LaPolice new Bombers OC

[17to85]

 

 

The last time around Lapo had Buck Pierce and a shitty o-line to work with and some talented receivers to work with. I think the Oline has been upgraded, if only marginally since the last time he ran the offence and the QB position appears to been drastically improved with willy (time will tell).

I like Willy a lot but he's got a ways to go before he's at the level Pierce was when the Bombers signed him. Our receivers are a lot worse than they were when Lapo was here and it's up for debate how good the OL was because our qbs got the crap beaten out of them last year too so I don't know how you can sit there and say "we're so much better than last time!" We might be better, but a lot of that rests on the coaching, and Lapo has a bad record getting Bomber qbs killed. 

 

Pierce was broken when he got here.. He was a shell of his former self. I think willy has shown more then pierce did in his time here and was able to take a hit until the season ending hit.  

 

Re-read my  comments.  I said "I think the Oline has been upgraded, if only marginally"  not a ringing endorsement is it?   No where did i state that "we're so much better than last time!"  But i did say the he had some talented recievers to work with..  i've only said that the qb appears to be dratically improved.

 

Stop applying your own agenda/bias to other peoples comments.

 

but it boils down to the same, you think the OL is improved I disagree because it's hard to say, they were some kind of bad last year, qbs we'll agree to disagree on, Pierce when he got here was still good, we broke him quickly, a concern with Lapolice back cause he got Khari broken as well. Even disregarding Pierce vs. Willy Khari Jones was better than both and I didn't like the offence back then either. Pretty easy to make plays when Roberts can make something out of nothing, or Stegall, or Sellers or Bruce. 

 

This Lapo hiring just reeks of people being overly optimistic and ignoring what's happened in the past. Pierce is being thought of as was always crap, all the anti-Mack sentiments are creeping in again. **** Lapo, he's got to wear his share of the failures here, enough with the excuses from everyone here. 

[Bomber Diehard]

I just read the Free Press sports on the signing of Lapolice.

That is a awful write up on the Bombers.

Does that sell papers or get people to cancel the paper?

If it isn't reported by Ed Tait don't read it.....

[Blueballz]

I'm more concerned about our Rec now. It will be a true test to see if it was routes or talent that was hurting them these past few years. I suspect it's somewhere in the middle. Hopefully Moore returns to his down field threat skills that we saw in BC. And denmark actually gets to see more then 1 ball a game.

It's very difficult to observe the routes our receivers ran last year by watching on TV. But I was told, from an observer field level, that the routes were run practically to the same depth, which of course, makes little sense.

Now, if there are STHs, or even casual game by game observers who can confirm or dispute that, please, let us know.

It would explain a lot about the failings of that offence.

That's absurd and can't say I saw that at all. Always deep routes, intermediate. Fewer deep throws after Willy went down because the QB's weren't good/comfortable, including Nichols. If the routes were ran at the same depth all the time you literally would complete about 20% of your passes maybe. That's someone with an agenda IMO.

Not to pump up the hiring but a lot of success and failure also depend on injuries, personel, locker room attitude etc, things mostly out of control of the coordinator.

Damn. Should have kept Bellefeuille.

A bit different, even with a supposed upgraded O-line, a healthy Willy, he still couldnt generate functional offense.

81-106 76% 1134 yards (283 per game) 7 TDs 1 INT in games Willy started and finished.

Looks pretty functional to me. If you put the best 4 games by all QB's combined in Lapolice's last stint here it would probably pale, and two of those games would be Joey Elliott.

Change was needed, but let's be realistic. Lapolice over Bellefeuille is not likely to be a significant upgrade. The significant upgrade will be personnel based. Let's hope that Walters & Co are being realistic too.

Never said it'd be significant but better is still better, how much better remains to be seen.

Sure Willy's numbers were good but our run game sucked, kinda one sided, not really functional.

Lapo may not be the ultimate solution but based on what was available out there, it was a crap shoot anyway.

[Mr Dee]

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

 

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

You're still talking theory about play design.

