Tyson Pencer Released

[Goalie]

I remember the draft quite well, it's the one where after taking pencer they showed reed and tillman and they were high fiving, the proceeded to then take austin pasztor (sp??) with the next pick who has also not seen the CFL field yet. After that calgary took DL/DE ameet pall who was subsequently PR'd then take by another team(montreal??) Chambers was taken next.

 

2012 was a pretty crappy draft actually.

[iso_55]

Another one of Mack's great picks.....

This is why I hate Joe Mack. What a frigging buffon as a GM. My gawd. 

[iso_55]

 

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if Poblah did good things in B.C.

 

Same with Etienne. 

 

The thing is, they both did virtually nothing in our jerseys so they wasted 2 roster spots. To me, that's what counts. Not what they do elsewhere. 

[Floyd]

I remember the draft quite well, it's the one where after taking pencer they showed reed and tillman and they were high fiving, the proceeded to then take austin pasztor (sp??) with the next pick who has also not seen the CFL field yet. After that calgary took DL/DE ameet pall who was subsequently PR'd then take by another team(montreal??) Chambers was taken next.

 

2012 was a pretty crappy draft actually.

 

I'd take Chambers. Or Fabien, Stephen, Plesius, Lavoie, Capicotti, Macdougall, Laing, Hurl...

[blitzmore]

The scouting report on Poblah before we drafted him was that he had to focus on 'his hands' more...  that being said, I can't think of anyone that was really against the pick - I thought we overpaid, especially when Edm got Laurent for a second - but, at that time, I probably would have ended up offering a 1st for him too...  we were desperate for receivers.

 

Honestly, I would like to have Poblah on the roster, I thought he did well on STs and was a serviceable backup with flashes.

 

I've said it before... if it was Taman and not Walters, that traded a former 1st round pick for a 35 year old import DB, this forum would have lit up.  I guarantee that Banks would have just been cut eventually.

You seem to think virtually every pick no matter who made it is an "overpayment" I guess we should just call you "cheap"

[Mr. Perfect]

 

 

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if Poblah did good things in B.C.

 

Same with Etienne. 

 

The thing is, they both did virtually nothing in our jerseys so they wasted 2 roster spots. To me, that's what counts. Not what they do elsewhere. 

 

Agreed to a point. That being said with them being in legit CFL offences now (though Poblah more than Etienne) I fully expect them to perform better. It's also why I was 50/50 on the trade (and still am, especially after Monday's game) that brought in Banks from B.C. as we also have a legit CFL offence now and gave up a NI for an aging import in search of one last big contract extension who frankly didn't earn it based on last year's play.

[Mike]

It's all optics, in a way.

 

We just cut a 3rd overall pick who was by and large useless. We rejoice.

 

We trade a 7th overall pick who was by and large useless. We worry that we didn't get good value.

 

 

[iso_55]

Optics are terrible. The reality is worse. 

[B-F-F-C]

It's interesting when you look back at the last three regimes.  Taman valued draft pics like tooth pics.  Then Kelly comes in and says that the team needs to start retaining their pics to rebuild their NI talent.      Then Mack arrives and says essentially the same thing but misuses his high picks by taking flyers on players.     

 

I think if we looked at our NI talent during the Taman years.  We'd all agree it was stronger than what we have today.   Taman strengthened our NI depth thru FA and trades.  Mack's philosophy was to not overpay for FA's and I'm not sure he could spell trade. 

 

Rebuilding our NI talent is going to take another 2 - 3 years if it's done properly.  Sure Walters could mortgage the future today and probably pick up a couple of NI starters.  But I see Walters as more of a long term vs short term strategist.  

 

But in the end I believe we've wasted our opportunity to build our NI talent over the last few years of drafting.     

[Goalie]

The thing is... taman, mack, kelly... they never won a grey cup.. that's all that matters.

 

Taman and Mack both made it to the big game though.

 

I guess when looking at our non import talent over the last 20 something years, it hasn't been good enough period. 

 

No doubt we've had some talented non imports come and go over the years, but.. none of them won a cup for us so... 

 

In my opinion, that means, we just haven't been good enough. Regardless of who the GM was.

 

But then again, who have the qb's been. 

 

Kept hearing that cal murphy would always say you only go as far as your qb and non imports take you...

 

Guess that means we can make it to the big game but can't win.

[Floyd]

It's interesting when you look back at the last three regimes.  Taman valued draft pics like tooth pics.  Then Kelly comes in and says that the team needs to start retaining their pics to rebuild their NI talent.      Then Mack arrives and says essentially the same thing but misuses his high picks by taking flyers on players.     

 

I think if we looked at our NI talent during the Taman years.  We'd all agree it was stronger than what we have today.   Taman strengthened our NI depth thru FA and trades.  Mack's philosophy was to not overpay for FA's and I'm not sure he could spell trade. 

