bombers signed Dru long term?

[WinnipegGordo]

 

 

[HardCoreBlue]

40 minutes ago, BaconNBigBlue said:

Better be pitch outs, roll outs and Chris Streveler mixed in the keep the defense guessing as to what's coming.  Don't fully rely on long bombs.  Kill them with short to intermediate passes and mix in runs and the Riders will be crying into their beers by the evening.

 

I like it.

As the saying goes, put the ball in the hands of the playmakers. 

[Booch]

44 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

I've heard Bryant is just fine. They're likely just giving him extra time to rest. As of right now I'm expecting that he plays sunday

Yeah he be fine and will play...he needs no reps...and its good for Randolph to see all the practice reps

I suspect we roll with Bryant/Dobson/Kolo/Randolph/Lofton...which is our starting group[ who have played well...with Eli as the 6th...Thomas as the 7th and we see MCI on roster....Clercius did a great job last game...well all yr, so not too concerned....and if we smart we use a lot of motion and move the launch point and have ZC rolling out...or actually implement stuff with Strev with motion and roll/outs and bootlegs as the Rider secondary is suspect and will bite and be easily torched with it...

[Super Duper Negatron]

48 minutes ago, BaconNBigBlue said:

Better be pitch outs, roll outs and Chris Streveler mixed in the keep the defense guessing as to what's coming.  Don't fully rely on long bombs.  Kill them with short to intermediate passes and mix in runs and the Riders will be crying into their beers by the evening.

 

Yeah, they either don't know how or don't want to mix Streveler in. At this point he is a less effective Prukop.

[rebusrankin]

Wait, how is the Riders secondary suspect? They have Ronald Milligan who is the best DB in CFL history. A combination of Rod Hill, Les Browne and Jovon Johnson. At least that what Suitor keeps saying.

[Booch]

2 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

Wait, how is the Riders secondary suspect? They have Ronald Milligan who is the best DB in CFL history. A combination of Rod Hill, Les Browne and Jovon Johnson. At least that what Suitor keeps saying.

i know...its very odd....lol

worst defensive stats basically for a secondary other than picks....But they have Milligan lol....all those tackles and combo of knock downs and picks would think he gets a lot of volume...almost targeted eh?...of TSN and their love of fluff stats

[Bigblue204]

13 minutes ago, Booch said:

Yeah he be fine and will play...he needs no reps...and its good for Randolph to see all the practice reps

I suspect we roll with Bryant/Dobson/Kolo/Randolph/Lofton...which is our starting group[ who have played well...with Eli as the 6th...Thomas as the 7th and we see MCI on roster....Clercius did a great job last game...well all yr, so not too concerned....and if we smart we use a lot of motion and move the launch point and have ZC rolling out...or actually implement stuff with Strev with motion and roll/outs and bootlegs as the Rider secondary is suspect and will bite and be easily torched with it...

I have little faith this is what will happen

[Rod Black]

28 minutes ago, WinnipegGordo said:

 

 

Woli’s back?! Did I read that right? 

[ShyGuy]

1 hour ago, Atomic said:

I don't disagree with the overall point but I'm not sure the Aaron Rodgers comparison is totally apt. Rodgers was coming off arguably the worst season of his career and his relationship with GB management had been strained, at best, for a year or more.

Zach actually had a pretty good start to 2023 and statistically it was one of the top 3 seasons of his career. And the Bombers management have a great relationship with Collaros. He just fell off hard in the final third of the season which has continued into this year.

But you're right - many people wanted to move on to Dru Brown from Collaros. That is not hindsight. It would have been an incredibly bold move to get rid of Collaros. But ultimately probably the right move.

Yeah I don't think the Rodgers comparison is super apt either. Rodgers is even older, Green Bay had a down year, he had a down year and Rodgers had a lot of super weird baggage coming to a head after that season. The Packers also had Love behind Rodgers, which isn't super dissimilar to the Brown situation but having invested a 1st round pick in Love is a lot bigger deal than just having Brown sitting behind Collaros.

I hope that they were having those conversations re: Collaros and Brown... but I can see why it never gained any traction.

Like just for Comparison sake

Rodgers in 2022: Probably the worst season in his career, doesn't even make the Pro Bowl (which is almost impressive for a QB in the NFL who starts all the games for their team lately with all the injury replacements), Green Bay misses the playoffs at 8-9. Talking about how he has been 'immunized' and sharing 9/11 conspiracies on Joe Rogans Podcast. One year removed from being back to back MVP.

Collaros in 2023: One of the best seasons of his career, CFL All Star at QB, Probably realistically was 3rd in MOP voting. Bombers make it to the Grey Cup for the 4th straight year at 14-4 in the regular season. By all accounts a great teammate and probably saves puppies with Oliveira in his spare time.

 

If anything Rodgers in 2022 was a preview of Collaros in 2024 (aside from all the weirdo stuff... so far)

 

[17to85]

54 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Getting rid of Collaros wasnt going to be as simple as we would like to believe. Cut him and we're on the hook for 2 yrs of $$. Or try to find a trade partner who could take on that contract, which likely means they get taken over coals as they wouldn't have much leverage in any deal. Maybe Ottawa takes him on if the Bombers signed Dru long term?

100% someone would have taken him if the Bombers put him on the trade market. Would have been the easiest thing in the world especially with Ottawa 100% needing a qb, or edmonton... or potentially sask or Hamilton or even Toronto what with Kelly's issues.

