Game 19 Jets @ Wild

[BomberFan]

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

[Goalie]

didn't show up until the third, the powerplay is still a disaster but i'll take the point we didn't deserve. 

[BomberFan]

didn't show up until the third, the powerplay is still a disaster but i'll take the point we didn't deserve. 

Yeah pretty flat in the first 2, some bad bounces, but they had some chances. They didn't quit, and that's the important part for me.

[Goalie]

 

didn't show up until the third, the powerplay is still a disaster but i'll take the point we didn't deserve. 

Yeah pretty flat in the first 2, some bad bounces, but they had some chances. They didn't quit, and that's the important part for me.

 

Oh i agree. I liked seeing that, they never gave up, never folded. Tough 5 game trip, could have been 5-0 with some puck luck but 2-2-1? i'll take it. 5 games in 10 days is tough. 

[The Unknown Poster]

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

[Goalie]

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

 

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something. 

[Jacquie]

Ken Wiebe @WiebeSunSports

I asked #NHLJets D Zach Bogosian what his team takes from the rally: "Don't play like (crap) in the first two periods. That's about it."

[The Unknown Poster]

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

[Goalie]

Blaming Maurice or Pavelec is like blaming ETCH and the D for the bombers when the Offense keeps going 2 and out all game

 

0 for 8 powerplay

 

no even strength shots in the first

 

But lets blame the coach and the goalie. 

[The Unknown Poster]

Well for starters I don't know who is blaming the coach and the goalie but both deserve some blame. It's a team sport.

It was the wrong decision to start Pavs. I understand why Maurice did it but the jets have very few back to backs this year. The team seems to have a delicate psyche. The fact Pavs was pulled proves it. He wasn't bad but the first goal was on him. And he looked rattled.

Jets showed up just in time but too little too late. Hopefully they learn from this. They can't have some success and then get lazy.

[HardCoreBlue]

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

I liked what Maurice said about the schedulers with not playing a NHL game in their life, classic.

[Atomic]

Well for starters I don't know who is blaming the coach and the goalie but both deserve some blame. It's a team sport.

It was the wrong decision to start Pavs. I understand why Maurice did it but the jets have very few back to backs this year. The team seems to have a delicate psyche. The fact Pavs was pulled proves it. He wasn't bad but the first goal was on him. And he looked rattled.

Jets showed up just in time but too little too late. Hopefully they learn from this. They can't have some success and then get lazy.

 

Its not laziness when there is less than 24 hours between games.  Humans, even professional athletes, get tired.  Yes, you have to push through it but let's not equate fatigue with laziness.

[sweep the leg]

 

Its not laziness when there is less than 24 hours between games.  Humans, even professional athletes, get tired.  Yes, you have to push through it but let's not equate fatigue with laziness.

 

I don't buy that it was laziness either. They played an evening game, travelled from Nashville to Minneapolis, got to their hotel after 1am, then had to play an afternoon game. I'm very impressed they took a point out of this game.

 

I didn't like the decision to play Pavelec for all of the above reasons.

[Goalie]

Outside of that first period, the case could be made that the Jets actually outplayed the WILD.

 

And they definitely outplayed them in the third. 

 

The first goal in on Pavelec? why? cuz the wild player made a nice move in close on the powerplay and scored? 

 

I dunno man. Maybe that was a bad goal, i don't really think it was, but... backstrom let in a goal from behind the net (the kane goal) so really it evened out. 

[The Unknown Poster]

Call it lazy. Call it taking the night off. Whatever. Fatigue? Well they weren't too fatigued in the third period. They came out flat. If that's rare then so be it. But we have seen that a lot from this team. They didn't show up until the third period.

The first goal pavs should have maintained positional advantage. Then the player either shoots it at pavs or goes for the low percentage wrap around. Player made a good

Move by drawing pavs in.

[BomberFan]

 

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

 

Do you actually watch any games? First goal could have beat anyone. Last 2 would have beat everyone. But you're right, Maurice has done nothing to elevate this teams compete level from last year.

