Bombers vs RedBlacks (and Jovon's chirp)

[do or die]

We have a number of problems on O, including dressing goofy rosters and simply terrible play calling,,,,

[Mr Dee]

Nichols isn't the saviour some want him to be, but he still is a damned good back up QB.

It takes one hell of a putrid offensive scheme where you turn a decent backup into a meddling third stinger where you even would think for a minute, just a minute mind you, of putting in B. Brohm.

That's what our Offence can do.

[Goalie]

Thought that was Brohm for a bit last night. Yup. Don't matter who the QB is If the OC is awful but at the same time probably doesn't matter who the OC is if your QB plays like crap

[Mr. Perfect]

Which makes me all the more impressed with Drew Willy, because he's able to make this offence work despite the clueless bafoon behind it pressing the buttons.

[Floyd]

Willy reminds me of the Dunigan days... for much of the game, we'd have this really average offence from a really average OC - then when we were down late in the game, Dunigan would take it on himself to try and carry the team to victory, probably calling a lot of the plays himself or at least reading the D on the fly - sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't but it was exciting.

[Guest J5V]

 

Quite comical the post made 2-3 weeks ago (you know who you are) that actually stated there wasn't much difference between Nichols and Willy, not that tonight was needed as any proof to the contrary...

Funny how when I've done this to another member before, moderators, and some other members lecture me about how inappropriate it is, and how I need to be more mature etc.  Funny how the ones doing most of the lecturing on this site are really the most messed up. 

Hey! Grow up! 

[gbill2004]

Quite comical the post made 2-3 weeks ago (you know who you are) that actually stated there wasn't much difference between Nichols and Willy, not that tonight was needed as any proof to the contrary...

Funny how when I've done this to another member before, moderators, and some other members lecture me about how inappropriate it is, and how I need to be more mature etc. Funny how the ones doing most of the lecturing on this site are really the most messed up.

Hey! Grow up!

[Blueandgold]

Nichols has 60 more attempts than Willy this year and the same amount of yards.

 

That sums up my feelings on the difference between those two.

[blueandgoldguy]

 

Quite comical the post made 2-3 weeks ago (you know who you are) that actually stated there wasn't much difference between Nichols and Willy, not that tonight was needed as any proof to the contrary...

So you think you've now proven a point based on 1-2 games? lol. Nichols hadn't thrown an interception in his previous 4 games, prior to last night. Sure he had a bad game last night. Willy has never had a bad game?

In his post game interview, Nichols said they prepared the entire week for Ottawa to play man defense, because that's what Ottawa has done all year. Instead Ottawa came out playing zone. It took Marcel an entire first half to adjust to that. Wow.

I still think Nichols is starter material in this league with a competent OC. Marcel handcuffs the entire team. Willy has lots of warts too; he isn't some proven, elite stud QB just yet.

 

Give it up already.  Nicholls is a backup who is fine filling in once in awhile.  Ask Eskimo fans what they think of him after a reasonably large sample size.  He is not good driving the field for TDs, has never been strong on long throws, and has been one of poorer QBs in the league with regards to turnovers.  Edmonton had a winning record with Nicholls at the helm because of their defense not because of his play.

 

INTs can be suppressed when a large number of passing plays are short 5 yard curls - pretty low risk.

[iso_55]

Even Tom Brady would struggle in MB's offense. 

[Mr Dee]

$1.25 or 5th quarter.

 

- Cam Marshall 8 carries for 48 yards, 7 catches for 65 yards screams "feed me the ball"  - D, Scott, not so much.

 

- Not much more can be said for the Offence. Opportunities galore,,many missed chances. While Burris executed a good offensive plan, Nichols failed to execute  a  bad offensive plan. Not a good combination.

 

Shout out for: 

 

- 12 tackles for the the "Monster Bass". 10 tackles for Washington, who had a borderline int. call and a great hustle play to tackle Williams for a short gain when the game still mattered. And, of course, for Ian Wild, 8 tackles and who seemed to be everywhere. Stoudermire 5 returns for 103 yards.

