Floyd Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Lawless reporting that no trades are in the works... which may or may not be true. A bit disappointing, would be selling players for picks right now. Still cheering for Walters but I still think we should have given him a few years as Asst GM and brought in someone with experience. I'd give Walters a C+ right now... Scouting - C+ - great Cdn finds, LH, JFG - moderate import success - Trades - C+ overpaying, maybe has no choice Bucknor deal looking really good don't like the Brohm trade Neufeld trade looking bad Free Agency - B+ got some talent even with Mackstink on us Randle was probably the biggest signing of FA imo feels like we passed on some good guys but hard to know what's behind the scenes Coaches - C swung and missed with Stubler, Etch was best of the rest safe choice with MB still believe in OShea Tracey was a good choice but not working so far Wiley needs to be here full-time Personnel - C+ bit slow with import talent - would have like more competition at camp brought in some stinkers - Kuale, Bryant - but I'll hang that on the coaches Walters has a good eye - Newman (probably), Stoudermire, Cornell, Kromah Couple more years and we'll have a nice Cdn core James 1
Mike Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Not going to bother grading things out. I agree with a lot of what you're saying. Here are my thoughts ... Walters, more than any GM we've had in recent times, has his finger on the pulse of the league. He understands the CFL and I'm sure he's got up to date opinions and information on nearly every player currently on a roster. He has done a good job of bringing in established talent in various capacities. Moves like Randle and Stoudermire, incredibly underrated moves to make for a GM and that impressed me. I also love his dedication to the draft and am very excited to see what talent he provides our roster from that pipeline going forward. As for the negative stuff ... I think he's a bit too fast and loose with dealing away draft picks (really don't like that Brohm trade) and to me, he definitely failed in his first season of import recruiting. Do I want him back? Absolutely. Floyd and James 2
Rich Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Some interesting tweets from Lawless regarding the trade deadline, it isn't just Walters who is inactive at the trade deadline. one #cfl GM gave me following reasons for no trades: 9-team league; system oriented game with huge learning curve, no guaranteed contracts — gary lawless (@garylawless) October 15, 2014 @garylawless Not many trades in the NFL either, so the league size isn't the critical factor. More so the learning curve. — Darren Gill (@cflsuperagent) October 15, 2014 Anyone want to bet the GM that Lawless talks to is Taman? Floyd 1
Captain Blue Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Definitely concerned about his ability to find Americans, but right now I still have confidence in him. The moves to go out and trade for Randle and Willy were huge moves that don't get enough credit. I get that Willy was about to be a FA, but we've failed to pull the trigger before on things that give us an advantage.
Tracker Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 There is an odd synchronicity between this year's team and Walters' performance- for the first couple of months, everything was going stunningly well, then the team and Walters' recruiting both fell apart completely.
Blueandgold Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 We should hire Joe Mack as a scout. max power and James 2
Mr Dee Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Score one for Walters on this latest Grigsby matter.
TBURGESS Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Lawless reporting that no trades are in the works... which may or may not be true. A bit disappointing, would be selling players for picks right now. Still cheering for Walters but I still think we should have given him a few years as Asst GM and brought in someone with experience. I'd give Walters a C+ right now... Scouting - C+ - great Cdn finds, LH, JFG - moderate import success - Trades - C+ overpaying, maybe has no choice Bucknor deal looking really good don't like the Brohm trade Neufeld trade looking bad Free Agency - B+ got some talent even with Mackstink on us Randle was probably the biggest signing of FA imo feels like we passed on some good guys but hard to know what's behind the scenes Coaches - C swung and missed with Stubler, Etch was best of the rest safe choice with MB still believe in OShea Tracey was a good choice but not working so far Wiley needs to be here full-time Personnel - C+ bit slow with import talent - would have like more competition at camp brought in some stinkers - Kuale, Bryant - but I'll hang that on the coaches Walters has a good eye - Newman (probably), Stoudermire, Cornell, Kromah Couple more years and we'll have a nice Cdn core Your worst grade is a C, which is average. If you were right, we'd have an average to above average team and we don't. You're a really really easy marker.
pigseye Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 From what I've seen this year, both Walters and O'Shea are too green for their current positions. Both have relied too heavily on Marcel and Etch as this team has their stink all over it. Strong GM's like Wally, Popp & Huff have their finger prints all over their teams regardless who's coaching.
