The Environment Thread

[Fatty Liver]

1 minute ago, pigseye said:

Why the laughter, it's right there in black and white,

https://unfccc.int/topics/climate-finance/the-big-picture/climate-finance-in-the-negotiations

But it's not a transfer of wealth, sure.........

Did you read the middle bits of the article you posted earlier explaining how the Western world both contributed and benefited the most during this period of rapid increase in the level of CO2? 

When is enough enough?  We can choose to help the future victims of climate change prepare, accept responsibility and do our part to cut down on emissions or we can do nothing and watch them starve to death on TV,  your choice.  

 

 

[Mark F]

38 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Did you read the middle bits of the article you posted earlier explaining how the Western world both contributed and benefited the most during this period of rapid increase in the level of CO2? 

When is enough enough?  We can choose to help the future victims of climate change prepare, accept responsibility and do our part to cut down on emissions or we can do nothing and watch them starve to death on TV,  your choice.  

 

 

World  carbon emissions since 1960.... 

http://www.globalcarbonatlas.org/en/CO2-emissions

 

Edited April 18, 2019 by Mark F

[Fatty Liver]

14 minutes ago, Mark F said:

World  carbon emissions since 1960.... 

http://www.globalcarbonatlas.org/en/CO2-emissions

 

Great map.  Case in point, Canada with a population of 36.6 M produces more CO2 emissions than Mexico with a population of 129.1 M and Brazil with a population of 209.2 M.

Edited April 18, 2019 by Throw Long Bannatyne

[Mark F]

16 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Great map.

check this out. night time satellite photo of the planet showing electrification of the continents. Power mainly generated by burning fossil fuels of course.

 

Edited April 18, 2019 by Mark F

[Mark H.]

10 hours ago, pigseye said:

I thought it summed things up pretty accurately. My take away from it, climate change is inevitable and the Paris Agreement signatories are being asked to compensate the third world $100B annually so they can adapt. Do you see it differently?

No. Climate change is inevitable and fossil fuels have contributed to it in a big way.  Thus, the rationale for compensating the third world. 

I was merely under the impression - that you disagreed with that rationale. 

[pigseye]

18 hours ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Did you read the middle bits of the article you posted earlier explaining how the Western world both contributed and benefited the most during this period of rapid increase in the level of CO2? 

When is enough enough?  We can choose to help the future victims of climate change prepare, accept responsibility and do our part to cut down on emissions or we can do nothing and watch them starve to death on TV,  your choice.  

 

 

Of course I read it, it's a guilt trip. These things have been happening in the third world long before the climate change narrative ever came along. And what about all the benefits that the western world has shared with everyone during the same time, medicine, education, technology, foreign aid, peace keeping, the list is just too long to even begin to name. Blaming all the problems of the third world on the wests success is way to simplistic. 

[pigseye]

15 hours ago, Mark H. said:

No. Climate change is inevitable and fossil fuels have contributed to it in a big way.  Thus, the rationale for compensating the third world. 

I was merely under the impression - that you disagreed with that rationale. 

I don't disagree with it at all. But there were many on here who disagreed that it wasn't just a system of wealth distribution from the west to the third world. It's pretty clear that that is exactly what it is. Now you can argue that they are owed that money from the west because it was us who put them in their current position but that is way to simplistic a view as I just said above. 

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

 

edit

Edited April 20, 2019 by wanna-b-fanboy

[Mark F]

Tesla Model 3 Performance Crushes Fossil BMW M3 fossil fans’ favorite sports saloon, around Race Track. 

A lead of almost 2 seconds on a 2 mile track (with lap times around 85 seconds in total) is significant. Both vehicles were stock without modifications, and were lapped by the same driver.

On the feel of the two vehicles around the track, the testers found that for the BMW, compared to the Tesla:

“when you floor it, the throttle response is glacial by comparison, and the accompanying racket isn’t quite as glorious as you remember — more of a distraction from listening to what the tyres are doing and getting on with the business of going fast.”

We’ve already seen battery electrics beat out fossils at the Pikes Peak hill climb (outright record), on the Nürburgring Nordschleife (production cars record), and at other racetracks. In each case, these are just the first tentative generations of full electric sports cars, with huge scope for further improvementshttps://cleantechnica.com/2019/04/25/tesla-model-3-performance-crushes-fossil-bmw-m3-around-race-track/

Used  35000 km Nisssan leaf, is around 15,000.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Mark F

[Mark F]

not climate but anyway plastic in caribbean sea.

