111th Grey Cup- Argos vs Bombers GDT

[JohnnyAbonny]

1 minute ago, Booch said:

well...Smith was more than fine...and probably would have got better...plus he has the most explosive speed on the team....so management had a guy....Osh refused to play him...he did nothing to play himself off the roster. an that other older punter was 2x the punter that punter guy is....but he had the freaky goofball style Osh got all horned up over...so it sealed the other guys fate...that dude could boom it if need be and had serious hang time.....

i'd take him back

Yup, Smith would have been 100x better than Lucky returning, I meant botching the Grant situation. 
And like you said, Walters is the boss. Part of being a good boss is not micromanaging, but part of it is also stepping in when the people underneath are clearly ******* up. 

 

Edited November 18 by JohnnyAbonny

[JuranBoldenRules]

1 minute ago, wbbfan said:

If you can run 9 times for 10 yards a pop, you can run 20 times in the game. 
 I don’t think fixing the ol will be easy. I’d start by flipping an imp at G though. 

Couple big runs and garbage time.  Yeah I would have liked them to run more especially out of a zone read look.  They needed to get Collaros moving a lot more too and get more easy throws.  Worst place for him to be on 90% of snaps was a straight drop back but we did it.

But it's folly to just say feed the back.  It's a massive oversimplification.

[Goalie]

2 minutes ago, JohnnyAbonny said:

You know they will

Some guys are done. Thomas won’t be back. I’d be beyond shocked. Neufeld is another. Not as shocked there but cooked. Every year there is some changes. There will be some here also. I’m not sure if it’s as much as some of us hope for tho. 

Edited November 18 by Goalie

[JuranBoldenRules]

2 minutes ago, Bigblue204 said:

Ball was overthrown to wheatfall. 

It was in the right spot.  If it's right on him it's a pick like the one before to Lawler should have been with them in Cover 2 cut in the red zone.

Wheatfall just an awful player.  Not a pro level player.

[Tracker]

8 minutes ago, Booch said:

Nobody needs to be run out of town coaching wise....that being said they need to really....reallly look inward and realize where they failed....an why.....with explanation and discussion with GM and President and put forth their plan of action to fix it

Osh needs to be sat down and made realize that he has to let go of aging....downside vets and move forward with new....younger guys. And if it means Walters not bringing guys back to his displeasure...so be it....Walters is the Boss....not Osh

He aslo has to realize standing pat on what has worked...or used to, and having his mantra that we good and they all starters....they here cause they help us win....and the other tripe he feeds us is not working and he needs to evolve/adapt

In all honesty....what evolution have you seen since 2022?...if anything I have seen regression. Another bee in the bonnet too is his force feeding his need to play more Canadians than required due to his Patriotic Canadianism bias....which it totally is and structure his roster accordingly. Lots of people will crap on American coaches for their American bias...and seemingly neglecting some Canadians...but in actuality they are playing their best players....With Osh it's the opposite....you can disagree all you want but it's been smack dab in our face the last 2 yrs.....if anyone seriously thinks excessive Thomas and Schmeck playing on the dline is better than any 2 americans we have....or could have brought in during the season until we found the right guy(s) is seriously delusional....we didn't have to do that at all....but we did

You either have to adapt and or evolved...or you destined to fail...we've failed 3 straight yrs.....time to adapt and evolve

I am over my hissy-fit and have apologized to my wife, so am allowed back on my laptop. This was far crueler an outcome than previous years. Last year Collaros was spiraling downwards in the playoffs and the team was lucky to get to the Cup game and I didn't think we had a chance. This year, Collaros looked like he exorcized his demons in thrashing the Riders, but choked even worse than 2023. And the sub-par players from last year were all brought back to be starters. The only coach who should not be afraid to answer his phone is Younger.

[Bigblue204]

Just now, JuranBoldenRules said:

Couple big runs and garbage time.  Yeah I would have liked them to run more especially out of a zone read look.  They needed to get Collaros moving a lot more too and get more easy throws.  Worst place for him to be on 90% of snaps was a straight drop back but we did it.

But it's folly to just say feed the back.  It's a massive oversimplification.

It really isn't. Feeding him the ball up the middle is sure. But you have to design your offense around your best players. Brady was an after thought today and it's happened too many times this year.

[Booch]

1 minute ago, Goalie said:

Some guys are done. Thomas won’t be back. I’d be beyond shocked. Neufeld is another. Not as shocked there but cooked. 

