Roster thoughts post game #2 - changes must be made

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

The theme for post game #2 CHANGES MUST BE MADE. And Mistakes have been made. And surprising contributers.  

 

 

 

SPECIAL TEAMS

 

The press today is bringing up why Mike Renaud was wanted off this team 2 and 3 years ago. For whatever reason maybe it was because he had a final good game last year, he is INT, and he had a happy off the field story at the end of last season he was viewed as a major key for our team. Well everyone was wrong. 2nd qtr we get a call for no yards (15 yard kind) was it the gunners fault? no it was Renaud. Took way too much time to get rid of the ball and he absolutely botched the ball. Took forever to pin the ball inside the 20...... reminds you a lot of that Banjor Bowl fiasco a few years ago at CanadInns Stadium doesn't it?.... 

 

Biggest mistake we made in training camp was not give Brett Maher a spot on the team. Keep Liram and get rid of Renaud. Cut Banks, keep Maher and you are even. Maher punted the ball extremely well yesterday and will be one of the leagues best special teamer in a season or two.  It's also noted already via media that Renaud's play almost costed the BB a victory or chance to get back into the game.

 

 

 

 

Anyone know why Demond Washington does not receive more kickoff and punt returns? He is more of a threat than 'run up the gut' Aaron Woods. I don't hate Woods but Washington should be given about 50% more opportunities. I've said this for the last 2 seasons.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OFFENSE

 

It's obvious that 'The Great Grigsby' Nic Grigsby will be our starting RB for a long time. Nobody saw that coming. Everyone had Cotton and Ford penciled in as starters so we got lucky. 

 

Our OL has been decent however lack of depth is a major concern. BB staff must look for improvement whether they come from INT or NAT help. Come Labor Day we must have 2 new additions that are capable of playing well via FA or trade.

 

Drew Willy makes exceptional reads. Throws the ball with speed. However our new QB coach has to work on setting his feet quicker. 

 

Aaron Kelly is our new Milt Stegall threat. Run him deep and again and again. Catches the ball very well.

 

Julian Feoli-Gudino has been a major surprise. He is your typical possession receiver. Robert Gordon comes to mind. Works the field very well and is surely a capable starter. Has major weakness going deep and working long sidelines but he has a role and if used properly can be a major coup for this team.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

DEFENSE

 

Missing in action was Bryant Turner and we sure needed him. End of story Turner should have been at the game. He was even on his way back to Winnipeg last night.

 

One of the players of the game on defense was surely Jake Thomas who was disruptive all night long. Probably had this best game of his career since the game vs Edmonton a few years ago.

 

Blue staff needs to find another OLB badly. Depth is going to be a major concern. Desia Dunn was fantastic tackling last night. Everyone else?

 

Matt Bucknor will be our starting CB for the rest of the season. Donovan Alexander will never see the field and that is a good thing. We got lucky with NAT starting spot at CB this season. But next we must try to find an elite CB

 

Etches defensive game plan was weak. He was not ready for the Henry Burris style offensive game plan and that worries me. Mike O'Shea needs to learn from this and make sure the team is ready more. This might be Etches weakness as a coach. Not able to game plan. I didn't see any adjustments either and if it wasn't for Burris's two close incomplete passes we may not have had a chance for our offense to take over in the 4th quarter.

 

 

 

 

 

 

OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME AWARD:       RB  Nic Gigsby

 

 

DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE GAME AWARD:       DT Jake Thomas

 

 

SPECIAL TEAMS PLAYER OF THE GAME AWARD:        KR Demond Washington

 

 

TAKE HIS HELMET AWAY OF THE GAME AWARD:       P Mike Renaud

[Mike]

I agree with Renaud, but your solution of Maher doesn't make any sense.

 

I don't really agree regarding Grigsby. He's got work to do. Product of the system is where I'm standing at this point. Strong runner, below average blocker. Won't cut it long term unless he improves to become a complete back.

 

Also don't agree that Aaron Kelly is the new Milt Stegall. Not only is he not even close to Milt Stegall, he's not the #1 receiver on our team by any means.

 

Bryant Turner ... anyone questioning him doesn't really have that right, as far as I'm concerned. Worry about your family, he'll worry about his.