[BomberFan]

 

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

 

First of all , you don't sound like a fan, at least not  a knowledgeable one. You talk a lot of crap.  "They looked tired and lethargic" perhaps if you payed attention to their schedule, you'd realize ANY team would have been tired and lethargic after that schedule. A  4:00 afternoon game on back to back? Well that's brilliant. BTW Number One goalies play back-to-back games, it's expected of them and they need to get used to doing it. Saying it's a stupid coaching decision clearly shows you haven't a clue, just an uninformed opinion. You should stick to posting BS trade rumours, seems closer to your level of expertise.

[The Unknown Poster]

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

Do you actually watch any games? First goal could have beat anyone. Last 2 would have beat everyone. But you're right, Maurice has done nothing to elevate this teams compete level from last year.

You mad bro? Lol. Where did I say Maurice had not elevated the team. In another thread I said just that. If you want to debate at least stock to facts.

One of pavs issues over be years has been taking himself out of position. So yes that first goal would have beat anyone if everyone else also bit on the fake and took themselves out of position. Had he stayed in his net and stayed in position he limits the shooters chances.

[The Unknown Poster]

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

First of all , you don't sound like a fan, at least not a knowledgeable one. You talk a lot of crap. "They looked tired and lethargic" perhaps if you payed attention to their schedule, you'd realize ANY team would have been tired and lethargic after that schedule. A 4:00 afternoon game on back to back? Well that's brilliant. BTW Number One goalies play back-to-back games, it's expected of them and they need to get used to doing it. Saying it's a stupid coaching decision clearly shows you haven't a clue, just an uninformed opinion. You should stick to posting BS trade rumours, seems closer to your level of expertise.

So you agree with me that they looked tired and lethargic. Excellent. So what's your problem?

Secondly the overall record of nhl goalies playing back to backs isn't good so it's not a Pavs thing. Think about it.

[BomberFan]

 

 

 

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

Do you actually watch any games? First goal could have beat anyone. Last 2 would have beat everyone. But you're right, Maurice has done nothing to elevate this teams compete level from last year.

You mad bro? Lol. Where did I say Maurice had not elevated the team. In another thread I said just that. If you want to debate at least stock to facts.

One of pavs issues over be years has been taking himself out of position. So yes that first goal would have beat anyone if everyone else also bit on the fake and took themselves out of position. Had he stayed in his net and stayed in position he limits the shooters chances.

 

Mad? No. Annoyed by your BS? Yes. Read what you wrote "team was awful, coach is an idiot."  Next time I'll mark the sarcasm for you.  Now go look at the goal again and point out where Pavs was out of position. He faced the puck carrier and tracked the pass to the right  sliding into position.  He got out-waited and beat by a slick play. It wasn't a bad goal or a positional error. Go look at the Leafs Preds game for some bad goal examples. And if you're not saying it was Pavs fault, why the hell are you bringing it up?

[BomberFan]

 

 

 

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

First of all , you don't sound like a fan, at least not a knowledgeable one. You talk a lot of crap. "They looked tired and lethargic" perhaps if you payed attention to their schedule, you'd realize ANY team would have been tired and lethargic after that schedule. A 4:00 afternoon game on back to back? Well that's brilliant. BTW Number One goalies play back-to-back games, it's expected of them and they need to get used to doing it. Saying it's a stupid coaching decision clearly shows you haven't a clue, just an uninformed opinion. You should stick to posting BS trade rumours, seems closer to your level of expertise.

So you agree with me that they looked tired and lethargic. Excellent. So what's your problem?

Secondly the overall record of nhl goalies playing back to backs isn't good so it's not a Pavs thing. Think about it.

 

No, I don't agree, that's why I put YOUR comments in quotes. Any reasonable person would realize a certain amount of fatigue might set in after such a gruelling road trip and the quick start to the next day game. . That same reasonable person might credit the players  for sticking with the plan, mounting a comeback and getting a point. They might also credit the coach for putting the system in place that allowed that level of play when faced with such adversity.

