JFK Assasination

[iso_55]

Watching a documentary on the shooting & the events around it. Hard to believe, even in 1963 that an American President would be in an open car in public with no protection.

[basslicker]

Maybe they had him right where they wanted him.

Have any presidents traveled in an open car since?

[The Unknown Poster]

LOVE this topic.  Im an avid reader/watcher of all things JFK assassination.  And my opinion has changed multiple times over the years.

 

On the specific topic, if you watch the JFK film, the Donald Sutherland character, who was very very loosely based on Col. L Fletcher Prouty (loosely because Prouty had nothing to do with JFK at the time of the assassination, never met Garrisson and simply speculated like everyone else except that he has very legitimate credentials), talks about the lax security - open air car, people in the windows etc.  But I recall seeing a debunker video that indicated this was not abnormal for the time.

 

Now, they go to great pains to make it appear the President is "open" but when he's outside, if you see longer shots, he's speaking through clear bullet proof glass.  Even saying that, Im surprised there hasnt been an attempt on the President in so many years.  Aside from a couple not nuts climbing the White House fence, when was the last one, Saddam on Bush Sr?

 

For what it's worth, I *think* there was a conspiracy (which people often forget is now official position since the House Select Committee on Assassinations deemed it a probably conspiracy) but that Oswald was involved.  Its really shocking that such a crime has never been fully and thoroughly investigated.  A real investigation would exhume Kennedy's body for a new autopsy.  And there are classified documents that are still sealed.

 

Its hard to believe it was a grand conspiracy between the CIA, the Cubans, the Russians, the Mob and members of the cabinet.  I think those were all individual theories that have been morphed into one massive conspiracy.  And I think some efforts to "do the right things" hampered the investigation.  I think the Kennedy's were powerful enough to keep things private (the rumor that Bobby essentially stole JFK's brain from the national archives and had it placed in the casket for burial being one) and if you believe LBJ was not involved, the feeling that the nation needed to heal and put it behind them led to a desire to just close the book on the whole thing.  That would never happen today.

 

Exhume his body and then you will know for sure where the bullets came from.  If they did all come from behind, then it was Oswald.  If even one came from the front, then it was a conspiracy and if you accept that it was a conspiracy it brings into question so many other acts that you have to believe it was a grand conspiracy.

[Mark F]

Iso_  you might be interested in these 

 

"operaiton Northwoods"

 

and also

 

"Operation gladio"

 

and 

 

The USS Liberty incident.

 

Operation Northwoods is really interesting.

[FrostyWinnipeg]

Maybe they had him right where they wanted him.

Have any presidents traveled in an open car since?

Not car related but every Inauguration Day they always walk that one street in D.C.

 

You'd think that it would be easier then a moving car but then you got to factor in the Russian sniper training.

[basslicker]

The jfk thing is now a part of cultural lore. Will we ever truly know what happened? It would be nice but I'm not holding my breath.

Personally I believe he was silenced by very powerful people. Probably the very same that put him in power. But when he didn't go along with being a puppet, they killed him....and Bobby too.

[kelownabomberfan]

The jfk thing is now a part of cultural lore. Will we ever truly know what happened? It would be nice but I'm not holding my breath.

Personally I believe he was silenced by very powerful people. Probably the very same that put him in power. But when he didn't go along with being a puppet, they killed him....and Bobby too.

The mafia put him in power. Richard Nixon won the 1960 election. But the mafia insured that the Kennedys won. And then the Kennedys turn on the mafia. Not too smart.

[kelownabomberfan]

a friend of mine was in Honolulu during Christmas break. The Secret Service shut down an entire city block just so that Obama could go out for dinner. There were gunboats in the harbor and helicopter gunships circling over-head. Meanwhile, at the same time, I was watching our Prime Minister high-fiving people in the crowd at the gold-medal junior hockey game at Air Canada center in Toronto. I like our ways better.

[iso_55]

Maybe they had him right where they wanted him.

Have any presidents traveled in an open car since?

No, i don't think so. I bet LBJ never would have done that especially after escalating the Viet Nam war.

[johnzo]

I'm ordinarily super cynical about Harper but I do get warm and fuzzies for home when the TSN cameras show him sitting in the crowd at a Redblacks game.

Funny, we didn't start getting presidential shutdowns in Seattle until Obama was in office. For some reason, GWB didn't ever come here

[iso_55]

That Inaugural walk in today's day & age is crazy. So dangerous. It's the 21st century,not 1886. They should rethink that. 

[The Unknown Poster]

The jfk thing is now a part of cultural lore. Will we ever truly know what happened? It would be nice but I'm not holding my breath.

Personally I believe he was silenced by very powerful people. Probably the very same that put him in power. But when he didn't go along with being a puppet, they killed him....and Bobby too.

The mafia put him in power. Richard Nixon won the 1960 election. But the mafia insured that the Kennedys won. And then the Kennedys turn on the mafia. Not too smart.

Nixon didn't win. The mafia influenced Union leadership to vote for Kennedy. Even had Sinatra campaigning for him

Some believe John didn't know the deals his father was making. Bobby was always wanting to go after organized crime. They say it was Bobby that told John to stop seeing one of his mistresses (was it Munroe?) because she was also linked to a mob boss.

I'm not sure who these "powerful people" would be that decide who wins and who dies. It would have been just as easy to defeat him in the next election than murder a sitting president.

As I've gotten older and less likely believe fantastic tales I think it was less grand than we've all romanticized it to be. Not one lone nut. But probably a small group.

They say the driver was in on it because he slowed down. The secret service were in on it because no one responded

I think it's more likely no one thought it could happen and were all taken by surprise.

