Chevy

[Brandon]

I was referring to burying as in him admitting that pav is a bad goalie to the public.

[TrueBlue]

I was referring to burying as in him admitting that pav is a bad goalie to the public.

If you are referring to my comments, I didn't suggest he admits that Pavelec is a bad goalie. What good does that do? But answering the question in a little more open-ended format was what I would have expected at this point in time.

[Floyd]

Dubnyk for a 30+ year old third (fourth) liner and retained salary...  I'd say this is the market for Pavelec

[Nasty Nate]

 

 

 

Olli is a good player - 3rd or 4th liner but he doesn't play with grinding intensity and like many Jets his meanness level is fairly low, taking the odd bad penalty to hope fans decipher that as intensity.

 

I think Chevy might shoot for a 2 million discount on a one year contract - approx. 2.5 mill. a year but Ollie will probably instruct his agent to bluff up Chevy and go for 3.5.

 

Maybe the answer lies in giving Jokinen two more years at 2.75 per year. Thats about what I'd give him to continue. But there's always a chance a desperate franchise gives him over 3 million. ie. Toronto, Buffalo, NYI or Edmonton.

 

Maurice likes him but we need more grit "n grind on this team, not just guys who are good in the room and who fess up when the going gets tough and a spokesman is needed for media interviews.

 

I understand Chevy's dilemma - he lets Jokinen walk he's still got to field an equivalent player. The way Chevy is he'd be rolling dice with a waiver wire pickup or pray he'll have a junior or Ice cap player ready.

 

Except your asessment of Jokinen is not true.  According to Paul Maurice, he very much likes Jokinen's defensive play. 

 

Maurice is the current coach. He speaks highly of everyone on his current team. If he was coming at it from his previous perch as a media analyst his tone would change significantly. I'm not saying Joker isn't a good player - but at 35/36 he's not a 4.5 million guy. 

Maurice has been blowing a ton of smoke since taking over for Noel. The yap about talking to his family regarding a long-term coaching contract with True North is a bit of a ruse imho.

He's really thinking about whether he wants to coach a team of mostly over-performers who might still be 3 years away from a legit playoff challenge cuz the Jets roster is just NOT THAT GOOD!

But a guy like Maurice can't say that......his out is the one he's been setting up for weeks - that his family has to agree!

Even Clod Noel maintained to his firing day that he 'like his team', liked his players. 

 

Maurice is tremendous at setting up low expectations. Did you hear him talking about Pavelec and turning it around to a mini-lecture about total team conditioning?

 

Nate, Maurice signed a new contract. Why would he do that for a bunch of overachievers if he didn't want to be here?. Maurice may be the best head coach the Jets 1.0 & 2.0 have ever had. We are fortunate to have him. I am extremely pleased he is coming back. Not pleased that Cheveldae announced Pavlec as the Jets starting goalie next year as that should have been Maurice. Still Chevy & Maurice must have discussed our goaltending & reached a consensus or he wouldn't have said that publicly.

 

That was the one time I wouldn't have minded Chevy going into his usual waffle-off style and not giving a direct answer!

Anyways, prolly an 80% chance Pavelec is the starter. I say that cuz Chevy's track record in trades is pretty dank. Traded a solid #3 d-man in Oduya for picks. Traded his 2nd rd pick for a piece of trash Setogucci. If Montoya walks we should pick up James Reimer til the kids are ready for prime-time. 

Even with a very good coach at the helm I can't see the Jets being more than 5 points better than this year - and just as easily, 5 pts worse!

[Nasty Nate]

 

Why would he bury Pav? That would drop his value big time.

because if we sign a better goalie or one of the youngsters come up and show they are ready, where else is he gonna go? why buy him out when u can put him in st johns. Maybe he doesnt accept that and goes back to play in the khl or czech leagues or something.

 

I really dont think a buyout on pavelec is something TNSE  will even think about.

 

Sometimes, it makes me wonder. Buyout Pavelec he sucks, get rid of him, he sucks... but... you think burying his contract in the minors is awful?