NHL goalies back to back records not withstanding, are irrelevant to the fact that No. 1 goalies play back to back games. You might want to try and figure out why that is, almost every team does it, so there must be a reason. 

[The Unknown Poster]

 

 

 

 

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

Do you actually watch any games? First goal could have beat anyone. Last 2 would have beat everyone. But you're right, Maurice has done nothing to elevate this teams compete level from last year.

You mad bro? Lol. Where did I say Maurice had not elevated the team. In another thread I said just that. If you want to debate at least stock to facts.

One of pavs issues over be years has been taking himself out of position. So yes that first goal would have beat anyone if everyone else also bit on the fake and took themselves out of position. Had he stayed in his net and stayed in position he limits the shooters chances.

 

Mad? No. Annoyed by your BS? Yes. Read what you wrote "team was awful, coach is an idiot."  Next time I'll mark the sarcasm for you.  Now go look at the goal again and point out where Pavs was out of position. He faced the puck carrier and tracked the pass to the right  sliding into position.  He got out-waited and beat by a slick play. It wasn't a bad goal or a positional error. Go look at the Leafs Preds game for some bad goal examples. And if you're not saying it was Pavs fault, why the hell are you bringing it up?

 

BS? lol  Okay.  Sorry but you dont get to be right just because you yell the loudest.  The player took Pavs out of position.  Out of position would be laying there on the ice, away from the net where the player was able to simply toss it in for a goal.  Had he remained up right, tight to the post, he takes away any opportunity for the player.  There were two defenders there (that I recall) so the player's deke options were limited.  He scored because he had a wide open net to shoot at.  Look, I love the Jets too but dont let your homer mentality over-look the errors.

 

Also, show me where I said Maurice was an idiot?  Never said it.  Here's some free advice: if you want to debate, especially if you want to win that debate, dont just make things up.  You automatically lose that way.  I said it was a stupid coaching decision to start Pavs.  Perhaps "stupid" was too strong a word.  it was a coaching "error" to start Pavs.  Not because he sucks but for two reasons: 1) Pavs' stats on back to back starts, 2) league-wide goalie stats on back to back nights.  Maurice admitted his plan was to start Hutch the next game anyway.  Why not reverse those two starts and play the statistical odds?  I get why he did and to be honest, I was on the fence about it.  I think it was this thread where, prior to the game, I said play the odds, start Hutch, even though my "heart" was in on the idea of letting Pavs stare down one of his demons.

 

You could also criticise the coach on the faceoff that lead to the winning goal as he didnt have a centre on the ice for a defensive zone faceoff.  I actually didnt see OT as my PVR cut out, but I know the guys on 1290 were talking about as a coaching error.  Kane & Wheeler have both taken and won faceoffs this year, but again, in that situation probably best to go with the high percentage rather than your gut.

 

Having said all that, I understand your position.  Im a huge Pavs fan.  Ive taken heat everywhere for defending him and saying how stupid it would have been to buy him out last season.  But he's not infallable. 

[The Unknown Poster]

 

 

 

 

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

First of all , you don't sound like a fan, at least not a knowledgeable one. You talk a lot of crap. "They looked tired and lethargic" perhaps if you payed attention to their schedule, you'd realize ANY team would have been tired and lethargic after that schedule. A 4:00 afternoon game on back to back? Well that's brilliant. BTW Number One goalies play back-to-back games, it's expected of them and they need to get used to doing it. Saying it's a stupid coaching decision clearly shows you haven't a clue, just an uninformed opinion. You should stick to posting BS trade rumours, seems closer to your level of expertise.

So you agree with me that they looked tired and lethargic. Excellent. So what's your problem?

Secondly the overall record of nhl goalies playing back to backs isn't good so it's not a Pavs thing. Think about it.