 

Rebuilding our NI talent is going to take another 2 - 3 years if it's done properly.  Sure Walters could mortgage the future today and probably pick up a couple of NI starters.  But I see Walters as more of a long term vs short term strategist.  

 

But in the end I believe we've wasted our opportunity to build our NI talent over the last few years of drafting.     

 

I think Walters has overpaid so far... but that might also be part of the cost of just 'getting back in the game', Mack was pretty much a pariah among CFL GMs.  So, KW gets a pass for now... JFG and Bucknor are decent pickups, really nice draft this year.

 

Waiting to see if KW goes after other teams NI 'castoffs' in a couple weeks...  this was pretty much a non-starter in the Mack regime.

[JuranBoldenRules]

This regime could be the one to turn things around with NI's.  Goveia has put together several stellar drafts for the Argos, and as stupid as it sounds, having several Canadians in the front office probably makes the non-imports more of a priority and less of a "oh, we have to play how many Canadians" type of issue.

 

Taman kind of goes against that, but he views draft picks more as currency to spend than investments.

[johnzo]

Re: NI talent, it really hasn't helped that we've lost our top three NIs during the past two off seasons.

It's not just bad drafting that hurts us--I'd love to see a draft success breakdown by team because I'm not certain we're the worst drafters in the league. It's the exodus of NI talent that has really killed us.

[JuranBoldenRules]

Re: NI talent, it really hasn't helped that we've lost our top three NIs during the past two off seasons.

It's not just bad drafting that hurts us--I'd love to see a draft success breakdown by team because I'm not certain we're the worst drafters in the league. It's the exodus of NI talent that has really killed us.

 

Depends on how you're judging, but we've had 5 first rounders since 2011 and the only one on our roster is Goossen.  That's relatively awful IMO.  We just cut a 2nd rounder from 2013 who couldn't even stay on our roster past one pre-season game, when we aren't exactly brimming with talent.  There was the analysis of the numbers of drafted players on CFL rosters and the Bombers were on the high side of average, but a lot of those players aren't Blue Bombers, and they didn't bring back quality NI's, so does it matter?

[17to85]

 

 

Agree. I think for a while, Mack used to look at things and say "we don't have one of those, get one" when he needed to stop and think about it to realize the reason he didn't have one is because he didn't need one.

 

Or maybe they are just flyers. I don't know.

 

I don't think that's the case at all, I think the guy really just cared about how good of an athlete a guy was and nothing else really mattered. If a guy is big and strong and fast Mack was a fan and expected the coaches to turn them into players. Went for more than just draft picks too. 

[Rids]

 

 

 

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if Poblah did good things in B.C.

 

Same with Etienne. 

 

The thing is, they both did virtually nothing in our jerseys so they wasted 2 roster spots. To me, that's what counts. Not what they do elsewhere. 

 

Agreed to a point. That being said with them being in legit CFL offences now (though Poblah more than Etienne) I fully expect them to perform better. It's also why I was 50/50 on the trade (and still am, especially after Monday's game) that brought in Banks from B.C. as we also have a legit CFL offence now and gave up a NI for an aging import in search of one last big contract extension who frankly didn't earn it based on last year's play.

 

 

Korey Banks fits into The Etch defense better than you may expect. 

 

 

 

 

 

Agree. I think for a while, Mack used to look at things and say "we don't have one of those, get one" when he needed to stop and think about it to realize the reason he didn't have one is because he didn't need one.

 

Or maybe they are just flyers. I don't know.

 

I don't think that's the case at all, I think the guy really just cared about how good of an athlete a guy was and nothing else really mattered. If a guy is big and strong and fast Mack was a fan and expected the coaches to turn them into players. Went for more than just draft picks too. 

 

 

I'd agree with that. A little of the Al Davis School of Drafting. For what it's worth Ty Pencer ran a 4.62 40 while a Sr. in high school which did a lot in the way of getting him that scholarship to Washington State. He was originally recruited as a DT and flipped to OT during his redshirt year. As a redshirt-freshman he was made starter at LT halfway through the season. The Cougars had two Canadians starting on their OL at one point with Joe Eppele starting at RT.

 

 

 

The scouting report on Poblah before we drafted him was that he had to focus on 'his hands' more...  that being said, I can't think of anyone that was really against the pick - I thought we overpaid, especially when Edm got Laurent for a second - but, at that time, I probably would have ended up offering a 1st for him too...  we were desperate for receivers.

 

Honestly, I would like to have Poblah on the roster, I thought he did well on STs and was a serviceable backup with flashes.