I want to know if anyone saw shorter, same depth route runs, as in what actually was run during the games, not how it theoretically should be.

You saw all kind of routes when Willy was playing, but less so after he was out. Based on 10 games I would assume.

Did anybody else notice route running?

[JohnnyOnTheSpot]

As far as Pierce being broken, I just remember he was cut in BC and not a team in the league would touch him.  Not even for free, which he was.  Even Joe Mack publicly said no.  He eventually changed his mind for reasons known only to him but I'd guess he couldn't find anyone better.  The surprise was that Pierce still had some game left but it wasn't much, not playing the style that he did.  With few exceptions, Wally always did know when a player's time was up.

[17to85]

As far as Pierce being broken, I just remember he was cut in BC and not a team in the league would touch him.  Not even for free, which he was.  Even Joe Mack publicly said no.  He eventually changed his mind for reasons known only to him but I'd guess he couldn't find anyone better.  The surprise was that Pierce still had some game left but it wasn't much, not playing the style that he did.  With few exceptions, Wally always did know when a player's time was up.

Wally was always able to replace guys, he let a lot of players go before their time was up, he was just always able to replace them so no one really cared. 

[pigseye]

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

 

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

That was Marcel's MO though, he'd put together some absolutely fantastic games but he just couldn't do it with any consistency, he is the good hank, bad hank of OC's.

[voodoochylde]

 

 

 

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

 

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

You're still talking theory about play design.

I want to know if anyone saw shorter, same depth route runs, as in what actually was run during the games, not how it theoretically should be.

You saw all kind of routes when Willy was playing, but less so after he was out. Based on 10 games I would assume.

Did anybody else notice route running?

 

 

The answer to your question is yes, there were instances (multiple instances) where receivers were running routes to the same depth .. where receivers were in the same vicinity .. where there was nobody to drive a defender off to clear up the underneath route.  Whether that's the play design or the receivers running poor routes  .. I'll leave that to others to speculate on ..  it did occur.  I'm not the only one who noticed this.  

[voodoochylde]

 

 

 

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

 

 

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

 

That was Marcel's MO though, he'd put together some absolutely fantastic games but he just couldn't do it with any consistency, he is the good hank, bad hank of OC's.

 

 

This.

 

Game planning from week to week was so hit and miss .. just wildly so.  He criminally under utilized Marshall last season in favour of guys like Walker .. it was hard to watch.

[tacklewasher]

I'm starting to get this hire. He was (probably) the best available that wasn't a rookie, they didn't want a rookie and so moved for Lapo in time that other changes can still be made.

 

But this hire does nothing to excite me and make me think the Bombers will be noticeably better next year. If I lived in Wpg, this would not make me change my mind about seasons tickets.

[Fatty Liver]

 

 

 

 

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

 

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

You're still talking theory about play design.

I want to know if anyone saw shorter, same depth route runs, as in what actually was run during the games, not how it theoretically should be.

You saw all kind of routes when Willy was playing, but less so after he was out. Based on 10 games I would assume.

Did anybody else notice route running?

 

 

The answer to your question is yes, there were instances (multiple instances) where receivers were running routes to the same depth .. where receivers were in the same vicinity .. where there was nobody to drive a defender off to clear up the underneath route.  Whether that's the play design or the receivers running poor routes  .. I'll leave that to others to speculate on ..  it did occur.  I'm not the only one who noticed this.  

 

 

If receivers were getting deeper on routes when Willy was playing it was because he often held onto the football for a good 2 seconds longer than the other QB's dared.  Re-watching some of this years games shows that he will often step up to avoid the rush and then hold the ball for an additional 2 seconds before attempting a pass.  The problem with this is that he is locked in a collapsing pocket with predictable results.  Willy is brave but foolhardy and for the good of all that has to change.

