Wiecek Article: Pressure Mounts On And Off Field For MOS

[Noeller]

14 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

I don't measure his success via his late round drafts. They're mostly shots in the dark, if they stick it's just as good a chance that we got lucky rather than we made great choices. Quite frankly, I don't know enough to have an informed opinion on who to pick in the later rounds anyway.

I don't like Walters second round picks though. IMO there were better players available, especially in 2015 where we had 2 2nd rounders. We chose Richards over Waud and Morgan over Durant.

I think I actually heard Walters snort from all the way here in Alberta. The amount of time and effort that goes into research on every single player in the draft would blow your mind......just ask Rids.

[17to85]

23 minutes ago, Jpan85 said:

I get that but the Canadian depth was complete crap when Mack took over and he was not able to get any significant players on the roster on through the draft other than Muamba

And Watson, and Greaves started for us for years. I'm not trying to hype up Macks drafting, but you are using a bit of bias with statements like that. 

[Taynted_Fayth]

its a little early to compare, but Richards and Waggoner might end up Etienne and Poblah.  walters got Chungh, Mack got Muamba, I`d say its almost a wash for both gms as far as drafts go imo

[kelownabomberfan]

1 hour ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

its a little early to compare, but Richards and Waggoner might end up Etienne and Poblah.  walters got Chungh, Mack got Muamba, I`d say its almost a wash for both gms as far as drafts go imo

Not sure why you are tarring Waggoner with the Poblah brush.  At least Waggoner played all year and contributed.  Richards and Etienne, now there's a comparative.

[TBURGESS]

Joe Mack - 2010-13

2010 - Watson (9th), Smith(28th), Woodson(29th), Greaves(45th)

2011 - Muamba(1st), Etienne(4th), Dunn(17th), Swiston(24th), Volny(32), Mahoney(31) 

2012 - Pencer(3rd), Poblah(4th(pick we used to get him)), Aprille(16th), Bilukidi(21), Stephan(23rd), Thomas(29th)

2013 - Mulumba(2nd), Robertson(11), Fitzgerald(20th), DiCroce(29th), Alli(46th), Pavopoulos(54)

Hits: Watson, Greaves, Muamba, Thomas.

First Round Misses: Etienne, Pencer, Poblah, Mulumba

Kyle Walters - 2013-Present

2014 - Goossen(2nd), Briggs(17), Jones(29), Everett(47), Eisho(56)

2015 - Chungh(2nd), Richards(11), Morgan(15), Normand(33), Lattanzio(38), Warden(46)

2016 - Waggoner(2nd (pick we used to get him))

Hits: Goossen, Chungh

First Round Misses: Maybe Waggoner, but that's still TBD

 

[Taynted_Fayth]

Poblah played too, the comparison, was supplemental picks, I did say too early to tell but could very well end up being kito 2.0. He didnt do much year 1 tho so if not much changes this year...

[Jpan85]

He did exactly what they wanted him to do go out and be solid special teamer.

[TBURGESS]

3 minutes ago, Jpan85 said:

He did exactly what they wanted him to do go out and be solid special teamer.

He played in 7 games and got a single tackle. Pretty low bar for a 'solid special teamer' IMO.

Revised: Special teams tackles are in a separate column and are not added up. Looks like he got 6 special teams tackles and 1 playing on defence.

Edited March 28, 2016 by TBURGESS

[Jpan85]

Pretty sure that is wrong CFL stats fairly crappy certain he played in every game this year. They don't have you playing in the game if you don't get a stat. Had 7 SP teams tackle.

[iso_55]

1 hour ago, Jpan85 said:

Pretty sure that is wrong CFL stats fairly crappy certain he played in every game this year. They don't have you playing in the game if you don't get a stat. Had 7 SP teams tackle.

You can only go by the stats provided.

[LeBird]

How about this deal: The fans give MOS a pass on the last two years because he was a rookie trying to coach a crapp of a team. We give him our support in this coming year in his decisions and choice of personnel. We don't make him feel like he's on his last leg.

MOS on his part coaches this team to the best of his ability and takes the right though maybe painful steps to field the best available players. He tones down his sometimes stubborn attitude.  I am sure he puts as much effort into his coaching as he did into his playing.

