DR. CFL Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 The impact of thinking you can plug and play ala the Mack philosophy fails to take into consideration, team chemistry, leadership and the impact in the locker room. The difference between a glorified personnel guy and a General Manager.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Why is it people continue to say a team is cheap? The cap is the cap how you distribute that money is a team philosophy. At one point Edm paid Ray 450k of their cap was that sound? Because the SMS is complete garbage that's why, a community owned team hasn't won the cup since the SMS came in. The last 5 Grey Cup winners have all been private owners with Braley and Wetenhal tied at 2 each, lol. It's a paper sham, the perks and bonuses that those two pay out on the side to players/coaches wives/girlfriends would make your head spin.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 cough cough Chris Matthews cough cough Bet I can name 3 to your one: Jordin Toarmina Any number of players to try SAM Pierre 'crap the bed' Labbe at MLB (and he had a few years under his belt)
kelownabomberfan Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 who would you have gone out and got? wait. You aren't supposed to ask that. You're just supposed to nod your head and agree that we should have gone out and signed all of these magic free agents that existed in fairy land. That's the way to look like a football genius.
kelownabomberfan Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Because the SMS is complete garbage that's why, a community owned team hasn't won the cup since the SMS came in. The last 5 Grey Cup winners have all been private owners with Braley and Wetenhal tied at 2 each, lol. It's a paper sham, the perks and bonuses that those two pay out on the side to players/coaches wives/girlfriends would make your head spin. I'd love to hear what perks and bonuses you know are being paid on the side.
Jpan85 Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Bet I can name 3 to your one: Jordin Toarmina Any number of players to try SAM Pierre 'crap the bed' Labbe at MLB (and he had a few years under his belt) Alex Hall, Chad Simpson?
DR. CFL Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 And if anyone thinks that Henoc Muamba is going to be the next Shay Emery at MLB they are delusional .
Jpan85 Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 And if anyone thinks that Henoc Muamba is going to be the next Shay Emery at MLB they are delusional . yeah he is not going to be a complete ass
AKAChip Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 And if anyone thinks that Henoc Muamba is going to be the next Shay Emery at MLB they are delusional . What does this even mean?
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Alex Hall, Chad Simpson? Guys with NFL experience....really, I'd take as many as those as Mack can convince to come North, unfortunately most are just prospects not professionals.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 wait. You aren't supposed to ask that. You're just supposed to nod your head and agree that we should have gone out and signed all of these magic free agents that existed in fairy land. That's the way to look like a football genius. You need to see my reply to 17to85, this isn't about signing free agents, it's about choosing to develop prospects instead.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 I'd love to hear what perks and bonuses you know are being paid on the side. Wetenhal has been giving away trips to Europe as door prizes to players wives/girlfriends at his 'appreciation parties' for years.....it was all over the CFL site that Cobournes better half won the trip for two to Paris.......there is more out there too, you just have do your own looking.
Jpan85 Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Guys with NFL experience....really, I'd take as many as those as Mack can convince to come North, unfortunately most are just prospects not professionals. I could also spit out three former NFLers that the CFL has swallowed and spit back out for everyone that's worked.
Uncle Bill Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 "Wetenhal has been giving away trips to Europe as door prizes to players wives/girlfriends at his 'appreciation parties' for years.....it was all over the CFL site that Cobournes better half won the trip for two to Paris.......there is more out there too, you just have do your own looking." The CFL knows and condones these perks? The eight team governors have turned a blind eye to this recognizing it hurts some teams and unduly rewards others? Gracious people these CFL governors....
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 I could also spit out three former NFLers that the CFL has swallowed and spit back out for everyone that's worked. For sure, the point remains though, you either agree with the path management has taken or you don't. I just don't see any upside. People want to point to the improvement from 2010 to 2011 when they stood pat but it was more than just staying pat, the pieces were already in place for that team, this one, I'm not so sure about.
kelownabomberfan Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Apparently it wasn't as obvious to some but, it should be common knowledge for football fans that when you replace a proven player at a position with a prospect there is usually a learning curve and drop off at the position before any real progress is made. Thinking you can just 'plug in' a prospect (even a sophomore) at the professional level without a drop off initially, is just foolish. Now a team that goes from GC finalist to out of the playoffs the following year (in spectacular fashion too boot) should be enough proof of the kind of drop off you can have if you go too far. In spectacular fashion? Burke lets Palardy kick the FG against the Riders in the Banjo bowl and we're in the playoffs.
17to85 Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 You need to see my reply to 17to85, this isn't about signing free agents, it's about choosing to develop prospects instead. I think you missed the point I was making entirely... The point is, get better qbing the roster is good enough to be in a grey cup, spend the year with the qb constantly getting hurt and you miss the playoffs. That is the issue here, QB. Get a good reliable qb in there this roster is perfectly able to make the playoffs. Hell look at Toronto for a good example as well. Poor qb play they're out of the playoffs, add the top qb in the league they win the Grey Cup. You want to talk about the roster and it's problems it starts at one position.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 In spectacular fashion? Burke lets Palardy kick the FG against the Riders in the Banjo bowl and we're in the playoffs. Still a far cry from the 2011 season even without all the one sided games that 2012 came with.
pigseye Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 I think you missed the point I was making entirely... The point is, get better qbing the roster is good enough to be in a grey cup, spend the year with the qb constantly getting hurt and you miss the playoffs. That is the issue here, QB. Get a good reliable qb in there this roster is perfectly able to make the playoffs. Hell look at Toronto for a good example as well. Poor qb play they're out of the playoffs, add the top qb in the league they win the Grey Cup. You want to talk about the roster and it's problems it starts at one position. No my friend, neither the 2010 or the 2012 teams were good enough to get to the Grey Cup with just better QB'ing and if you think that, then you have a lot to learn about football. That 2011 team was damned good, they just lost to a better really good team in the cup.