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1121451974216552449/pu/vid/1280x720/od8e6GgIqrWaXMw7.mp4?tag=8

[Mark F]

Methane release Siberia (This one of the feedback loop, that scientists warned about..... from melting permafrost, the permafrost is a huge methane/carbon sink)

starting to happen now, with heat waves at the N Pole.

 

Quote

 

The gradual melting of the ancient permafrost in Siberia is causing huge problems in the area.  Giant blow-out craters are appearing everywhere and are threatening roads, people, and production facilities.

The rapidly released methane is creating a serious feedback loop in the region; as methane is a greenhouse gas it is driving the temperatures higher, and in turn melting more permafrost and releasing yet more methane.

Other than monitor and try and predict where they are going to form, there is no way to stop the craters from forming.  It is simple science – the area has grown warmer over time, and the permafrost is melting.

 

 

 

 

"No way to stop it"

https://m.outdoorrevival.com/travel/mysterious-new-landforms-appearing-in-siberia-2.html?fbclid=IwAR0MWpGYV6QYiHBUVluh8xnJKa75BdHUxViG0LITbi-KY6WrOH-GkiRU5Vg

Edited April 28, 2019 by Mark F

[Mark F]

flooding in Eastern canada is very bad

just saw that a dam was overtopped, or failed and an entire town of several thousand was flooded in minutes.

wow.

The Canadian Press
Published Sunday, April 28, 2019 7:16AM EDT
Last Updated Sunday, April 28, 2019 1:43PM EDT

MONTREAL -- Emergency workers urged another 1,500 residents of a flood-ravaged suburb west of Montreal to leave their homes Sunday, one day after floodwaters broke through a natural dike northwest of the city and forced some 5,000 others to flee with only the clothes on their backs.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/dike-breaks-in-quebec-forcing-thousands-from-their-homes-1.4398536

https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1670348

 

Edited April 28, 2019 by Mark F

[kelownabomberfan]

 

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

1 hour ago, kelownabomberfan said:

 

About time. It's been an emergency for many decades.... finally some governments are recognizing it.

[SpeedFlex27]

3 hours ago, kelownabomberfan said:

 

How come I can't send you a PM?

[kelownabomberfan]

12 hours ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

How come I can't send you a PM?

try again

[pigseye]

16 hours ago, kelownabomberfan said:

 

But no urgent action is needed, lol, what ?????

[Fatty Liver]

Permafrost is thawing in the Arctic so fast scientists are losing their equipment

"Climate scientists have assumed a slow, steady erosion of permafrost and a similar pace of carbon release. Turetsky and her colleagues found something different.

Instead of a few centimetres of thaw a year, several metres of soil can destabilize within days. Landscapes collapse into sinkholes. Hillsides slide away to expose deep permafrost that would otherwise have remained insulated."

"Soil analysis found those quickly thawing areas also contain the most carbon. Nearly 80 per cent of them hold at least 70 kilograms of carbon per cubic metre.

That suggests permafrost is likely to release up to 50 per cent more greenhouse gases than climate scientists have believed. As well, much of it will be released as methane, which is about 30 per cent more efficient at trapping heat than carbon dioxide."

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/permafrost-melting-1.5119767

Edited May 2, 2019 by Throw Long Bannatyne

[Wanna-B-Fanboy]

31 minutes ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

Permafrost is thawing in the Arctic so fast scientists are losing their equipment

"Climate scientists have assumed a slow, steady erosion of permafrost and a similar pace of carbon release. Turetsky and her colleagues found something different.

Instead of a few centimetres of thaw a year, several metres of soil can destabilize within days. Landscapes collapse into sinkholes. Hillsides slide away to expose deep permafrost that would otherwise have remained insulated."

"Soil analysis found those quickly thawing areas also contain the most carbon. Nearly 80 per cent of them hold at least 70 kilograms of carbon per cubic metre.

That suggests permafrost is likely to release up to 50 per cent more greenhouse gases than climate scientists have believed. As well, much of it will be released as methane, which is about 30 per cent more efficient at trapping heat than carbon dioxide."

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/permafrost-melting-1.5119767

Pfft- pure anecdotal hearsay- bunk science!