 

how can the jets trade someone who is awful? why would anyone pick him up if he's as awful as some make him out to be. Why waste a  buyout on pav when you dont need too. You either trade him if you sign someone or one of your young guys step up or you bury him in the minors. He has no  trade value according to those who think he sucks.

 

Pav's stop average is inferior. He's a good goalie if you never want to mount a playoff challenge. 

[The Unknown Poster]

Pavs isn't a technically great goalie. He's big and athletic. It used to be that many goalies got better even as they ages because they became smarter and technically sound. What Pavs has can't be taught. But being better technically can be taught. I'd actually be taking a long hard look at our goaltending coach.

Also of we did find a new number one Pavs could be traded. We see the negatives but I think for the most part he's still considered a young goalie with upside. His contract isn't bad.

[The Unknown Poster]

Also I would be utterly shocked if we made gooch an offer. He's gonzo.

[Nasty Nate]

Also I would be utterly shocked if we made gooch an offer. He's gonzo.

Gooch can still play but only as a 2nd or 3rd line player in Germany, Switzerland, ECHL.

[Nasty Nate]

Pavs isn't a technically great goalie. He's big and athletic. It used to be that many goalies got better even as they ages because they became smarter and technically sound. What Pavs has can't be taught. But being better technically can be taught. I'd actually be taking a long hard look at our goaltending coach.

Also of we did find a new number one Pavs could be traded. We see the negatives but I think for the most part he's still considered a young goalie with upside. His contract isn't bad.

Well, I now see why Chevy is "protecting" Pavs. However, Pav's inferior stats don't lie and they extend over a number of seasons, not just one. Only thing good about Pav is he doesn't injure easily and doesn't appear to be a locker room cancer. If Chevy's 'unpublished plan' doesn't include a playoff berth then no problem with Pavelec carrying the mail. That said - may as well bring back almost all of this year's group plus the one or two draft picks that make their way onto the roster.

If playoffs not a real possibility - then why not Wright, Gooch, Tango, Thorburn, etc?

[iso_55]

Not happy Chevy annointed Pavlec the starter as I said before. Make the position as strong as he can. Sign another #1 goaltender like Reimer perhaps & make it a competition where the 2 goalies push each other & the best man wins. Montoya played well for us but it appears Chevy & Maurice have no interest in keeping him. Having a so so starter & a proven long term backup helps us how as a team??

[Jacquie]

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

[AKAChip]

I suppose the argument is that even if he can't, would any backup that we could play in his place even be close to as bad as Pavelec? Stats suggest no.

[Jacquie]

Montoya's stats are better than Reimer's iirc and they played about the same number of games this season. I don't think anyone is suggesting Montaya is #1 material.

[Nasty Nate]

My fantasy trade would be

 

Kane, Ladd, Enstrom, Clitsome, Pavelec & Jets 3rd round pick to 

 

Tampa for

 

Stamkos, Bishop

 

Obviously Tampa would never let Stamkos leave town but my point is there'd be a very large group of Jet fans that would think its a stupid trade and we're giving the Bolts way too much. Tons of hometown bias, no matter where you're an NHL fan.

 

Funny thing - even though its a fantasy trade that has no chance of happening it might actually help both teams big=time.

 

Ladd gives the Bolts solid 2nd or 3rd line production with leadership capabilities, Enstrom is a good puck-moving defenseman who if used properly (not as a defender in certain situations) can be very productive. Kane would give the Bolts at least 1/2 of the production lost by Stamkos' departure, Clitsome is a good 4th to 6th d-man. If a change of scenery meant Pavelec went from a .899 stop % to .919 to .922 then the trade almost is in Tampa's advantage.

 

Stamkos would be a monster playing with Wheeler and Schiefele. Bishop probably solves Jets goal-tending woes.

 

We'd need Morrisey or Redmond to step into Enstrom's shoes and a guy like Petan or Lowry to replace Ladd. 

 

But unfortunately the dream ends now. Guys like Stammer, Crosby, McKinnon are virtually untradeable NHL commodities. 

