Marcel Bellefeuille

[gbill2004]

Aside from the year Bellefeuille was OC for Calvillo, is there a breakdown of sacks given up by year for every time Bellefeuille was OC?

[Noeller]

Is there a breakdown of sacks attributed to the OC vs the OL coach, or, God forbid, the players...?

[Goalie]

So etch gets canned but MB not being canned is the popular topic. Bombers dammed when they do and don't.

[gbill2004]

So etch gets canned but MB not being canned is the popular topic. Bombers dammed when they do and don't.

It's the offseason...we need something to talk about until training camp.

[17to85]

Is there a breakdown of sacks attributed to the OC vs the OL coach, or, God forbid, the players...?

there is but it's a sliding scale depending on who you're trying to prop up or drag down at the time. 

[Doublezero]

Etcheverry's defence gets criticized because it is high risk, high reward. And it is true that Bombers defence gave up too many yards per game in 2014 and surrendered too many points. But Etch's defence also scored points. If it hadn't been for defensive team scores and special teams scores our record last year would have been more like 4-14 rather than 7-11. It is a fair and reasonable argument that the O was more of a liability than the D.

[TBieber]

Sacks are a shared statistic. Not fully on the OL, scheme, or QB.

 

Some plays a lineman gets beat, some plays the QB doesn't progress his reads, and sometimes the scheme just sucks.

[Mr Dee]

 

 

 

OK so Etcheverry goes and Bellefeuille stays. 

IMHO Bombers got this a$$backwards.

This shows the football brain trust: Miller, Walters, O'Shea - whose collective experience is essentially on the defensive side of the ball and special teams (I know Miller got inserted occasionally as FB) - it shows that they know nothing about offence and can't see what a disaster the offence was in 2013-2014. I predict the Bombers sad-sack offence is going to be the achilles heel in 2015.

 

You're right. They should hire Doublezero.

 

Hey Mike do you have anything football related to add to this thread - or is that outside of your area of expertise?

 

I'll take Doublezero over Marcel at this point.

 

 

Double nothing is better than nothing?

[iso_55]

OK so Etcheverry goes and Bellefeuille stays. 

IMHO Bombers got this a$$backwards.

This shows the football brain trust: Miller, Walters, O'Shea - whose collective experience is essentially on the defensive side of the ball and special teams (I know Miller got inserted occasionally as FB) - it shows that they know nothing about offence and can't see what a disaster the offence was in 2013-2014. I predict the Bombers sad-sack offence is going to be the achilles heel in 2015.

Etcheverry HAD to go. There were no if's and's or but's. By far the worst DC in the CFL. Once teams figured out his schemes we were done. And he couldn't or wouldn't adjust. Even after MOS said he'd have to change he still refused. Stubborness got him fired... again. Who needs a guy with a mindset like that as a coordinator? Good riddance.

[Logan007]

 

 

 

 

OK so Etcheverry goes and Bellefeuille stays. 

IMHO Bombers got this a$$backwards.

This shows the football brain trust: Miller, Walters, O'Shea - whose collective experience is essentially on the defensive side of the ball and special teams (I know Miller got inserted occasionally as FB) - it shows that they know nothing about offence and can't see what a disaster the offence was in 2013-2014. I predict the Bombers sad-sack offence is going to be the achilles heel in 2015.

 

You're right. They should hire Doublezero.

 

Hey Mike do you have anything football related to add to this thread - or is that outside of your area of expertise?

 

I'll take Doublezero over Marcel at this point.

 

 

Double nothing is better than nothing?

 

- Silence is a true friend who never betrays.

- Silence is better than unmeaning words.

- Silence is one of the great arts of communication.

 

[Captain Blue]

I still think our offensive (and even some defensive) issues stem from the personnel and not coaching. Like how our running game looked a whole lot better with Cotton over Grigsby suddenly. 

 

Our WRs for the most part underperformed. Guys like Kelly and Bryant are not going to help create a viable offense.

[Logan007]

I still think our offensive (and even some defensive) issues stem from the personnel and not coaching. Like how our running game looked a whole lot better with Cotton over Grigsby suddenly. 

 

Our WRs for the most part underperformed. Guys like Kelly and Bryant are not going to help create a viable offense.

