Final Scouting Bureau Rankings

[Atomic]

I still feel like we go with a DL like Gill or Smith if Lavertu goes to Ottawa.

 

Foucault is too risky... NFL interest scares me off.  If Goossen isn't good enough to start this year, then he shouldn't be our pick.  We need someone who can contribute to our ratio right away and IMO that means Evan Gill or Quinn Smith.

[Nasty Nate]

 

I got a feeling that Walters in co don't pay too much attention to this list. They have hours of their own research to go on.

Yes but if we take someone like a #9 Goosen at 2nd overall is that not any different than our off the board pick of Pencer or even Etienne when there were several higher rated players available? 

 

But that was a product of Joe Mack and a no-scouting system. Joe also ordered Kyle Walters to draft an NFL bound behemoth instead of a guy who could have started in our secondary from Day 1 in Mike Edem..... now starting in Montreal...

I suspect Ottawa will pass on Tardif and we will too. Then its just whether Foucault - Lavertu or vice-versa.

Unless Walters believes Goosen is gonna get 25% stronger, 10% faster and 15% bigger within a few months.

 

Too bad we don't have a second round pick. Could use one now that we have real people scouting these youngsters, not a piece of trash like Joe.

[Nasty Nate]

I still feel like we go with a DL like Gill or Smith if Lavertu goes to Ottawa.

 

Foucault is too risky... NFL interest scares me off.  If Goossen isn't good enough to start this year, then he shouldn't be our pick.  We need someone who can contribute to our ratio right away and IMO that means Evan Gill or Quinn Smith.

Gotta go with an olineman unless they are officially told their pick is gonna go NFL if Bombers take him. btw - I believe all CIS players should be forced to play 1 + 1 in the CFL before going into the NFL draft.

[Atomic]

 

I still feel like we go with a DL like Gill or Smith if Lavertu goes to Ottawa.

 

Foucault is too risky... NFL interest scares me off.  If Goossen isn't good enough to start this year, then he shouldn't be our pick.  We need someone who can contribute to our ratio right away and IMO that means Evan Gill or Quinn Smith.

Gotta go with an olineman unless they are officially told their pick is gonna go NFL if Bombers take him. btw - I believe all CIS players should be forced to play 1 + 1 in the CFL before going into the NFL draft.

 

 

Officially told?  So go with Foucault, and then watch as he signs in the NFL the next day?  Yeah, no one would be cutting down the Bombers for that one.  Hamilton didn't think Gaydosh was going to the NFL so they took him first overall.  Not doing them much good now.

 

We need someone who will contribute this year.  Our Canadian depth was poor and it took a hit this off-season.  We need someone who can come in and make a difference.  That likely won't be an OL if we can't get Lavertu.

[TBieber]

You set yourself up for failure if you select a position just because the need may be there. If you think the guy can play, then it becomes a different story. The Bombers have drafted too many players who are gone within two or three years.

[gbill2004]

You set yourself up for failure if you select a position just because the need may be there. If you think the guy can play, then it becomes a different story. The Bombers have drafted too many players who are gone within two or three years.

Who do you see the Bombers taking, assuming Ottawa takes Lavertu?

[rebusrankin]

If you're Winnipeg and Lavertu goes, do you deal down and try to nab say Gossen and Gill?

[Jpan85]

I would not trade down take the guy you want. You have no clue what anyone else will do, especially this year.

[JuranBoldenRules]

If you're Winnipeg and Lavertu goes, do you deal down and try to nab say Gossen and Gill?

 

Unless Goossen really drops it would be hard to make a trade and end up drafting both of them.

 

I'd consider something like 4 and 13 from Montreal (or 5 and 12 from BC )for 2nd overall...but they'd really have to like someone at 2 who they don't think they'd have a shot at with the 4th pick.

 

Then we'd probably end up with a Gill, Smith, Landry, Lue, Chin or Briggs depending on how Walters et al have them ranked at 4th overall and if one of them is picked.  Then we could take a run at one of the interior OL at 13.

 

That said, if they are convinced that Foucault can and will play for us in 2014, take him.  But if it's a pick for a starting tackle/guard in 2 years, and then the guy is going to look to sign down east after we've developed him, don't bother.  I just don't think we have that luxury, when the only one of our last 5 1st rounders (since 2011) playing for us is Pencer, and we traded two of them away for imports.

