Wrestling

[Brandon]

2 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

Austin was a great promo. Michaels was okay.   Bret was way better.    Who carried whom in 97?  

Well it's only my opinion but his time with the Hart Foundation his promos were very meh and it didn't help that Anvil literally only could do the maniacal laugh and scratching his beard.     His best promos were after the split when he was going against guys like Perfect and they seemed better because so many promos during hat time were hard core cheese.    His promos during his last years with WWE he was carried by guys like Austin , The Rock and Micheals.  I personally don't like HBK but he was good on the mic and stirring up the fans.    His time in WCW he was so massively coked out and post Owen he was a shell of himself.  I barely remember any of his WCW stuff outside of being KO'd by Goldberg.    

His best promo was all his real life heat with Vince.  

I found Bret to have zero personality at all and very dry.   His in ring work though was A+++ and it was his ability to put on a great match that told the best stories.  Outside of him saying the best their is one liner I can't really remember anything at all about his promos aside from him calling Jerry Lawler a coward and saying words like dweeb and chicken.  

He wasn't memorable like Austin doing his 3:16 speech,  Warrior telling Hogan about the pilot and the plane going into a  nose dive or the millions of promos of the Rock insulting people.   

[The Unknown Poster]

Old news but resurfaced this week 

 

[The Unknown Poster]

11 hours ago, Brandon said:

Well it's only my opinion but his time with the Hart Foundation his promos were very meh and it didn't help that Anvil literally only could do the maniacal laugh and scratching his beard.     His best promos were after the split when he was going against guys like Perfect and they seemed better because so many promos during hat time were hard core cheese.    His promos during his last years with WWE he was carried by guys like Austin , The Rock and Micheals.  I personally don't like HBK but he was good on the mic and stirring up the fans.    His time in WCW he was so massively coked out and post Owen he was a shell of himself.  I barely remember any of his WCW stuff outside of being KO'd by Goldberg.    

His best promo was all his real life heat with Vince.  

I found Bret to have zero personality at all and very dry.   His in ring work though was A+++ and it was his ability to put on a great match that told the best stories.  Outside of him saying the best their is one liner I can't really remember anything at all about his promos aside from him calling Jerry Lawler a coward and saying words like dweeb and chicken.  

He wasn't memorable like Austin doing his 3:16 speech,  Warrior telling Hogan about the pilot and the plane going into a  nose dive or the millions of promos of the Rock insulting people.   

Bret spoke with conviction even when delivering bad lines.  Very good promo.  I didnt watch a lot of WCW but a good example would be his debut where he had to over turn the Hogan/Sting match and even though Hogan screwed Sting, making Bret's actions absurd, his delivery was fine.  He wasnt Hogan or Austin or Rock but hardly anyone is.

His El Dandy line was hilarious.  Even Bret admits he was better when he had something to say as opposed to nothing.  In WCW, he had a lot of nothing.  But again, the Goldberg angle was a great example.

I didnt think HBK had very good delivery.  He was okay but I think people equate his in-ring charisma with charisma on the mic and it wasnt true.  I wouldnt say he was bad, just not that good.

[Goalie]

HBK was ok... His raspy voice and somewhat lets just call it "pilled up" promos weren't the best... HBK was a great worker tho.. He could have a match with a broom and you'd believe the broom had a chance. Dont think one of his strong points was talking tho.. 

Guys i consider to be excellent on the mic... In maybe order... Rock. Hogan. Austin. Piper. Jericho. Vince. Raven. 

There were others... Road Dogg and the types.. Stevie Richards etc.. 

Id put HBK in the great in ring category. 

[The Unknown Poster]

9 minutes ago, Goalie said:

HBK was ok... His raspy voice and somewhat lets just call it "pilled up" promos weren't the best... HBK was a great worker tho.. He could have a match with a broom and you'd believe the broom had a chance. Dont think one of his strong points was talking tho.. 

Guys i consider to be excellent on the mic... In maybe order... Rock. Hogan. Austin. Piper. Jericho. Vince. Raven. 

There were others... Road Dogg and the types.. Stevie Richards etc.. 

Id put HBK in the great in ring category. 

And perhaps the best of all time, Ric Flair.

[Brandon]

54 minutes ago, The Unknown Poster said:

And perhaps the best of all time, Ric Flair.

Lol I could watch Flair promos for hours I love them! 

[Goalie]

AEW to start weekly show this fall on TNT

[Goalie]

1 hour ago, The Unknown Poster said:

And perhaps the best of all time, Ric Flair.