 

Matt Bucknor, I'm not terribly sold on. He was getting abused HARD early. He picked up his socks, but there's a reason he had like 6 tackles in the first quarter.

 

As far as Etcheverry goes ... if you didn't see any adjustments, you must have turned the game off quite early. Like in the first quarter.

[M.O.A.B.]

Wow... we're just 2-0 and some people becoming a spoiled brat already.

[Arnold_Palmer]

Remember that time we went 3-15 last season..

[Booch]

pretty much don't agree with much of this....JFG I agree with...nice surprise...Grigsby has potential...blocking isn't that as people claim but not ready to anoint him the man for next 3-5 years...yet

 

If anything Willy is...it's very technically sound and fundamentally I will go as far to say prob tops in the league..Missing o-lineman, hand issue, were reason for the erratic performance. He will have ups and downs but from a technical standpoint he the best we seen here in years...like I mean yeeeeaaarrrss!!

 

Once we seen what they were doing offensively by the mid point of second quarter we had it figured and second half solved...so not sure what you were watching. The big key this year to our success and it has already shown is that we have coaching...ongoing during the games, prior to the games, and we have a plan and are prepared. 

 

Jake Thomas sure made a few plays but if you isolate on him he is far from full-time starting material. He there out of necessity, wouldn't start on any other team and truth be told on many wouldn't even be on game roster...sure he a nice guy but not a starter by any stretch.

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

Mike you have interesting perspective of the game.......

 

First off Maher out punted Renaud yesterday. Why was the staff so high on him? He should have been cut last year. Maher punted 55 yards and had a 46 yarder into the wind with outstanding placement. Renaud punted 38 yard avg. enough said.

 

Bryant Turner should have been in Winnipeg. There was zero reason for him to stay for 1 week. Like Troy Westwood say. You are different than a professional athlete. Almost 90% of the pro athletes actually miss the birth of their child to play in a game. Some even miss a meaningless game in MLB or NBA where as a CFL game has way more importance. Chris Walby said it best. Plan to have a child outside of football season. And that is the truth. It's like if you have a regular job that you know in the fall you will be busy. Majority of people would plan that. In fact isn't that just a basic life lesson to plan the birth of your child?

 

and regards to Matt Bucknor. He got burnt once and you should know by now that every DB has that moment. He was almost perfect in the pursuit all night long and got at least 3 tackles covering his guy perfectly. 

 

Etches defensive game plan was an epic fail all night long. There were no adjustments made. It was a standard 4-3 combo blitz which allowed the inside DB's to play zone or the LB's to cover outside. They did this all night long so not sure what you saw. Unless you consider a dropped pass adjustments. 

[brett_c_b]

 

 

Bryant Turner should have been in Winnipeg. There was zero reason for him to stay for 1 week. Like Troy Westwood say. You are different than a professional athlete. Almost 90% of the pro athletes actually miss the birth of their child to play in a game. Some even miss a meaningless game in MLB or NBA where as a CFL game has way more importance. Chris Walby said it best. Plan to have a child outside of football season. And that is the truth. It's like if you have a regular job that you know in the fall you will be busy. Majority of people would plan that. In fact isn't that just a basic life lesson to plan the birth of your child?

 

I don't have kids, want kids or even really like kids, and with that said, your ignorance is absolutely astounding.

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

If anything Willy is...it's very technically sound and fundamentally I will go as far to say prob tops in the league..Missing o-lineman, hand issue, were reason for the erratic performance. He will have ups and downs but from a technical standpoint he the best we seen here in years...like I mean yeeeeaaarrrss!! 

 

 

oh boy.... missing OL was an issue. Hence why we need depth. So you agree with me?

 

Drew Willy is not fundamentally sound. And basically the entire CFL panel last night agrees with me. There is a reason why he under threw passes last night and got sacked twice (before the hand issue) 

 

i'll teach you something. If you are in a 3 set drop and you pump fake twice and then lose your feet position and at the same time hold the ball foolishly you are not technically sound. He is the best QB we have had in a while but if we do not get him proper coaching. He will not develop the best he can be.

[Booch]

epic failure all game???....like you are being serious?