[do or die]

Sure we need better OL play, a complementary RB, and more size/speed at receiver.   But our O was really poorly designed from the get-go:

 

Every run play a form of stretch play, with the RB coming to a dead stop, taking the handoff

Running shotgun formations with a C who couldn't make the snaps (Picard)

Having a zone blocking scheme, that confused only our OL-men

Running gimmick plays for a player who is not a YAC guy (Denmark)

Having no apparent plan against pressure D packages, especially zone blitzes

Running short yardage plays from shotgun

Slowest overall tempo on O......ever.

No draw/screen game

O not properly prepared for start of games.....20 to 30 min. of total futility, most games

 

I could go on and on.....but you get the picture.   Lapo might not be the be and end all, as OC's go.   But he should be able to at least DESIGN something better for the players to work with.   Why we didn't can Marcel along with Etch, before this year.... is still an enduring (and enraging) mystery.

[Atomic]

I'm not talking about routes being different, the willingness and ability for the QB to make the read and hit the deep route was different.

It's not a stretch to say that one wouldn't affect the other, now would it?

Wouldn't affect play design as much as the order of the reads and the decisions of the QB pre-snap.

That was Marcel's MO though, he'd put together some absolutely fantastic games but he just couldn't do it with any consistency, he is the good hank, bad hank of OC's.

This.

Game planning from week to week was so hit and miss .. just wildly so. He criminally under utilized Marshall last season in favour of guys like Walker .. it was hard to watch.

To be fair, Marshall did have the fifth most touches in the league by an RB.

[johnzo]

Is Marshall really an every-down back? He's not great at making anyone miss and I think you need some element of shiftiness to be a great CFL back. You look at Cornish, he's got the power and can drag the pile, but I've also seen him absolutely embarrass linebackers with a move.

And Walker had very few touches in his time here. Many of them were up-the-gut blasts, and he got owned on those. Couldn't believe how badly we used him. He's not a complete player by any stretch, but he can do damage in the open field -- run a pick on the MLB, get him the ball with some receivers and a lineman in front of him and let him do his thing. But we just used him like an ordinary running back.

[pigseye]

Marshall is a down hill runner not a read option type, which is what Walker should have excelled at. The whole offense was one big CF.

[Fatty Liver]

Is Marshall really an every-down back? He's not great at making anyone miss and I think you need some element of shiftiness to be a great CFL back. You look at Cornish, he's got the power and can drag the pile, but I've also seen him absolutely embarrass linebackers with a move.

And Walker had very few touches in his time here. Many of them were up-the-gut blasts, and he got owned on those. Couldn't believe how badly we used him. He's not a complete player by any stretch, but he can do damage in the open field -- run a pick on the MLB, get him the ball with some receivers and a lineman in front of him and let him do his thing. But we just used him like an ordinary running back.

 

Don't forget that Marshall was brought in as "thunder" not "lightening".  If the Bombers can get Cotton back in original condition or sign Andrew Harris I think they'll be fine at RB.

[Blueandgold]

I would be fine with Marshall as our reserve Running back with Andrew Harris and Cotton as our every week players.

[M.O.A.B.]

I would like them to bring back Carlos Anderson.

[Goalie]

Harris and Marshall would be fine with me. Think you should be able to find a better rb than cotton. Nothing against him but he's probably the 9th best running back in the league

[Bigblue204]

Yeah I wonder if Carlos anderson would be ready to go for TC and if they have been in contact with him?

[M.O.A.B.]

You can use the argument from Moore to Cotton. They're good receiver and runningback, respectively.... when they are healthy.

[Nolby]

How refreshing might is be if someone looked to the CIS where they actually play 3 down football with 12 players.

ya but then everyone would've said " he's a rookie CFL catch, hasn't coached at the pro level, why can't we ever find someone with experience Bla Bla Bla Bla bla" you can't win with these things.

[Noeller]

it's a good thing you posted that 3 times......just to make sure we got it......

[Mr Dee]

Nolby, did you go to school with iso by any chance?

[JuranBoldenRules]

Well, if you don't like Denmark as a screen/end around guy, you better hope he gets cut.  Lapo used him in that role a heck of a lot more than Bellefeuille or Crowton did.