[Nasty Nate]

I don't think anyone gives us 3 upper tier picks just for #2.

 

They know there's incredible pressure on Wpg (or Ottawa for that matter) with their early pick as the tendency is to get greedy and end up with a bag of NFL air. 

 

If they go off the grid - then you potentially draft a bed-wetter like Etienne or that non-receiver we lost another #1 pick for to get 1st in supplemental.

 

Bombers are caught between a rock and a hard cold NFL place - again!

[James]

It was two picks

 

I was thinking about that trade JBR and I don't think they would do it for number 2 strait up... we would probably have to throw in one of our 3rd's... but I'd still do it...

 

I'm really thinking the bombers are going to go for Smith if Ott. grabs Lavertu

[TBieber]

 

You set yourself up for failure if you select a position just because the need may be there. If you think the guy can play, then it becomes a different story. The Bombers have drafted too many players who are gone within two or three years.

Who do you see the Bombers taking, assuming Ottawa takes Lavertu?

 

 

I would be looking to trade out. If a trade is not attainable, I am selecting Quinn Smith.

 

You may say that if you want to trade out and select Smith he may not be there. True, but I still like the option of getting two very good players, which I believe you can find in all picks up until about #16.

[Nasty Nate]

If there's a hint Lavertu or Focault are NFL bound (especially if Bombers pick them) then Quinn Smith has to be selected at #2.

 

The basic problem is Tyson Pencer is still probably not ready for prime-time action. Although he's far stronger than Morley and a tad bigger, too he's just not experienced enough to make a difference. One on one meatball contact he'll give you decent protection and won't be defeated easily. Run some crosses or schemes at him and he'll be balling his eyes out. And so will we.

 

If Pencer was available for this year's draft I doubt he'd be picked any higher than 2nd round - possible third. Just on potential. Same as he still is.

[gbill2004]

I wonder if we take Quinn Smith then convert him to a centre...

[TBieber]

If there's a hint Lavertu or Focault are NFL bound (especially if Bombers pick them) then Quinn Smith has to be selected at #2.

 

The basic problem is Tyson Pencer is still probably not ready for prime-time action. Although he's far stronger than Morley and a tad bigger, too he's just not experienced enough to make a difference. One on one meatball contact he'll give you decent protection and won't be defeated easily. Run some crosses or schemes at him and he'll be balling his eyes out. And so will we.

 

If Pencer was available for this year's draft I doubt he'd be picked any higher than 2nd round - possible third. Just on potential. Same as he still is.

 

To my knowledge there hasn't been anything regarding Lavertu and the NFL. He should be safe for Ottawa or Winnipeg.

[gbill2004]

If there's a hint Lavertu or Focault are NFL bound (especially if Bombers pick them) then Quinn Smith has to be selected at #2.

The basic problem is Tyson Pencer is still probably not ready for prime-time action. Although he's far stronger than Morley and a tad bigger, too he's just not experienced enough to make a difference. One on one meatball contact he'll give you decent protection and won't be defeated easily. Run some crosses or schemes at him and he'll be balling his eyes out. And so will we.

If Pencer was available for this year's draft I doubt he'd be picked any higher than 2nd round - possible third. Just on potential. Same as he still is.

To my knowledge there hasn't been anything regarding Lavertu and the NFL. He should be safe for Ottawa or Winnipeg.

That's what makes him a rock hard first overall pick.

[Tracker]

 

 

If there's a hint Lavertu or Focault are NFL bound (especially if Bombers pick them) then Quinn Smith has to be selected at #2.

The basic problem is Tyson Pencer is still probably not ready for prime-time action. Although he's far stronger than Morley and a tad bigger, too he's just not experienced enough to make a difference. One on one meatball contact he'll give you decent protection and won't be defeated easily. Run some crosses or schemes at him and he'll be balling his eyes out. And so will we.

If Pencer was available for this year's draft I doubt he'd be picked any higher than 2nd round - possible third. Just on potential. Same as he still is.