My favourite theory is the video evidence that the driver turned and shot John in the head in front of everyone and no one noticed.

[kelownabomberfan]

I'm ordinarily super cynical about Harper but I do get warm and fuzzies for home when the TSN cameras show him sitting in the crowd at a Redblacks game.

I've always wondered why Trudeau or Mulcair aren't ever seen at any sporting events. Seems like pretty cheap publicity. Even Pierre took in almost every Grey Cup game, even if he didn't know a football from a meatball...

[kelownabomberfan]

Nixon didn't win. The mafia influenced Union leadership to vote for Kennedy. Even had Sinatra campaigning for him

I know Nixon didn't win. All of those ballot boxes thrown into Lake Michigan by the mayor of Chicago made sure Nixon didn't win.

 

Kennedy carried Cook County, which includes Chicago, by 318,736 votes -more than double his national margin of 118,574 votes. This new book by Edmund Kallina fairly examines all sides of this intense political debate, which has vexed historians and fired up partisans since that razor-thin election. However, Kallina reaches the wrong conclusion, that is that the Illinois result wouldn't have changed the election's outcome, thus minimizing what he admits was widespread voter theft and fraud on election day. Mayor Daley himself gave away the game on election eve when he said, "With the Democratic organization and the help of a few close friends," the Democrats would prevail on election day.

 

There is sufficient evidence that the "few close friends" mentioned include Chicago crime boss Sam Giancana--a fact Kallina pretty much ignores. Federal special prosecutor Morris Wexler conducted a quiet inquiry into 1960 Illinois election fraud and the evidence was pervasive. Mayor Richard J. Daley stole Illinois' 27 Electoral College votes for fellow Democrat John F. Kennedy, denying Richard Nixon the presidency. Kennedy won the state by 8,858 of 4.7 million votes.Kallina believes vote fraud did occur in Chicago and elsewhere in Illinois, but not on a scale that changed the outcome. Mayor Daley was known for stuffing ballot boxes and giving ward bosses and precinct captains vote quotas. Two recounts of Chicago-area voting later showed that Democrats had likely stolen tens of thousands of votes for the Democratic ticket, including down-ballot races. Special prosecutor Wexler's report, issued in April 1961, found "substantial" miscounts in the 1,367 precincts it examined, including unqualified voters, misread voting machines and math mistakes. - See more at: http://stonezone.com/article.php?id=391#sthash.rvBpBVnN.dpuf

 

[The Unknown Poster]

I'm ordinarily super cynical about Harper but I do get warm and fuzzies for home when the TSN cameras show him sitting in the crowd at a Redblacks game.

I've always wondered why Trudeau or Mulcair aren't ever seen at any sporting events. Seems like pretty cheap publicity. Even Pierre took in almost every Grey Cup game, even if he didn't know a football from a meatball...

Harper is a legitimate fan. Those other guys would probably puke at the thought of sitting with the beer swilling masses.

[kelownabomberfan]

Those other guys would probably puke at the thought of sitting with the beer swilling masses.

Mulcair definitely, but I wouldn't mind hanging out at a game with Justin...especially if this is the reaction he gets wherever he goes...

 

 

[The Unknown Poster]

That about sums up his qualifications to be PM lol

[iso_55]

I guess a lot of information having to do with the Warren Commission's investigation & others has been sealed & can't be opened until at least 75 years to a century years have passed to make sure all the people involved are dead. That in itself is conspiratorial. If a proper investigation was done then why the need to protect people to the grave? 

[Fraser]

Isn't stuff coming up for release in a couple years?

[The Unknown Poster]

Yes, 2017. You never know. The U.S. is weird about classified information. Look at Roswell. Let people think aliens crashed and refuse to release documents and it turns out it was a military weather balloon. What a secret.

[Fatty Liver]

I watched the following video on the Zapruder film a couple of months ago and found it really interesting.  Especially as people now dead that worked in the film lab at the time were interviewed for this documentary.   Even a straight forward piece of evidence such as the Zapruder film has been messed with by the "authorities" so that it's impossible to examine it as a completely truthful document. 

 

I believe that Oswald was involved but little doubt in my mind that Kennedy was also shot from the front and Oswald was set up to take the fall for the entire operation.  Jack Ruby was obviously the clean up man.

 

[The Unknown Poster]

The only problem with the film is the studies that show a shot from the back would cause the head to move in the direction the shot came from. Which is counter intuitive.

But the most striking thing is how many people including police immediately looked towards and ran towards the grassy knoll. That is instinctively where they heard or saw something

The argument will be it was echos.

But if I recall the initial talk was of less shots until the audio recording from a motorcycle cop was discovered and it was proven the shots came too close together to have been one shooter.

[iso_55]

When the information is released, I wonder if it'll shed light on what really happened. Imagine if the CIA was involved or if it was some kind of coup d'etat with the Russians involved.

[The Unknown Poster]

I would think if the information contains anything like that it would be denied release on the basis of national security.

which in itself would be suspicious.

[basslicker]

I'm ordinarily super cynical about Harper but I do get warm and fuzzies for home when the TSN cameras show him sitting in the crowd at a Redblacks game.

I've always wondered why Trudeau or Mulcair aren't ever seen at any sporting events. Seems like pretty cheap publicity. Even Pierre took in almost every Grey Cup game, even if he didn't know a football from a meatball...

Harper is a legitimate fan. Those other guys would probably puke at the thought of sitting with the beer swilling masses.

Never thought of it that way but you're probably right. Makes me want him to win even more.