[Nasty Nate]

Not happy Chevy annointed Pavlec the starter as I said before. Make the position as strong as he can. Sign another #1 goaltender like Reimer perhaps & make it a competition where the 2 goalies push each other & the best man wins. Montoya played well for us but it appears Chevy & Maurice have no interest in keeping him. Having a so so starter & a proven long term backup helps us how as a team??

I'm sure he didn't intend such but when Chevynoplayoff announced Pavelec as his 2014-15 starter it was almost as if he was taunting Jet fans. 

We're a patient group and sometimes too patient. Chevy shouldn't be taking advantage of all the good will he's been granted!

[iso_55]

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing. 

[Jacquie]

 

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing. 

 

IIRC Reimer has been the #1 goalie for the Leafs and has lost the job because of his play.

[Brandon]

Reimer also sucks the only reason I'd want him is simply for a way out of Pavs contract.

[The Unknown Poster]

Pavs contract is easy to handle though. If the jets resign Montoya it tells you they really are committed to Pavs. And they might be. I think there is a sense that Pavs plays as the team does. And a more defensively sound team would greatly improve Pavs stats. If the jets being in someone like Reimer or even use hutch as the back up it tells you they are open to real competition.

[iso_55]

 

 

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing. 

 

IIRC Reimer has been the #1 goalie for the Leafs and has lost the job because of his play.

 

So, you don't think that it was a team effort all around him? That only he was the problem?

[Goalie]

anyone remember the anaheim game? we dont win that if not for pavs. You cant just throw out his bad games and say he sucks, you have to throw in his good ones too, There were plenty of games we won just because of how pav played, that anaheim game is one that just sticks out.

 

What seems to be the case is the entire team, not just pavelec, but the entire team is inconsistent.

 

Its not just one player, it never is in pro sports. Its the entire team. You can blame pav for a few bad goals sure, but... what about the games he won pretty much all by himself?

 

What about the powerplay that sucked so badly all year, if our powerplay was any good, some of those 1 goal games might have gone the other way for us.

 

You cant really blame one guy, You can but... when you look at the team as a whole, well... what it shows is that they are all inconsistent (everyone except ladd little and wheeler really)

 

3 players are pretty consistent game in game out, the rest arent. You can blame the goalie, you can blame the bottom 6 lack of scoring, you can blame the powerplay... but if you do just blame one of them, you are ignoring the other issues the team has.

 

Would a new goalie make a difference? maybe, maybe not tho. Maybe tho. But would that new goalie make the bottom 6 put up more goals and points? would it improve the powerplay? would it make most our players any less inconsistent? I dont think so.

[AKAChip]

Every goalie in the NHL has good games, they just have significantly less bad games than Pavelec.

[Jacquie]

 

 

 

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing.

IIRC Reimer has been the #1 goalie for the Leafs and has lost the job because of his play.

So, you don't think that it was a team effort all around him? That only he was the problem?

 

I didn't say that. Of course Reimer wasn't the only problem but he was enough of a problem that he lost the #1 status and only got it back because of an injury. It's funny that you mention the team effort around Reimer when so many seem to be ignoring the team effort around Pavs. People seem to forget that stats don't tell the whole story. I was watching a highlight video of some of Pav's big saves on YouTube the other day and on almost every save there was some type of defensive breakdown - players out of position, guys left wide open in the slot, players focused on the puck instead of who they are supposed to be covering, etc. If the Jets played consistently sound defence and Pav's numbers were the same then I would say there is a problem. But the Jets are not yet doing that and Pav's numbers reflect that. And no I'm not saying Pav's has not let in some weak goals but every goalie in the league has let in some stinkers. 

[Brandon]

 

 

 

 

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing.

IIRC Reimer has been the #1 goalie for the Leafs and has lost the job because of his play.

So, you don't think that it was a team effort all around him? That only he was the problem?