To my knowledge there hasn't been anything regarding Lavertu and the NFL. He should be safe for Ottawa or Winnipeg.

That's what makes him a rock hard first overall pick.

 

Maybe that was just Viagra.

[gbill2004]

If there's a hint Lavertu or Focault are NFL bound (especially if Bombers pick them) then Quinn Smith has to be selected at #2.

The basic problem is Tyson Pencer is still probably not ready for prime-time action. Although he's far stronger than Morley and a tad bigger, too he's just not experienced enough to make a difference. One on one meatball contact he'll give you decent protection and won't be defeated easily. Run some crosses or schemes at him and he'll be balling his eyes out. And so will we.

If Pencer was available for this year's draft I doubt he'd be picked any higher than 2nd round - possible third. Just on potential. Same as he still is.

To my knowledge there hasn't been anything regarding Lavertu and the NFL. He should be safe for Ottawa or Winnipeg.

That's what makes him a rock hard first overall pick.

Maybe that was just Viagra.

lol...maybe I should have said 'rock solid'!

[Goalie]

3 weeks ago quinn smith was a nobody nothing, not even ranked on the top 15 list, now he's #4 and everybody wants the guy? based on a strong e camp it appears, but how much does e camp actually mean? how much do the numbers actually mean? can you repeat those numbers? or is it a one off type day or camp of a lifetime where you just show up and dominate but then you go back to normal and dont.

 

Im curious how much these e camp numbers actually mean to the people in charge of actually making the picks.

 

As a fan, all i really know is... all year there have been guys who have been ranked in the top 5.. all rankings really, LDT,LAVERTU,FOUCAULT being 3...

 

and there was a guy who wasnt ranked at all really, but after the e camp he is ranked top 5. I dunno about guys like that to be honest, go with the sure thing like foucault or lavertu, smith could just be some testing freak... i dont know, havent seen him play... but like i said, as a fan all i know is what the rankings have been and i find it strange he wasnt really ranked until after the e camp. perhaps a red flag of sorts.

 

I just think we need oline help so badly that passing on either of lavertu or foucault  (got off the goosen train but still think he's an option)(he becomes probably a bigger one if lavertu and foucault get serious nfl interest), it would be silly. Oline needs help so bad, its vital to our success, put lavertu and foucault with wylie and you got yourself a couple young guys ready to go im sure, pencer too (he has potential still), perhaps wylie gets it out of him. Like the idea of us taking an oline and having wylie coach him up... Think long term, oline is whats needed for this club. Smith? I dunno, not a fan of the testing freaks, see it lots in sports, nhl,nfl,cfl even.. guys who have crazy e camp type things and then proceed to really not do much as a pro.

 

I guess regarding SMITH, is... based on his play on the field agasint competition, he wasnt ranked at all. Based on what he did at a weekend or so at an evaluation camp, he moves up to 4. I think thats a reach of a pick if there ever was one. Do you take a guy at 4 to groom to become a center just based on a weekend of work? Thats a tough one, excellent numbers but scouts didnt have him ranked at all all year really. Well im sure he was just not so high... at all. LDT Lavertu and Foucault were, if no NFL interest we have a shot at one of those 2 (LDT is nfl bound for sure) who have been ranked high all year. Be crazy to pass on one of them if they didnt get nfl interest.

[MOBomberFan]

I gotta say that just because you were ranked highly throughout the evaluation process doesn't make you a 'sure thing' by any means. Just look at Scott Mitchell who played in all of a dozen games over 3 seasons after being ranked the consensus top pick in 2011; he was ranked the #2 player in Fall and Winter rankings, and the #1 player when final rankings came out. Meanwhile players like Shawn Gore, Marco Ianuzzi, and Jabar Westerman, who have all contributed about as much as you can hope for from a first rounder, only made it into the top 15 following ecamp.

 

The draft is always a gamble, no matter who you draft and where they were ranked. Luc Brodeur-Jourdain is a CFL all star, and he was the very last player drafted in 2008; Justin Sorensen was the 5th overall pick in the very same draft.

[gbill2004]

Good post MOBomberFan.  I still have high hopes for Tyson Pencer. 