[pigseye]

That's in the Mackenzie River Delta, NWT. 

[Mark F]

1 hour ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

That suggests permafrost is likely to release up to 50 per cent more greenhouse gases than climate scientists have believed.

This isn't really true. It should say "some" scientists have believed. Some scientists have been warning about this for years.

The UN reports have been slanted into the direction of the least amount of harm from greenhouse gases, and rising temperatures.
 

Quote

 

The New York Times has a must-read article on how and why the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change “seems to be bending over backward to be scientifically conservative” in its forthcoming assessment.

Climate Progress has explained many times why the IPCC’s Fifth Assessment Report (AR5) is “an instantly out-of-date snapshot that lowballs future warming because it continues to ignore large parts of the recent literature and omit what it can’t model.” For instance, we have known for years that perhaps the single most important carbon-cycle feedback is the thawing of the northern permafrost. The AR5’s climate models completely ignore it, thereby lowballing likely warming this century.

 

 

 

Stupid. Also, they were timid, and afraid of the fossil fuel lobby. Scientists were not prepared for the onslaught, and didn't know how to deal with it.

It's now obvious that the most dire estimates, were / are the ones in line with what's happening.

 

https://thinkprogress.org/ny-times-did-denier-intimidation-tactics-move-ipcc-to-lowball-sea-level-rise-and-climate-sensitivity-1ecb7ad875f4/

Edited May 2, 2019 by Mark F

[Mark F]

Quote

 

European fund managers are casting an increasingly skeptical eye towards the oil industry, concluding that the industry’s financial future looks grim, according to a new survey published by a London-based organization this week.

Just 18 percent of the responding fund managers, including representatives of firms based in the U.K., France, Spain, and Italy, predicted that “oil companies will be good investments if their business is still focused on fossil fuels in five years’ time,” according to the survey, published by the U.K. Sustainable Investment and Finance Association (UKSIF) and the Climate Change Collaboration.

“68 percent believe they will still be attractive if they adopt business models aligned with the Paris targets,” it adds,

 

https://truthout.org/articles/oil-companies-will-be-bad-investments-within-five-years-survey-predicts/

[Fatty Liver]

In addition to an influx of abandoned wells many oil and gas companies are no longer paying taxes or landowners their lease rights.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trident-exploration-alberta-oilpatch-rma-surface-leases-1.5121507

"Under Alberta law, landowners can't refuse companies wanting to develop oil and gas below the surface of their land."

Curious, not only are they irresponsible they're ******* immoral.

"The Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers, which represents most oil and gas companies in the country, declined an interview request and said it was "unable to share any insight into this issue."

Of course....

[pigseye]

Quote

 

Frustrated by the government's muted response, some activists have taken matters into their own hands. They are driving electric vehicles, taking public transportation more often and swearing off meat. All those changes will reduce the output of Earth-warming greenhouse gases. But no personal action reduces a person's carbon footprint like having fewer children. With each child, citizens of the developed world increase their carbon footprint sixfold, adding roughly 60 metric tons of carbon dioxide to the atmosphere, one oft-quoted study concluded. The calculation figures the probability that each offspring may also reproduce — potentially expanding an individual's carbon footprint for decades after they die. Put another way, forgoing having a child has more than 25 times the carbon-reducing impact of giving up a gas-burning car.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/weather/topstories/a-world-too-hot-and-dangerous-for-children-some-millennials-think-so/ar-AAAYN1V?ocid=spartandhp

So this is what it has come to, stop reproducing as a species, I'm sorry but a grip already. 

[Mark F]

3 hours ago, Throw Long Bannatyne said:

In addition to an influx of abandoned wells many oil and gas companies are no longer paying taxes or landowners their lease rights.

You mentioned the abandoned well cleanup cost..... the original estimate was this
 

Quote

 

Cleaning up the Alberta oilpatch could cost an estimated $260 billion, internal regulatory documents warn.

The staggering financial liabilities for the energy industry’s mining waste and graveyard of spent facilities were spelled out by a high-ranking official of the Alberta Energy Regulator (AER) in a presentation to a private audience in Calgary in February.

 

Then there was a huge fuss, and it was then said that it was "only" seventy billion.

Did not see any explanation why the first high estimate was wrong.

Once oil stops flowing, they'll just bugger off, and leave the poor citizens with the mess.