 

I didn't say that. Of course Reimer wasn't the only problem but he was enough of a problem that he lost the #1 status and only got it back because of an injury. It's funny that you mention the team effort around Reimer when so many seem to be ignoring the team effort around Pavs. People seem to forget that stats don't tell the whole story. I was watching a highlight video of some of Pav's big saves on YouTube the other day and on almost every save there was some type of defensive breakdown - players out of position, guys left wide open in the slot, players focused on the puck instead of who they are supposed to be covering, etc. If the Jets played consistently sound defence and Pav's numbers were the same then I would say there is a problem. But the Jets are not yet doing that and Pav's numbers reflect that. And no I'm not saying Pav's has not let in some weak goals but every goalie in the league has let in some stinkers. 

 

 

 

I don't buy the whole "The team played better defensively with Montoya in net" excuse....

 

Montoya was playing against a lot of the elite teams and the Jets had an equal amount of breakdowns with him in net.   

 

I'm no expert but from watching most of the games this season... to me it seemed like Pav cannot control the rebounds at all... so many shots he kicked out the puck bouncing it back to the opposition which then set up many goals.   Also many more sloppy goals of him being out of place and/or spending to much time on the ice.

 

I noticed a massive difference in puck control with Montoya in net...  instead of deflecting an innocent shot back to the oppositions defense... he seemed to be able to ground the puck and allow our defense to pick it up and move it down the ice breaking the oppositions cycle.  

 

I could see if you were comparing to Hutchinson who only had the 3 starts.... but come on now Montoya played quite a bit of games and over a period of time the numbers simply don't lie.  

[Jacquie]

 

 

 

 

 

Reimer hasn't played more than 36 games in a season in the NHL. What makes anyone think he can carry the load for an entire season.

And what makes you think Reimer can't if given the chance? You have no way of knowing.

IIRC Reimer has been the #1 goalie for the Leafs and has lost the job because of his play.

So, you don't think that it was a team effort all around him? That only he was the problem?

 

I didn't say that. Of course Reimer wasn't the only problem but he was enough of a problem that he lost the #1 status and only got it back because of an injury. It's funny that you mention the team effort around Reimer when so many seem to be ignoring the team effort around Pavs. People seem to forget that stats don't tell the whole story. I was watching a highlight video of some of Pav's big saves on YouTube the other day and on almost every save there was some type of defensive breakdown - players out of position, guys left wide open in the slot, players focused on the puck instead of who they are supposed to be covering, etc. If the Jets played consistently sound defence and Pav's numbers were the same then I would say there is a problem. But the Jets are not yet doing that and Pav's numbers reflect that. And no I'm not saying Pav's has not let in some weak goals but every goalie in the league has let in some stinkers. 

 

 

 

I don't buy the whole "The team played better defensively with Montoya in net" excuse....

 

Montoya was playing against a lot of the elite teams and the Jets had an equal amount of breakdowns with him in net.   

 

I'm no expert but from watching most of the games this season... to me it seemed like Pav cannot control the rebounds at all... so many shots he kicked out the puck bouncing it back to the opposition which then set up many goals.   Also many more sloppy goals of him being out of place and/or spending to much time on the ice.

 

I noticed a massive difference in puck control with Montoya in net...  instead of deflecting an innocent shot back to the oppositions defense... he seemed to be able to ground the puck and allow our defense to pick it up and move it down the ice breaking the oppositions cycle.  

 

I could see if you were comparing to Hutchinson who only had the 3 starts.... but come on now Montoya played quite a bit of games and over a period of time the numbers simply don't lie.  

 

 

I didn't said the team played better defensively for Montoya. The only time I've mentioned Montoya in this thread was in comparing his stats to Reimer. I don't know what Hutchinson has to do with this. Montoya played 28 games this season with a 2.30 GAA and .920 Sv% while Reimer played 36 games with a 3.29 GAA and .911 Sv%. Montoya has played 91 games with a career 2.63 GAA and .910 Sv% compared to Reimer's 140 games with a career 2.85 GAA and .914 Sv%. Do you think Montoya should be a #1 goalie in the league. Reimer has been given opportunities to be the #1 guy in Toronto and he hasn't been able to capitalize on them.

 

There are a number of goalies who will be UFAs this off-season who are lot better than Reimer who will be a RFA. I really have to wonder whether people would be as high on Reimer if he had been born in Minnesota instead of Manitoba.