Except that when you look at Marcel's track record...you start to see how things add up...to failure.

[SPuDS]

I still think our offensive (and even some defensive) issues stem from the personnel and not coaching. Like how our running game looked a whole lot better with Cotton over Grigsby suddenly.

Our WRs for the most part underperformed. Guys like Kelly and Bryant are not going to help create a viable offense.

Except that when you look at Marcel's track record...you start to see how things add up...to failure.

Hes a capable OC.. you dont last as long as he has without talent.. With that said, is he all-world? No.. All-northamerican? Nope.. Hell hes not even all-winnipeggian... We could do better... We could do much much worse...

You cannot deny the fact that willy looked deadly in his offense at times and that denmark was pretty exceptional.. Oline sucked, yup.. But how much of that was scheme or blocking help not helping...

Long story short, waaaaaaaaaaay too many variables on offense to lay blame all at MBs feet where as Etch kind of hooped himself with poor decisions and not willing to budge..

[Noeller]

Sacks are a shared statistic. Not fully on the OL, scheme, or QB.

Some plays a lineman gets beat, some plays the QB doesn't progress his reads, and sometimes the scheme just sucks.

...Exactly.

[TBieber]

I thought Bellefeuille was the right coordinator for what the Bombers needed last year with a new QB, looking for a new direction, and more importantly, to win games. Bellefeuille may not light the world on fire with his offence, but you know what you're gonna get, and I think with an improved defence, the Bombers can get a ticket to the show and see what happens.

[Logan007]

I thought Bellefeuille was the right coordinator for what the Bombers needed last year with a new QB, looking for a new direction, and more importantly, to win games. Bellefeuille may not light the world on fire with his offence, but you know what you're gonna get, and I think with an improved defence, the Bombers can get a ticket to the show and see what happens.

Yeah, you're gonna get mediocrity.  I'd like someone who can win, not just be average.

[Tracker]

Bellefeuille deserves a season with a decent O-line, a couple of healthy competitive wide receivers, an aggressive running game and a vertical quarterback. I'm not sure anyone could have done any better with that mess of an offence last season.

[TBieber]

 

I thought Bellefeuille was the right coordinator for what the Bombers needed last year with a new QB, looking for a new direction, and more importantly, to win games. Bellefeuille may not light the world on fire with his offence, but you know what you're gonna get, and I think with an improved defence, the Bombers can get a ticket to the show and see what happens.

Yeah, you're gonna get mediocrity.  I'd like someone who can win, not just be average.

 

 

Mediocrity was a step up from downright abysmal. I don't think he's the guy long term, but he was what the Bombers needed last year. 

[Logan007]

2003 - 11-7
2004 - 9-9
2005 - 9-9
2007 - 8-10
2008 - 3-15
2009 - 9-9
2010 - 9-9
2011 - 8-10
2013 - 3-15 (only half a season)  His choice for QB was also Boltus, whom he requested to have brought in.
2014 - 7-11

2012 - 6-12 HC

 

So the only successful season he's had was the one where he was OC for the first time.  He also thought Boltus was a good choice for QB.

 

I don't care what anyone says.  I'd prefer to have an OC who can get us farther then 9-9.  That whole "I don't want Drew Willy to have to learn a whole new scheme" is BS.  QB's are successful jumping from one team to another all the time, so why is Drew any different?

[mbrg]

 

I thought Bellefeuille was the right coordinator for what the Bombers needed last year with a new QB, looking for a new direction, and more importantly, to win games. Bellefeuille may not light the world on fire with his offence, but you know what you're gonna get, and I think with an improved defence, the Bombers can get a ticket to the show and see what happens.

Yeah, you're gonna get mediocrity.  I'd like someone who can win, not just be average.

 

 

Who was the last OC or DC that people didn't endlessly complain about?

 

Etch was a bum.  Burke was a bum.  Reed was a bum.  Marshall was a bum.

 

Lapolice has been fired twice here.

 

I don't believe the fans "liking someone" is something that will ever occur.

[Logan007]

 

 

I thought Bellefeuille was the right coordinator for what the Bombers needed last year with a new QB, looking for a new direction, and more importantly, to win games. Bellefeuille may not light the world on fire with his offence, but you know what you're gonna get, and I think with an improved defence, the Bombers can get a ticket to the show and see what happens.

