Team Losing Because Of Coaching Decisions

[17to85]

I don't see any MARVE hate, what i see is some people realizing he's still pretty much green as goose crap, i see lots of potential in him but i've been around long enough to know that you don't throw a rookie basically in to the fire immediately if you want him to succeed. I like Marve, i like what I've seen of him but.. the fact is, he is a 2nd year player, he's green still, there is no conspiracy, he's not ready obviously.. while BROHM might not be the answer, part of me wants to see him go out there and fail again and again and again so the coaches finally get that he's not good enough and needs to be sent packing. Marve tho, I don't want him to go in there and get ruined.. People can say what they want on here but if Marve went in there and stunk the joint up, man, fans would be calling for his head too. I'd like to see him developed properly, not rushed, he has potential, why do we want to ruin him b4 he even gets a chance to learn the game. 

 

With that being said and going on this "he isn't ready" stuff yet, WTH is OSHEA talking about regarding DAVIS, saying he's not ready, he looked pretty damn good running dickenson and hufnagels O in the pre-season... he can run that O but he can't ours? LOL, is ours more complicated? if it is, is that part of the problem really? 

pretty much exactly the bolded. He goes out and has a rough game fans would be no kinder to him than they are to Brohm and we'd run him out of town. It's the way things work in Winnipeg, Overall the fan base treats qbs the same way Mike Kelly did. They're not an instant success despite the adversity they have to face toss em on the scrap heap and keep trying until you find that instant smash hit. 

[Yourface]

I was willing to give Brohm a chance at first. But he has stunk up the joint too many times now, not only in regular season action but also in the preseason and in practice. There is no justification for keeping him on the roster. 

 

If Marve shows that much incompetence in all of his reps (which he hasn't to this point) then he most assuredly will be run out of town and for good reason. But that is unlikely to happen.

[TBURGESS]

Of course Marve's green.   I don't see anyone suggesting that Marve isn't green. The answer for that is to play him so he gains experience, not to keep him on the sidelines then say you can't play him because he's green. I know I'd rather see Marve get experience then experience what Brohm has to offer.

 

Marve was a rookie last year and he played well enough when he got his limited chances to see the potential.  He's not a rookie anymore and quite frankly, that's not an excuse for not playing him anyway. It should be about who moves the team better, who scores the most points and who the team gets behind and that's not Brohm. It's not going to ruin him either.  Think playing Cato, a raw rookie, is ruining him? Nope. Didn't think so,

 

If Marve goes in and stinks up the joint, yup... some posters will be ready for the next QB. Others will point to the small number of reps he's had in practice and the fact that he's working with an offense that's designed for a pocket passer.  Most will understand that he needs more experience.  Heck folks around here are happy with him and he's only a 50% passer so far so the bar has been set really low. 

[SPuDS]

It's hilarious how fast people's memories fail them. Do you remember Bryan Randall? What about Tee Martin? 2 QBs with stellar college stats and both wheels and an arm. What happened when we rushed them into games and got them shell shocked?

Both lasted next to no time in the CFL due to being rushed or forced into a role they were not ready for. I realize nobody here has patience but that is what is required.

And please don't reference other teams backups coming in and performing as they don't have our shoddy oline or questionable OC as we seem to have been cursed with for the last decade.

[do or die]

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

[White Out]

Can't wait see brohm shut up some of his defenders. He's gonna be an epic disaster against bc. Hopefully our d scores points and plays hard.

[SPuDS]

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

Riddle me this folks. Marcel's offense is vanilla, outdated and simple.. If this is the case, why can't such an elite stud like marve pick it up and use it to his advantage in practice or scrimmages?

[SPuDS]

Can't wait see brohm shut up some of his defenders. He's gonna be an epic disaster against bc. Hopefully our d scores points and plays hard.

Isn't willy starting?

[Noeller]

 

Can't wait see brohm shut up some of his defenders. He's gonna be an epic disaster against bc. Hopefully our d scores points and plays hard.

Isn't willy starting?

 

According to the Sun, Willy wasn't able to leave the pocket and had a noticeable limp throughout practice. Also left early to go see the docs. Throws he did make were strong and accurate, but his mobility definitely in question...

[Tracker]

Can't wait see brohm shut up some of his defenders. He's gonna be an epic disaster against bc. Hopefully our d scores points and plays hard.