[Mike]

3 weeks ago quinn smith was a nobody nothing, not even ranked on the top 15 list, now he's #4 and everybody wants the guy? based on a strong e camp it appears, but how much does e camp actually mean? how much do the numbers actually mean? can you repeat those numbers? or is it a one off type day or camp of a lifetime where you just show up and dominate but then you go back to normal and dont.

 

Im curious how much these e camp numbers actually mean to the people in charge of actually making the picks.

 

As a fan, all i really know is... all year there have been guys who have been ranked in the top 5.. all rankings really, LDT,LAVERTU,FOUCAULT being 3...

 

and there was a guy who wasnt ranked at all really, but after the e camp he is ranked top 5. I dunno about guys like that to be honest, go with the sure thing like foucault or lavertu, smith could just be some testing freak... i dont know, havent seen him play... but like i said, as a fan all i know is what the rankings have been and i find it strange he wasnt really ranked until after the e camp. perhaps a red flag of sorts.

 

I just think we need oline help so badly that passing on either of lavertu or foucault  (got off the goosen train but still think he's an option)(he becomes probably a bigger one if lavertu and foucault get serious nfl interest), it would be silly. Oline needs help so bad, its vital to our success, put lavertu and foucault with wylie and you got yourself a couple young guys ready to go im sure, pencer too (he has potential still), perhaps wylie gets it out of him. Like the idea of us taking an oline and having wylie coach him up... Think long term, oline is whats needed for this club. Smith? I dunno, not a fan of the testing freaks, see it lots in sports, nhl,nfl,cfl even.. guys who have crazy e camp type things and then proceed to really not do much as a pro.

 

I guess regarding SMITH, is... based on his play on the field agasint competition, he wasnt ranked at all. Based on what he did at a weekend or so at an evaluation camp, he moves up to 4. I think thats a reach of a pick if there ever was one. Do you take a guy at 4 to groom to become a center just based on a weekend of work? Thats a tough one, excellent numbers but scouts didnt have him ranked at all all year really. Well im sure he was just not so high... at all. LDT Lavertu and Foucault were, if no NFL interest we have a shot at one of those 2 (LDT is nfl bound for sure) who have been ranked high all year. Be crazy to pass on one of them if they didnt get nfl interest.

 

The thing about Quinn Smith ... and I'm just going off secondhand information ... is that he was always hovering in that 15-20 range of the rankings, it's not like he was off the radar completely. The problem he had is that he was playing on an absolutely awful team.

[Atomic]

CIS scouting is still spotty. Lots of guys fall through the cracks. That's what makes the CFL combine so important. The level of competition varies so greatly between the CIS conferences, so getting all the best players together and competing in one-on-ones can totally change the perception of a player. It's not really about testing numbers for Quinn Smith, it's about how he came in and absolutely dominated every OL he faced.

[17to85]

I gotta say that just because you were ranked highly throughout the evaluation process doesn't make you a 'sure thing' by any means. Just look at Scott Mitchell who played in all of a dozen games over 3 seasons after being ranked the consensus top pick in 2011; he was ranked the #2 player in Fall and Winter rankings, and the #1 player when final rankings came out. Meanwhile players like Shawn Gore, Marco Ianuzzi, and Jabar Westerman, who have all contributed about as much as you can hope for from a first rounder, only made it into the top 15 following ecamp.

 

The draft is always a gamble, no matter who you draft and where they were ranked. Luc Brodeur-Jourdain is a CFL all star, and he was the very last player drafted in 2008; Justin Sorensen was the 5th overall pick in the very same draft.

And this is why it's absolutely ridiculous that so many people get so upset when a team drafts someone off the board. The board is a crapshoot at best and likely has little resemblance to what teams boards actually look like anyway. 

[Nasty Nate]

Drafting top 2 seems to be a dilemna to be sure. Look at last year. Bombers in a particularly tough spot cuz they traded their 2nd rd pick for Neufeld. 

 

If Neuf works out then its OK, but if he rolls his cankles again or can't be more than 'adequate' it further weakens an already weak o-line.

 

If we can't control our destiny for a canadian o-line pick the backup plan is for Kyle to instruct Danny Mac and the scouts to find a monster import o-lineman that can be a total upgrade over mediocre guys like January or Douglas or the like.