 

man I bet you only person on planet who see's it that way and if the game stats from mid second quarter on, plus fact they scored 7 points from the 6 minute mark of the first quarter to the end of the game....which wasn't even a touchdown then I don't know what more of an adjustment could have been made on an offence that nobody had seen before.

 

If anything it was an epic success....dude like wake up

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

 

 

 

Bryant Turner should have been in Winnipeg. There was zero reason for him to stay for 1 week. Like Troy Westwood say. You are different than a professional athlete. Almost 90% of the pro athletes actually miss the birth of their child to play in a game. Some even miss a meaningless game in MLB or NBA where as a CFL game has way more importance. Chris Walby said it best. Plan to have a child outside of football season. And that is the truth. It's like if you have a regular job that you know in the fall you will be busy. Majority of people would plan that. In fact isn't that just a basic life lesson to plan the birth of your child?

 

I don't have kids, want kids or even really like kids, and with that said, your ignorance is absolutely astounding.

 

 

 

Well that is a bit rude calling it ignorant. Do you feel the same way when everyone says the same thing? or just me? Cause I think it's safe to say everyone in professional sports feels the same way. The kid was born last week not yesterday.

 

We are learning lots about Mike O'Shea. If he doesn't comment he probably agrees. And MOS didn't come out and say it was ok for him to miss the game. He even said last week that ''OH BRYANT WILL BE HERE OF COURSE'' so you know MOS is upset with him.

[M.O.A.B.]

21 points gave up by D on 1st quarter then only 7 points (off FGs) for 3 quarters after that.... yup there are no adjustment made by D.

[M.O.A.B.]

If anything Willy is...it's very technically sound and fundamentally I will go as far to say prob tops in the league..Missing o-lineman, hand issue, were reason for the erratic performance. He will have ups and downs but from a technical standpoint he the best we seen here in years...like I mean yeeeeaaarrrss!! 

 

 

oh boy.... missing OL was an issue. Hence why we need depth. So you agree with me?

 

Drew Willy is not fundamentally sound. And basically the entire CFL panel last night agrees with me. There is a reason why he under threw passes last night and got sacked twice (before the hand issue) 

 

i'll teach you something. If you are in a 3 set drop and you pump fake twice and then lose your feet position and at the same time hold the ball foolishly you are not technically sound. He is the best QB we have had in a while but if we do not get him proper coaching. He will not develop the best he can be.

 

This gonna be interesting another Know-It-All guy in the forum. You think you're better than Dahlquist?

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

Booch there is a difference between coaching success and player success and player failure.....

 

If Burris completed that pass down the middle who was left wide open BB lose the game..... I don't care what Ottawa did. If they have players open all over the place and drop the ball in the end zone it does not mean we did a good job.

 

I would be upset with Ottawa's game plan in the 2nd half because they tried to out smart themselves with running the ball too many times. And I think they know that now. We got lucky!

[Armchair GM]

Thanks for your opinions... agree with a bunch of them.  Have a few of my own:

 

- Grigsby looked good, and to me looked like he was reading his blocks better, but I still think Cotton based on what I've seen, is the best back on this team.  Grigsby's start has been excellent, and he doesn't deserve to be demoted when Cotton returns at all.  I just think Cotton is that good.

- Kelly is no Stegall.  That's blasphemy.  He might be able to grow into a Robert Gordon in his prime, and that would be fantastic.

- JFG fills in admirably for Watson.  Sticky hands and high effort.  Can play for me all day.

- Bucknor led the team in tackles because Ottawa felt strongly about picking on him.  Happy that he can tackle, but it says more about Ottawa's opinion of him than it does about his skill.

- Etch adjusted very well in-game.  Ottawa had game film to work with, we had nothing but studying our own assignments, and individual tendencies.  I expected Ottawa to have a better 1st quarter than us.  We won 29-7 in the final 3 quarters and that speaks to effective coaching adjustments.

[Booch]

Mr Beach....pretty sure there is nothing you can teach me in the game of football....nope

 

The panel whistles whatever tune the game being played is showing them at that time. Other than Dunigan and a lesser extent Milt that panel most times is way off mark.

 

Everyone agrees we need oline depth....thats a given, but the missing guys...zero time and the short term chaos that occured resulted in Willy looking unsettled. 