 

 

 

[Noeller]

Based on what I've read about how tight The Trinity are, and how much the board likes 'em, I feel like Wade has a contract ready, but is very aware of the optics. I hope for a red hot start to the year, so he can pull it outta the desk and get it signed while things are rosy still...

[sweep the leg]

5 hours ago, Taynted_Fayth said:

its a little early to compare, but Richards and Waggoner might end up Etienne and Poblah.  walters got Chungh, Mack got Muamba, I`d say its almost a wash for both gms as far as drafts go imo

Richards and Waggoner might end up Fantuz and O'Shea. Little early to compare though. 

[sweep the leg]

The 2013 draft was a steaming pile of excrement.  I will consider a re-grade if Mulumba ever plays here. 

[Atomic]

2 hours ago, iso_55 said:

You can only go by the stats provided.

Yes but if we know they are incorrect then it is pointless to even reference them.

[Atomic]

Worth noting, the common refrain during Mack's reign was "well look what Kelly left for them!  Our Canadian talent is much better now."  Can't help but feel a little deja vu when reading this stuff now.

However I really do think that our Canadian talent now is the best it's been since 2011, maybe even 2007-08.  Certainly our starters look good on paper.

[brett_c_b]

14 minutes ago, Atomic said:

Yes but if we know they are incorrect then it is pointless to even reference them.

He's only being consistent. He is the one who kept insisting on making arguments based on data from cflcapgeek despite everyone knowing it's wrong. Not even worth reading his posts/rants

[TBURGESS]

3 hours ago, Jpan85 said:

Pretty sure that is wrong CFL stats fairly crappy certain he played in every game this year. They don't have you playing in the game if you don't get a stat. Had 7 SP teams tackle.

That would be worse for him because he'd have played 11 games without a single stat.

[Atomic]

19 minutes ago, TBURGESS said:

That would be worse for him because he'd have played 11 games without a single stat.

And as we all know, stats are the only thing that matters.  Especially for a first year Canadian playing exclusively special teams.  They might as well just cut him now, another failed project.

[iso_55]

1 hour ago, brett_c_b said:

He's only being consistent. He is the one who kept insisting on making arguments based on data from cflcapgeek despite everyone knowing it's wrong. Not even worth reading his posts/rants

I have no axe to grind with you. However, your boat & fishing tackle is all set to go. Don't forget your lures on the dock. The motor is all gassed up. Have a good day trolling.

Edited March 29, 2016 by iso_55

[comedygeek]

46 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

Oh hello, Mr 137 Posts. Did you come out of your cave to see if the groundhog was right?? Wi Fi not working?

No needs to talk down to someone because of their "inferior post count". I don't post that often, but I'm on here almost day and consider myself a pretty knowledgeable fan. Many others are in the same category as me. Lots of people read but don't post, lots of people can't be here every day but still know what they're talking about, and lots of knowledgeable fans also post frequently -- which is cool, too!

Unless of course post count is all that matters around here?

[iso_55]

1 hour ago, comedygeek said:

No needs to talk down to someone because of their "inferior post count". I don't post that often, but I'm on here almost day and consider myself a pretty knowledgeable fan. Many others are in the same category as me. Lots of people read but don't post, lots of people can't be here every day but still know what they're talking about, and lots of knowledgeable fans also post frequently -- which is cool, too!

Unless of course post count is all that matters around here?

You know, I had deleted that post but you quoted it before it was gone. So you caught me but whatever as what's done is done. I don't even know who brett_c_b is yet he took a swipe at me. His reference to CFL Cap Geek is funny because if he really understood, he'd have known that even I agree that the stats on that site were wrong once I got to know the place. The numbers shown weren't consistent. Mike pointed that out as did others (& I agreed) they were correct after reading what they had to say. That was over 6 months ago. That was it, a couple of non descript posts yet I'm criticized for quoting that site half a year later.

The other thing is yeah, I know  post counts shouldn't matter on the surface other than it shows certain people more than others like posting here. However, the more people who post here, the greater this place will be. Look at this site compared to Our Bombers with the amount of activity here compared to there. There can be days or even weeks where posts go unanswered. That isn't the case here & the activity here is on the upswing.