 

- Richie Hall - still like how we're coping on Defence, and giving this team a chance by staying in the game.

 

- while I didn't mind the early gamble on 3rd down, I didn't like the fact that we handed off the ball 5 yards deep to start with.

 

 

Which leaves the burning question…why in hell did the RedBlacks gamble on 3rd and 3 and give an opposing team a last gasp chance to win…well, I mean, a good opposing team a chance to win?

[Mr. Perfect]

 

 

 

Quite comical the post made 2-3 weeks ago (you know who you are) that actually stated there wasn't much difference between Nichols and Willy, not that tonight was needed as any proof to the contrary...

So you think you've now proven a point based on 1-2 games? lol. Nichols hadn't thrown an interception in his previous 4 games, prior to last night. Sure he had a bad game last night. Willy has never had a bad game?

In his post game interview, Nichols said they prepared the entire week for Ottawa to play man defense, because that's what Ottawa has done all year. Instead Ottawa came out playing zone. It took Marcel an entire first half to adjust to that. Wow.

I still think Nichols is starter material in this league with a competent OC. Marcel handcuffs the entire team. Willy has lots of warts too; he isn't some proven, elite stud QB just yet.

 

 

GBILL - I'll say it again (not that you'll take heed to my comments). I'm an ESKIMO season ticket holder. I've WATCHED Nichols a lot longer than you have. I know what he's all about. I haven't / won't say anything because most people here don't listen to me anyway. All I'll say is this (again) - Mr. Nichols is far far better than any QB we have in Wpg not named Drew Willy and gives us the best chance to win. This is NOT a complement to Nichols, this is a slap in the face to the Wpg Blue Bomber organisation who haven't recruited and developed their OWN QB in 3 decades.

 

There's a reason why Nichols was traded in mid season to the Bombers for a 7th round pick. I still think it's a great trade for Wpg. I still think it doesn't really matter. Though secretly I was hoping he'd (Nichols) would have some success - but he's doing the same things he was doing here. He'll make good plays, he'll make good throws, and he'll also get stubborn and throw balls he shouldn't. His other weakness - he has no leadership qualities - the team here in Edmonton did not respect him at all. All you need to do is re-watch the absolute and utter destruction of the Wpg Blue Bombers here in Edmonton a few months back and the difference in the Eskimos play when Franklin came in in the second half. 

 

But you all have your own opinions. I have mine. Nichols is a fine backup QB for us, he won't be replacing Drew Willy, or any other starter, in the league, unless that team wants the first overall pick. 

 

Thanks for this.  I've watched most of Nichols starts, so you being a Edmonton season ticket holder doesn't really add much, in my opinion.  There were a few factors that lead to Nichols being traded to the Bombers for a 7th rounder.  I'm not saying Nichols is some stud QB.  All I'm saying is that there isn't MUCH of a drop off between him and Willy, in terms of giving us the best chance to win. Both QBs bring different strengths and weaknesses to the table. I think people here are overrating Willy a bit, and not giving Nichols enough respect.  I'm trying to look at this objectively...what exactly has Willy accomplished to date??  Personally, I like both QBs, and I'll be getting a Willy jersey next year.  I'll be ecstatic if both are with the Bombers next year, and if so, I'd expect Willy to be the starter.  But at this point, there isn't much a drop off from Willy to Nichols IMO.  If Willy learns to get rid of the ball quicker, he could be deadly, but until that happens, that's a pretty significant flaw in his game.  Nichols has his flaws as well. 

 

Only this isn't how Marcel's offence is designed. Marc Trestman's for example was, Bellefeuille's is not. Never has been. Glenn never got the ball out quick in Hamilton working with him, Calvillo didn't in Montreal under him (which is why one of his worst seasons as a starter was under MB), and Nealon Greene and Henry Burris didn't either under his direction in Saskatchewan. 