 

Most people in the know main thing they say about Willy is his pocket presense and demeanor, his sound mechanics and technique is what is going to make him a sure fire top teir Q.B in this league.

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and ours differ

[M.O.A.B.]

 

 

 

 

Bryant Turner should have been in Winnipeg. There was zero reason for him to stay for 1 week. Like Troy Westwood say. You are different than a professional athlete. Almost 90% of the pro athletes actually miss the birth of their child to play in a game. Some even miss a meaningless game in MLB or NBA where as a CFL game has way more importance. Chris Walby said it best. Plan to have a child outside of football season. And that is the truth. It's like if you have a regular job that you know in the fall you will be busy. Majority of people would plan that. In fact isn't that just a basic life lesson to plan the birth of your child?

 

I don't have kids, want kids or even really like kids, and with that said, your ignorance is absolutely astounding.

 

 

 

Well that is a bit rude calling it ignorant. Do you feel the same way when everyone says the same thing? or just me? Cause I think it's safe to say everyone in professional sports feels the same way. The kid was born last week not yesterday.

 

We are learning lots about Mike O'Shea. If he doesn't comment he probably agrees. And MOS didn't come out and say it was ok for him to miss the game. He even said last week that ''OH BRYANT WILL BE HERE OF COURSE'' so you know MOS is upset with him.

 

 

Not all baby-delivery are the same. Some women deliver baby normally and seems nothing happen. Some women delivers with much much difficulty. Some women recover from it pretty fast and some need a lot of time to recover from pain and heal. I guess Turner's wife required him for a couple of days.

 

The head coach dont have a problem with it. Why you, Troy Westwood?

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

if you all think they made adjustments what adjustments did they make? this is real life football not video game football or back yard football. You tell me what adjustments they made. In football writing. Did they remove a player and add a DL to contain the RB? Did they mix up there zone coverages? 

 

I wish the CFL used StatsPro used by the NFL and NCAA after 2-3 days they grade possessions and try to calculate % of different play calls. Which is a coaches killer in message boards like this that people say coaches did a good job.

 

I am telling you that the BB did very little and Etches defensive game plan was horrible. Hence why we got burned down the field almost the entire first half. 

 

Certain players stepped up and also we got lucky with dropped passes. We need more from Etch or this could be a long season. No Suber and no Turner hurt us. But you have to game plan something for these losses.

[Floyd]

Maher is gone because he outpunted our coverage teams...  I'm no real fan of Renaud but until we find a better directional punter, we will have to put up with his occasional brain farts.

 

Weird that the post is pretty picky about most aspects of the game yet you missed Grigsby's attrocious blocking.

 

Not sure what the complaint about OL depth is... Goossen stepped in and survived.  Last year, we would have had Pencer or CK getting manhandled all game.  Quinn Everett and Swiston are depth...  who knows how Swiston is responding now that Wylie is here...

 

JFG has not actually been called on to 'go deep'...

 

You are watching a different Desia Dunn than me... I feel like he is by far our weakest link on the D

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

2 things.

 

i'm not comparing Stegall to Kelly. But he can be used the same way. Gordon is not the same receiver as Kelly so that is off the mark. And we are using AK as Stegall. Down the field threat.

 

 

drew willy strengths are his short passes and reads. He needs better work on fundamentals. 

[Booch]

Play you mentioned Burris read the play...seen the safety blitz and tried to take advantage of it....that's football. 

 

If i re-watched the game film...yes game film and not t.v footage I am sure I can find many instances where if "this would have happened" or "that would have happened" then it could have been a blow out one way..or the other...that logic of yours makes no sense.

 

Burris tried to take advantage of a scheme...missed....happens all the time.

 

I guess we didnt deserve to win cause if Washington didn't return his kick we would have lost?...we took advantage of over pursuit of coverage due to fear of outside speed...returner read it...two blockers adjusted to what he did...took it to house...so we in this instance took advantage of a scheme and in-situ game moment...exploited it...and scored

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

Desia Dunn made the tackle of the game last night. just so you know.

 

Grigsby is a RB and he doesn't have to block. This ain't the NFL. How many times do CFL RB's even get into position to block? not often. And if you disagree watch the games tonight. And Grigsby at least 2 times in the 4th had to block blind side and did an awesome job.