17to85 Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Lawless reporting that no trades are in the works... which may or may not be true. A bit disappointing, would be selling players for picks right now. Still cheering for Walters but I still think we should have given him a few years as Asst GM and brought in someone with experience. I'd give Walters a C+ right now... Scouting - C+ - great Cdn finds, LH, JFG - moderate import success - Trades - C+ overpaying, maybe has no choice Bucknor deal looking really good don't like the Brohm trade Neufeld trade looking bad Free Agency - B+ got some talent even with Mackstink on us Randle was probably the biggest signing of FA imo feels like we passed on some good guys but hard to know what's behind the scenes Coaches - C swung and missed with Stubler, Etch was best of the rest safe choice with MB still believe in OShea Tracey was a good choice but not working so far Wiley needs to be here full-time Personnel - C+ bit slow with import talent - would have like more competition at camp brought in some stinkers - Kuale, Bryant - but I'll hang that on the coaches Walters has a good eye - Newman (probably), Stoudermire, Cornell, Kromah Couple more years and we'll have a nice Cdn core Your worst grade is a C, which is average. If you were right, we'd have an average to above average team and we don't. You're a really really easy marker. yeah the import scouting is at best a D. Leggett and Johnson were good but who else of note have they found? Trading hasn't really been that good either. Basically they brought in some OK depth NIs and some good free agents. The biggest area that needs improvement is the american scouting. They have to bring in better depth players than they did last year. Can't be relying on guys like Romby Bryant as your depth. I think people just got so angry with Joe Mack that they are willing to overlook the areas that Walters needs to get better at. Right now he's basically Brendan Taman without the experience. Blue-urns and blitzmore 2
Adrenaline_x Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 From what I've seen this year, both Walters and O'Shea are too green for their current positions. Both have relied too heavily on Marcel and Etch as this team has their stink all over it. Strong GM's like Wally, Popp & Huff have their finger prints all over their teams regardless who's coaching. Well.. You can have the best coaches in the league but if you don't have the best players or even good to great players you can't win ****. Our oline hasn't been good.. Which we thought wylie could fix, but the talent isn't there. The d-line requires us to blitz to get pressure, and even then we can't get to the QB. The recievers need work. We need a dominant running back with an oline that can run block. Thats a big list. Do i think the OC and DC are great? no.. No they are not.. But they also don't have the greatest players..
Floyd Posted October 15, 2014 Author Report Posted October 15, 2014 I gave Walters higher grades because... a. Mack left the cupboard bare b. Walters either hits a homerun or strikes out... seems like all or nothing - much like Taman actually
17to85 Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 I gave Walters higher grades because... a. Mack left the cupboard bare b. Walters either hits a homerun or strikes out... seems like all or nothing - much like Taman actually Hardly. Most of the starters for this team are guys Mack brought in. Walters did some nice work in FA, but he's so far behind Mack in terms of recruiting American players at this point that it's not even a fair comparison. As for drafting we need more time to see just what Walters brings to the team in that regard. MOBomberFan 1
Goalie Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 We will just do it like this QBs- Willy,Brohm,Marve <--- all upgrades on last seasons complete CRAP.. BY A MILE even. RB- let's call it a wash really, Ford was ok last year, much like Grigsby this year, Just ok, nothing special, Just ok. <--- needs to be upgraded big time OL- January,Morley,Jones and Howard (for a bit) were around last season... Goossen,Tyler,Hinse and the PR guys are pretty much new.... Couple Import tackles i'm assuming on the PR right now so i suppose they do recognize the weakness, Neufeld has been hurt, Knapp lost his job and hasn't been able to get it back.. Bit undersized i suppose. WR- Moore, Denmark.. Kohlert,Watson.. Moore is new, the rest are the same. Kelly is the same, Bryant is new but not really, JFG is new too... Should have been able to find at least one receiver better than Kelly and Bryant, maybe that guy is on the PR though, who knows. Really just need 1 guy there. Couldn't find him earlier on, altho maybe kemp would have been that guy but he got hurt, hard to say exactly. Have tried McGuffie but he doesn't seem to be that impressive right now. DL- exact same as last year minus a few guys and plus Vega. Booker looked good, Fraser was ok when he played too, just got hurt..Lots of issues there with Injuries though. LB- Definitely worse, Funny cuz both Wild and Dunn were starters last year for us. Wild is good, Dunn is i suppose adequate? I dunno, don't hear his name much, not sure if that's good or bad.. DBs - definitely better than last year... big time upgrades there S- Leggett is way better than Muamba K- Lirim is the best kicker we have had in some time But when you really look at it... Leggett,Johnson,Fraser/Booker have been our only real changes from last season. Minus the QB's and free agent signings. Probably not good enough but i suppose i'm willing to give the scouting staff the benefit of the doubt for now, they seem to understand that there are issues with this team and judging by a few PR signings, they seem to be recognizing the right areas. Couple Tackles on there, Just signed a Linebacker too, Looks like he can play the Middle, so they are aware of the issues so that's a plus in my view but they haven't really given these guys a chance yet and the ones they have given that chance too, well a couple have looked decent (Booker,Tyler) a couple have not.
gbill2004 Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 I'm not convinced the problems with the OL are entirely lack of talent. I believe other significant contributing factors are: 1. Offensive schemes. No outlet for QB when pressure arrives early, not moving the pocket. 2. Lack of continuity due to injury. An OL needs 4-6 games to gel. Seems like this year every game there's a new combo.