 

I've said it before... if it was Taman and not Walters, that traded a former 1st round pick for a 35 year old import DB, this forum would have lit up.  I guarantee that Banks would have just been cut eventually.

 

 

The reason why Edmonton got Laurent with a 2nd round pick in the supplemental was because Winnipeg used their 1st on Poblah. Edmonton offered a 2nd round on Poblah forcing the Bombers to use their 1st.

 

Either way a 1st and 2nd were going for those two individuals it just depended on who went where. 

 

 

[Floyd]

 

 

 

 

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if Poblah did good things in B.C.

 

Same with Etienne. 

 

The thing is, they both did virtually nothing in our jerseys so they wasted 2 roster spots. To me, that's what counts. Not what they do elsewhere. 

 

Agreed to a point. That being said with them being in legit CFL offences now (though Poblah more than Etienne) I fully expect them to perform better. It's also why I was 50/50 on the trade (and still am, especially after Monday's game) that brought in Banks from B.C. as we also have a legit CFL offence now and gave up a NI for an aging import in search of one last big contract extension who frankly didn't earn it based on last year's play.

 

 

Korey Banks fits into The Etch defense better than you may expect. 

 

 

 

 

 

Agree. I think for a while, Mack used to look at things and say "we don't have one of those, get one" when he needed to stop and think about it to realize the reason he didn't have one is because he didn't need one.

 

Or maybe they are just flyers. I don't know.

 

I don't think that's the case at all, I think the guy really just cared about how good of an athlete a guy was and nothing else really mattered. If a guy is big and strong and fast Mack was a fan and expected the coaches to turn them into players. Went for more than just draft picks too. 

 

 

I'd agree with that. A little of the Al Davis School of Drafting. For what it's worth Ty Pencer ran a 4.62 40 while a Sr. in high school which did a lot in the way of getting him that scholarship to Washington State. He was originally recruited as a DT and flipped to OT during his redshirt year. As a redshirt-freshman he was made starter at LT halfway through the season. The Cougars had two Canadians starting on their OL at one point with Joe Eppele starting at RT.

 

 

 

The scouting report on Poblah before we drafted him was that he had to focus on 'his hands' more...  that being said, I can't think of anyone that was really against the pick - I thought we overpaid, especially when Edm got Laurent for a second - but, at that time, I probably would have ended up offering a 1st for him too...  we were desperate for receivers.

 

Honestly, I would like to have Poblah on the roster, I thought he did well on STs and was a serviceable backup with flashes.

 

I've said it before... if it was Taman and not Walters, that traded a former 1st round pick for a 35 year old import DB, this forum would have lit up.  I guarantee that Banks would have just been cut eventually.

 

 

The reason why Edmonton got Laurent with a 2nd round pick in the supplemental was because Winnipeg used their 1st on Poblah. Edmonton offered a 2nd round on Poblah forcing the Bombers to use their 1st.

 

Either way a 1st and 2nd were going for those two individuals it just depended on who went where. 

 

 

I thought Tillman had pretty much scouted Laurent on his own - no one seemed to have heard of him before the Supplemental...?

[17to85]

 

 

 

 

Agree. I think for a while, Mack used to look at things and say "we don't have one of those, get one" when he needed to stop and think about it to realize the reason he didn't have one is because he didn't need one.

 

Or maybe they are just flyers. I don't know.

 

I don't think that's the case at all, I think the guy really just cared about how good of an athlete a guy was and nothing else really mattered. If a guy is big and strong and fast Mack was a fan and expected the coaches to turn them into players. Went for more than just draft picks too. 

 

 

I'd agree with that. A little of the Al Davis School of Drafting. For what it's worth Ty Pencer ran a 4.62 40 while a Sr. in high school which did a lot in the way of getting him that scholarship to Washington State. He was originally recruited as a DT and flipped to OT during his redshirt year. As a redshirt-freshman he was made starter at LT halfway through the season. The Cougars had two Canadians starting on their OL at one point with Joe Eppele starting at RT.

 

 

was Kris Robertson another guy who got on the radar because he tested really well at the combine? Seems to me he had some good measurables but the memory is a bit foggy on it. 

[blueandgoldguy]

Wow, those off-the-board early round picks by Mack really paid off - Etienne, Pencer and now Robertson.

 

Boom or bust prospects?  More like all bust.

[Floyd]

I'm no Mack fan... but I think Robertson's knee injury had more to do with this than bad scouting by Mack.

[KptKrunch]

But Mack's gone... why keep complaining and bitching about it though?  