Isn't willy starting?

I'm betting that Willy will start and be pulled for Brohm if things do not go well. When things go badly for Brohm, O'Shea will do nothing.

[Yourface]

 

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

 

 

And when do you assume Marve will get that chance exactly? How can he prove anything if he doesn't get playing time?

 

Regarding Bryan Randall... The guy threw 20 career passes and did not start a single game. How do you figure we rushed him?

[dmillerywg]

 

I don't see any MARVE hate, what i see is some people realizing he's still pretty much green as goose crap, i see lots of potential in him but i've been around long enough to know that you don't throw a rookie basically in to the fire immediately if you want him to succeed. I like Marve, i like what I've seen of him but.. the fact is, he is a 2nd year player, he's green still, there is no conspiracy, he's not ready obviously.. while BROHM might not be the answer, part of me wants to see him go out there and fail again and again and again so the coaches finally get that he's not good enough and needs to be sent packing. Marve tho, I don't want him to go in there and get ruined.. People can say what they want on here but if Marve went in there and stunk the joint up, man, fans would be calling for his head too. I'd like to see him developed properly, not rushed, he has potential, why do we want to ruin him b4 he even gets a chance to learn the game. 

 

With that being said and going on this "he isn't ready" stuff yet, WTH is OSHEA talking about regarding DAVIS, saying he's not ready, he looked pretty damn good running dickenson and hufnagels O in the pre-season... he can run that O but he can't ours? LOL, is ours more complicated? if it is, is that part of the problem really? 

pretty much exactly the bolded. He goes out and has a rough game fans would be no kinder to him than they are to Brohm and we'd run him out of town. It's the way things work in Winnipeg, Overall the fan base treats qbs the same way Mike Kelly did. They're not an instant success despite the adversity they have to face toss em on the scrap heap and keep trying until you find that instant smash hit. 

 

Other teams seem to have less trouble finding quality QBs that we do, we traded for Willy so we didn't even find him...

[17to85]

Can't wait see brohm shut up some of his defenders. He's gonna be an epic disaster against bc. Hopefully our d scores points and plays hard.

Except that no one is defending Brohm. Well maybe one guy, most people are simply arguing the point that Marve is superman and will save the day. 

[17to85]

 

 

I don't see any MARVE hate, what i see is some people realizing he's still pretty much green as goose crap, i see lots of potential in him but i've been around long enough to know that you don't throw a rookie basically in to the fire immediately if you want him to succeed. I like Marve, i like what I've seen of him but.. the fact is, he is a 2nd year player, he's green still, there is no conspiracy, he's not ready obviously.. while BROHM might not be the answer, part of me wants to see him go out there and fail again and again and again so the coaches finally get that he's not good enough and needs to be sent packing. Marve tho, I don't want him to go in there and get ruined.. People can say what they want on here but if Marve went in there and stunk the joint up, man, fans would be calling for his head too. I'd like to see him developed properly, not rushed, he has potential, why do we want to ruin him b4 he even gets a chance to learn the game. 

 

With that being said and going on this "he isn't ready" stuff yet, WTH is OSHEA talking about regarding DAVIS, saying he's not ready, he looked pretty damn good running dickenson and hufnagels O in the pre-season... he can run that O but he can't ours? LOL, is ours more complicated? if it is, is that part of the problem really? 

pretty much exactly the bolded. He goes out and has a rough game fans would be no kinder to him than they are to Brohm and we'd run him out of town. It's the way things work in Winnipeg, Overall the fan base treats qbs the same way Mike Kelly did. They're not an instant success despite the adversity they have to face toss em on the scrap heap and keep trying until you find that instant smash hit. 

 

Other teams seem to have less trouble finding quality QBs that we do, we traded for Willy so we didn't even find him...

 

Like Montreal who have gone through how many qbs since Calvillo retired? Or Hamilton who had to poach a free agent? Or Ottawa who brought in a FA and got a backup in the expansion draft? Or Toronto who had Harris on their roster for several years now developing and he's still the backup to Ray who yep from another team. Calgary sure we'll give them that, BC them too cause Wally always managed to find a qb, but Edmonton still has NIchols as a backup and they seem to have been trying to get rid of him for a while but no one can beat him, other than that it's Reilly who you guessed it, came from another team. Durant was a good find by the Riders but since then what have they got? Kevin The Journeyman Glenn and a pile of crap, I don't see all this success other teams are having finding qbs, I see a couple guys who can find qbs and everyone else picks up from them. 