[Armchair GM]

If anything Willy is...it's very technically sound and fundamentally I will go as far to say prob tops in the league..Missing o-lineman, hand issue, were reason for the erratic performance. He will have ups and downs but from a technical standpoint he the best we seen here in years...like I mean yeeeeaaarrrss!! 

 

 

oh boy.... missing OL was an issue. Hence why we need depth. So you agree with me?

 

Drew Willy is not fundamentally sound. And basically the entire CFL panel last night agrees with me. There is a reason why he under threw passes last night and got sacked twice (before the hand issue) 

 

i'll teach you something. If you are in a 3 set drop and you pump fake twice and then lose your feet position and at the same time hold the ball foolishly you are not technically sound. He is the best QB we have had in a while but if we do not get him proper coaching. He will not develop the best he can be.

 

Not only completely ignorant toward family/personal issues, but you're also cornering the market on sheer arrogance. 

 

Willy's footwork is above-average.  You don't throw 25+ yard back shoulder fades as well as he does without above-average footwork.  Probably the most technical throw in football. 

 

Did he have great footwork every throw?  God no.  But there were a lot of things at work.  Zone coverage, poor blocking, Willy not checking out of longer developing plays with Ottawa showing overload blitzes... even something as simple as tight coverage on his hot reads can rightly lead you to pump fake and go to your next progression. 

[Dr. Blue]

 

 

 

 

Bryant Turner should have been in Winnipeg. There was zero reason for him to stay for 1 week. Like Troy Westwood say. You are different than a professional athlete. Almost 90% of the pro athletes actually miss the birth of their child to play in a game. Some even miss a meaningless game in MLB or NBA where as a CFL game has way more importance. Chris Walby said it best. Plan to have a child outside of football season. And that is the truth. It's like if you have a regular job that you know in the fall you will be busy. Majority of people would plan that. In fact isn't that just a basic life lesson to plan the birth of your child?

 

I don't have kids, want kids or even really like kids, and with that said, your ignorance is absolutely astounding.

 

 

 

Well that is a bit rude calling it ignorant. Do you feel the same way when everyone says the same thing? or just me? Cause I think it's safe to say everyone in professional sports feels the same way. The kid was born last week not yesterday.

 

We are learning lots about Mike O'Shea. If he doesn't comment he probably agrees. And MOS didn't come out and say it was ok for him to miss the game. He even said last week that ''OH BRYANT WILL BE HERE OF COURSE'' so you know MOS is upset with him.

 

 

From an article earlier in the week.

 

Head coach Mike O’Shea says family takes precedence over football.

“I’m quite comfortable letting him know he needs to take whatever time he needs to take with his family,” O’Shea said, Wednesday. “It’s important. He’s going to play football for a long, long time. And this is once, maybe twice, maybe three — I don’t know how many kids he’s going to have... as a group we’re all very supportive of that idea.”

[Floyd]

2 things.

 

i'm not comparing Stegall to Kelly. But he can be used the same way. Gordon is not the same receiver as Kelly so that is off the mark. And we are using AK as Stegall. Down the field threat.

 

 

drew willy strengths are his short passes and reads. He needs better work on fundamentals. 

 

Actually short passes and reads are the fundamentals... 

[WinnipegBeach_BlueBombers]

Play you mentioned Burris read the play...seen the safety blitz and tried to take advantage of it....that's football. 

 

If i re-watched the game film...yes game film and not t.v footage I am sure I can find many instances where if "this would have happened" or "that would have happened" then it could have been a blow out one way..or the other...that logic of yours makes no sense.

 

Burris tried to take advantage of a scheme...missed....happens all the time.

 

I guess we didnt deserve to win cause if Washington didn't return his kick we would have lost?...we took advantage of over pursuit of coverage due to fear of outside speed...returner read it...two blockers adjusted to what he did...took it to house...so we in this instance took advantage of a scheme and in-situ game moment...exploited it...and scored

 

 

he didn't try to take advantage. The guy was wide open and dropped the ball. Happened 3 times which could have let to 30 plus yard gains. That doesn't happen all the time or should happen all the time.

 

we got out played this game. We got lucky! If it wasn't for Grigsby and Demond Washington we lose the game.