 

I agree - I used up all my anti-Mack rants at OB - but admittedly I was doing it when he was still in office and he had a lot of supporters here..umm there (OB) I mean. He's gone now and maybe the odd time I might mention him, but frankly I'm just happy we got some people now that have some football sense running the club now in Miller and Walters. Like what I see in O'Shea too. The fact they are willing to cut bait with a useless tub o lard like Pencer is (from what I'm reading here anyway) is good. Why keep him around taking valuable reps away from players like Goosen. Pencer, don't let the door hit you on the way out. Maybe go ride shotgun for Braidwood.

[KptKrunch]

It's interesting when you look back at the last three regimes.  Taman valued draft pics like tooth pics.  Then Kelly comes in and says that the team needs to start retaining their pics to rebuild their NI talent.      Then Mack arrives and says essentially the same thing but misuses his high picks by taking flyers on players.     

 

I think if we looked at our NI talent during the Taman years.  We'd all agree it was stronger than what we have today.   Taman strengthened our NI depth thru FA and trades.  Mack's philosophy was to not overpay for FA's and I'm not sure he could spell trade. 

 

Rebuilding our NI talent is going to take another 2 - 3 years if it's done properly.  Sure Walters could mortgage the future today and probably pick up a couple of NI starters.  But I see Walters as more of a long term vs short term strategist.  

 

But in the end I believe we've wasted our opportunity to build our NI talent over the last few years of drafting.     

 

Actually, Taman did what I believe in. Draft picks by and large in the CFL are semi-useless. They're like poker chips at a poker table. They eventually make their way around the table no matter who has them to start. Taman's philosophy was to wait and let the players get cut after a few 'disappointing' years with the team that drafted them and then sign them. We have no 'developmental' system here so that's how it goes. I will admit that, especially over the last few drafts and now with Ottawa here and another team (?) coming sometime and the league not adjusting the ratio the draft will become more important.

[Rids]

 

 

 

 

 

I thought Tillman had pretty much scouted Laurent on his own - no one seemed to have heard of him before the Supplemental...?

 

 

The Laurent situation is a very unique one. Bruce Feldman (who was at ESPN at the time) came across a Duane Forde article ranking the top defensive linemen available in the CFL draft. He contacted me asking if those 10 guys were all better than Ted Laurent or at least why there was no mention of Ted. Bruce had written the fantastic book "Meat Market" and got to know that recruiting class very well at Ole Miss and Ted was part of that class. 

 

After a couple of emails it was confirmed that Ted would qualify for the draft but it was beyond the date to get onto the official draft list so he ended up in the supplemental draft in one of the largest supplementals in a long time. 

 

These kids that move with family members to the States during their teens are nearly impossible to keep track of especially when they move before high school. The high school kids are a little easier if they've made a name for themselves a bit. 

[Rids]

 

 

 

 

I'd agree with that. A little of the Al Davis School of Drafting. For what it's worth Ty Pencer ran a 4.62 40 while a Sr. in high school which did a lot in the way of getting him that scholarship to Washington State. He was originally recruited as a DT and flipped to OT during his redshirt year. As a redshirt-freshman he was made starter at LT halfway through the season. The Cougars had two Canadians starting on their OL at one point with Joe Eppele starting at RT.

 

 

was Kris Robertson another guy who got on the radar because he tested really well at the combine? Seems to me he had some good measurables but the memory is a bit foggy on it. 

 

 

Kris Robertson is a solid player with great measurables. To those watching he wasn't a surprise (he jumped a 38" vert at the East West Bowl before the big performance at the Quebec Regional and then beat all of those marks at the CFL Combine). He was also a 2 time All-Canadian as a kick returner. 

 

His height likely made him slide down most team boards and I graded him as a 3rd/4th round selection but was my #2 DB so being the first DB off the board isn't much of a stretch (Mike Edem was still in the discussion as a LB vs being a Safety). 

[Mike]

 

 

 

 

 

I thought Tillman had pretty much scouted Laurent on his own - no one seemed to have heard of him before the Supplemental...?

 

 

The Laurent situation is a very unique one. Bruce Feldman (who was at ESPN at the time) came across a Duane Forde article ranking the top defensive linemen available in the CFL draft. He contacted me asking if those 10 guys were all better than Ted Laurent or at least why there was no mention of Ted. Bruce had written the fantastic book "Meat Market" and got to know that recruiting class very well at Ole Miss and Ted was part of that class. 

 

After a couple of emails it was confirmed that Ted would qualify for the draft but it was beyond the date to get onto the official draft list so he ended up in the supplemental draft in one of the largest supplementals in a long time. 

 

These kids that move with family members to the States during their teens are nearly impossible to keep track of especially when they move before high school. The high school kids are a little easier if they've made a name for themselves a bit. 

 

 

Hypothetically, what would happen if they found out a guy who had played in the NFL for a couple years (let's say he's 27 or 28) was actually eligible to be a NI. An established player.

 

Would he suddenly be declared eligible for the next draft?