If it's just about drive bys, hate, anger or disrespect directed towards others when people disagree then this place will go the same way as other CFL sites that have died or been discontinued because of the same thing. Places like CFL Zone (extinct) & 13thman (life support).

Ask any of the mods here & they'll say they need all members to make a site great. Ones like myself, TUP & a few others who do post a lot & the ones that don't.  They'd also say that we may not agree but we should at least try to get along.

Edited March 29, 2016 by iso_55

[comedygeek]

57 minutes ago, iso_55 said:

You know, I had deleted that post but you quoted it before it was gone. So you caught me but whatever as what's done is done. I don't even know who brett_c_b is yet he took a swipe at me. His reference to CFL Cap Geek is funny because if he really understood, he'd have known that even I agree that the stats on that site were wrong once I got to know the place. The numbers shown weren't consistent. Mike pointed that out as did others (& I agreed) they were correct after reading what they had to say. That was over 6 months ago. That was it, a couple of non descript posts yet I'm criticized for quoting that site half a year later.

The other thing is yeah, I know  post counts shouldn't matter on the surface other than it shows certain people more than others like posting here. However, the more people who post here, the greater this place will be. Look at this site compared to Our Bombers with the amount of activity here compared to there. There can be days or even weeks where posts go unanswered. That isn't the case here & the activity here is on the upswing.

If it's just about drive bys, hate, anger or disrespect directed towards others when people disagree then this place will go the same way as other CFL sites that have died or been discontinued because of the same thing. Places like CFL Zone (extinct) & 13thman (life support).

Ask any of the mods here & they'll say they need all members to make a site great. Ones like myself, TUP & a few others who do post a lot & the ones that don't.  They'd also say that we may not agree but we should at least try to get along.

I had no problem with your criticism of his criticism -- I just thought it was a weak shot that, as someone who has a similar post count to his (even though I was a regular for years on OB and was one of the first members to sign up on MBB) but feels just as part of this site and the discussions and the fandom as anyone else.

Discussion is important, but why should I post more if I have nothing constructive to add? I try to only post when I feel something that hasn't yet been said needs to be said -- otherwise I'll just like posts that express what I would've said already. There's a lot of people here that I agree with much of the time, who often get to things before I do, so there's no sense in repeating things.

Plus, even lurkers and infrequent posters still bring pageviews and ad views, keeping the site running. Of course, there'd be no pages to view without good posts and replies to begin with, but we're all important cogs in the Winnipeg Blue Bombers fan community and Morning Big Blue!

(I didn't purposefully mean to catch it our out you before you deleted/edited it -- I just happened to see it and felt I needed to add my 2 cents.)

[Mike]

3 hours ago, TBURGESS said:

That would be worse for him because he'd have played 11 games without a single stat.

I know the likelihood of you scoffing at this is high, but I just wanted to bring up the fact that he didn't play a position on special teams that is meant to be making tackles. He was primarily playing what I'd call, for lack of a better term, the L5 spot on kick coverage and really the only time he'd be doing anything other than lane contain in that role is if the gunner blows a tackle and there's an opening down the sideline. Not every player on ST is out there to make the tackle. What you're doing is similar to accusing the offensive guard of being no good because he didn't get enough touchdowns. 

[iso_55]

46 minutes ago, comedygeek said:

I had no problem with your criticism of his criticism -- I just thought it was a weak shot that, as someone who has a similar post count to his (even though I was a regular for years on OB and was one of the first members to sign up on MBB) but feels just as part of this site and the discussions and the fandom as anyone else.

Discussion is important, but why should I post more if I have nothing constructive to add? I try to only post when I feel something that hasn't yet been said needs to be said -- otherwise I'll just like posts that express what I would've said already. There's a lot of people here that I agree with much of the time, who often get to things before I do, so there's no sense in repeating things.

Plus, even lurkers and infrequent posters still bring pageviews and ad views, keeping the site running. Of course, there'd be no pages to view without good posts and replies to begin with, but we're all important cogs in the Winnipeg Blue Bombers fan community and Morning Big Blue!

(I didn't purposefully mean to catch it our out you before you deleted/edited it -- I just happened to see it and felt I needed to add my 2 cents.)

Your first sentence paragraph was correct which is why I deleted it. You're right.