[Booch]

28 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

I have little faith this is what will happen

SADLY....I have to agree with you

[GCn20]

39 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

100% someone would have taken him if the Bombers put him on the trade market. Would have been the easiest thing in the world especially with Ottawa 100% needing a qb, or edmonton... or potentially sask or Hamilton or even Toronto what with Kelly's issues.

Getting rid of Zac would have taken one phone call. There are at least 5 teams that would have gladly traded for him. Brown would have fared no better this year in this offense. It's easier to blame the QB for a swiss cheese OL and receivers that are making rookie mistakes in route running. Is Zac still MOP calibre? Probably not but it is delusional to place all the blame on him. 

[17to85]

Collaros can barely move anymore, it exacerbates the protection issues. It's sad to watch him try and run away from pressure these days.

[Noeller]

Good news all around...

 

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, Bigblue204 said:

I've heard Bryant is just fine. They're likely just giving him extra time to rest. As of right now I'm expecting that he plays sunday

Mos just said he expects big Stan to play now, and thinks Wallace might be back this year. 
 It makes sense that they would give Stan time to rest. Recovering from that type of dehydration especially for a big guy, is no joke. 
  I do worry they might send him to go when he isn’t ready. 
 It does beg questioning how he became critically dehydrated on the first drive. Guy keeps him self in immaculate shape and is a real pro. Maybe it was a mistake or accident. But I hope it’s not a sign of deeper issues.  
 

2 hours ago, Atomic said:

I don't disagree with the overall point but I'm not sure the Aaron Rodgers comparison is totally apt. Rodgers was coming off arguably the worst season of his career and his relationship with GB management had been strained, at best, for a year or more.

Zach actually had a pretty good start to 2023 and statistically it was one of the top 3 seasons of his career. And the Bombers management have a great relationship with Collaros. He just fell off hard in the final third of the season which has continued into this year.

But you're right - many people wanted to move on to Dru Brown from Collaros. That is not hindsight. It would have been an incredibly bold move to get rid of Collaros. But ultimately probably the right move.

He did have streaks of about a month twice were he was not only brutal, but consistently throwing pick 6s. 
 Zach is a great great guy and team player though, Rodger’s is a turd. It’s hard to say when it’s time to move on from a guy like zach. But I think 90% of that call is dependant on having the next guy. Brown + strevy is the best case scenario to move on. You never get a better jumping off point. 

[IC Khari]

Just now, wbbfan said:

Mos just said he expects big Stan to play now, and thinks Wallace might be back this year. 
 It makes sense that they would give Stan time to rest. Recovering from that type of dehydration especially for a big guy, is no joke. 
  I do worry they might send him to go when he isn’t ready. 
 It does beg questioning how he became critically dehydrated on the first drive. Guy keeps him self in immaculate shape and is a real pro. Maybe it was a mistake or accident. But I hope it’s not a sign of deeper issues.  
 

He did have streaks of about a month twice were he was not only brutal, but consistently throwing pick 6s. 
 Zach is a great great guy and team player though, Rodger’s is a turd. It’s hard to say when it’s time to move on from a guy like zach. But I think 90% of that call is dependant on having the next guy. Brown + strevy is the best case scenario to move on. You never get a better jumping off point. 

[wbbfan]

2 hours ago, BaconNBigBlue said:

Better be pitch outs, roll outs and Chris Streveler mixed in the keep the defense guessing as to what's coming.  Don't fully rely on long bombs.  Kill them with short to intermediate passes and mix in runs and the Riders will be crying into their beers by the evening.

 

As much as moving the pocket, I’d have slot backs chipping ends, and go with an extra blocker. Either chip LT or put a fb/6th ol with him. We could use a chip and a half roll. If zach is on a 5 step, instead of dropping straight back slide step to the side, or do a fast 3 step sprint out and reset. 
 Balancing all those different augmentations to our pass pro will be critical to keeping the riders off balance and zach in time to pass. Even if Stan is healthy I’d put in a lot of that. 

[wbbfan]

40 minutes ago, 17to85 said:

Collaros can barely move anymore, it exacerbates the protection issues. It's sad to watch him try and run away from pressure these days.

The mobility issue isn’t physical now imo. Early in the year I think it was a game shape issue. The last two weeks we’ve seen him do a much better job with his feet. 
 The problem is he often tucks the ball as soon as he sees pressure and takes his eyes off the down field targets. He stares into the blitz then tries to get the ball out of his arm and back to his hand then throws half blind. The moment he tucks the ball any one in the tackle box rushes him. The moment he takes his eyes off the targets he loses coverage adjustments. 
 

When zach was at his best here he wasn’t crazy fast escaping, he was really poised. Eyes down field, ball ready to throw, stepping confidently not panicking.  He always seemed fast enough to beat any rush, because the threat of throwing and running keeps the D honest. Because his goal was to take whatever was open. Not force a shot to over compensate. 

[Noeller]

11 minutes ago, wbbfan said:

It does beg questioning how he became critically dehydrated on the first drive. Guy keeps him self in immaculate shape and is a real pro. Maybe it was a mistake or accident. But I hope it’s not a sign of deeper issues. 

He had the flu all last week...

[wbbfan]

Just now, Noeller said:

He had the flu all last week...

That makes a lot of sense, I hadn’t heard that. I hope they do a good check on him before game time, and I’m sure they will our trainers are ace. 

[Noeller]

Just now, wbbfan said:

That makes a lot of sense, I hadn’t heard that. I hope they do a good check on him before game time, and I’m sure they will our trainers are ace. 

I believe MOS said this during the OB post game... But I know I heard it somewhere.