 

No, I don't agree, that's why I put YOUR comments in quotes. Any reasonable person would realize a certain amount of fatigue might set in after such a gruelling road trip and the quick start to the next day game. . That same reasonable person might credit the players  for sticking with the plan, mounting a comeback and getting a point. They might also credit the coach for putting the system in place that allowed that level of play when faced with such adversity.

NHL goalies back to back records not withstanding, are irrelevant to the fact that No. 1 goalies play back to back games. You might want to try and figure out why that is, almost every team does it, so there must be a reason. 

 

 

Exactly.  I said the team looked tired and lethargic and you said its reasonable that they would be so.  So we agree,.  Thank you.  Certainly they deserve credit for the comeback.  But crediting a team for coming back from a 3 goal deficit also means they likely deserve to be criticised for being in that 3 goal deficit to begin with.  They dug themselves a hole and then they fought out of it.  Maurice called it an important game in showing their character..  Maybe I expect more after how they've played this season but certainly in years past they would have folded like a cheap suit.  So they team is improving in that regard, no doubt.

 

As for your last point, it's ridiculous.  The league wide stats of goalies playing back to back games is not irrelevant.  What is irrelevant to the point regarding the decision to start Pavs is your point that some starting goalies *do* play back to back games.  The most relevant data is the macro stats showing reduced effectiveness league wide and the micro stats showing Pavs in particular has reduced stats on back to backs.

 

Further, I did some research for you.  in an article linked on NHL.com, it was revealed that "goalies playing on a second consecutive night have a save percentage much lower than goalies who have at least one off day between games."  Goalies with no rest have an average .892 save percentage while goalies who rested have a .912 average save percentage.  Elite goalies status didnt seem to make a difference.  Most interesting is this quote: "Rested goalies playing behind a tired team had the exact same .912 save percentage as found overall for rested goalies -- which presumably means that rested goalies behind a rested team were also at .912, and that the team's rest has no impact on the goalie's save percentage. The entire 0.020 difference would then be due to goalie fatigue."

 

Then there is this: "To put that 0.020 difference in perspective: Tim Thomas' career save percentage is .921; Michael Leighton's is .901. This difference is enormous, and would basically mean that no goalie should ever start back-to-back games."

 

Smaller sample size than required to really confirm the data but interesting nonetheless.  I believe the Jets have the fewest number of back to back games this season than any other team and therefore, to me, it wasnt that important to try and prove a point about Pavs' play.  Play the odds, start Hutch, get the win, move on.  If the time came for the Jets to be in the playoffs and had back to back, then the story of Pavs is only slightly more interesting than the league-wide story of goalies starting back to back.  Unfortunately, after this game, Pavs and the Jets are absolutely linked with the idea that their starting goalie cannot play back to backs (even though the loss was not his fault).  Its a potential psychological sticking point down the road and I dont think it was worth it.

 

If you disagree, thats cool.  Like I said, I was on the fence so I see the merit in starting him.  Hindsight is 20-20.  If you think its irrelevant now, feel free to refute the stats given (and remember, they arent *my* stats.

[BomberFan]

 

 

 

 

 

Team never gave up. Not sure why people always want to point to the negatives. Reality is, down 3-0. didn't show up for 2 periods, never gave up, came back tied it up, That's the team showing fight, never give up.

LOL @ fans blaming coaches, like the fans are some expert or something.

So if a fan isn't a hockey expert they aren't allowed rocks their opinion? Then why are you?

Team didn't give up. That implies they were trying to begin with. They looked tired and lethargic. I wonder if their terrible back to back record messed with them. It seemed to mess with Pavs. That was a dumb coaching decision. At this point is start Huch next game too. Give Pavs a rest.

First of all , you don't sound like a fan, at least not a knowledgeable one. You talk a lot of crap. "They looked tired and lethargic" perhaps if you payed attention to their schedule, you'd realize ANY team would have been tired and lethargic after that schedule. A 4:00 afternoon game on back to back? Well that's brilliant. BTW Number One goalies play back-to-back games, it's expected of them and they need to get used to doing it. Saying it's a stupid coaching decision clearly shows you haven't a clue, just an uninformed opinion. You should stick to posting BS trade rumours, seems closer to your level of expertise.

