Madani: CFLPA Recommends Strike Vote To Members

[The Unknown Poster]

I think in most CBA negotiations the company (in this case league) *appear* to be the bully because it's *their* business.  The players or workforce are collectively trying to get something out of their boss.  The boss is almost always going to have the sense "we will give you this and you should be grateful" because it is, afterall, *their* business and *their* money.  (And I say that as a member of a local workforce going through current CBA negotiations).

 

I remember asking my Union once why they didnt just knock off the childish rhetoric and go into a room and be adults and make their best offer, accept the companies best offer, meet in the middle, shake hands and have some drinks.  And I was basically told "thats not how it works.  Both sides have to make offeres they have no intention of ever seeing come to reality".  It really is quite stupid.  In this day and age, collective bargaining should be much different.

 

The last union meeting I went to I couldnt believe the attitudes.  There was almost no one at the meeting (awful communication by our union "leadership") and the national rep called everyone "brother" and "sister" and took every opportunity to tell us what losers our front line managers were...those managers, ofcourse, had zero to do with union negotiations.  It's an old school mentality that is beyond passe.  But most of ther workforce dont care.  The ones that are VERY pro union and become leadership are the ones that embrace the old school passe mentality.

 

The PA and the League could make a deal easily.  Just do it.

[gbill2004]

@DarrinBauming: #Bombers veteran players spotted arriving at the airport this afternoon. #CFL

[Jaxon]

 

Which leads me to wonder why they even bother having it. If you're paying 4 (now 2) guys the same as you would be if they were playing, why not just let them play?

I agree. With the number of injuries we see during games sometimes, the more guys on the sidelines suited up the better. It makes no sense to have two OL go down in a game and having a guy standing there in civvies on the sideline who could have gone in as a sub, instead of putting some poor DL out there doing his best impression of a turnstyle.

 

IIRC, it becomes a ratio issue.  If these 2 additional guys are now designated imports, they can go in on special teams, and take the spot from a non-import player.  

[ALuCsRED]

The 6 month a year thing really does not fly anymore. It is not the 60's where these guys lived in the city they played and were given jobs that worked around their football.

They train 12 months a year most live far away to live with their families and it's pretty tough to hold down a decent job when you need 25 weeks vacation a year. All in a row, during the summer......

 

In 2003-04, Chuck Assman (special teamer for Calgary/Toronto) worked at the same company I did before he want back to play for the 2004 season.  The guys can still have off season jobs.

 

Doesn't Kevin Glenn operate Timmy's in Detroit?

 

[Atomic]

Chuck Assman? Is that a real name?

[gbill2004]

Chuck Assman? Is that a real name?

Proctologist.

[road griller]

The 6 month a year thing really does not fly anymore. It is not the 60's where these guys lived in the city they played and were given jobs that worked around their football.

They train 12 months a year most live far away to live with their families and it's pretty tough to hold down a decent job when you need 25 weeks vacation a year. All in a row, during the summer......

This is somewhat true. Some of the guys can and do pickup a part time job with the offseason whether it is in sales, trainers in gyms, etc.

Also, the ones making the league minimum are usual in the 20 - 25 year old age.

If you were in that age range and were told you could get paid 45 - 50k per year to play professional football 6 months of the year, have 6 months off to dedicate to training full time, all for a chance to make it to the big show, would you take it? Sometimes it is Risk vs Reward.

Sure sales and work in a gym, no problem. Going against people who can work 12 months a year for the employer who is going to invest money into training you.

'Hey glad you are thinking of joining our gym. I am leaving in three weeks but I will be back in six months or so. I am sure your goals can wait. Eh?'

Sales is not great either it takes months to get rolling and build up a name and clients. You lose all that every spring.

What you are saying sounds nice but it probably is not as real as you think.

As far as making 45k in this day and age, my sights would be set higher. Kinda like them, and they will get it.

[Jacquie]

Really, road griller. You liked your own post. 

 

There are still a lot of players who have off-season jobs in their fields. A supportive employer is definitely necessary although some players do have their own businesses.

[Rids]

 

 

Which leads me to wonder why they even bother having it. If you're paying 4 (now 2) guys the same as you would be if they were playing, why not just let them play?