Armchair GM Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Bet I can name 3 to your one: Jordin Toarmina Any number of players to try SAM Pierre 'crap the bed' Labbe at MLB (and he had a few years under his belt) LOL... do you really think playing half the season with Turnstile Taormina was the Bombers' preference? Of course they'd rather have had their starter Douglas in there. Hefney could easily have ended the SAM debacle by doing exactly what he's doing in Cowtown... what the coaches ask. Non issue if he does that. Do you really think Labbe starting at MIKE was the Bombers' plan? Stop gap until Muamba was ready. Even the mildest of Bomber fans could see that. And by the way... "found" quality players who made an impact last year: Chris Matthews, Alex Hall, Chad Simpson, Justin Sorenson, Will Ford. I'll stop now, my point is made.
iso_55 Posted June 23, 2013 Report Posted June 23, 2013 Because the SMS is complete garbage that's why, a community owned team hasn't won the cup since the SMS came in. The last 5 Grey Cup winners have all been private owners with Braley and Wetenhal tied at 2 each, lol. It's a paper sham, the perks and bonuses that those two pay out on the side to players/coaches wives/girlfriends would make your head spin. As long as the penalties are so light teams will cheat. Last year was the first year since the SMS came in that all teams abided by it. The first time! So, if I was a GM & I had to pay a penalty of dollar for dollar for being over the cap, say in the neighbourhood of $50,000 to $100,000 to win a GC by sign an impact player to get my team over the top, I'd do it. And that is the problem. GMs should be fined as well & not just the teams.
pigseye Posted June 24, 2013 Report Posted June 24, 2013 I agree with everything JBR says but I will add my own two cents. Let's say for example you are concerned about the WIL position this year. Obviously we weren't bringing in anyone in the past because we had Bowman and bringing in a veteran backup to a proven commodity is both expensive and generally completely uneccessary. Parker is by no means a proen commodity in the CFL and even if I personally am high on him, it doesn't mean squat. However, we are at the VERY least better off with him than we would be with Shomari Williams who is the closest thing to a WIL LB who hit free agency this year. Or if you're in the mood for a DB, last year we could have signed Byron Parker who was signed by BC and had a less than stellar year only to be released and signed by Montreal. Let's see if he lasts more than one year there. To say one "marquee" free agent in the last 4 years would solidify four positions is absolutely ludicrous. Remember when everyone in Winnipeg was crestfallen that we couldn't finalize a deal with "marquee" free agent Richard Karikari a few years back? That one sure bit us in the butt. One a year over the last 4 years: 2010 - Buck Pierce QB, solidified starter 2011 - We didn't need much going in, there were some guys available Eric Taylor & Terrius George on the dline and Archibald, Hudson, Ramsay on the oline, could of solidified 2 line spots. 2012 - Oliners available, Picard, Parenteau, O'Neil, could have used 1 of them, Rod Davis LB, Koch WR, there's 3 more spots 2013 - LB Black, DE Foley, DB Brown, 2 or 3 more there It's very easy to solidify 4 starting spots in 4 years just from the handful of guys I mentioned.
17to85 Posted June 24, 2013 Report Posted June 24, 2013 No my friend, neither the 2010 or the 2012 teams were good enough to get to the Grey Cup with just better QB'ing and if you think that, then you have a lot to learn about football. That 2011 team was damned good, they just lost to a better really good team in the cup. but 2010 and 2012 were good enough to get to the playoffs with better quarterbacking... and once you're in the playoffs who knows what happens. Look there is a mountain of evidence that says the teams with the best quarterbacking wind up being the best teams in the league... why do you think that the Als have been contenders each and every year? It's because they have had unreal stability at the quarterback position regardless of who else is on the roster. Why do you think BC has been good for so long? Because Wally has always provided them with at very least servicable quarterbacking. There is only one real issue with this roster and it happens to be the hardest position to fill. I stand by that and I think we'll see it play out that way this year again. If this team gets servicable quarterbacking they will be a playoff team.
JuranBoldenRules Posted June 24, 2013 Report Posted June 24, 2013 One a year over the last 4 years: 2010 - Buck Pierce QB, solidified starter 2011 - We didn't need much going in, there were some guys available Eric Taylor & Terrius George on the dline and Archibald, Hudson, Ramsay on the oline, could of solidified 2 line spots. 2012 - Oliners available, Picard, Parenteau, O'Neil, could have used 1 of them, Rod Davis LB, Koch WR, there's 3 more spots 2013 - LB Black, DE Foley, DB Brown, 2 or 3 more there It's very easy to solidify 4 starting spots in 4 years just from the handful of guys I mentioned. You want Tristan Black starting at WIL LB?
pigseye Posted June 24, 2013 Report Posted June 24, 2013 You want Tristan Black starting at WIL LB? Unfortunately, when something better than what you have comes along, as a GM you owe it to the fans to take a look, you know, due diligence, something the Bombers have had no interest in pursuing of late.
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