[Floyd]

 

Shout out for: 

 

- 12 tackles for the the "Monster Bass". 10 tackles for Washington, who had a borderline int. call and a great hustle play to tackle Williams for a short gain when the game still mattered. And, of course, for Ian Wild, 8 tackles and who seemed to be everywhere. Stoudermire 5 returns for 103 yards.

 

- Richie Hall - still like how we're coping on Defence, and giving this team a chance by staying in the game.

 

 

1 tackle for Hurl who got more reps than Wild...  even Burnett had more with a handful of snaps.  Nothing for Newman either.

 

Watch pre-snap... Wild moves around searching for a 'read', Hurl finds his assigned place and sticks with it - Burris comfort zone totally different with the two MLBs

 

I'm a huge NI supporter but, man, stop the madness... put Sherman or Newman at Safety where Lin-J Shell is not really having a huge impact... anything other than Bass-Wild-Leggett with Burnett rotating is ridiculous.

[Fatty Liver]

If you re-watch some of this seasons early games you will see that Willy often holds on to the ball for an extra second looking for a medium to deep route to develop.  Sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't but I don't think any other Bomber QB that's played this season has had that level of patience or the courage to stand in the pocket and wait for the deep man to get open.

[iso_55]

Hurl lines up 1-2 yards from the LOS everytime in the A gap over center left or right. lt looks more left than right. But he can't read the play, react or get to it unless it is run towards him. He gets caught up in the wash on the line all the time. I don't get why Hurl is almost on the LOS everytime. 

[Mr Dee]

I don't even know why we're asking questions about the defence and who's playing where and how often. The defence is far from the problem. I bet with even an average offence, we'd be 8-8, even with the ST gaffes in a couple of games.

This offence is last in the league. Worse, we're behind last. We're ranked even behind ourselves. We're in a special category.

I would love to be a defensive player on the opposing team and facing our offence. You absolutely can tell what's coming by just the way we line up...and sometimes we even screw that up.

*** It was overheard late in the BC game, after the defence once again stood tall and got the ball back for the offence, that O'Shea turned to the team on the bench and screamed to the offence - Get out there and FICKING do something with it!

[JuranBoldenRules]

Hurl lines up 1-2 yards from the LOS everytime in the A gap over center left or right. lt looks more left than right. But he can't read the play, react or get to it unless it is run towards him. He gets caught up in the wash on the line all the time. I don't get why Hurl is almost on the LOS everytime. 

 

Because that is the system they are running.  It's all about keeping OL from getting to the second level and forcing cutbacks.  Bass is basically your MLB in the way you're thinking of it, the guy chasing the play.  He's been a beast once he adjusted to the width of the field and figured out how to get on the right side of the play to make tackles with his inside shoulder.

[rebusrankin]

Let's see, Willy had a better completion percentage, more wins and better stats despite not getting to rack up any garbage yards like last night or essentially the second half in Montreal.

Nicholls is a good back up but to say there is not a drop off is crazy.

[SPuDS]

Hurl lines up 1-2 yards from the LOS everytime in the A gap over center left or right. lt looks more left than right. But he can't read the play, react or get to it unless it is run towards him. He gets caught up in the wash on the line all the time. I don't get why Hurl is almost on the LOS everytime.

 

Because that is the system they are running.  It's all about keeping OL from getting to the second level and forcing cutbacks.  Bass is basically your MLB in the way you're thinking of it, the guy chasing the play.  He's been a beast once he adjusted to the width of the field and figured out how to get on the right side of the play to make tackles with his inside shoulder.

Why you have had to explain this a half dozen times this season astounds me lol. hurl is a gap filler and guy that keeps a RB/mobile funneled into the other play makers. Just because he is the "MLB" in our defense doesnt make him the prototypical MLB seen in most defenses..