Mark H. Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 It's a curious thing. Its been said over and over that Etch wants a certain type of player on D. However...most of the starters on D were already here last year.
rebusrankin Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Players brought in by Mack: 1. Washington 2. Dunn 3. Wild 4. Bryant 5. Anderson 6. Denmark 7. Watson 8. Kolhert 9. Greaves 10. Vega 11. J. Jones 12. Woods Players brought in by Walters: 1. Bucknor 2. Leggett 3. Randle 4. Johnson 5. Kuale 6.Peach 7. Willy 8. Moore 9. Kelly 10. Grigsby 11. Neufeld 12. JFG 13. Liram H. 14. Bryant 15. Howard 16. Tyler 17. Stoudermire 18. Cotton 19. Frazier 20. Booker 21. Brohm 22. Marve Need to disagree with 17to85, Mack didn't bring in most of the players on the team and certainly not most of the starters. Willy, Grisbby/Cotton, Moore, Kelly, Leggett, Randle, Johnson, Bucknor, Kuale, Peach, Howard, Tyler is half of our starters. January and Morley predate Mack too. sweep the leg 1
Jpan85 Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Jarvis Jones was after Mack was fired. Kohlert was probably more to do with Walters. Woods played with MB in UFL.
rebusrankin Posted October 15, 2014 Report Posted October 15, 2014 Jarvis Jones was after Mack was fired. Kohlert was probably more to do with Walters. Woods played with MB in UFL. Thanks. Couldn't recall some of them exactly.
pigseye Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 From what I've seen this year, both Walters and O'Shea are too green for their current positions. Both have relied too heavily on Marcel and Etch as this team has their stink all over it. Strong GM's like Wally, Popp & Huff have their finger prints all over their teams regardless who's coaching. Well.. You can have the best coaches in the league but if you don't have the best players or even good to great players you can't win ****. Our oline hasn't been good.. Which we thought wylie could fix, but the talent isn't there. The d-line requires us to blitz to get pressure, and even then we can't get to the QB. The recievers need work. We need a dominant running back with an oline that can run block. Thats a big list. Do i think the OC and DC are great? no.. No they are not.. But they also don't have the greatest players.. So you're blaming the GM for bringing in the guys the coaches wanted?
iso_55 Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 I'd like to see Wylie back but only if he gives the Bombers a full time commitment. No American OL high school skill camps after June 1st. If he won't commit to full time then release him & find someone else. We can't afford to have him missing while he does one of these camps.
DR. CFL Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 Coaches are paid to coach the players the GM and scouting staff provides them with. If they want to be in player personnel they should give up coaching.
17to85 Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 Players brought in by Mack: 1. Washington 2. Dunn 3. Wild 4. Bryant 5. Anderson 6. Denmark 7. Watson 8. Kolhert 9. Greaves 10. Vega 11. J. Jones 12. Woods Players brought in by Walters: 1. Bucknor 2. Leggett 3. Randle 4. Johnson 5. Kuale 6.Peach 7. Willy 8. Moore 9. Kelly 10. Grigsby 11. Neufeld 12. JFG 13. Liram H. 14. Bryant 15. Howard 16. Tyler 17. Stoudermire 18. Cotton 19. Frazier 20. Booker 21. Brohm 22. Marve Need to disagree with 17to85, Mack didn't bring in most of the players on the team and certainly not most of the starters. Willy, Grisbby/Cotton, Moore, Kelly, Leggett, Randle, Johnson, Bucknor, Kuale, Peach, Howard, Tyler is half of our starters. January and Morley predate Mack too. The main point here is that the bolded were all guys who were in the CFL previously. As I said, he did some good work in free agency but a lot of those guys were plucked off the scrap heap and many of them shouldn't be starting at all and I'd argue are only starting because of how poor the recruitment has been. The cupboards were not nearly as bare as people make them out to be. This team without guys like Denmark and Washington and Wild and Turner would be absolutely terrible. The only guys of note that were recruited this past offseason were Johnson and Legett and I don't doubt that they would have been fine in the secondary playing Suber instead of Johnson either.
Jpan85 Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 That's 3 years of work compared to 1. voodoochylde and Rich 2
mbrg Posted October 16, 2014 Report Posted October 16, 2014 Bringing them in is bringing them in. If Mack gets lambasted for completely refusing to look at players from other teams or using free agency, why wouldn't Walters get credit for doing the opposite? Looking at good players on our roster that Walters brought here and saying they somehow don't count - that's silly. Mr Dee and blitzmore 2
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