I agree. With the number of injuries we see during games sometimes, the more guys on the sidelines suited up the better. It makes no sense to have two OL go down in a game and having a guy standing there in civvies on the sideline who could have gone in as a sub, instead of putting some poor DL out there doing his best impression of a turnstyle.

 

IIRC, it becomes a ratio issue.  If these 2 additional guys are now designated imports, they can go in on special teams, and take the spot from a non-import player.  

 

 

The 2 additional guys are 1 non-import and 1 import. 

 

There will be 3 designated imports per team now up from the 2 last year. 

 

This change was agreed on already by the CFL and CFLPA during the off season (perhaps back when Mike Morreale was still in charge). 

 

Part of what the reserve roster was originally set up for was to have up to four protected players from the old practice roster that other teams couldn't just pick up. The CFLPA arranged that they would get a full game cheque for being on the 46 man roster during the last CBA discussion. 

 

Remember the two way contracts that the CFLPA didn't want? The reason for that was so that CFL teams could shuffle players from the 46 man roster (primarily for the bottom 4 to 6 players on the roster) to the PR without having to release them and have them sign a PR contract. I think for young players, especially on their second team after being drafted, it would be a smart contract to sign. When they know they'll only see the field in about half the games but be able to do it without getting released is a bonus. 

[Mike]

Isn't it a jump from 3 to 4 for designated imports

[ALuCsRED]

Chuck Assman? Is that a real name?

 

Yes.  Is your google broken?

 

He played for Hamilton, Edmonton, Toronto, and Calgary as a special teamer.

 

 

On a side note, D I C K Assman from Regina, Sk (I believe no relation) made celebrity status in North America in the mid-nineties.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Assman

 

[gbill2004]

Chuck Assman? Is that a real name?

Yes. Is your google broken?

He played for Hamilton, Edmonton, Toronto, and Calgary as a special teamer.

On a side note, D I C K Assman from Regina, Sk (I believe no relation) made celebrity status in North America in the mid-nineties. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Assman

His parents must have a great sense of humor to name him that!

[road griller]

Really, road griller. You liked your own post.

There are still a lot of players who have off-season jobs in their fields. A supportive employer is definitely necessary although some players do have their own businesses.

I actually 'love' my posts, waiting patiently for that feature.

Some players do have their own businesses but most do not and it is probably more of the vets who are older and more life experienced.

And yes, some players do have off season jobs but simply pointing out it is not as easy as 'well just get a job for 5 months' the quality of work they can find is not great. As an owner of a business I would not want someone for 5 months a year when I can easily find someone who will work 12 months for me.

[Atomic]

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  18m

.@andrewharris33 - "To be completely honest, both sides are being completely stubborn right now" #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  18m

.@andrewharris33 - "It's a tough situation. I hope we can meet in middle soon. I don't want to miss any of season." #CFL

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  17m

.@andrewharris33 - "I think we'll be playing football. I think we'll max miss a wk of training camp though." #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  17m

.@andrewharris33 - "I think we're asking for a bit too much right now." #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  17m

.@andrewharris33 - "In markets that are struggling, it's going to put them in a bind." #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  16m

@andrewharris33 - "Something has to give. I think there's definitely a middle pt where both sides R happy." #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  13m

.@andrewharris33 - "20% players are voting yes for this. Other 80% are in a position they need to play in." #CFL #CFLPA

 

CFL News ‏@CFL_News  14m

.@andrewharris33 - "Same for the owners. 20% want to stand strong on this. Other 80% have to play football." #CFL #CFLPA

 

Korey Banks ‏@24Banks  8m

Some people that play in the CFL need to learn how to zip their lips when it comes to the CBA. Let the qualified handle the talking. PERIOD

[Atomic]

Andrew Harris is going to have a lot of players pissed off at him after that interview...

 

Listen to it here:

 

https://soundcloud.com/680cjob/andrew-harris-cfl-and-cflpa-dispute

[Mr Dee]

Andrew Harris is going to have a lot of players pissed off at him after that interview...

 

Listen to it here:

 

https://soundcloud.com/680cjob/andrew-harris-cfl-and-cflpa-dispute

 

 

This is basically a CFL player, who actually knows what is going on, and is honest in his answers…maybe too much so for the union's liking.

But the union, who are focused on mailing ballots, should have already countered with a proposal to the league.

Were they not ready with a counter-proposal?

I mean, since Wednesday, and only silence?

Maybe it's just me, but they seem to be staggering at this point.