Not a big Flair fan. I feel hes overrated as a wrestler. Great promo guy tho for sure

[The Unknown Poster]

11 minutes ago, Goalie said:

AEW to start weekly show this fall on TNT

That’s big. 

[The Unknown Poster]

Speculation the streaming component would be B/R live.  

TNT would likely be Wednesday. TBS would be Tuesday I believe.  They’ve flipped back and forth on that. 

Should be official before the up fronts which is May 15.  The UK deal to so the PPV is really good too and potential for that to air the tv which would be better then WWE’s UK deal (in terms of exposure not money). 

He interesting to  hear the money aspect. Khan said he expected to be profitable based on deals they were negotiating.   

AEW partnering with Turner is basically the worst thing for WWE but likely very good for fans.  Probably good for wwe too in terms of competition making everyone better. 

Very exciting.  Should be more info next week and certainly in Vegas. 

[The Unknown Poster]

The RAW writer fired was the "home" lead writer which is the team that stays in Stamford and doesnt travel.  Dave Kapoor, the lead writer for SD, didnt like him and one of them had to go.  Kappor felt Callahan took it too personally when changes were made to this scripts.

Angle is training to be an agent.

Saudi Arabia looks to be Goldberg vs Lashley.

[Goalie]

Ill say this about AEW eventho i feel the market isnt there... 

Im excited and hoping its on TBS.

Likely the smarter more logical move.. TBS has a very long history with pro wrestling not named wwe and even with them for a little bit.. Its the better station (aka its on the TV package) 

I hope they do well cuz WWE with so much talent has been so brutal for a while now.. Years. 

I hope AEW does well.. If its on TBS ill be watching. 

[The Unknown Poster]

1 hour ago, Goalie said:

Ill say this about AEW eventho i feel the market isnt there... 

Im excited and hoping its on TBS.

Likely the smarter more logical move.. TBS has a very long history with pro wrestling not named wwe and even with them for a little bit.. Its the better station (aka its on the TV package) 

I hope they do well cuz WWE with so much talent has been so brutal for a while now.. Years. 

I hope AEW does well.. If its on TBS ill be watching. 

There was actually some concern that networks might have cooled off in the last few weeks with WWE's ratings tanking.  But AEW reportedly had two networks very interested.  One was said to be more money and the other higher visibility.  I'd assume Turner is the high visibility one.

Its really hard to say what willbe a good rating.  Basically, if they draw more than whatever programming they replace in that time slot, its a success.  But the X factor is streaming and DVR numbers because sports are more valuable than other programming.

I think if they can end up with a million viewers, its a big success.  I bet they start off quite a bit lower but can grow.  Can't underestimate power of Jericho and Omega.  Id assume they want Ambrose.  WWE is being super protective too obviously, not wanting to let anyone go.  

TNA got over 1 million consistently on SPIKE...big success.  But WWE is so soft right now.  Im not sure anyone can predict.

Certainly the Elite guys have shown to be bigger draws than a regular WWE card but its also less availability (less house shows etc).  

Its really exciting though.  I think the Khan's are in it for the long haul.  Hopefully a 3 year TV deal at least, to prove themselves.  With WWE's ratings, to get the money they're getting from NBC and FOX, AEW is in a good position to capitalize as long as they dont flop and I cant see that happening.

[SpeedFlex27]

3 hours ago, Goalie said:

Not a big Flair fan. I feel hes overrated as a wrestler. Great promo guy tho for sure

Explain overrated.... WOOOOO!

 

 

[The Unknown Poster]

1 minute ago, SpeedFlex27 said:

Explain overrated.... WOOOOO!

 

 

If you're a younger fan or a WWE-centric fan (Im not sure Goalie's age but he seems to be a WWE fan), many of those people see Flair as over-rated because his best days were late 70's into late 80s.  He got a bit formulaic in the 90's though there was still instances when he was the best thing going, even into the 90's.  Even in late 90's in WCW, he was a big ratings draw.  His house show feud with Savage revitalized house shows in WCW.

Bret Hart said he thought Flair was over-rated because he basically had his formula and stuck to it.  On the other hand Steamboat talks about them having their best matches on random house shows (and their televised matches were considered some of the best of all time).  

My opinion is, he's the greatest performer of all time, which doesnt mean he's the greatest in-ring worker but he was among the greatest in his prime.  But even when he was old, he still connected emotionally in a way few guys did (his RAW match with Hunter where literally everyone wanted him to win the World title., even his stuff in TNA).  But when you combine everything, he was the greatest.  And he was still good in the ring at an advanced age.