[iso_55]

 

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

Riddle me this folks. Marcel's offense is vanilla, outdated and simple.. If this is the case, why can't such an elite stud like marve pick it up and use it to his advantage in practice or scrimmages?

 

 

 

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

Riddle me this folks. Marcel's offense is vanilla, outdated and simple.. If this is the case, why can't such an elite stud like marve pick it up and use it to his advantage in practice or scrimmages?

 

Okay, I'll bite. I'm not trying to defend MB here but how do you know his offense is "vanilla, outdated & simple"? Have you ever been a coach at any level? A CFL OC? What exactly are your football qualifications based on to make such a statement? Come back with a new & complete CFL offensive playbook & show us how you would call the plays against every defense you'd see. Oh & don't forget blocking schemes as well. 

[Logan007]

 

 

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

Riddle me this folks. Marcel's offense is vanilla, outdated and simple.. If this is the case, why can't such an elite stud like marve pick it up and use it to his advantage in practice or scrimmages?

 

 

 

There is a balance between developing QBs....and sticking with ones that don't work.   Pretty close to a tip point, here....

Hard to disagree. Brohm has not looked good but I also don't believe marve is ready (or healthy enough) to take brohms spot. I truly believe marve needs to prove he can run MB's offense (as crummy as it can be) without needing to run away at first pressure every time,

Riddle me this folks. Marcel's offense is vanilla, outdated and simple.. If this is the case, why can't such an elite stud like marve pick it up and use it to his advantage in practice or scrimmages?

 

Okay, I'll bite. I'm not trying to defend MB here but how do you know his offense is "vanilla, outdated & simple"? Have you ever been a coach at any level? A CFL OC? What exactly are your football qualifications based on to make such a statement? Come back with a new & complete CFL offensive playbook & show us how you would call the plays against every defense you'd see. Oh & don't forget blocking schemes as well. 

 

If you haven't read the entire thread, Spuds is quoting what other people have stated in this thread many times already, including me.  He's not actually saying MB's offense is vanilla.  If you've read anything from Spuds in the last while, he's actually been the one defending MB.

[iso_55]

I like SPuDS & I'm not trying to single him out but no one here can label an offense or an OC like we do Bellefeuille without first knowing the game inside & out at the pro level. We're fans & have no idea what it's like to coach & run a CFL offense or whether it's vanilla or not. Tired of the bitching about MB. I was at the game in Calgary & it was Pat Tracy's special teams that lost us that game. We had a couple of long TD's & Willy was playing well. Stop the mistakes on ST that day we'd have won. Other than the last series with the mistakes our offense looked fine. Sorry SPuDS, like I say I like you a lot as a poster here. I just reacted to what you said.

[do or die]

Also have no idea what it is like to coach and run a CFL offense, or for that matter, a CFL defense. 

Don't know what it is like to play professional QB, or coach a pro team.

Don't even know  all intricacies of CFL special teams.

As far as being a GM, well, lets not go there.

 

So, in the final analysis..I got nothing... except clean gin and unwashed opinions

 

....on a Blue Bomber football forum.,..and plan to continue to exercise both.... when and how it strikes me, as appropriate.

 

ps....still think that MB's offense is somewhat noncommittal, featureless, and beige...... 

[Fatty Liver]

Also have no idea what it is like to coach and run a CFL offense, or for that matter, a CFL defense. 

Don't know what it is like to play professional QB, or coach a pro team.

Don't even know  all intricacies of CFL special teams.

As far as being a GM, well, lets not go there.

 

So, in the final analysis..I got nothing... except clean gin and unwashed opinions

 

....on a Blue Bomber football forum.,..and plan to continue to exercise both.... when and how it strikes me, as appropriate.

 

ps....still think that MB's offense is somewhat noncommittal, featureless, and beige...... 

 

All of this time I thought you were a qualified expert with all the stuff you come up with for "Odds and Sods" and now I find out it was just the gin lubricating your keyboard.  That's as good a reason as any to endorse gin, I guess.