Didnt Thomas signa 2 yr deal?...and he has said he wants to keep playing...Walter's needs to release him.....cause if he doesnt....you know damn well Osh will trot him out there for 80% of the snaps

[Noeller]

I know people will laugh, but honestly I'm good right now. It was a hell of a run just to get to the game. Next year is going to be epic. I already can't wait. 

Virtually everything JBR had posted is dead on. 

[wbbfan]

1 minute ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

Couple big runs and garbage time.  Yeah I would have liked them to run more especially out of a zone read look.  They needed to get Collaros moving a lot more too and get more easy throws.  Worst place for him to be on 90% of snaps was a straight drop back but we did it.

But it's folly to just say feed the back.  It's a massive oversimplification.

The last 4 runs were garbage time the first 9 was the game with in a few points both ways. Brady had two short runs rest were putting us in 2nd and short. 
 I think we could’ve run almost any other game plan and done better tbh. Play action screen to Brady, pin and pull, name it. 

[captaincanuck12]

https://3downnation.com/2024/11/15/bombers-elders-stanley-bryant-jake-thomas-still-not-sold-on-retirement/#:~:text=While he certainly isn't,I'm enjoying it.

There's your answer about Thomas.   I think Bryant has more in the tank, but we need to start thinking about the future 

[rkp]

dont think schoen is coming back, sounds like he wants to get paid big money for his work and collaros making what he is making doesnt leave much for anything else...maybe time to cut bait with collaros....how many first downs did he make....why wasnt the game plan same against the riders, it was just drop back and pass the long ball....(have to wonder if collaros wants to do the run option or roll out)........ it didnt work previously, why would it work now...no running game out of the gate......i dont expect anything next season and wont wasting time on a losing effort in the end

[wbbfan]

Just now, Booch said:

Didnt Thomas signa 2 yr deal?...and he has said he wants to keep playing...Walter's needs to release him.....cause if he doesnt....you know damn well Osh will trot him out there for 80% of the snaps

🤢

 I have to think Lawson takes a lot of snaps next year. Garbutt Lawson woods wj would look really good. 

[JuranBoldenRules]

Just now, wbbfan said:

The last 4 runs were garbage time the first 9 was the game with in a few points both ways. Brady had two short runs rest were putting us in 2nd and short. 
 I think we could’ve run almost any other game plan and done better tbh. Play action screen to Brady, pin and pull, name it. 

Our current OL did not move very much.  Don't think they trust Dobson.  Saw a lot more pressing A gaps and power traps with Geoff Gray in there and mobile.

Bryant basically voiced this to media this week but they didn't get the slam on Dobson that it was.

[Deiter Fan]

1 minute ago, Goalie said:

Some guys are done. Thomas won’t be back. I’d be beyond shocked. Neufeld is another. Not as shocked there but cooked. 

The scary aspect is that none of these guys want to pack it in and if they have a coach that is loyal to a fault and will let them come back...that's a bad combo. When I saw Bighill saying he wants to/will come back all I could think was if that's what he wants you can bet O'Shea will likely let him without even having to fight for the job in camp.

[Mark H.]

I hate saying this, but I was not surprised.  Problem #1 was the over match in the trenches.  Neuf & Kola vs. Ceresna - was going to end badly.

[Booch]

1 minute ago, wbbfan said:

🤢

 I have to think Lawson takes a lot of snaps next year. Garbutt Lawson woods wj would look really good. 

I agree...and I think Person's is gonna be a rookie of yr candidate for us....But you me and the lady in the tree know thatif Osh has access to Thomas....he will get way too many reps...his 100+k needs to go elsewhere

[JuranBoldenRules]

1 minute ago, rkp said:

dont think schoen is coming back, sounds like he wants to get paid big money for his work and collaros making what he is making doesnt leave much for anything else...maybe time to cut bait with collaros....how many first downs did he make....why wasnt the game plan same against the riders, it was just drop back and pass the long ball....(have to wonder if collaros wants to do the run option or roll out)........ it didnt work previously, why would it work now...no running game out of the gate......i dont expect anything next season and wont wasting time on a losing effort in the end

There's no shortage of cash.  Off football operations since pandemic they have 8 figures in the kitty.  If they want to be in the home Grey Cup and win it they have the money to have whoever they want on the roster of current CFL players.

[Goalie]

Heads will roll when we bring back the roster and pull a BC next year. 