So you agree with me that they looked tired and lethargic. Excellent. So what's your problem?

Secondly the overall record of nhl goalies playing back to backs isn't good so it's not a Pavs thing. Think about it.

 

No, I don't agree, that's why I put YOUR comments in quotes. Any reasonable person would realize a certain amount of fatigue might set in after such a gruelling road trip and the quick start to the next day game. . That same reasonable person might credit the players  for sticking with the plan, mounting a comeback and getting a point. They might also credit the coach for putting the system in place that allowed that level of play when faced with such adversity.

NHL goalies back to back records not withstanding, are irrelevant to the fact that No. 1 goalies play back to back games. You might want to try and figure out why that is, almost every team does it, so there must be a reason. 

 

 

Exactly.  I said the team looked tired and lethargic and you said its reasonable that they would be so.  So we agree,.  Thank you.  Certainly they deserve credit for the comeback.  But crediting a team for coming back from a 3 goal deficit also means they likely deserve to be criticised for being in that 3 goal deficit to begin with.  They dug themselves a hole and then they fought out of it.  Maurice called it an important game in showing their character..  Maybe I expect more after how they've played this season but certainly in years past they would have folded like a cheap suit.  So they team is improving in that regard, no doubt.

 

As for your last point, it's ridiculous.  The league wide stats of goalies playing back to back games is not irrelevant.  What is irrelevant to the point regarding the decision to start Pavs is your point that some starting goalies *do* play back to back games.  The most relevant data is the macro stats showing reduced effectiveness league wide and the micro stats showing Pavs in particular has reduced stats on back to backs.

 

Further, I did some research for you.  in an article linked on NHL.com, it was revealed that "goalies playing on a second consecutive night have a save percentage much lower than goalies who have at least one off day between games."  Goalies with no rest have an average .892 save percentage while goalies who rested have a .912 average save percentage.  Elite goalies status didnt seem to make a difference.  Most interesting is this quote: "Rested goalies playing behind a tired team had the exact same .912 save percentage as found overall for rested goalies -- which presumably means that rested goalies behind a rested team were also at .912, and that the team's rest has no impact on the goalie's save percentage. The entire 0.020 difference would then be due to goalie fatigue."

 

Then there is this: "To put that 0.020 difference in perspective: Tim Thomas' career save percentage is .921; Michael Leighton's is .901. This difference is enormous, and would basically mean that no goalie should ever start back-to-back games."

 

Smaller sample size than required to really confirm the data but interesting nonetheless.  I believe the Jets have the fewest number of back to back games this season than any other team and therefore, to me, it wasnt that important to try and prove a point about Pavs' play.  Play the odds, start Hutch, get the win, move on.  If the time came for the Jets to be in the playoffs and had back to back, then the story of Pavs is only slightly more interesting than the league-wide story of goalies starting back to back.  Unfortunately, after this game, Pavs and the Jets are absolutely linked with the idea that their starting goalie cannot play back to backs (even though the loss was not his fault).  Its a potential psychological sticking point down the road and I dont think it was worth it.

 

If you disagree, thats cool.  Like I said, I was on the fence so I see the merit in starting him.  Hindsight is 20-20.  If you think its irrelevant now, feel free to refute the stats given (and remember, they arent *my* stats.

 

I'm not going to refute the stats, they're more than likely correct. What I think s seems to make them irrelevant is coaches continuing decisions to start goalies in back to back games regardless of their access to said stats. I think this is usually the case when riding a hot goalie for playoffs. Maurice playing Pav back to back might have simply been preparing him for that eventuality, to get him mentally and physically prepared. I don't KNOW that that was the case, but it makes sense to me. And I don't think "the Jets are absolutely linked with the idea that their starting goalie cannot play back to backs".  Maurice said he pulled Pavs because of the types of shots he was getting - bad bounces caroms of skates etc. I'm pretty sure it was a confidence thing for Pavs more than anything, and I think we will see him in a back to back situation if he's "hot" and we need a playoff point. 