Lots of guys were more athletic or more spectacular that no one talks about because thats all they were.  

[bigg jay]

I wasn't a huge fan of Flair growing up but as I got older and was able to see more of his earlier stuff, thanks to the internet, the more I was able to appreciate him in his prime.  He was a complete package back then and it's amazing to think of the career he had when you consider he was lucky to have survived a plane crash that broke his back in 3 places.

[Brandon]

7 hours ago, Goalie said:

Not a big Flair fan. I feel hes overrated as a wrestler. Great promo guy tho for sure

I'm not sure about the over rated as a wrestler part.  I listened to many interviews where nearly every guy said Ric Flair could put on a great match with a  mop.   He is insanely highly respected as a wrestling talent with his peers. 

[The Unknown Poster]

1 minute ago, Brandon said:

I'm not sure about the over rated as a wrestler part.  I listened to many interviews where nearly every guy said Ric Flair could put on a great match with a  mop.   He is insanely highly respected as a wrestling talent with his peers. 

It’s mostly cause Bret buried him. So some people parrot that. But ironically Bret was accused of being formulaic as well.  Although for longevity it’s probably not a bad idea to sort of phone it in on house shows.  But some guys are known for busting their ass on house shows too.  

By 92 when Flair went to wwe he was still great but a lot of people seeing him then for the first time missed his real prime.    Still the best rumble ever though 

[bigg jay]

Was going to post this in the UFC thread but this fight seems more like a work than a shoot.

 

[The Unknown Poster]

This is hilarious.

https://www.wwe.com/article/wwe-most-infamous-lost-match-has-been-found-bret-hart-tom-magee-wwe-network

If you dont know the story, the basic  gist is, Tom MaGee was a stud way back and had a match with Bret.  The only problem is, Magee was terrible but Bret made him look like a million dollars so Vince thought Mcgee was the next Hogan.

Years ago, Bret had asked WWE for copies of several matches, including this one.  The match has never aired anywhere and became somewhat of an urban legend.  It seems WWE accidentally sent Bret their one and only copy of the match.  Bret's assistant used the tapes to make digital copies and recently, came across the video tape.

WWE got the tape back and is planning an airing after RAW.  

Quote

In Dec. 6, 1986, Bret “Hit Man” Hart faced Tom Magee in an untelevised tryout match in Rochester, New York. After the bell sounded and Magee’s hand was raised, he was labeled the next Hulk Hogan, but since the bout was untelevised, footage became lost over time … until today.

VHS tape traders tried in vain to chase down the cassette of Hart vs. Magee for three decades to no avail, but it was recently discovered as part of “Hit Man’s” tape library and is available Monday after Raw on WWE Network. Check out this classic match and get the full story on how the tape was discovered, what happened to Tom Magee, and much more by watching Holy Grail: The Search for WWE’s Most Infamous Lost Match, streaming Monday after Raw

 

Edited May 10, 2019 by The Unknown Poster

[bigg jay]

Fun fact: Tom Magee is from Winnipeg!

Davey Boy Jr tweeted out a snippet of the match a while ago, shortly after it was discovered.  Looking forward to seeing the whole thing.

[Goalie]

Flair - i remeber the ***** **** old ric flair. Wasnt around in the 70s and 2 young in 80s.. Or didnt get WCW on cable. 

Magee vs Bret will be cool to see. 

[Brandon]

Tom Magee was brutal,  I remember watching one of his matches in Japan and the crowd was laughing at him.  Unheard of from a Japanese audience back in those days.  

I think he was in a few movies and the last time he was in the news was because he was mobbed and beaten up and he looked absolutely terrible.    

The guy also had a striking resemblance to Kenny Omega looks wise...

[SpeedFlex27]

On 2019-05-08 at 9:49 PM, The Unknown Poster said:

Old news but resurfaced this week 

 

Well, wouldn't break my heart if they pull Lars Sullivan over these quotes. Another angry big man with what appears little personality & mic skills. 

[SpeedFlex27]

18 hours ago, Brandon said:

Tom Magee was brutal,  I remember watching one of his matches in Japan and the crowd was laughing at him.  Unheard of from a Japanese audience back in those days.  

I think he was in a few movies and the last time he was in the news was because he was mobbed and beaten up and he looked absolutely terrible.    

The guy also had a striking resemblance to Kenny Omega looks wise...

Magee nearly got killed in a bar fight over a year ago. The assailants used his face as a soccer ball. What a mess. Lucky to be alive. 

Edited May 11, 2019 by SpeedFlex27