[bluto]

3 minutes ago, Noeller said:

I know people will laugh, but honestly I'm good right now. It was a hell of a run just to get to the game. Next year is going to be epic. I already can't wait. 

Virtually everything JBR had posted is dead on. 

Why would anyone laugh at that? The second half of the season the bombers were the best team in the league. There are some players and coaches who could get trimmed and restaffed but honestly this is a team that should be back looking to come first in the west again.

[Bigblue204]

2 minutes ago, rkp said:

dont think schoen is coming back, sounds like he wants to get paid big money for his work and collaros making what he is making doesnt leave much for anything else...maybe time to cut bait with collaros....how many first downs did he make....why wasnt the game plan same against the riders, it was just drop back and pass the long ball....(have to wonder if collaros wants to do the run option or roll out)........ it didnt work previously, why would it work now...no running game out of the gate......i dont expect anything next season and wont wasting time on a losing effort in the end

Making things up works a lot better in ssk. 

[JohnnyAbonny]

7 minutes ago, JuranBoldenRules said:

Couple big runs and garbage time.  Yeah I would have liked them to run more especially out of a zone read look.  They needed to get Collaros moving a lot more too and get more easy throws.  Worst place for him to be on 90% of snaps was a straight drop back but we did it.

But it's folly to just say feed the back.  It's a massive oversimplification.

This was driving me nuts. They rolled out Zach once and it worked perfectly, didn’t do it again for the rest of the game. 

[JuranBoldenRules]

Just now, Mark H. said:

I hate saying this, but I was not surprised.  Problem #1 was the over match in the trenches.  Neuf & Kola vs. Ceresna - was going to end badly.

Yep.  Was sad when he was traded and we weren't the acquiring team.  Exact kind of guy we needed along with a rookie rush end to fill out our DL.

[Doublezero]

19 minutes ago, rebusrankin said:

MOS stays and they likely can Buck.

If I was Walters: Biggie, Neufeld, Kolo, Alexander, K. Wilson, Lucky, Augustine, Jake are all gone.

I am OK with the coaching, including Buck. I think today's game plan just showed lack of confidence the O-line could compete with Argos front four and backer box. So they decided to not give the ball to Brady thinking Argos would expect that. One coaching irritation is that MOS is stubborn to a fault - very loyal to his players leading to bonehead roster decisions. Now 10 years in, I would also question his in-game management. You'd think after so long at the helm he wouldn't make so many mistakes. As for keeping the has-been players - It is no coincidence that MOS himself chose to continue to play as an older veteran player and did not retire after he was spent - hung on til the bitter end when he had to be cut. As for Walters - don't forget it was Walters who signed ZC to a 3-year $550/per deal when he really didn't have to. Could have easily gone 1+. It was also Walters who let the leagues best kick returner - who returned 5 TDs this year alone - get away. To his credit, Walters did re-sign Brady and Dalton Schoen when no one thought he could. It just meant there was nothing left for Janarion Grant and it could have been predicted that that would not turn out well - just as even the fans could see that ZC was done a year or more ago. But Bombers had to keep him because of that contract.

[deepsixemtoboyd]

53 minutes ago, Mike said:

Why is it insane? The two issues aren’t mutually exclusive. If we had lost three in a row without winning the two previous, this wouldn’t even be a discussion and let’s be honest, O’Shea 2022-2024 isn’t even remotely the same coach that he was prior. 

I think you are overreacting. It is upsetting, for sure. And the coach needs to take his share of accountability for what happened today. Just as does Zach.
Maybe it’s fair to say there’s something about this particular combination of coaches and core players that seems to have trouble Executing in the big games? Too obvious? 🙂 At the end of the day O’Shea is still one of the most successful coaches in the history of the franchise and put us in the position to win the whole thing five times in a row… You don’t fire that type of coach. Not when he still getting you to the dance… But some adjustments need to be made. 

obviously one of his great strengths is he is a culture guy… I just don’t know if he’s much of a strategy guy. Their strategy guy, Dinwiddie, out strategied whoever our strategy guys are. Again, I don’t think that is MOS‘s skill set… But it’s on him to find guys who compete with a guy like Dinwiddie.

Keep in mind too MOS has repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly said that he is 110% a Zach guy and has no plans to move on from him… So if you have issues with Zach then you have issues with MOS. Or you should. 

[Goalie]

Man these replays on tsn right now. We got jobbed on a few potential turning points. The one pick 48 Toronto was offside and I still don’t think that Argo player was actually going for the ball on the blocked punt.