[Fatty Liver]

 

 

Hurl lines up 1-2 yards from the LOS everytime in the A gap over center left or right. lt looks more left than right. But he can't read the play, react or get to it unless it is run towards him. He gets caught up in the wash on the line all the time. I don't get why Hurl is almost on the LOS everytime.

 

Because that is the system they are running.  It's all about keeping OL from getting to the second level and forcing cutbacks.  Bass is basically your MLB in the way you're thinking of it, the guy chasing the play.  He's been a beast once he adjusted to the width of the field and figured out how to get on the right side of the play to make tackles with his inside shoulder.

Why you have had to explain this a half dozen times this season astounds me lol. hurl is a gap filler and guy that keeps a RB/mobile funneled into the other play makers. Just because he is the "MLB" in our defense doesnt make him the prototypical MLB seen in most defenses..

 

 

So Hurl essentially functions as a "plug"?

[iso_55]

 

Hurl lines up 1-2 yards from the LOS everytime in the A gap over center left or right. lt looks more left than right. But he can't read the play, react or get to it unless it is run towards him. He gets caught up in the wash on the line all the time. I don't get why Hurl is almost on the LOS everytime. 

 

Because that is the system they are running.  It's all about keeping OL from getting to the second level and forcing cutbacks.  Bass is basically your MLB in the way you're thinking of it, the guy chasing the play.  He's been a beast once he adjusted to the width of the field and figured out how to get on the right side of the play to make tackles with his inside shoulder.

 

So Hurl is a gapper & not a true MLB. Hall's system basically takes away a tackler on D as Sam sometimes can't make the play even if he knows where the ball is going away from him. Therefore, it's 11 on 11 matching man to man (not counting the qb unless he runs) instead of 12 on 11 for the defense on a run play. Don't like that at all. I want all the linebackers to be able to read & close on every play which explains why Hurl looks to be so out of position or late to make the tackle. I hadn't noticed all year until last night.

[Floyd]

Gap filler versus play maker equals conversation over.

 

So, from the last interviews... Oshea gamelans for his ST and then lets them make decisions on the field...  but our D must stick with their assigned roles and not make any reads?  Okay, its not Hurl's fault.

 

Makes sense if we're the best run D in the league... but we're like 2nd worst in the league against the rush.  

 

Bass has almost twice as many tackles as Hurl... must be because Hurl fills those gaps so well and lets Bass get the glory.

 

If we're lining up on the LOS, then just play Sherman at SAM again... at least, he got a sack now and then.

[iso_55]

Gap filler versus play maker equals conversation over.

 

So, from the last interviews... Oshea gamelans for his ST and then lets them make decisions on the field...  but our D must stick with their assigned roles and not make any reads?  Okay, its not Hurl's fault.

 

Makes sense if we're the best run D in the league... but we're like 2nd worst in the league against the rush.  

 

Bass has almost twice as many tackles as Hurl... must be because Hurl fills those gaps so well and lets Bass get the glory.

 

If we're lining up on the LOS, then just play Sherman at SAM again... at least, he got a sack now and then.

I've never seen a linebacker play up so close unless he's showing blitz. But Hurl lines up on the DL ass  almost in the gap he's covering. Looking at the Esks defense, all their LBers are lined up 3 to 4 yards behind the DL making their reads & flowing to the football on run plays. 

[DR. CFL]

The LBs 3-4 yds off the LOS can see the play develop, be far enough off lineman trying to get to the second level to block them and then scrape to the play with momentum "down hill". Hurl lined up on the butt of the DL gets caught in the first level traffic and has no down hill momentum. If he is anywhere near the play to make the tackle he then is being dragged back by the momentum of the ball carrier for additional yardage. Not a very effective way to play MLB.

[JuranBoldenRules]

You'd be hard pressed to find a football team in Canada from high school to the pros who are playing the kind of 80s defense you guys are describing with guys guessing where the ball is going and chasing, and not gap control on first downs and 2nd and short.  The only major variations are on passing downs.