[gbill2004]

Pretty sure this is directed at Andrew Harris:

@24Banks: Some people that play in the CFL need to learn how to zip their lips when it comes to the CBA. Let the qualified handle the talking. PERIOD

[Atomic]

Andrew Harris was being completely honest and sensible... terrible traits to display during a negotiation, unfortunately.

 

 

Were they not ready with a counter-proposal?

I mean, since Wednesday, and only silence?

Maybe it's just me, but they seem to be staggering at this point.

 

I agree that they appear to be staggering.  But just to be clear, they weren't ready with a counter-proposal, because on Wednesday that was their counter-proposal.  The league hasn't changed their stance.  The PA is going to have to come up with something new because revenue sharing just doesn't look like it's going to happen.

[Mr Dee]

Andrew Harris was being completely honest and sensible... terrible traits to display during a negotiation, unfortunately.

 

 

Were they not ready with a counter-proposal?

I mean, since Wednesday, and only silence?

Maybe it's just me, but they seem to be staggering at this point.

 

I agree that they appear to be staggering.  But just to be clear, they weren't ready with a counter-proposal, because on Wednesday that was their counter-proposal.  The league hasn't changed their stance.  The PA is going to have to come up with something new because revenue sharing just doesn't look like it's going to happen.

 

Yeah, but that's what I was getting at.

You're right, it's not like the league has been ambiguous in its answers regarding revenue sharing..and if the union hasn't been meeting with the express purpose of altering that stand, then I guess we're in for a knock out round of talks and not the sparring that should be going on right now.

 

They should be trying to carve out as much of the pie as they can, because the sooner they admit this league is not a rich league, the better it will be for them.

[JuranBoldenRules]

This is reminding me a lot of the breakdown of the NHLPA in 2005.  Small group of players, along with the PA executive willing to die on the hill of absolutely no salary cap, even if that extended the lockout into a second season, larger group of players eventually freeze out that faction and take over negotiations.  The league side also brought in more moderate negotiators.

 

I don't know how accurate Harris' estimates are, but I think they are favouring the right sides in terms of most players and most owners wanting to compromise.  Problem is it gets very personal, basically a clash of personalities among the people from both sides at the table, and you're looking at a group of competitive people on both sides.

[Tracker]

 

Chuck Assman? Is that a real name?

 

Yes.  Is your google broken?

 

He played for Hamilton, Edmonton, Toronto, and Calgary as a special teamer.

 

 

On a side note, D I C K Assman from Regina, Sk (I believe no relation) made celebrity status in North America in the mid-nineties.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Assman

 

Both were probably the butt of many jokes, right up to the end. These jokes keep rearing their heads.

[The Unknown Poster]

Good for Andrew Harris. Sure, it's terrible for his PA but it's actually honest, mature and professional.

[mbrg]

Andrew Harris is going to have a lot of players pissed off at him after that interview...

 

Listen to it here:

 

https://soundcloud.com/680cjob/andrew-harris-cfl-and-cflpa-dispute

I don't mind when the US players have no sense of the history of the CFL; when they act like it's the NFL's little brother.  Why shouldn't they?  How much time do I spend learning about the history of Peruvian soccer?

 

It's when guys like Pottinger do the "slap in the face" routine that I get bothered.  He grew up here.  He should know.

 

Harris gets it.  Something good has happened to this league.  Not everyone at the factory went in on lottery tickets and now were all rich kind of good.  More like the company landed a big contract and we finally know the plant won't be shutting down.

 

A raise is definitely in order for the guys at the bottom end of the payroll scale, but no player has ever lost money playing on a CFL roster.  Owners have lost money with stunning regularity.

 

I'm amazed that I'm 100% behind the players getting paid more yet with every dumbass comment they make it forces me to advocate for the owners because the owners have no choice but to care about the survival of the league.  Harris is the first player who has said anything remotely close to caring about the CFL's existance.  Give him ALL the money as far as I'm concerned; the rest need a history lesson first.

[gbill2004]

@andrewharris33: My apologies to fellow @CFLPA members. Lesson learned when putting the heart of one ahead of business for all. #united

[Mr. Perfect]

If there's one thing in pro sports I can't stand, it's athletes who don't stand behind comments they obviously meant. Say what you mean, and mean what you say. What a joke. Kind of like the CFLPA.