[BomberFan]

 

 

 

 

 

I'm so impressed with the never quit attitude of this team. Awesome effort. Kudos again to Maurice for getting these guys in the right frame of mind.

Not at all. Team was awful. Stupid coaching decision to go with Pavs in back to back. I'm nkt even saying it was his fault but that first goal he was out of position. And he looked rattled after the wheeler deflection.

Guys like Kane took control of this game. No points for Maurice on this one.

Do you actually watch any games? First goal could have beat anyone. Last 2 would have beat everyone. But you're right, Maurice has done nothing to elevate this teams compete level from last year.

You mad bro? Lol. Where did I say Maurice had not elevated the team. In another thread I said just that. If you want to debate at least stock to facts.

One of pavs issues over be years has been taking himself out of position. So yes that first goal would have beat anyone if everyone else also bit on the fake and took themselves out of position. Had he stayed in his net and stayed in position he limits the shooters chances.

 

Mad? No. Annoyed by your BS? Yes. Read what you wrote "team was awful, coach is an idiot."  Next time I'll mark the sarcasm for you.  Now go look at the goal again and point out where Pavs was out of position. He faced the puck carrier and tracked the pass to the right  sliding into position.  He got out-waited and beat by a slick play. It wasn't a bad goal or a positional error. Go look at the Leafs Preds game for some bad goal examples. And if you're not saying it was Pavs fault, why the hell are you bringing it up?

 

BS? lol  Okay.  Sorry but you dont get to be right just because you yell the loudest.  The player took Pavs out of position.  Out of position would be laying there on the ice, away from the net where the player was able to simply toss it in for a goal.  Had he remained up right, tight to the post, he takes away any opportunity for the player.  There were two defenders there (that I recall) so the player's deke options were limited.  He scored because he had a wide open net to shoot at.  Look, I love the Jets too but dont let your homer mentality over-look the errors.

 

Also, show me where I said Maurice was an idiot?  Never said it.  Here's some free advice: if you want to debate, especially if you want to win that debate, dont just make things up.  You automatically lose that way.  I said it was a stupid coaching decision to start Pavs.  Perhaps "stupid" was too strong a word.  it was a coaching "error" to start Pavs.  Not because he sucks but for two reasons: 1) Pavs' stats on back to back starts, 2) league-wide goalie stats on back to back nights.  Maurice admitted his plan was to start Hutch the next game anyway.  Why not reverse those two starts and play the statistical odds?  I get why he did and to be honest, I was on the fence about it.  I think it was this thread where, prior to the game, I said play the odds, start Hutch, even though my "heart" was in on the idea of letting Pavs stare down one of his demons.

 

You could also criticise the coach on the faceoff that lead to the winning goal as he didnt have a centre on the ice for a defensive zone faceoff.  I actually didnt see OT as my PVR cut out, but I know the guys on 1290 were talking about as a coaching error.  Kane & Wheeler have both taken and won faceoffs this year, but again, in that situation probably best to go with the high percentage rather than your gut.

 

Having said all that, I understand your position.  Im a huge Pavs fan.  Ive taken heat everywhere for defending him and saying how stupid it would have been to buy him out last season.  But he's not infallable. 

 

I'm not going to get into a battle of semantics with you, but by calling Maurice stupid, you implied he was an idiot.I just paraphrased what I perceived your meaning  to be.  And you're right maybe stupid was a bad choice of words. So I'll just leave that one alone. I agree the face-off wasn't the best choice Maurice said as much afterwards.  I still think you should watch the goal again, he looked fine positionally from before the puck was passed to a wide open winger at the side of the net. That may have had more to do with the goal than the slick deke to put it in.