Yeah, you're gonna get mediocrity.  I'd like someone who can win, not just be average.

 

 

Who was the last OC or DC that people didn't endlessly complain about?

 

Etch was a bum.  Burke was a bum.  Reed was a bum.  Marshall was a bum.

 

Lapolice has been fired twice here.

 

I don't believe the fans "liking someone" is something that will ever occur.

 

Umm...there's different meanings for the word "like".  My meaning was not that I need to like the person...as in "hey, he's a good guy".  I just want him to be a winner, I could care less if I like the guy.

 

I personally thought LaPo got a bum rap.  I was not for that.  Burke was a bum as a HC, not as a DC.

 

My point is, we need winners here.  You, me and everyone else is bitching about how we never get a Grey Cup.  Well, then get us some coordinators who knows what they're doing, and bring in some decent players (which they've already started doing).  Personally, if they hire a good DC, then I think that the OC position will be their only real weak spot.  I mean, I'm sure there will be other smaller weak spots as far as players, but I think that the biggest one will be at OC.  I think they're going to get the job done as far as bringing in players (I hope).

 

They're keeping MB for the next season, so we have to live with that, but if we make it to the playoffs, it will probably be our defense that brings us there.  Marcel's schemes will be figured out soon enough.

[mbrg]

 

Umm...there's different meanings for the word "like".  My meaning was not that I need to like the person...as in "hey, he's a good guy".  I just want him to be a winner, I could care less if I like the guy.

 

I'm aware.  My point is outside of nostalgic reminiscing, reserved for guys like Mike Riley and Cal Murphy and a few select others, there have not been any coordinators that I can think of that have not been met with complaints from a not insignificant number of people.

 

People argue that Lapo should have been fired on his first go-around as OC because in the second year the offence dropped to 4th in the league.  4th.

 

The grass is always greener until it's planted on our yard.  Whomever is hired is just going to be the next guy some people will demand we should fire.

[Goalie]

Stats don't tell the whole story obviously but an interesting one is that we were 9th in the league, dead last in terms of points against.

 

On O we averaged about 22.05 points for per game, on D we average about 26.7 points against per game. 

 

There were 4 teams who scored 400 or more points for, Calgary, Edmonton,Toronto and Hamilton <-- in that order too of points scored per game

 

The rest goes SASK WPG BC MTL OTT

 

Sask had 399 points scored, Wpg 397 points scored.

 

Our O was kind of middle of the pack really, Our D tho was dead last. 

[Logan007]

 

 

Umm...there's different meanings for the word "like".  My meaning was not that I need to like the person...as in "hey, he's a good guy".  I just want him to be a winner, I could care less if I like the guy.

 

I'm aware.  My point is outside of nostalgic reminiscing, reserved for guys like Mike Riley and Cal Murphy and a few select others, there have not been any coordinators that I can think of that have not been met with complaints from a not insignificant number of people.

 

People argue that Lapo should have been fired on his first go-around as OC because in the second year the offence dropped to 4th in the league.  4th.

 

The grass is always greener until it's planted on our yard.  Whomever is hired is just going to be the next guy some people will demand we should fire.

 

I don't know.  Most of us didn't want Etch or MB in the first place.  Now if someone like Cortez came here and **** the bed for a year and a half, then I would say ok to what you're saying.

[Doublezero]

Stats don't tell the whole story obviously but an interesting one is that we were 9th in the league, dead last in terms of points against.

 

On O we averaged about 22.05 points for per game, on D we average about 26.7 points against per game. 

 

There were 4 teams who scored 400 or more points for, Calgary, Edmonton,Toronto and Hamilton <-- in that order too of points scored per game

 

The rest goes SASK WPG BC MTL OTT

 

Sask had 399 points scored, Wpg 397 points scored.

 

Our O was kind of middle of the pack really, Our D tho was dead last. 

Your right, Goalie, stats don't tell the whole story. For example, due to scores off fumbles and picks, Winnipeg's defence contributed to our 397 total points scored. The most telling stat IMHO is TD percentage, and that stat is calculated by dividing the number of touchdowns by the number of times the team was in the red zone. By that measurement Bombers were dead last in the league at 2.6% - a very inefficient offence that repeatedly failed to capitalize on the many chances it was given.