[do or die]

 

Also have no idea what it is like to coach and run a CFL offense, or for that matter, a CFL defense. 

Don't know what it is like to play professional QB, or coach a pro team.

Don't even know  all intricacies of CFL special teams.

As far as being a GM, well, lets not go there.

 

So, in the final analysis..I got nothing... except clean gin and unwashed opinions

 

....on a Blue Bomber football forum.,..and plan to continue to exercise both.... when and how it strikes me, as appropriate.

 

ps....still think that MB's offense is somewhat noncommittal, featureless, and beige...... 

 

All of this time I thought you were a qualified expert with all the stuff you come up with for "Odds and Sods" and now I find out it was just the gin lubricating your keyboard.  That's as good a reason as any to endorse gin, I guess.

 

Just to clarify, I am a unqualified expert....

[rebusrankin]

I'm not an O.C. but I can read, we have gained the fewest yards per game in the CFL this year and gained the fewest last year. We were 6th in points per game last year and 7th this year. Gives me an indication that Marcel is not a very good O.C.

[bb1]

Man, i can't believe i'm gonna say this... wouldn't normally but all this MARVE stuff after a loss is getting so insane it's getting to me lol.. I hope Marve gets to play soon and here it goes, can't believe i'm gonna say this... i hope he craps the bed big time, not because i want to see the bombers fail but.. i kind of am curious to see what people would then say...

Don't get me wrong here, go bombers and all but.... man, i'd love to see what some people would say if Marve went in there and sucked really badly.

What would be the excuses? oh and i hope it's like plus 25 to plus 30 with no wind and no weather issues at all, i hope it's next game and i hope it's because BROHM gets hurt and is done for the season...

But if i could be serious for a moment, Has brohm fully healed from his thumb injury? Could that be part of the problem this year cuz.. he wasn't as awful last year. He wasn't exactly lighting it up when he got his shots last year but.. he wasn't as awful as he has been this year either.

Did you forget he won in Calgary last year? Didn't crap the bed in horrible weather.Y would he do it now?You talk about the anti Brohm? Why the anti Marve? I don't care who the QB is as long as he gives us a chance to win.

[dmillerywg]

 

Man, i can't believe i'm gonna say this... wouldn't normally but all this MARVE stuff after a loss is getting so insane it's getting to me lol.. I hope Marve gets to play soon and here it goes, can't believe i'm gonna say this... i hope he craps the bed big time, not because i want to see the bombers fail but.. i kind of am curious to see what people would then say...

Don't get me wrong here, go bombers and all but.... man, i'd love to see what some people would say if Marve went in there and sucked really badly.

What would be the excuses? oh and i hope it's like plus 25 to plus 30 with no wind and no weather issues at all, i hope it's next game and i hope it's because BROHM gets hurt and is done for the season...

But if i could be serious for a moment, Has brohm fully healed from his thumb injury? Could that be part of the problem this year cuz.. he wasn't as awful last year. He wasn't exactly lighting it up when he got his shots last year but.. he wasn't as awful as he has been this year either.

Did you forget he won in Calgary last year? Didn't crap the bed in horrible weather.Y would he do it now?You talk about the anti Brohm? Why the anti Marve? I don't care who the QB is as long as he gives us a chance to win.

 

Exactly I don't care either but I don't expect much from Brohm I hope I am wrong...

[iso_55]

I guess the coaches think Brohm gives us the best chance to win after Drew Willy. We'll find out soon enough.

[GCn20]

Marve is one of the best "sandlot" QBs I've seen in awhile. When the play breaks down he would be the guy I choose to be at QB. However, broken plays are not something any team should ever want, and the play breaks down waaaay to often when Marve is behind centre.

 

Marve has a skill that when he learns to run an offence with efficiency will serve him well. Until he learns to execute the playbook as it is written he will not make the next step in his career. That being said, I would like to see where he is at developmentally. I get the feeling that I will not be enthused with the answer when he does play, because he has been unable to surpass a scrub like Brohm. However, give him a chance to show he can run an offence. He really can't do any worse than Brohm. Maybe we ruin his development that way...I don't know. What I do know is he's been here long enough. It's time for Marve to show that he can be a professional QB and not just a one trick pony, and it's definitely time we move on from Brohm.